Future Alliance Feature - Defence

[wakey]

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

It's completely irrelevant what alliance your in, your whining. No one here but you decided what alliance you'd apply to. and as for you playing longer than ND has existed.... ND has played since round 1 genius...so, try again. Very simply, I'm not impressed by who you say you are, could care less to be honest....Your doing the exact thing you accuse others of doing, talking down to them as if your on a high horse over looking the PA population, whats wrong, your little ego get bruised, well here's a little cyber tissue, now shut up and quit crying, and oh ya... the world does revolve around ND... thanx

First of all lets get the "ND has played since round 1 genius...so, try again" comment out of the way. The fact I co-founded the only alliance still in this game that pre dates ND suggests that Ive played this game longer than ND has been around. Idiot.

As for who I am and what alliance I am, I wasn't trying to make out i'm more important than anyone else or to talk down to them. You however were talking to me (and others here) like they were a bunch of clueless newbies. You shouldnt be talking down to even newbies like this let alone experianced players.

I also wanted you to off and actually realise its far from me moaning due to being unhappy with my alliance or bitter due to attacks. I'm someone who is happy where they are, i've had ample opertunity to join other alliances over the rounds but I have never felt the need to give up my ideals just to join another alliance for personal gain. I''m in this to help new players and to fight for making the game better by ensuring the more vocal bigger alliance community doesnt stampede over the smaller alliance community due to being unchallenged in their views of whats good for the game (as what they think is good is quite often not good for the grass routes of the game which is where improvements need to be made to attract and keep new players)

If you had bothered to take 5 mins to find out who you were talking to youd have easierly found this out rather than throw wild accustaions and without you talking down to me like some new player

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

I don't know what other alliances do, I'm not in their chain of command or attack staff, I do however know what ND does, we hit our enemies. At no time have I stated our enemies didn't provide opportunities for easy roids, some nights are simply better than others. It's planning, good strategy, and a bit of luck, that make those targets accessible, and roidable. In the beginning of this round HR and ND basically traded roids for 6 weeks, both alliances were "easy targets" at one point or another due to the location of their fleets, and things like that. Some alliances have the ability to control their members fleets, others do not. A lot of smaller alliance players hit targets of opportunity, which means they scan em, launch at em, and hope for the best. If "Joe small alliance member" is hostile to an ND planet, or an LCH planet, or a 1up planet, or whatever alliance you want to throw in there....they go on a hostile planet list. They opened themselves up for retaliation, simple as that. So players are wrong for attacking planets that are hostile to them?...we're not playing chutes and ladders here kid, get a freakin grip. Now, since your the all knowing all seeing self proclaimed PA know it all of the hour, you should know these things, and you'd probably think twice before crying more about them.

Your just so bloody deluded ffs. I bet theres no ONE member in ND who can claim not to have launched an unprovoked attack on a player from a small alliance whos just in range and whom they want to bash and get easy roids from. Quite often this is done in multiple tick raids with multiple people so cant even be chalked down to a random raid by members without anyone elses knowledge as it has to have been discussed somewhere, most likly the alliances private channel.

ND may not declare war on smaller alliances BUT to even claim that they dont bash is just bloody ridiculous. Even I wouldnt try and claim F-Crew doesnt bash and not bashing was always a key aspect of our ideals, as I know full well that there are times when I'm not around to discourage hitting unsuitable targets that it does happen. its simply the way PA works and iits something you have to do if you want to grow. You cant grow as quickly if your hitting tougher targets as this means more losses are incured so the more expensive your roids are. Everyone especially when at war finds the easiest targets possible to supliment their score on the cheap so stop spinning the yarn that ND is special and doesnt do it as it simply doesnt wash

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

I'm not going to apologise for being in a large alliance, you chose your alliance, whether it's because you just liked the country non big city life, or you got kicked or turned down by big alliances, or you just couldn't handle the stress, I have no idea, regardless, your issues are just that... yours. Don't expect the rest of us to pull up a bottle and have a PA pity party for you. Again, I could care less who you claim to be, just another AD whiner best I can tell.

I havent asked you to apologises for being in a large alliance. What i am, asking is for you to be a little less conceited and to treat people with a little more respect and understanding. People like yourself need to realise they arent the centre of the universe and infact and even though they are the most vocal group and most powerful group of players in the game they are infact the minority group. As such they hold a great deal of responsability in their hands to make this game betetr for everyone. If they keep pushing for things that are only good for the upper echelons of the game then they are helping kill it by doing so. They are part of PA's problems atm due to their lack of understanding of others but they can easierly be PA's saviours if they just woke up and realised the power they have to help improve the lower levels and thus help attract and keep new players much better

[Tippity]

yeah on actually thinking about it i think you're right lol it's a kinda stupid argument to say that it'll help those who can't get on IRC as even if they could the idea is they couldn't at the time of the defence call.... still i don't see what harm it could have if occasionally you miss a hostile incoming and your friend in the gal sees it and alerts your alliance for ya

[aNgRyDuCk]

As for who I am and what alliance I am, I wasn't trying to make out i'm more important than anyone else or to talk down to them. You however were talking to me (and others here) like they were a bunch of clueless newbies. You shouldnt be talking down to even newbies like this let alone experianced players.

err ya, you were the high almighty...whatever...get a grip

I also wanted you to off and actually realise its far from me moaning due to being unhappy with my alliance or bitter due to attacks. I'm someone who is happy where they are, i've had ample opertunity to join other alliances over the rounds but I have never felt the need to give up my ideals just to join another alliance for personal gain. I''m in this to help new players and to fight for making the game better by ensuring the more vocal bigger alliance community doesnt stampede over the smaller alliance community due to being unchallenged in their views of whats good for the game (as what they think is good is quite often not good for the grass routes of the game which is where improvements need to be made to attract and keep new players)

bla bla bla.....your a martyr, I know... I'll buy you a bullhorn

If you had bothered to take 5 mins to find out who you were talking to youd have easierly found this out rather than throw wild accustaions and without you talking down to me like some new player

you act like a new player...if it looks like shit, and it smells like shit.... it's prolly shit

Your just so bloody deluded ffs. I bet theres no ONE member in ND who can claim not to have launched an unprovoked attack on a player from a small alliance whos just in range and whom they want to bash and get easy roids from. Quite often this is done in multiple tick raids with multiple people so cant even be chalked down to a random raid by members without anyone elses knowledge as it has to have been discussed somewhere, most likly the alliances private channel.

there's not 1, prolly 98 ( atleast they haven't with th knowledge of their HC)

ND may not declare war on smaller alliances BUT to even claim that they dont bash is just bloody ridiculous. Even I wouldnt try and claim F-Crew doesnt bash and not bashing was always a key aspect of our ideals, as I know full well that there are times when I'm not around to discourage hitting unsuitable targets that it does happen. its simply the way PA works and iits something you have to do if you want to grow. You cant grow as quickly if your hitting tougher targets as this means more losses are incured so the more expensive your roids are. Everyone especially when at war finds the easiest targets possible to supliment their score on the cheap so stop spinning the yarn that ND is special and doesnt do it as it simply doesnt wash

ND doesn't bash, we don't need to....try LCH

I havent asked you to apologises for being in a large alliance. What i am, asking is for you to be a little less conceited and to treat people with a little more respect and understanding. People like yourself need to realise they arent the centre of the universe and infact and even though they are the most vocal group and most powerful group of players in the game they are infact the minority group. As such they hold a great deal of responsability in their hands to make this game betetr for everyone. If they keep pushing for things that are only good for the upper echelons of the game then they are helping kill it by doing so. They are part of PA's problems atm due to their lack of understanding of others but they can easierly be PA's saviours if they just woke up and realised the power they have to help improve the lower levels and thus help attract and keep new players much better[/quote]

I'm not concieted, I'm just a prick

With reference to the newbies being 'bigger for longer' at teh start of the round, etc - this new feature has absolutely zero bearing on that.


The idea suggested here is a button to report a galmates incs to their alliance.

its the same as going to their public channel and telling a HC that there are incs.

Put it in next round!

[Quartz]

Well Anything that makes the game better to use will encourage more new people to play and pay more. If features are made easier to access {as suggested} then even new gamers will not be put off too much if they get smashed after a few dozen ticks, and if these people cannot use mIRC {as at work or something} then at least their voices can be heard given the oppertunity.

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Quartz

Well Anything that makes the game better to use will encourage more new people to play and pay more. If features are made easier to access {as suggested} then even new gamers will not be put off too much if they get smashed after a few dozen ticks, and if these people cannot use mIRC {as at work or something} then at least their voices can be heard given the oppertunity.

It doesnt help new players though. As i keep saying over and over again the only people it will really help would be the bigger alliances. The smaller alliances need IRC activity not to be alerted about incoming more. A system like this just ends up removing a reason for players to be on IRC which weakens their alliance and ultimatly makes it harder for them to enjoy the game.

Just a thought... how the hell will the delay work if the inc. is discovered late in the tick??? because as soon as the tick passes, the person is screwed... if people start choosing to use this "button" instead of irc... then ppl can be missing out on the defence that they really need...

[Tippity]

i dont think it should matter it will probably just go immediately any time in the second half of the tick? no?

[Iceman]

most gals have a system where they report their galmates defcalls straight to a bot on irc anyways. the delay is a problem i think, i know i wouldnt use it... but like alot of ppl say newbs need this not pro's. make it a 10 min delay from wehn you report it or instant if it is halfway through tick.

plus if the server is gonna keep doing its backupthingy halfway through the tick then sometimes small alliances will only have like 20 mins to cover def calls through the ingame system... abd thats if they are lucky

[Iceman]

It doesnt help new players though. As i keep saying over and over again the only people it will really help would be the bigger alliances .A system like this just ends up removing a reason for players to be on IRC

void as irc is instant, and this is primarily for galmates (tell me if im wrong)
ingame tools are like email, or this thread. You have to go looking for the def calls, checking the page, thats why irc is better, it beeps at you

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Iceman

void as irc is instant, and this is primarily for galmates (tell me if im wrong)
ingame tools are like email, or this thread. You have to go looking for the def calls, checking the page, thats why irc is better, it beeps at you

How does your point void my argument. I dont know what alliance your playing at but if had played lower down you would know full well that its hard to get alot of members to use IRC. A feature like this allows a planet to 'help' their galaxy even if they dont use IRC as such many will be even less inclined to use IRC. They need the pressure of both the galaxy and the alliance to get them on IRC, even if its just for a few mins here and there to report incoming. A few mins is all you need to login check if defence is needed and send and while most alliances would like more activity than that it would be an improvement in most peoples cases

Anyway unless you continue to give more reason for people to get their arses on IRC the only alliances who will stand any chance of defending the incoming that gets reported will be the big alliances whos members are online anyway.

ANYTHING like this which gives people another reason not to use IRC is just another nail in the coffin of the lower end of the game and a boost to the upper end of the game (as they wont have to worry as much about incoming not being reported) UNLESS theres some major changes to the game which would see this game become less activity driven.

[Hellcat]

Big thing that people have been saying is:

"this will reduce peoples activity in IRC"

this idea was for GAL mates to report incoming to a GAL mate's alliance without them having to know his aliance or its IRC channel - annonomously in both directions (with built in report function to report abuse).

NOT

for an alliance member to report their own incoming. If they want to report their own incoming they will need IRC or to post in their alliance forum.

It is asking too much for people in random gals to go to the lengths to report incoming for gal mates (seeing the incoming, finding out their IRC channel, getting onto IRC, finding a DC ect...). But they might feel that pressing a report incoming button is worth the effort.

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Hellcat

Big thing that people have been saying is:

"this will reduce peoples activity in IRC"

this idea was for GAL mates to report incoming to a GAL mate's alliance without them having to know his aliance or its IRC channel - annonomously in both directions (with built in report function to report abuse).

NOT

for an alliance member to report their own incoming. If they want to report their own incoming they will need IRC or to post in their alliance forum.

It is asking too much for people in random gals to go to the lengths to report incoming for gal mates (seeing the incoming, finding out their IRC channel, getting onto IRC, finding a DC ect...). But they might feel that pressing a report incoming button is worth the effort.

We all know what the features there for and our issues are valid no matter which version you were arguing against.

Alot of the people on this thread simply dont understand the lower end of the game and the attitudes of the players down there, either that or as in some cases they havent thought about it properly.

Smaller players end up having a less competive nature on the whole and as such they normally end up only really caring about helping their galaxy which is something that can be done without irc access. As such their alliances never see them on irc. The one thing which can help persuade them to get online is their galaxies insitance that they have to get online to report the incomings on them. Its this pressure coupled with their own alliances pressure to get on irc which eventually drags some of them on irc.

Now if you remove this incentive you damage the lower end of the game. The lower end of the game needs these people to be able to give more to the game by being active on irc even if its only for a short amount of time so they can give defence ect.

This idea really only benifits the bigger players and alliances. They cant defend anymore attacks than they already do so being made aware of more of them isnt going to help, what they need is more irc actives so they can better cover the attacks they have already and to free up some spare capacity to do more defence which this idea wont bring about

The only thing it might achieve for smaller alliances is make it harder for them to catch a bigger player unaware.


And tbh i dont think its too much to ask for most people to report incoming on IRC, they shouldnt need to find out the irc channel and the reporting method as they should have supplied gal members with this info. if not then its their gal mates fault if they dont get defence.

[Judge]

Originally Posted by Ferretus

Scanner rank and bonuses wil be bad. We ALL know that scanners are harmful to the game so lets get rid of this stupid suggestion straight away. It also off topic :-)

A player chooses to be a scanner for his alliance at a considerable cost.

1) His ranking is gonna be crap
2) He pays cash money for a planet that he knows will never play a full active part in the game
3) His activity has to be double most of the rest of the alliance he is in, as people depend on him for scans when attacking etc..
4) Most alliances have their scanners outside the Tag, so therefore cannot benefit from Alliance defence.

So enlighten us on how exactly scanners are bad for the game?

[Judge]

The biggest part of this discussion appears to be focused on the issue of IRC.

A lot of people are fearfull of using an IRC client (irrational I know)

We (the rest of us who use it ) and have been doing so for years never fully realise what is behind these fears.

When I first started to use IRC it was a complete mystery to me as to what was going on with my computer, lert alone how to connect to any specific server/channel etc.

When an IRC program starts all sorts of things happen, windows pop open, scripts run, call out boxes demanding action, open............ and all this in a matter of seconds.

Someone who is relatively new to the internet or who believes all these horror stories about programs taking over computers, stealing personal info, Credit Card/Bank details etc... would be convinced that someone is trying to take over their computer, and would quickly click the close button.

Now it is completely beyond me as to how to do it, but perhaps someone could modify a version of Mirc, (or any other Client) that does not give the impression that your computer is being taken over by aliens, and that simply connects to the NG server with minimum fuss and connects to an appropriate channel for new users?

Where hopefully some nice kind person could advise them on basics, or alternatively they could meet with the person who has persuaded them to use IRC and get advice from them?

(Slightly off topic I know- sorry)

[flikman]

wakey you're an idiot, as others have tried to point out.

Of course small alliances need more activity - but if they arent notified about incomings more often (as you said would be bad) how are they gonna defend each other?

Alliance is attacked..noone notifies...alliance weakened further.

[Gerbie]

I.m.o. the arguments made by wakey seem valid. There is a significant risk that people will be less eager to use IRC. Galmates will be less eager to push their galmates to start using it. The big alliances will have an advantage if they get the incomming on their members reported better. The smaller alliances already have their defences stretched to their limit most of the time. It's hard to see how big this problem will be though.
It's more a support to people from strong alliances who are unlucky enough to end up in a galaxy with few people who join IRC.

Another isue is the fact that such a button either displays the galmate's alliance instantly or makes it easier for people to hide their alliance. The latter making this an anonimous game of roid racing instead of a wargame. I'd prefer to see the alliance I send my defence call to. This will improve galaxy co-operation (no more need to have secrets for each other) which i.m.o. would make the game more enjoyable.

[tauric]

to long a thread to completely read it,

Is the idea just to report incommings? Or will i (non irc user during daytime) be able to see incomming on alliance mates and thus be able to use my fleets?
From just reporting only the bigger alliances will profit. Their people can get less active and rely on noobs reporting their incomings.

[Gerbie]

Originally Posted by tauric

to long a thread to completely read it,

Is the idea just to report incommings? Or will i (non irc user during daytime) be able to see incomming on alliance mates and thus be able to use my fleets?
From just reporting only the bigger alliances will profit. Their people can get less active and rely on noobs reporting their incomings.

It's just to report incommings.
edit: The HC can control who gets the access to see the incomming. (Though they might have to give people BC status to see it.)

[tauric]

Then, this function will only benefit the bigger alliances.

If you wanna help smaller alliances make sure non irc players can see alliance incommings
you as old tfd must know the way tfd did this Gerbie.

click alliance
check planets under attack.
send fleets
BC AND HC delete the call when there is enough defence.

Imagine the entire pa community engaging in Batlle...., not just the irc community

[Gerbie]

The in-game alliance already has a defence system like that (eventhough it can use some improvement): if I recall correctly members cannot add the defence they sent to it. And I'm not sure what kind of information about the incomming is shown. Such systems create significant security risks as well, a reason why many alliances do not use a system like that. Ofc the system could be improved and access could be better regulated. (Gimme access to it during office hours...; log the page requests)

Originally Posted by Kal

This idea came from somwhere, possibly suggestions forums, or maybe someone just had it as a crazy idea, but I immeditatly jumped on it becuase i'm insane and added it to the todo list to do at some point in the future, however I have now seen the light and realise some discussion is needed

The idea is a simple one, it is to have a way for galm8s to report incomings to an in game alliance through a quick and easy solution. Put simply, you press a single button and the attack is reported and added to the ingame defence system for each alliance. Now this is great for the smaller alliances with no external tools, and for thoose who choose not to use irc, but at the same time it makes using irc much less useful and according to some would make half of the community disapear.

So I propose a modified version of this idea for adoption in the future. Basically the button would still exist, but it would have delayed affect, the defence call would be reported half way through the tick. This then means that using irc is still a huge advantage, but also means that alliances can relly a little more on the in game defence system and more importantly perhaps gives the in game defence system a use for all alliances in the event of their irc systems failing for some reason.

Of course the in game defence systems also need improving to make them easier and more efficent to use, so feel free to suggest things here as well as shredding the idea I just proposed.

mabey you should make the amount of time for your ships to defende shorter if the person your defending is in the same allience as you, another i dea i have thought of is a allience fund, like a galactic fund, and using the fund you should be able to buy new constructions e.g a warpgate for the whole allience to make everyones fleets faster when defending.

[ils]

mm, sounds good to me. Making def more easy

[Vencedor]

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

As for who I am and what alliance I am, I wasn't trying to make out i'm more important than anyone else or to talk down to them. You however were talking to me (and others here) like they were a bunch of clueless newbies. You shouldnt be talking down to even newbies like this let alone experianced players.

err ya, you were the high almighty...whatever...get a grip

I also wanted you to off and actually realise its far from me moaning due to being unhappy with my alliance or bitter due to attacks. I'm someone who is happy where they are, i've had ample opertunity to join other alliances over the rounds but I have never felt the need to give up my ideals just to join another alliance for personal gain. I''m in this to help new players and to fight for making the game better by ensuring the more vocal bigger alliance community doesnt stampede over the smaller alliance community due to being unchallenged in their views of whats good for the game (as what they think is good is quite often not good for the grass routes of the game which is where improvements need to be made to attract and keep new players)

bla bla bla.....your a martyr, I know... I'll buy you a bullhorn

If you had bothered to take 5 mins to find out who you were talking to youd have easierly found this out rather than throw wild accustaions and without you talking down to me like some new player

you act like a new player...if it looks like shit, and it smells like shit.... it's prolly shit

Your just so bloody deluded ffs. I bet theres no ONE member in ND who can claim not to have launched an unprovoked attack on a player from a small alliance whos just in range and whom they want to bash and get easy roids from. Quite often this is done in multiple tick raids with multiple people so cant even be chalked down to a random raid by members without anyone elses knowledge as it has to have been discussed somewhere, most likly the alliances private channel.

there's not 1, prolly 98 ( atleast they haven't with th knowledge of their HC)

ND may not declare war on smaller alliances BUT to even claim that they dont bash is just bloody ridiculous. Even I wouldnt try and claim F-Crew doesnt bash and not bashing was always a key aspect of our ideals, as I know full well that there are times when I'm not around to discourage hitting unsuitable targets that it does happen. its simply the way PA works and iits something you have to do if you want to grow. You cant grow as quickly if your hitting tougher targets as this means more losses are incured so the more expensive your roids are. Everyone especially when at war finds the easiest targets possible to supliment their score on the cheap so stop spinning the yarn that ND is special and doesnt do it as it simply doesnt wash

ND doesn't bash, we don't need to....try LCH

I havent asked you to apologises for being in a large alliance. What i am, asking is for you to be a little less conceited and to treat people with a little more respect and understanding. People like yourself need to realise they arent the centre of the universe and infact and even though they are the most vocal group and most powerful group of players in the game they are infact the minority group. As such they hold a great deal of responsability in their hands to make this game betetr for everyone. If they keep pushing for things that are only good for the upper echelons of the game then they are helping kill it by doing so. They are part of PA's problems atm due to their lack of understanding of others but they can easierly be PA's saviours if they just woke up and realised the power they have to help improve the lower levels and thus help attract and keep new players much better
I'm not concieted, I'm just a prick

DUDE! Get a grip and stop treatin ppl like crap
Far out, and people wonder why newbies dont stay?!?
People that act like u kill the game, even for themselves.
And just so u know BEFORE you post, I've been here since r2 ... so dont n00b me.

[Metis]

imho, annonymous reporting = fantastic

sleep is a wonderfull thing. being able to rely on one's galaxy from the start would help game moralle, give everyone at least a few hours of sleep each night, and would make all of us less ready to quit.

i miss the gianormous battles.

more tools = more players = large battles sooner

and while yer at it, bring back salvage. it's good for the newbs to profit from helping each other out. how about -- % salvage cap proportional to ratio of attacker value to defender value. like minimum %cap if defender is bigger than attacker, and if you are smaller than attacker, salvage cap = (min% + min% * (scoreAttacker/scoreDefender)^1.5*0.2) <--and don't be stingy about that multiplier ... use a more complicated formula if you want an exponential response. but the little dudes deserve a break.

and guys, ffs -- quit with the holier than thou b.s. ... put yer egos in their respective little baggies and do try and have a productive thread. we can all do without having to read yer plethoric whinging.

luv, ~me

/me is PHNX to the last, in case u wondered *

[Gerbie]

Originally Posted by Metis

imho, annonymous reporting = fantastic

sleep is a wonderfull thing. being able to rely on one's galaxy from the start would help game moralle, give everyone at least a few hours of sleep each night, and would make all of us less ready to quit.

i miss the gianormous battles.

more tools = more players = large battles sooner

and while yer at it, bring back salvage. it's good for the newbs to profit from helping each other out. how about -- % salvage cap proportional to ratio of attacker value to defender value. like minimum %cap if defender is bigger than attacker, and if you are smaller than attacker, salvage cap = (min% + min% * (scoreAttacker/scoreDefender)^1.5*0.2) <--and don't be stingy about that multiplier ... use a more complicated formula if you want an exponential response. but the little dudes deserve a break.

and guys, ffs -- quit with the holier than thou b.s. ... put yer egos in their respective little baggies and do try and have a productive thread. we can all do without having to read yer plethoric whinging.

luv, ~me

/me is PHNX to the last, in case u wondered *

I like it, but the formula needs some work. I'd leave out the ^1.5 and choose a cap on it (say: max 120% salvage). (Although every maximum above 100% is open to abuse).

edit: note that this reply is a bit off-topic.

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Metis

imho, annonymous reporting = fantastic

sleep is a wonderfull thing. being able to rely on one's galaxy from the start would help game moralle, give everyone at least a few hours of sleep each night, and would make all of us less ready to quit.

i miss the gianormous battles.

more tools = more players = large battles sooner

and while yer at it, bring back salvage. it's good for the newbs to profit from helping each other out. how about -- % salvage cap proportional to ratio of attacker value to defender value. like minimum %cap if defender is bigger than attacker, and if you are smaller than attacker, salvage cap = (min% + min% * (scoreAttacker/scoreDefender)^1.5*0.2) <--and don't be stingy about that multiplier ... use a more complicated formula if you want an exponential response. but the little dudes deserve a break.

and guys, ffs -- quit with the holier than thou b.s. ... put yer egos in their respective little baggies and do try and have a productive thread. we can all do without having to read yer plethoric whinging.

luv, ~me

/me is PHNX to the last, in case u wondered *

It wont allow anyone to get any more sleep and certainly wont bring in more players.

On the more sleep thing HOW do you think it acheives this? Players still need to be active to help DEFEND their alliance mates, as ive been saying about the small alliances if theres no 'ships' to defend a member it doesnt matter if its reported or not.

The only way it allows for less activity and thus allows for sleep is if you decide to be a selfish git and dont try and help your alliance mates out and lets be honest you arent going to survive long in an alliance with this attitude. And if too many people take this view then the alliance isnt going to last long either.

And as for more players, for more players you need to make the entry point of the game more comeptative and fun. A feature that encourages less IRC activity with the lower down players and thus reduces an entry level alliances ability to defend isnt going to achieve this.


As for slavage, the reason it was reduced was that it was being abused. If you make salvage too high your risking making it too abusable. So while it would be something thats pretty good for recoving from 'bashings' i'm not sure its something which would be that good for the game on the whole

[god113]

But wakey, how about all the players who have play but don't use irc that just don't want to? I have certainly encountered a fair few players like this, who just enjoy the game for what it is, without the irc community. Sure these players won't have very big planets, and many might be on free-be accounts... but nevertheless, they're still players. And a feature like this would be a massive advantage to players like that in small alliances that don't use irc. Yes it wouldn't mean they would have extra ships around for defence, but with a defence call ten times more likely to be reported, it is much better for the allie, as generally in these small non-irc-based alliances having the ships isn't always the problem. It's not knowing the call exists...

It wouldn't by any means be an instant cure for these small non-irc alliances, or for the players. But it could help considerably. Maybe in some allies knowing the def the call exists isn't the problem (Like in F-crew I would take it...), but I know for sure in some allies that is the problem. Or at least a problem.

I don't know how many percent of the players playing planetarion use irc regulary, with a random stab-in-the-dark guess I would say about 70%? Which still leaves 30% which is pretty important to the game. So that's why I think there is potential gain from this tool. As it makes playing on that level much more managable.

And the possible bad sides would be it helps big alliances? All incomming would be reported to the big alliances anyway through irc, as any active galaxy mates in a galaxy with big alliances would be on irc anyway. It would mean they could keep their alliance anonymous for longer, which would inturn help them, but for the small alliances that don't even think about targetting big alliances this wouldn't make any difference. It would just mean alliance battles might start a little slower, as the intel isn't so good....

And then the other bad side would be it discourages people from using irc? It's then up to the alliance if they defend people who don't go on irc or not. If someone doesn't offer any defence and doesn't come on irc, and by this new system you get their defence call, you don't have to defend them. It's up to the alliance to make them know that they need to defend on irc to get defence. If an alliance has problems keeping members on irc if such a tool came into use, then they need to change their policy on defending these members.... Then for them it would be like the tool never existed.

My overal point is, there are people who do enjoy the game without irc (who just don't want to use it), this would make the game more fun for them. And therefore add another level of playing the game, so possibly increasing the amount of customers.

So I think the good sides outway the bad...

[Ferretus]

I personally dislike IRC, I am no noob as I've been playing since R2, and also experience a rich community both ia these boards and via my alliance. IRC is not essential to playing this game or in fact many others.

[flikman]

If ppl like IRC, and want to use it they will still use it. But what about when you're at work and u can get online, but cant run an IRC client to report incs?

On my uni workstation the com unit doesnt work either, so I'd be unable to do anything than mail ppl at random.

This round I played for ND also, but in a small galaxy with inactive members who were never seen on IRC, but I'm sure would have reported the incs with the button.

This feature HUGELY benefits smaller alliances who don't have defence call bots and defence channels, and who don't have any great infrastructure; the calls will presumably go to a webpage that DC/HC can look at and instantly see whats coming, what ETA, and would in many respects be a free alliance tool like the large alliances have.

all these idea's are nice and so. But did anyone ever thought about the following:


When you limit alliances ,or communites as some call them, to a lower limit then some already are then it means alot of those members can't play along with their own alliance.
I take myself for example - if my alliance would say sorry but we only have so many
spots , hell... then I just don't play. Simply cuz I'm not going to join another alliance were I am ordered to attack all my friends. Thus means a lower player base ( = less $$ for Jolt.) Now ofcourse its not about the money, as Jolt doesn't make loads of it on Planetarion - but we do want a keep a nice player ammount before there's no1 left to attack anymore.

Providing tools for alliances is indeed handy. Some rounds ago planetarion had an arbitor ingame on the alliance subpages. I think alot of new alliances have a good tool on that one. (the pre round 10 alliance pages). I've actually been thinking to release an open source (arbitor) for the alliances that can and want to use it.

anyways, dont limit people to much.. they don't like that in real life and they wont like that in a game for sure.

[Metis]

If we assume the following are true:
1) A buddy pack consists of three people
2) A galaxy consists of ten people

And we also assume that:
3) 50% of your non-buddy galaxy m8s are active

By making everyone able to report your incomings from day 1, this means your incomings have double the chance of being reported to your alliance (aka: you don't all have to stay awake and watch).

[cycle o path]

Here's a thought, sorry if this has been discussed, but after the first page, I really couldn't face working my way through another two.

Why should incomings have to be manually reported? Why not use an alliance status screen, much like the gal status page? A tag on the alliance main page modelled on the galaxy attack warning message would be good too. You go into your alliance page, you see 'Your alliance has incoming fleets', you check the alliance status screen and act acordingly.

For those of you who are worried about losing the advantage or community spirit of IRC: Just becuase people can easily see incoming doesn't mean that the D is instantly organised, that's half the fun, trying sort out D.

There are, of course, security issues here. Many HC's, myself included, do not like their members to be able to see the coords of everyone in the alliance, at least until we are sure that they can be trusted. Why not have the alliance status screen visable to only those who have their arbiter rights set to planet. Restricting this information, whether it be on a page or in a message, to the commanders of the alliance is not really gonna help the smaller alliances that it could otherwise aid hugely. It should be on a trust basis rather than rank.


As for putting a time limit on the information, with the alliance travel time bonus at only 1 tick, this is a terrible idea. By the time the half hour has elapsed, you have another half hour in which you hope that there will be people online who can help, who see the information and get organised in time. Can happen in the bigger alliances but lets face it, they have their precious irc. This feature, as I see it, will help people in smaller alliances, without the exterior tools and who don't live online. These people need their alliances to have at least the full hour to try and pull something together. In fact I've been thinking for a while, why not increase the alliance travel time bonus to 2 ticks??? - Yes I realise that this idea will be hated, smashed, shredded, trampled, burned and burried by the 'Reward Activity Lobby' but I thought it needed to be suggested. If smaller alliances can actually function properly then they will not continually lose their good members to bigger alliances and the game will become MUCH more interesting. If all of this were to be implemented, along with a lower limit on alliance size, I think that we would see some far more spectacular wars.

Anyway, that got a little off-point at the end there but I was on a roll and didn't want to stop typing! If you don't like some or all of these ideas, please feel free to discuss the reasons, alternatives, etc. Please do not sit there and slag me off, I'm sure that this can be kept civillised folks!

[Joseph]

No more fake defcalls in the bots?
i like the idea =)

[Alki]

top of the head suggestion, not really thought about it. But have alliance leagues, u enter a certain tier alliances can choose which league they wish to enter, if theres a couple of small alliances from a smaller tier want to work together to take on teh big boys in the top league they can choose to all move to that league. As i sed its top of the head idea prolly needs some tweaking or to not be used at all. Also completely off topic jus the fact i keep reading this thread and see many ppl complaignin about big alliances small alliances etc

[Veil05]

Originally Posted by Alki

top of the head suggestion, not really thought about it. But have alliance leagues, u enter a certain tier alliances can choose which league they wish to enter, if theres a couple of small alliances from a smaller tier want to work together to take on teh big boys in the top league they can choose to all move to that league. As i sed its top of the head idea prolly needs some tweaking or to not be used at all. Also completely off topic jus the fact i keep reading this thread and see many ppl complaignin about big alliances small alliances etc

really good idea. your proof not everyone from our town are spastics.

[Alki]

mbro forever bigboy

[Kal]

back to the oringal ideas in the thread i'm going to go with something mist said - now we can mail alliances in game people can mail in a def call if they can;t get on irc, this automation is not needed.

So this thread is now closed - will put a new thing to discuss up soon.