Planetarion Support Team

[aNgRyDuCk]

Originally Posted by notsure

Actually I didn't lose sight of that at all - I agree it was unfortunate that he lost ships - but heck I've lost ships on def calls - either because the dc stuffed up, someone who was meant to send def didn't or did & pulled etc etc - none of which was my fault, but it also wasn't the fault of the PA Team - it was the fault of the dc or the person who didn't launch/pulled etc....in fam's case it was the fault of the person who got themselves closed.

If a player recalls a defense fleet, it's his fault, if the PA team does it and doesn't send notification, it's their fault, and the player shouldn't have to pay for them not paying attention to detail.

[notsure]

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

If a player recalls a defense fleet, it's his fault, if the PA team does it and doesn't send notification, it's their fault, and the player shouldn't have to pay for them not paying attention to detail.

Erm I believe that's why I made the comment that this highlights the need for other affected planets to be notified of the fact that a closed planets fleets have been recalled.

And while PA Team is responsible for the lack of notification - they are not ultimately responsible for the recall - since it would never have happened, had the planet in question simply followed the rules - it's not even as if it's some rule buried in the EULA that most players probably agree to without reading - it's clearly stated in the overview - and has been all round - and last round too for that matter. Which brings me back to my original point - if I was fam - I'd be pissed at the ally mate who got themselves closed - not at the multihunters for enforcing the rules.

notsure

[The Real Arfy]

I'm not going to quote anything because I simply can't be assed.

I've read people saying "fam should have made sure his defence was clear to land". What a pile of bullshit. What if the closure was made at xx:59 when he was ETA 1? Regardless, why he should be responsible for his defence fleet when it was covered? Again, complete bull.

[aestuos]

I agree with angry duck, i shouldnt have to check my raids at ETA 4 3 2 and 1 in case the person im attacking with cheated.

Also whats this crap about we dont get piad, if you dont like it dont do it dont whine at us when you make a cock up.

Again marv et al clearly form peoples opinion you can see what WE think as the PLAYERSand what WE think should be done so grow a backbone and do it.

I know it might be hard work but dont forget we pay for the privelage to play this game and that is the only importnant issue, and if im paying to get my fleet crashed and ruin the game id rather not play.

Also you might not be allowed in alliance but you definately prefer some, frankly AOL customer help could do a better job and owuld be more curtious and not quite so stuck up.

WE PAY to play dont forget that, again thanks for doing it for free but dont whine about how hard it is thats offtopic and irrelevant if its hard and ruins your life quit PA.

[aestuos]

Also as i prepare to get neg repped notice the lack of exil players posting about open closure

[pig]

Well I just read this and I fail to see how it is double standards at all.

First things first we have to remember is that he is a paying customer.

If I bought say a coat from a shop and walking out of the shop, a painter dropped paint on it. The shop would give me a refund and apologise or replace the garment. Where I work if someone complains we do everything upmost to sort it out.

The argument they are unpaid is bullshit. Because if you arent paid for a job you probably wont put much effort into it or care about losing your job as much as a paid job. I would say marv has acted like he is better than fam. Perhaps he is. Perhaps he has ops in #planetarion. He must important right? Wrong. He isnt as important as you and I. When I sit in #public and a "n00b" comes in asking for help, in general I will try and help them, be it through pm, pointing them in the right direction etc. No need to belittle them.

I believe this guy should have a refund of resources and ships. Failing that a refund of his money. This "outcry" that the pa team predict most certainly wouldnt happen except people would go well done pa team have done something decent again.

If you dont get your resources/ships back. Phone up Jolt UK. Explain the situation saying that you paid for a service etc, treated like shit yadda yadda yadda. I reckon you will get your money back at least.

[jt25man]

Originally Posted by aestuos

Also you might not be allowed in alliance but you definately prefer some, frankly AOL customer help could do a better job and owuld be more curtious and not quite so stuck up.

I have to say, I'd rather deal with the MH team than AOL any day. Our MH may not always get it right, but at least they have souls.

[wakey]

I cant help but feel both sides arguments are flawed here and as such theres no right answer.After all should fam and his alliance gain from having a cheater in their ranks? If the defence was reliant on this 'cheater' then if its let go roids are being saved by ships that have to some degree been obtained via unfair methods and no-one should be benifiting from that.

Also should the game really be helping people gain just to protect people from their own mistakes. At any point a fellow defender can pull on any of us and we should be checking that the defence we need is still there and this recall is no different to a recall done by the planet.

On the other hand though why should innocent people lose out because of someone cheating. The planet getting defence could find themselves stranded when defence is pulled, maybe the other defenders cant jpg scan the planet they are defending or as others have had the recalled ships then defend an attack on them and destroy an attacker who thought they were safe.

All in all whatever action is taken its unfair on someone involved and i'm not sure anyone deserves compensation or an apology from the MH's and I dont think people should be directing their anger at the MH's but rather towards the person who lost you your ships, the person who cheated and was needed to be closed. The MH simply did their job and made a judgement call, a judgement call that one way or the other would have left someone losing out and left someone wanting compensated for the actions of a ‘cheater’ that had a negative effect on themselves

[The Real Arfy]

Incidentally, this should also apply to free accounts. Whether or not its a paying customer, its still somebody playing the game and they have spent alot of time doing so.

[The Real Arfy]

Originally Posted by wakey

I cant help but feel both sides arguments are flawed here and as such theres no right answer.After all should fam and his alliance gain from having a cheater in their ranks? If the defence was reliant on this 'cheater' then if its let go roids are being saved by ships that have to some degree been obtained via unfair methods and no-one should be benifiting from that.

Also should the game really be helping people gain just to protect people from their own mistakes. At any point a fellow defender can pull on any of us and we should be checking that the defence we need is still there and this recall is no different to a recall done by the planet.

On the other hand though why should innocent people lose out because of someone cheating. The planet getting defence could find themselves stranded when defence is pulled, maybe the other defenders cant jpg scan the planet they are defending or as others have had the recalled ships then defend an attack on them and destroy an attacker who thought they were safe.

All in all whatever action is taken its unfair on someone involved and i'm not sure anyone deserves compensation or an apology from the MH's and I dont think people should be directing their anger at the MH's but rather towards the person who lost you your ships, the person who cheated and was needed to be closed. The MH simply did their job and made a judgement call, a judgement call that one way or the other would have left someone losing out and left someone wanting compensated for the actions of a ‘cheater’ that had a negative effect on themselves

Its the way that they refuse to help a player due to a flaw in the game design/code that most people find this discgraceful.

Oh, and did I read correctly that this guy was found out not to be cheating? I think thats proof enough.

[wakey]

Originally Posted by The Real Arfy

Its the way that they refuse to help a player due to a flaw in the game design/code that most people find this discgraceful.

Oh, and did I read correctly that this guy was found out not to be cheating? I think thats proof enough.

He was reopened I believe but he still techically cheated. The MH's generally try and keep people open unless the infringement is too extreame which may not be something I like (Ive banged heads on more than one occasion when F-Crew members havent been deleted for cheating) but its their policy and as long as its something that happens across the board then we have to respect that.

And if fam should be compensated are they going to compensate all the people whom have lost ships/roids against his 'alliance mate' or any other person closed for cheating?

[jt25man]

Originally Posted by The Real Arfy

Its the way that they refuse to help a player due to a flaw in the game design/code that most people find this discgraceful.

This is a real tragedy yes, they've done a good job of giving themselves a black eye on this case. Even though they were "just doing there job", and dispite not getting paid, they could have handled it better. Perhaps they were put off by the way the case was brought to them, and the attitude of fam in going about trying to get compensated, but they're actually taking a stand and telling him "no", which is something they have been needing to work on. I still say the blame falls more on the guy who was ignorant enough to not read the overview, ask someone, or tell someone about him wanting his gf to sign up on same IP. The only reason it's an issue is because they finally acted on it while he was defending with someone else, if he had not had any fleets out, it would be a moot point. I agree they need to do a little extra work in making sure if his fleets were recalled to notify anyone attacking/defending with him, but they have clearly stated it's a policy not to do it (right now), and they're actually not giving into his whinning about it and I think that's good.

Oh, and did I read correctly that this guy was found out not to be cheating? I think thats proof enough.

From what I read, he was closed for not informing them about a second account on same IP. In my opinion, I don't really see this as cheating anyway, I see it as ignorance on the part of the person who was closed. I do think that instead of closing his account they should of sent him a warning first that they noticed he was sharing an IP, I've seen this tactic before in seeing more than one on the same IP and sending them a warning without closing there accounts. He had every right to be re-opened once they worked out that he wasn't actually cheating, just was ignorant, or perhaps stupid. I will say that MH needs to be the "bigger man" and apologize to him for the way in which they turned him down, and I still think fam should apologize to them for his attitude in the way he went about it, but more importantly, the guy who got his account closed is the one that really needs to apologize to fam, for being ignorant (or stupid) and getting his fleet recalled at a critical time leaving fam hung out to dry.

[Ace]

As i was in the MH channel when this guy came in and started a rant for the second time (not the stuff he posted here) and saw all the responces from the MH team during his rant and after he left i have to say they talked to and about him with a lot of respect and in no way did they acted as "being better then him"


I do agree with a lot of remarks made here about mails to fellow defenders etc and that HE cant help it his ally m8 got closed.
But his way of "trying to solve stuff" is in my eyes not the right way.

My 2 cents

[Phil^]

Originally Posted by jt25man

From what I read, he was closed for not informing them about a second account on same IP.

unless theyve changed this, the game does it in bright red letters upon signup of the second or more account. They also get told in the eula and on the overview - what more do pateam have to do?

[notsure]

Ultimately, I stand by my comment that the blame lies with the planet that was closed....now I also agree that it's unfair that fam lost his ships - but I don't believe it is the responsibility of PA Team (or the multihunters et al) to compensate him - he lost ships as a direct result of the actions of an other alliance member - while doing an alliance defence.....in my opinion - he should be asking his alliance for assistance....not abusing PA Team because they said no to his request....yes there appears to be some flaws in the system - in which case making suggestions about how to change the system is needed - not abuse of people who are following the system as it currently stands.

Originally Posted by The Real Arfy

Oh, and did I read correctly that this guy was found out not to be cheating? I think thats proof enough.

Guess we read it differently - I read it as he did something that is against the rules and was closed - but as it was deamed to be an unintentional oversight (ie he wasn't trying to cheat - he just didn't let the multihunter team know that someone else would be connecting from his IP), they used their judgement and decided to reopen him....of course I could be entirely wrong, but as I said, that's kind of the impression I got.

notsure

[SpookyVince]

Originally Posted by Kal

(...)
For the moment I would reccomend that where possible people try to verify that people who should be joining them in a battle do still have their fleets present as planned.

I must agree.

And to those who will argue against checking your fleets sent out in defence: yes, the DC is there to make sure that you can launch safely, and yes you should trust your DC. But the DC, if not the player himself, also has a responsibility in checking that those who were supposed to join battle are actually there, and if needed recall the fleet, and that you can also land safely...

Originally Posted by Smudge

(...)
With regards to what happens to people who are involved [by involved I mean having fleets being sent to the as defence / attack], there has been the same policy in place that the fleets are recalled and if someone else is reliant on them then we dont compensate them. It maybe harsh but after all this is a war game. If we were to compensate fleets in this matter then I know that within an hour there would be a flood of people wanting there fleets re-instated. And even if this rule was introduced at the beginning of a round that fleets would be recompensated, there simply isnt the time to go through every case, investigating each planet and the losses they may have suffered.
(...)

Btw, I lost 200+ BS the other day. I couldn't be home in time to recall them. Can I have them back? (just kidding) It was not my fault, I swear

[jt25man]

Originally Posted by Phil^

unless theyve changed this, the game does it in bright red letters upon signup of the second or more account. They also get told in the eula and on the overview - what more do pateam have to do?

It's in small yellow letters at the moment. But if you're going to quote me, you should've added the second sentence about how I said it's more ignorance and stupidity than "cheating". As in he was ignorant for not reading that he should have done it, or really stupid for not doing it if he had, and they had every right to close his account if they thought it was cheating, I just mentioned that in the past they have merely sent a warning instead of closing the accounts on the same IP. If there is a set policy to send a warning first, they should do that, if there's a set policy to always close the account and sort it out before re-opening it, they should do that, if there isn't a set policy on what to do, they should make one, then they can stand by it.

[robban1]

lol what is the big deal here? give the dude his stuff back and say sorry.

the mh did right but didnt see the side effect of their acting and its piss easy to sort it but noo

its actually a clear case of doble standards as you guys dont fix it as you would if it was a "known" player

[Gio2k]

Afaik, there's code in the game so that a planet can't exile while his fleets are out. Why don't you just code something like that for closures. Let the closed account log in as normal, he just won't be able to launch new fleets (except maybe run his ships), initiate a cons / res or do covert ops, i would still let him have his resources. He however still has control over fleets that are already flying, meaning he can recall them anytime. This would control some of the damage that wrong closures creates.

[Kal]

Someone made an itneresitng point earlier about whether someone is still actually guilty of cheating if they are cloased and then opened. The answer is that yes they can still be guilty. For example lets say as in this case its multiple accounts on the same IP that have not been reported. Thats quite an obvious thing form our tools so the MH goes and closes. Person comes on and apologises and the MH then decides that though the perosn really should have reported the IP stuff the punishment of being closed for a few ticks was sufficient, so they are reopened. If the person was entirly innocent of anything then they themsleves should have been compensated for any losses they incurred as a result of being closed.

So the fact that they guy was reopened should not be a factor in this discussion really. I think my other posts still adequatly cover the other issues.

[equalizer]

A few points that occurred to me whilst reviewieng the new posts from the night.

Originally Posted by fam

My ally m8's account got closed at some point before the landing. Apparently he allowed his GF to create an account on his computer therefore he broke the rules and a multihunter closed his account.

Firstly, the original post. We keep hearing about these wonderful procedures, investigations and the closure period. Where the heck was the mail to this Ally m8 saying "um are you a really st00pid multi, or just making a dumb mistake? You have two accounts playing on the same IP, please come to #mh and explain yourself!!" Seems this would have solved the whole issue with no problems AND been an essential part of an investigation!!

Originally Posted by Smudge

would the community rather have less closures of cheats with more careful checking or closure and re-opening of planets?

Secondly, I don't know about anyone else, but personally I would like less closures with more careful checking!! I appreciate now what an MH gives up to do their job, but as AngryDuck says you did chose to do this job. Seems to me that if this case had just had a modicum of investigation then we wouldn't be discussing this now.

Originally Posted by notsure

If instead of being closed, he had recalled his fleet (either accidentally or otherwise) would it be fair to blame anyone else for his fleets not being there to support fam...of course not.

Finally, the rather pointless statement above... BUT HE WAS CLOSED, I'm sorry but surely this makes your comments irrelevant to this discussion??

But to address them anyway, I do not assume everyone who plays this game is a cheat and therefore may have their account closed at any minute, as a direct result I expect their fleets to arrive as promised.

As a DC for my alliance I know that when I ask my members to launch what is suitable they will do it, they always paste a launch statement to the def chan aswell, despite the fact it is not asked for. They then do not recall without one of four things happening, i) I as the DC or an HC inform them to recall, ii) The attacked planet informs of the recall of the attacker, iii) a JGP reveals the recall of the attacker or iv) An MH closing their account for cheating. The first two are most likely, the third is not expected from any member unless they have the ability to do so and choose to, the fourth is improbable.

As an HC of my alliance, still acting as one of the DC's as it is a difficult role to fill and I refuse to give it to someone not capable of doing it properly, I expect my DC's NOT to f*** up. I understand that we are all human, sometimes errors occur. If these errors directly affect my members I take steps to rectify them. A member that recalls or forgets to launch is chastised, a DC that tells peeps their ships will be fine when he knows otherwise is bollocked, a member that crashes their fleet as a result of a DC c*** up WILL recieve a donation from the alliance fund.

Have the the PA Team lost sight of the fact that they are HC of the Community Alliance, and the sub department of MH is essentially one of their BC's/DC's!?!?

Do the right thing guys.

[Nadar]

Originally Posted by aestuos

Regardless whether the PA team messud up what the golden rule of bussiness, the customer is always right especially if you messed up guys. If you apologise and stop being up your own arse marv he will play next round and pay to surely thats what you want?

be a man for christ sake

Agree.

Originally Posted by Smudge

Again I wish to say that the Support Team has NOTHING to do with Multihunting or the Multihunting department, PLEASE can you address future posts as MH Team rather than Support.

Agree.

[coffee-]

Originally Posted by notsure

And while PA Team is responsible for the lack of notification - they are not ultimately responsible for the recall - since it would never have happened, had the planet in question simply followed the rules
notsure

Well if you are "notsure" what is happening notsure then I should inform you that the planet in question was later reopened after an apology. Thusly did not do anything wrong.

[SpookyVince]

Actually he did something wrong, even though it was (maybe) not an attempt at cheating: whenever you want more than 1 account on the same IP, you have to inform the multihunters as soon as possible & apply for an exception.

It is stated clearly in the rule, and every players is supposed to know it. I don't always read all the rules myself (proof below), but before anyone told me, I guessed that this kind of behaviour would not be tolerated (several accounts), so before even doing it, a quick look in the rules & that's it you know!

Proof I don't always read the rules: in beta between round 17 & round 18 I overlooked the fact that my ruler name had to be named like my IRC nick. I didn't do that & got closed Well, simple confusion or mistake leads to simple solution, I was quickly reopened after Appoco changed my ruler name. But I have potentially screwed my gal (I know it was beta, but it happens in real game, hence this thread).

Thus my comments of earlier (and it's not a question of doubting your DC ability): always cover yourself & check things, as far as you can. That way, you can't blame it on others... Unless of course you are the kind of person to always blame it on others.

[Gio2k]

Originally Posted by SpookyVince

Actually he did something wrong, even though it was (maybe) not an attempt at cheating: whenever you want more than 1 account on the same IP, you have to inform the multihunters as soon as possible & apply for an exception.

My internet access at the student residence i live in goes through the proxy of the university. Needless to say, there are thousands others using the same proxy for web browsing. So the question is the following:
Now if i am the first to register my account i won't get any messages, or will I? What happens when someone else registers an account after i do? Do i get any notification? If i don't, how am i supposed to know someone else i playing or registered with the same ip. If i DO get a notifcation, doesn't it mean that PA team already know about it? Shouldn't it be them who tell me about someone playing from the same ip?

Originally Posted by SpookyVince

Thus my comments of earlier (and it's not a question of doubting your DC ability): always cover yourself & check things, as far as you can. That way, you can't blame it on others... Unless of course you are the kind of person to always blame it on others.

Of course, because everybody wakes up at 4am in the morning to check whether MHs have closed your alliance mate. Furthermore, nobody sends a defence mission after checking that he has no incomings and then goes off to enjoy his real life, or to work, etc.

[SpookyVince]

Originally Posted by Gio2k

My internet access at the student residence i live in goes through the proxy of the university. Needless to say, there are thousands others using the same proxy for web browsing. So the question is the following:
Now if i am the first to register my account i won't get any messages, or will I? What happens when someone else registers an account after i do? Do i get any notification? If i don't, how am i supposed to know someone else i playing or registered with the same ip. If i DO get a notifcation, doesn't it mean that PA team already know about it? Shouldn't it be them who tell me about someone playing from the same ip?
(...)

No, because it's not an anonymous proxy. I use a proxy to connect at work too, and that's not a problem. No one has a problem in that case.

[A2]

If you start compensating people for losing ships because the person they were defending with (as an example) was closed and their fleets recalled you open a massive can of worms with the following situation:

Planet A is being defended by B & C
C is closed, and his fleet is therefore recalled
In this instance, B either notices (or as some have proposed) is notified and recalls.
Does planet A then have a compensation claim because if C wasn't closed then B wouldn't have recalled, and so A's losses would have been much less. In addition what would happen to any gains the attacker got? Would the attacker keep them, even though without the closure they might not have got them, or would they be returned?


Yes, the current rule sucks if you're unlucky enough to be defending with someone who is closed because of "cheating". In this case it seems there was a legitimate explanation, hence it being reopened. However, as far as I know the closure and non-compensation issue is following the same principle that has been followed for several rounds.

Having multihunted previously myself I know that accounts are not closed lightly, and despite all the checks there sometimes is a genuine explanation which leads to reopening, which is why the game doesn't move directly to full deletion.


On a completeley different note:
Someone mentioned that they might be the first person to sign up on an IP, and therefore wouldn't know if someone else had used it. The simple solution I can think of for this is to pa-mail each planet on an IP every time someone signs up on the same IP and give them some details about what to do next.

[SpookyVince]

Originally Posted by A2

Someone mentioned that they might be the first person to sign up on an IP, and therefore wouldn't know if someone else had used it. The simple solution I can think of for this is to pa-mail each planet on an IP every time someone signs up on the same IP and give them some details about what to do next.

Yes, can be an option I suppose. As a matter of fact, I'm having the same ISP as some other players in Belgium, likely. Belgium is small, and there are not a lot of different ISPs. DHCP (or whatever it's called that gives me dynamically an address each time I connect) can give the same IP as another guy a few days ago... Indeed... But I don't think that this can be a problem, can it? This should be quite obvious in such a case that those 2 players are not sharing the same IP, but just the same ISP that can, by pure chance, give one of them the IP of the other one on another day...

And about proxies... If I use a proxy at work, like mentioned above, this is because I have no choice (yeah I know, I shouldn't be playing at work )... Now, using such a non-anonymous proxy, and deliberately using an anonymous proxy to hide a multi account are 2 totally different things...

[Gio2k]

So what is exactly the difference between an anonymous and a non-anonymous proxy when it comes to PA? Either way, you get two accounts registered under one ip, or not?

[ronnie]

if this is the way customers are treated then god im glad i dont play PA actively anymore. People who arent big enough to apologise when making mistakes and being rude to customers shouldnt really be in posession of high powered ranks within the PA team.

this has been a problem for many rounds, its not something which is new and yet still nothing has been done to combat this problem. innocent people shouldnt be getting screwed in this way.

give the guy his ships back and make this a rule for people who are innocently affected by another persons (peoples) actions.


*Customers in bold because thats what people who pay for a service are, they deserve to be treated as if they are the life blood of the company as, thats what they are. PA with no customers = no PA.

[Kargool]

Originally Posted by Eula

(1) Account closure means it will not be possible to log into the account,
fleets and covert operations cannot be directed at a closed Account. Upon
closing all outgoing fleets will be automatically recalled, closed Accounts
keep ticking (gaining resources, auto adjusting stealth/alert levels, etc)
with the rest of the universe.

Its in the eula that fleets may be recalled due to cheating, therefore you actually agree to the risk that fleets may be recalled due to cheating. Im not sure if it gives the PA-crew a full aquittal, but since it stands in the eula that peoples fleet may get recalled you are "aware" of the risk that ships may get recalled due to cheating.

[notsure]

Originally Posted by equalizer

A few points that occurred to me whilst reviewieng the new posts from the night.

As an HC of my alliance, still acting as one of the DC's as it is a difficult role to fill and I refuse to give it to someone not capable of doing it properly, I expect my DC's NOT to f*** up. I understand that we are all human, sometimes errors occur. If these errors directly affect my members I take steps to rectify them. A member that recalls or forgets to launch is chastised, a DC that tells peeps their ships will be fine when he knows otherwise is bollocked, a member that crashes their fleet as a result of a DC c*** up WILL recieve a donation from the alliance fund.

So what happens to an alliance member who gets himself closed for not following a clearly stated rule? Since again, this is what happened in this case...it's not fam's fault his alliance mate got closed, nor is it the fault of PA Team....there is only one person to blame for the closure, and all consequences resulting from said closure.

If you go back and read my posts, I have never disputed that it was unfortunate that fam lost his ships, but I have disputed who is to blame for him having done so. Until someone can prove to me that PA Team is responsible for his alliance mate breaking the rules, then I don't see why they should be responsible for compensating other players as a result....especially since all they did was follow the stated proceedure for this situation (closing the planet & recalling the fleets).

notsure

[noah02]

Originally Posted by Eula
(1) Account closure means it will not be possible to log into the account,
fleets and covert operations cannot be directed at a closed Account. Upon
closing all outgoing fleets will be automatically recalled, closed Accounts
keep ticking (gaining resources, auto adjusting stealth/alert levels, etc)
with the rest of the universe.
-------------------------

If i report myself as a cheat but can prove my innocence, I can get resource fat ?

Wahoo vacation with resources ftw :P

[randal]

Looks like a punch in the face for a normal player to me too.

Arguments like "he should jpg before to make sure" etc. obviously are completely useless, as it was pointed out before.
Not many people build alot of amps themselves (with alliance scanners and stuff), and asking for scans there for *every* little defense (of course not before 15 minutes to the land, cause who knows then the closure happens), just to avoid that case, which we agree is heavily unlikely allover, that's plain stupid.
And there is no other reason "to make sure", at least not in half-decent alliances.

The argument that they're unpaid is as old as pointless. As others, like Forest I think, pointed out. Many people 'work' for free in more or less important positions. Still the no-money-argument is never an excuse for doing stuff wrong.
And as funny as it may sound, it actually is important to some people what happens to their planet, and now hold your seat, even if they're Not Top100 or battling for the Win. I only play a bit here and there aswell, still allover theres tens of hours you invest in building up your planet and your networks, plus I paid money to be treated correctly as long as I behave correctly.
Getting the planet screwed over by such an instance is exactly the often explained punch in the face. Any such instance, where I did everything 100% right on my side and still got what I built up destroyed would seriously make me think about continuing the round or the game as such aswell.
And maybe a bit more than someone who cares for homeless cats or whatever, some of you people sure more than enjoy the 'power' that position gives you.

And no matter if fam is honest, childish, cool, talking crap with the friends he wanted to get in, or about his quittage, or whatever. His main problem surely is that he is not a 'pa celeb', as I am extremely sure that, if he was one, he would have had some pal who would have talked to some dude etc., which would end with a full compensation.
There is no doubt that if this would have happened to a "high profile" player, or one ranked high, that's what would have happened.
This is where the double Standard lies.

Compensating him is nothing of a double Standard. What happened is a flaw in the system You created, and speaks against everything we as players rely on.

And if someone refers to the 'wrong department' or whatever, heck why should anyone care what exactly is what. It's the people who decide that kinda stuff, support, multihunters or whatever. I'm playing for like 6 years and couldn't put one of those guys in one right position.


In my eyes aswell, a full compensation and an apology for the arrogance towards him is the only right way.

[Nadar]

Originally Posted by randal

In my eyes aswell, a full compensation and an apology for the arrogance towards him is the only right way.

Indeed.

Has he gotten his ships (+ compensation) back yet btw?

[equalizer]

Originally Posted by notsure

....there is only one person to blame for the closure, and all consequences resulting from said closure

You are absolutely right, it is fam's friends girlfriend we should all be lynching!!

Seriously, this discussion is starting to turn into an argument about which of us posters are right or wrong, not fam or the MH Team. It's kinda lost it's direction....

I think the important part we can ALL agree on is that the closure procedure needs a full and frank review, if it worked properly and well then there would not be 2 pages of replys on this thread, and there would be no where near this much discussion.

Perhaps given the strong feelings this has bought to the surface the PA/MH/Whatever Team(s) would consider an IRC meeting amongst some of the people who have given ideas in this thread? Then a resolution could be hammered out and a poll could be taken to chose a final solution? Call it a customer satisfaction survey if you will.

eq

[Squidly]

Well, I'd love to hear suggestions for improvements, concerns, etc.

I'm always in #multihunters, or my email works just peachy as well. [email protected]

[noah02]

Originally Posted by Phil^

unless theyve changed this, the game does it in bright red letters upon signup of the second or more account. They also get told in the eula and on the overview - what more do pateam have to do?

I got warned there was someone playing on the same IP as me when i was in catterick, north yorkshire in an army barracks when i first signed up.
I did ask PA team who it was so i could declare it but they couldnt find no one on same IP and even if they did i wouldnt be told coz of discretion and all that malarky. I just hoped I never attacked the same target everynight

[fam]

Originally Posted by Nadar

Indeed.

Has he gotten his ships (+ compensation) back yet btw?

no ships/resources compensation. I did however recieve an apology from Kal on behalf of the team. And also, he claimed they are going to change the way planets are closed for next round.

[TouRiQueT]

Well at on the positive side, at least some change was brought about regarding closures.
________
RosseBlack live

[myk]

For my bit on this issue.

I am making this a personal statement as I do not speak for the team, but Kal has already done that for us, and I agree with every word he wrote.

I love helping out players in PA and I have always tried to be fair with decisions. I am always going to be doing my best to help anyone who asks for it and all you would have to do is ask those I have helped out in the past.

As for the coding I do, I love it and I have done it pretty much in the background as you can guess as I bet the majority of you do not know my role within PA. This is fine, but I do code, I do help support people and I love it. I don't get paid, but at the end of the day, do I have to be? I do the best I can to help, and will continue to do so.

[Nadar]

Originally Posted by fam

no ships/resources compensation. I did however recieve an apology from Kal on behalf of the team. And also, he claimed they are going to change the way planets are closed for next round.

Kal is a good guy Good thing you brought this up, it was needed.

[Phil^]

Originally Posted by Nadar

Kal is a good guy Good thing you brought this up, it was needed.

kal means well, but he forgets his place at times.
Its appoco who is in charge of the team, not him. Appoco gets to make all the calls like that and as such, its from appoco ( or biffy as his superior ) any apology on the teams behalf should come from really.

[Nadar]

Kal is (at least how I've experienced it) the one who mostly "shows up" in the forum and elsewhere when there's something up. No harm meant for Appoco of course, I know he's doing a good job too, but shows up rarely (like here).

Like I said, that's how I've experienced it. Others may look at it elsewise.

[teknik]

Originally Posted by Gio2k

My internet access at the student residence i live in goes through the proxy of the university. Needless to say, there are thousands others using the same proxy for web browsing. So the question is the following:
Now if i am the first to register my account i won't get any messages, or will I?

If you know you are playing from a student residence or anywhere where there could be multiple people playing from the same IP without your knowledge, it's pretty easy just to mail the MH team regardless of whether you get the lil message or not and inform them of your situation isn't it? Thats exactly what i did while playing from university and never had any problems.

[bwtmc]

Let's be fair, there's probably only one university in the UK with more than one player on it.

[Kargool]

Originally Posted by Phil^

kal means well, but he forgets his place at times.
Its appoco who is in charge of the team, not him. Appoco gets to make all the calls like that and as such, its from appoco ( or biffy as his superior ) any apology on the teams behalf should come from really.

Appoco is still on vacation I pressume.

[jerome]

Originally Posted by Phil^

kal means well, but he forgets his place at times.
Its appoco who is in charge of the team, not him. Appoco gets to make all the calls like that and as such, its from appoco ( or biffy as his superior ) any apology on the teams behalf should come from really.

why does it matter if it's kal or appoco?

[robban1]

an apology without an refund in this case is totally useless and a slap in the face to the guy and anyone else here. its bad behaviour from the idiot admins in this matter

[xontas]

this is the result of PAteam putting people in charge without proper training

lets view the issue first

a couple of accounts go on a attack and one of the accounts gets closed for cheating
resulting in a loss of all accounts involved

this issue has been around for years

the person that made the first post is placing blame @ the wrong stop
your buddy who you trusted to guard your back in battle wasnt honest and got closed
HE is the one that coudnt be trusted

the multihunter department did what it should do
close a account as soon as they have evidence of cheating!
the law in most country's prohibits PA from sending you a mail that someone else got closed (usualy called the privacy act)
so imo there is blame to place there

In the past ships lost in batlle have never been refunded for this and PA should not start doing it now.
why you might ask
This is a game of alliances enemy's and mostly TRUST
so if you attack, do it with the people you trust
then this will not happen!

Now reading the logs pasted in the orrigithe original post and knowing some of the details on what went on after this
i would like to ask marv to give us a job discription of his own job
What do you think a Head multihunter should do in this game!!!
** (turns out i was wrong marv is head support) but the question stands **