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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 18:29   #1
Nicole
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Freedom Dressing, Freedom Toast, Freedom Vanilla Ice Cream...

I'm sure we all know about the "Freedom Fries" being sold in a truckstop in bumble**** America but I'm here to tell you all that it's spreading! Last week I visited a dorm cafeteria on campus for lunch and they were selling mother****ing freedom fries. This was at a ****ing school for christ's sake. Next thing you know McDonald's will be selling freedom fries. I officially hate everybody

end rant.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 18:33   #2
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stupid tiny-brainers shop owners that have nothing more to do than to start a trend...
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 18:35   #3
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im sorry nicole but i want this to spread :/



just so i can laugh at you silly americans in m superior european way
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 18:36   #4
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I'm shaking an angry fist at you by the way.

If we weren't seperated by an ocean it would be very intimidating.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 19:26   #5
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Crazy Americans....

BTW, I heard they want to "punish" the French for this veto incident.
Who do they think they are?
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 19:35   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by Structural Integrity
Crazy Americans....

BTW, I heard they want to "punish" the French for this veto incident.
Who do they think they are?
THE BOOGIE MEN!!!
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 20:23   #7
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Ok, everyone hates the French. Can we all just along with our lives and spin the dial for our next random targert.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 20:34   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Ok, everyone hates the French. Can we all just along with our lives and spin the dial for our next random targert.
I hate the Americans more now than the French. In some way I find that the French did the right thing in opposing the US and I hope that more countries will openly oppose to the things the US is now doing (pointing their dirty fingers at random nations for random crap).
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 20:42   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Structural Integrity
I hate the Americans more now than the French. In some way I find that the French did the right thing in opposing the US and I hope that more countries will openly oppose to the things the US is now doing (pointing their dirty fingers at random nations for random crap).
Wake up and read the news. Its cause France sold them illegal arms as well as did Russia and where now finding the ****. So if I was France, Germany or Russia I would encourge a peaceful means too.

Besides, or full of **** if you think even after 12 years of diplomacy a mircale was going to happen in a month.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 21:48   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Wake up and read the news. Its cause France sold them illegal arms as well as did Russia and where now finding the ****


Priceless.


No need to oppose the US, sooner or later they'll give someone with his level of education a job in a nuclear powerplant and the problem will solve itself.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 21:52   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Wake up and read the news. Its cause France sold them illegal arms as well as did Russia and where now finding the ****. So if I was France, Germany or Russia I would encourge a peaceful means too.

Besides, or full of **** if you think even after 12 years of diplomacy a mircale was going to happen in a month.

the americans let saddam use a 'host' of apache attack helipcopters.

what they didnt bank on was that hed use it to massacre kurds in the north.


however the US did little/nothing to reprimand him.

incidently this was after desert storm and was overseen by shwartskoph (who i cant spell btw)


the US list of 'misdemenours' is far more extensive than you give it credit for.

Israel alone would suffice as an example.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 21:56   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Wake up and read the news. Its cause France sold them illegal arms as well as did Russia and where now finding the ****. So if I was France, Germany or Russia I would encourge a peaceful means too.

Besides, or full of **** if you think even after 12 years of diplomacy a mircale was going to happen in a month.
Yeah, well.... pot... kettle...
Besides that, so what if they sold weapons to Iraq. It's not like they become a threat to the US when they have western guns.

And this whole diplomacy thing was one big show. A month or three after 9-11 it was clear that Iraq was a target and that the US were going to invade them no matter what. Not a single resolution could change this.

Also, this whole WMD thing was untrue (as of yet). That makes me wonder why the hell they really went to war. It's not because the US is the noble knight of the world and wanted to liberate those poor iraqis. They left them to rot down there for 12 years (I don't blame them for that, it's far from my bed too), and the whole world had about forgotten that iraq even existed.
I still believe that this is a political thing. I believe that Bush tries to win the next election by exploiting American patriotism (or nationalism if you will). And he will continue his killing spree untill he has secured his next term as a President (basing that on threats towards N-Korea and Syria).

Your turn again... take your time as I'm off to bed.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 21:57   #13
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intrepid read chomsky's rougue states.


tis a nice book based on facts.
you will enjoy muchly.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 22:08   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
intrepid read chomsky's rougue states.


tis a nice book based on facts.
you will enjoy muchly.
Let me guess, The US is listed

If anyone is reading more into my statement shame on you. I just don't give a **** for this Freedom [insert product] crap.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 22:47   #15
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Re: Freedom Dressing, Freedom Toast, Freedom Vanilla Ice Cream...

Quote:
Originally posted by Nicole
I'm sure we all know about the "Freedom Fries" being sold in a truckstop in bumble**** America but I'm here to tell you all that it's spreading! Last week I visited a dorm cafeteria on campus for lunch and they were selling mother****ing freedom fries. This was at a ****ing school for christ's sake. Next thing you know McDonald's will be selling freedom fries. I officially hate everybody

end rant.
hehe, in things like these America looks strangely similar to Iraq (I'm referring to the Bush portrait on the floor of an hotel, wich was just as funny ).
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 22:49   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
the americans let saddam use a 'host' of apache attack helipcopters.

what they didnt bank on was that hed use it to massacre kurds in the north.


however the US did little/nothing to reprimand him.

incidently this was after desert storm and was overseen by shwartskoph (who i cant spell btw)


the US list of 'misdemenours' is far more extensive than you give it credit for.

Israel alone would suffice as an example.
Is this just bollocks, or do you have a source, cos it sure sounds unlikely to me.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 23:09   #17
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Just wait till they start selling Freedom Matrims. I'll be big.







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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 23:36   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by NEWSBOT3
Is this just bollocks, or do you have a source, cos it sure sounds unlikely to me.

i had one minor fact wrong. they wernt apaches'

i shall quote

Quote:
Naom Chomsky

"The official ban [regarding the ban on official contacts with kurdish leaders and iraqi democratic dissidents] was renewed immediatly after the Gulf War, in March 1991, when Saddam was tacitly authorized to conduct a massacre of shi'ites in the south and then Kurds in the north. The Massacre proceeded under the steely gaze of 'Stormin'' Norman Schwarzkopf, who explained that he was "suckered" by Saddam, not anticipating that Saddam might carry out military actions with the helicopters he was authorised by Washington to use. the bush administration explained that support for Saddam was necessary to preserve 'stability'."
Ref : Rougue States - Noam Chomsky- Pluto Press, 2000. P37.





theres multiple references to other acts involving us support for saddams actions btw.
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 23:39   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Let me guess, The US is listed

If anyone is reading more into my statement shame on you. I just don't give a **** for this Freedom [insert product] crap.
rogue states is a term either to

a) use as a propaganda term applied to various enemies or


b) a literal term applying to states who do not regard themselves bound by international norms.



based on us agression and foreign policy over the past century its safe to say america acts as a rogue nation outside international norms and law. it circumvents the UN on many occassions and is rather contradictory in its 'ideals'
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Unread 23 Apr 2003, 23:50   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
fair enough.

if you hadnt mentioned apaches thats believable anyhow
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 17:38   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
rogue states is a term either to

a) use as a propaganda term applied to various enemies or


b) a literal term applying to states who do not regard themselves bound by international norms.

based on us agression and foreign policy over the past century its safe to say america acts as a rogue nation outside international norms and law. it circumvents the UN on many occassions and is rather contradictory in its 'ideals'
That's a pretty strange statement coming from a person who lives in the center of what used to be an empire that spanned the globe. Let's also not forget Britain's pre-emptive strikes in the last century.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 17:50   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
the americans let saddam use a 'host' of apache attack helipcopters.

what they didnt bank on was that hed use it to massacre kurds in the north.


however the US did little/nothing to reprimand him.

incidently this was after desert storm and was overseen by shwartskoph (who i cant spell btw)


the US list of 'misdemenours' is far more extensive than you give it credit for.

Israel alone would suffice as an example.
They where not apaches you tard. They where hueys that where armed. If you read the accounting it was someting we did not foresee that asshole doing when we gave premission use helicopters to move personal and never accorded to use when signing the legal documents he was going to arm them and well, a treaty is a treaty like France said. Oh, and remember your goverment was invovled in this treaty too so that makes you just as guilty and any other country that took part in the colition.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 17:52   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
rogue states is a term either to

a) use as a propaganda term applied to various enemies or


b) a literal term applying to states who do not regard themselves bound by international norms.



based on us agression and foreign policy over the past century its safe to say america acts as a rogue nation outside international norms and law. it circumvents the UN on many occassions and is rather contradictory in its 'ideals'
The UN is a joke and is NOT a planet goverment. Its just a forum for countires to talk. It really is a joke what people think it is. Not to mention for a good laugh look who is on the security council and Humans Rights boards. We got dictators and human right violaters on them. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 17:58   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Texan
That's a pretty strange statement coming from a person who lives in the center of what used to be an empire that spanned the globe. Let's also not forget Britain's pre-emptive strikes in the last century.
That's a pretty strange statement coming from a person who was born in a country of people who slaughtered millions upon millions of Native Americans. Let's also not forget their use of WMDs in the last 60 years.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:04   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sub
That's a pretty strange statement coming from a person who was born in a country of people who slaughtered millions upon millions of Native Americans. Let's also not forget their use of WMDs in the last 60 years.
We used 2 bombs and at the time noone knew about radiation poising being so bad and mix in they where looking for a way to end a war with a sucidal country.

Also, I do not remember slaughtering my neighbors or my armed forces coming in to my neighborhood to wipe me and my friends and neighbors out.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:10   #26
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listen retarded yanky boys.

when i talk about 'world affairs' i am in no way excusing my country.
you wanted a discussion so i gave you a discussion. saying 'your country is just as bad' is possibly the crappest 'come back line' you couldve said.
The UK is most clearly the US's attack dog when it comes to most things and we usually do crap **** together so drop the whole 'your just as bad as us act'. it doesnt solve anything and it doesnt actually add to the debate whatsoever.

why is it that whenever anyone brings up critisism you will always revert to the 'WELL YOU DID XXXX BACK IN XXXX TOO. YOUR JUST AS BAD'


to call the UN a joke is so indicative of your own viewpoint its scary and just reinforces the whole 'rogue' state nature of america. its the only superpower and it doesnt give a rats ass if it breaks international law or goes against the consensus. It doesnt care if its poilicies are hypocrytical and protect american interests while maintainig the facade of human rights and 'new humanism'.


your country supports dictators to keep 'stability' which infact means 'american interests alive'. It supports mass killings because the current government is US friendly. (e.g. East timor and indonesia.)
America is the biggest hypocracy the world has ever witnessed. Its sense of morals are twisted by beuocracy and american financial interests in various areas of the world.



prove
me
wrong
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:10   #27
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incidently. 'retarded yankee boys' refers only to interpid and texan who have proved to be retarded americans on this thead.


i wish sandy was here. at least he speaks sense sometimes :-((((
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:32   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
We used 2 bombs and at the time noone knew about radiation poising being so bad and mix in they where looking for a way to end a war with a sucidal country.

Also, I do not remember slaughtering my neighbors or my armed forces coming in to my neighborhood to wipe me and my friends and neighbors out.
You really are good at missing the point.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:34   #29
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Originally posted by JammyJim
listen retarded yanky boys.

when i talk about 'world affairs' i am in no way excusing my country.
you wanted a discussion so i gave you a discussion. saying 'your country is just as bad' is possibly the crappest 'come back line' you couldve said.
The UK is most clearly the US's attack dog when it comes to most things and we usually do crap **** together so drop the whole 'your just as bad as us act'. it doesnt solve anything and it doesnt actually add to the debate whatsoever.

why is it that whenever anyone brings up critisism you will always revert to the 'WELL YOU DID XXXX BACK IN XXXX TOO. YOUR JUST AS BAD'


to call the UN a joke is so indicative of your own viewpoint its scary and just reinforces the whole 'rogue' state nature of america. its the only superpower and it doesnt give a rats ass if it breaks international law or goes against the consensus. It doesnt care if its poilicies are hypocrytical and protect american interests while maintainig the facade of human rights and 'new humanism'.


your country supports dictators to keep 'stability' which infact means 'american interests alive'. It supports mass killings because the current government is US friendly. (e.g. East timor and indonesia.)
America is the biggest hypocracy the world has ever witnessed. Its sense of morals are twisted by beuocracy and american financial interests in various areas of the world.



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1st Let me know where the US has an empire where we have subjected the population and not made them full citzens without the full rights gaurenteed under the constition (with some minor details like their senators geting voting power) or didn't eventully let teh country go on its own. I can think of a certain country which citzen is being a hipocrit and when his country built an empire doing the oppisote where countless countries rebelled to get their freedom, peacefully or violently.

2nd I never pointed out your previous acts of your country in history. I just pointed out that your a tard to even suggest we gave them apaches, I mean that is just a stupid statement, and we where sololy reponisable for the results after gulf war 1, which not are we not but neither are the other countires invovled like yours that blam rest on Saddam and his Baath party. THe only think I can saw WE, oh look again I didn't blame just the UK like someone else, where at fault for was leaving a loophole.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:35   #30
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Originally posted by Sub
You really are good at missing the point.
No your really good at missing my point and my sarcism. If you want I can pull out a dictionary for you and tell you what native means.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:44   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
1st Let me know where the US has an empire where we have subjected the population and not made them full citzens without the full rights gaurenteed under the constition (with some minor details like their senators geting voting power) or didn't eventully let teh country go on its own. I can think of a certain country which citzen is being a hipocrit and when his country built an empire doing the oppisote where countless countries rebelled to get their freedom, peacefully or violently.

2nd I never pointed out your previous acts of your country in history. I just pointed out that your a tard to even suggest we gave them apaches, I mean that is just a stupid statement, and we where sololy reponisable for the results after gulf war 1, which not are we not but neither are the other countires invovled like yours that blam rest on Saddam and his Baath party. THe only think I can saw WE, oh look again I didn't blame just the UK like someone else, where at fault for was leaving a loophole.
britain doesn't have an empire anymore. we knew it was wrong to take it so we gave it back. go away.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:46   #32
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Originally posted by Add
britain doesn't have an empire anymore. we knew it was wrong to take it so we gave it back. go away.
You gave it back to a couple, the rest had to fight for it. I think I can speak on the US's behalf and serveral small african nations on saying I am right. Besides, you missed the point.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 18:49   #33
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the 'america doesnt have an empire' part made me chuckle.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 19:00   #34
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Who gives a rats ass about what happened ages ago? I thought we we're discussing the CURRENT[ problems and world affairs.
Judging a country on what it did over half a century ago is just plain silly anyway.

To throw in a new news fact I read on www.fok.nl (dunno if it's true):
Quote:
TRANSLATION

The US doesn't find it's 10000 nuclear warheads enough. That's why the production will be restarted.

Yesterday Los Alamos stated that for the first time in 14 years they made a plutonium core. That is the heart of modern nuclear weapons. In 1989 the production was halted by the FBI because of environmental problems at the Rocky Flats factory.

The first four years Los Alamos will produce 6 warhead a year. After that the production will be increased to 10 warheads a year. In 2018 a whole new factory will become operational that can produce 500 warheads a year.

These plans are in line with the ideas of the Bush administration to secure American security with more nuclear weapons.

Because of radioactive depletion (err... right word? Warhead losing radioactivity over time) a warhead can suddenly become unusable. The US already has 5000 warheads in reserve, but want to be able to manufactor more warheads more quickly than any other country in the world.

MY SOURCE (Dutch): http://frontpage.fok.nl/news.fok?id=27990
Crazy Americans. They already have more warheads to destroy the world a hundred times over, yet they still want more. Also, I thought they had a treaty with the Russians not to produce any more warheads?
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 19:05   #35
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they backed out of the ABM and russia agreed after a half assed stuggle to save face and not look stupid.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 20:35   #36
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Originally posted by JammyJim
the 'america doesnt have an empire' part made me chuckle.
Yet you don't state what countires we rule with an iron fist and have for a long time.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 20:41   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Structural Integrity
Who gives a rats ass about what happened ages ago? I thought we we're discussing the CURRENT[ problems and world affairs.
Judging a country on what it did over half a century ago is just plain silly anyway.

To throw in a new news fact I read on www.fok.nl (dunno if it's true):


Crazy Americans. They already have more warheads to destroy the world a hundred times over, yet they still want more. Also, I thought they had a treaty with the Russians not to produce any more warheads?
It ended when we where not allowed to have our toy missle shield. Yet the fact remains, we will not use a nuke unless we are nuked and know who did it and even then I doubt we would use them.

Besides, all cards where put on the table with pakistan, india, iran, n. korea and other counties making them. Its just like that anal no landmins treaty we won't sign. Just cause we agree not to use them doesn't mean the enemy will so why would we hamper ourselves and we clean up our mines. I mean we even clean up our enemie's mine fields when the war is done. You know, its like behind the same stupid principle that if you make guns illegal they bad guys won't have them. Funny, I thought they where bad guys for a reason.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 20:53   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Yet you don't state what countires we rule with an iron fist and have for a long time.


Rhodesia, South-West Africa, Siam, East Pakistan, Persia, Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia. Now prove to me you don't rule these countries with an iron-fist!
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 21:07   #39
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Originally posted by JonnyBGood
Rhodesia, South-West Africa, Siam, East Pakistan, Persia, Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia. Now prove to me you don't rule these countries with an iron-fist!
Siam doesn't even exist. Also I asked you to prove we do. Not to through random names up.
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Unread 24 Apr 2003, 21:15   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Siam doesn't even exist. Also I asked you to prove we do. Not to through random names up.


None of them exist anymore, that's the ****ing point you humourless excuse for a human being.










PS Seriously I don't get your point though. Just because it does not have the classical appearance of an empire means it isn't? That's a bit shallow.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 01:25   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
the 'america doesnt have an empire' part made me chuckle.
i notice you use simple definations to justify your assertion that america is a rouge state while ignoring simple definations of an empire which america simply does not fit.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 10:08   #42
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Is Intrepid00 going to be the new DavidBrahm?
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 10:10   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by Grind
i notice you use simple definations to justify your assertion that america is a rouge state while ignoring simple definations of an empire which america simply does not fit.
actually, America does fit some of the definitions of empire rather well.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 10:35   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by Grind
i notice you use simple definations to justify your assertion that america is a rouge state while ignoring simple definations of an empire which america simply does not fit.
There have been two types of Empire in history. Firstly, the most common type involves overt control and domination (usually by an Emperor) of foreign countries - for instance the Roman and British Empires. Secondly, the rarer type involves less overt domination, usually involving alliances or treaties which give massive influence over foreign states to a great power, while that power does not have actual control over the foreign states - for instance the Athenian Empire of the 5th century BC.

It is the second type of empire that the USA is an example of.

Note that this I am not saying that this is a bad thing - the Athenian Empire was mostly beneficial to the subjects of the Athenians - but it is an empire nonetheless.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 13:22   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by Intrepid00
Siam doesn't even exist. Also I asked you to prove we do. Not to through random names up.

heh someone missed the joke


look to south america for pretty much all the proof you need.
america is not a 'traditional empire'

its borders are not well defined.
its power does not rely on the military per se.
its power is defined by the economic devestation it can cause to a country should it not comply.



it has also backed various 'rebel factions' when a government has been less than US friendly even if democratically elected and not starving its people.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 18:38   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sub
That's a pretty strange statement coming from a person who was born in a country of people who slaughtered millions upon millions of Native Americans. Let's also not forget their use of WMDs in the last 60 years.
Last time I checked European countries conquered all of North and South America. I have a map here that shows Britain, Spain, France, Portugal, Netherlands and Russia split up both continents between themselves.

I think most of the Native Americans died from sexually transmitted diseases brought by Europeans in the first two hundred years of colonization. By the time Americans started expanding to the west, Native American populations were about 10 percent of what they were before European colonization.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 18:46   #47
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
listen retarded yanky boys.

when i talk about 'world affairs' i am in no way excusing my country.
you wanted a discussion so i gave you a discussion. saying 'your country is just as bad' is possibly the crappest 'come back line' you couldve said.
The UK is most clearly the US's attack dog when it comes to most things and we usually do crap **** together so drop the whole 'your just as bad as us act'. it doesnt solve anything and it doesnt actually add to the debate whatsoever.

why is it that whenever anyone brings up critisism you will always revert to the 'WELL YOU DID XXXX BACK IN XXXX TOO. YOUR JUST AS BAD'

to call the UN a joke is so indicative of your own viewpoint its scary and just reinforces the whole 'rogue' state nature of america. its the only superpower and it doesnt give a rats ass if it breaks international law or goes against the consensus. It doesnt care if its poilicies are hypocrytical and protect american interests while maintainig the facade of human rights and 'new humanism'.

your country supports dictators to keep 'stability' which infact means 'american interests alive'. It supports mass killings because the current government is US friendly. (e.g. East timor and indonesia.)
America is the biggest hypocracy the world has ever witnessed. Its sense of morals are twisted by beuocracy and american financial interests in various areas of the world.



prove
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It's really easy to call people retarded. You are retarded, JJ. See how easy that was.

I think you just get irritated because UK actually has a worse record than the US.

The only difference between UK and US is that UK has been ****ting on people for a few centuries longer.

Pointing out that UK is worse than US when someone from the UK says the US is the biggest hypocrisy is a valid argument whether you like it or not.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 18:47   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by JammyJim
incidently. 'retarded yankee boys' refers only to interpid and texan who have proved to be retarded americans on this thead.


i wish sandy was here. at least he speaks sense sometimes :-((((
When I say retarded European, I mean only JammyJim, who is so retarded he has to resort to name calling when he doesn't like other peoples' facts.
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 18:48   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by Texan
Last time I checked European countries conquered all of North and South America. I have a map here that shows Britain, Spain, France, Portugal, Netherlands and Russia split up both continents between themselves.

I think most of the Native Americans died from sexually transmitted diseases brought by Europeans in the first two hundred years of colonization. By the time Americans started expanding to the west, Native American populations were about 10 percent of what they were before European colonization.


Words have actually failed me at this point.











PS Proteus, didn't the Athenians tax the other city-states at an extremly high rate to pay for construction projects in Athens? Plus I'm unsure what you think they gained. The intellectual tradition? Building methods or something? The Athenians didn't exactly go around handing out their advantages as I recall. (Plus I think they had two empires didn't they?)
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Unread 25 Apr 2003, 18:49   #50
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