Planetarion Forums

MrL_JaKiri · 12 Jan 2005, 14:37

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...pe/4167867.stm

Atletico Madrid have been fined £400 because of racist chanting.

Christ that's pathetic.

Apothos · 12 Jan 2005, 15:02

"We wish to repeat our condemnation of this kind of behaviour and repeat our promise to act with maximum firmness to eradicate any display of racism or xenophobia in Spanish football,"

Is this Spain trying to tell the EU they're just as poor as the new members?

roadrunner_0 · 12 Jan 2005, 15:19

now that takes the piss, i wonder what view fifa will take of it?

are spain the new england?

Radical Edward · 12 Jan 2005, 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrL_JaKiri

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...pe/4167867.stm

Athletico Madrid have been fined £400 because of racist chanting.

Christ that's pathetic.

filthy blasphemer. €700 fine.

JC · 12 Jan 2005, 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

now that takes the piss, i wonder what view fifa will take of it?

They wont do anything.

If English fans were seen to be hurling racist abuse at players week in week out that would be a whole different matter as far as FIFA are concerned.

roadrunner_0 · 12 Jan 2005, 16:59

as i said, is spain turning into the new england?

Stew · 12 Jan 2005, 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

as i said, is spain turning into the new england?

I don't get this.
As JC says, England would be dealt with severley, Spain will go unpunished. How does this mean they are turning into us?

roadrunner_0 · 12 Jan 2005, 17:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stew

I don't get this.
As JC says, England would be dealt with severley, Spain will go unpunished. How does this mean they are turning into us?

sorry, my fault for not making myself clear:

spain are getting worse and worse for racism, eventually, no matter how much they want to, FIFA will be unable to ignore this problem, therefore, will spain end up being the new england, as in, will they end up with massive fines/ possible expulsions from competition/etc. Unless they do something now to nip this problem in the bud

MrL_JaKiri · 12 Jan 2005, 17:21

Not a chance. England has a much better record, at home and abroad, than most eastern european countries and Turkey. They never get anything done to them.

Stew · 12 Jan 2005, 17:22

No, because they're Spain and not England, they'll get away with it for eternity.

[/The world is against us type of England fan]

Hicks · 12 Jan 2005, 17:26

Dam Stew posted what I wanted to post

The Turks lynch a few people at games and it's a slap on the wrists yet a few England lads throwing plastic chairs about and they threaten to kick England out. It's pathetic.

Lupin · 12 Jan 2005, 17:38

i thought you had the second biggest rate of killed ppl through football riots.

Nondescript Human · 12 Jan 2005, 17:41

There's no such club as Athletico Madrid.

Hicks · 12 Jan 2005, 17:45

Yea about 20 years ago, last death in this country I can remember is the Swansea fan who was killed during a police horse charge at Rotherham 4/5 years ago.

The punishment England get is usually far worse than other countries receive for equivalent behaviour. ITS PUNNISHMENT FOR THE LEAUGE CUP !

Embroglio · 12 Jan 2005, 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hicks

Yea about 20 years ago, last death in this country I can remember is the Swansea fan who was killed during a police horse charge at Rotherham 4/5 years ago.

The punishment England get is usually far worse than other countries receive for equivalent behaviour. ITS PUNNISHMENT FOR THE LEAUGE CUP !

hillsborough was less than 20 years ago wasn't it? or am i silly?

edit: no i'm not i just can't ****ing read, at all, what a spastic

Lupin · 12 Jan 2005, 17:59

i dont know, but i watched an hooligan docu on bbc 2 years ago and dude, there is no doubt that the english hooligans are potientally very aggressive (especially if alc is in the game).

you pretty ****ed the situation up in the past, so dont wonder if you get punished in the present/future.

G.K Zhukov · 12 Jan 2005, 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hicks

Yea about 20 years ago, last death in this country I can remember is the Swansea fan who was killed during a police horse charge at Rotherham 4/5 years ago.

The punishment England get is usually far worse than other countries receive for equivalent behaviour. ITS PUNNISHMENT FOR THE LEAUGE CUP !

Wasnt there a steward who got killed a year ago?

Hicks · 12 Jan 2005, 18:11

Oh that was earlier this season, Aston Villa vs QPR, for some reason Aston Villa decided the game didn't need police present despite QPR having one of the more up and coming active hooligan groups in the country, this left the stewards to try and keep QPR from getting to Villa and one got kicked to death

I forgot about that, I still don’t think they’ve charged anyone either

but still I stand by the line that it's a far lower death toll than other countries and England is usually punished disproportionately.

Stew · 12 Jan 2005, 18:17

What punishment did Turkey get for stabbing 2 Leeds fans?

MrL_JaKiri · 12 Jan 2005, 18:20

Nothing.

Sarina_Joy · 12 Jan 2005, 18:27

This may not be a popular view but why the hell should this club (or any club for that matter) be heftily fined because some fans were shouting racist chants? Unless the people in question had 'I'm a racist and plan to cause trouble at this match' stamped on their foreheads, the club had no control over this and I don't see why they should be penalised. The fans themselves should be punished, and barred from matches. The club obviously has a responsibility to work with police/security to stop these fans getting back in, but I still don't see why they should be fined at all because some random guys with their colours on were being wankers.

roadrunner_0 · 12 Jan 2005, 18:34

because if the club is fined it's an initiative for them to root out the troublemakers at their games, which currently the spanish clubs just dont seem to care about

MrL_JaKiri · 12 Jan 2005, 18:35

If they're not made directly responsible for the conduct of their fans, where's the incentive to start expensive and possibly unpopular schemes to remove the unsightly element?

If the clubs aren't made responsible, who do you propose should be responsible?

Sarina_Joy · 12 Jan 2005, 18:45

I'm not saying the club shouldn't have some responsibility, and bear in mind I don't follow football, I am reading this article as a one off so I have no information on whether this is an ongoing problem at this particular club, so in my answer I have basically assumed that this is a one off or a rarity.

Assuming for a second it's a first incident then the club should not be fined imho but fines or other forms of punishment should come into force if the behaviour is repeated and the club is seen to be failing to cooperate with police/security in order to weed these fans out.

As a matter of interest, what do you think would be a reasonable fine?

roadrunner_0 · 12 Jan 2005, 18:52

depending upon the scale of the problem fines should really be no less than 20k rising up to 100k under normal circumstances

MrL_JaKiri · 12 Jan 2005, 18:56

The fines should be given as a percentage of gross income on the match in question.

This kind of thing is fairly common in Spanish football, but noone really cares domestically. Or at least they didn't until the international publicity after the England friendly.

Nodrog · 12 Jan 2005, 19:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stew

What punishment did Turkey get for stabbing 2 Leeds fans?

Turkey stabbed 2 Leeds fans? Was it a really big knife or something?

Stew · 12 Jan 2005, 19:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarina_Joy

As a matter of interest, what do you think would be a reasonable fine?

Whilst watching SkySports News, it said they had been fined "Four hundred and twenty.." and I was expecting "thousand pounds" to follow. For the split second I thought wow, at last, a decent size punishment, that should push things in the right direction. How round I was when only the latter of the two expected words followed.

Stew · 12 Jan 2005, 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nodrog

Turkey stabbed 2 Leeds fans? Was it a really big knife or something?

It used it's 'wishbone'.

Dante Hicks · 12 Jan 2005, 19:54

I don't really get why this is such a big deal personally.

Although if it is a big deal to individuals / teams then I'm sure they could refuse to play them or something like that.

Overall though I found the media coverage of the last incidents to be stupidly over the top. Undboutedly Africans in Spain are treated like shit generally, probably work for apalling wages in the most dangerous industries and get abused all the time. But when some other black guys who happen to be famous footballers get abused then Spain is the worst country in the world.

As for "who should be held responsible" I think anyone is reponsible for what they personally chant. If individual clubs promote racist chanting (through some kind of discount scheme) or worse still, force fans at gun point to chant racist slogans then sure that's pretty bad and should be dealt with asap.

Blastoderm · 12 Jan 2005, 20:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nondescript Human

There's no such club as Athletico Madrid.

I wonder which club does Fernando Torres play for?

EDIT: I noticed the error now. It's the H.

MrL_JaKiri · 12 Jan 2005, 22:25

Oh, and my objection isn't just the size of the fine. It's the fact that it's apparantly the maximum punishment

Quote:

"We wish to repeat our condemnation of this kind of behaviour and repeat our promise to act with maximum firmness to eradicate any display of racism or xenophobia in Spanish football," it read.