Planetarion Forums

acropolis · 19 Sep 2005, 14:55

So here's the basis. You see a lot ofbusinesses out there, from cell phones to mmorpgs to health clubs that get you to be a member and then charge per amount of time for some service. While in cases this can 'work', there are some obvious problems:
1. Not everyone will want to sign up
2. Members may quit
3. You actually have to provide a service, which isn't free

So to rectify those weaknesses, I have devised a perfect business plan according to the following:
1. Force people to join
2. Make it impossible to quit
3. Provide no service

1. Forcing people to join

I will have a well-trained phone sales staff that speaks little English. They will have been taught that "No" means "Yes, sign me up for your service." Also, that "Do not sign me up" "No, I don't want your product" "Yes, I understand what services you provide and I don't want them" all mean "Yes, sign me up for your service." In the event that the potential customer does not request service (by making any of the "Yes, sign me up for your service" statements"), then the salesperson will ask directly: "Do you want our service? If yes, say yes, or no. Or nothing at all. Or hang up. Or say something else entirely." At this point you can be confident that the customer has signed up. Many business plans are unable to go this route, because even if you 'sign up,' they can't charge you unless you give your credit card number or somesuch. Under my busniess plan, I will make a deal with a major credit card company so this is unnecessary, and then my salespeople will only contact this company's card holders.

2. Making it impossible to quit

This is a key element. So here's my plan: when the customer calls up, wanting to quit, he is told that he must first verify his identity. Obviously we can't be letting anyone quit on someone else's behalf! Now here's where it gets tricky: to verify their ID, they simply need to give their name and their "order number." The order is created when they first "sign up" and is immediately not given to the customer. It is on file at my company, and is completely accessible to any employee, or any customer that calls in once he has verified his identity. Why can't we use your social security number, driver's license number, credit card number, etc to verify? Because we don't have access to the credit card company's database. That would violate your privacy. Our well-trained staff will be ready with such useful cathc phrases as "Sir, we will just need your order number to validate your I.D." "Well, you need to have it before we can access your account" "Maybe you should call back later when you have all your information" "I'm sorry but we can't use that information to validate your ID, we are a separate company than your credit card company and don't have access to their database" "Yeah...sir, you really don't seem to be understanding the concept here"

3. Providing no service

This part is important, but much easier than the first two. I could provide no service standing on my head. Some options I'm considering are prenatal care for pregnant men and fraud protection insurance. The thing is, providing service costs money. Anything someone would actually want is going to put a serious expense on my company, and I don't see how that would help my bottom line.

If anyone sees any flaws in my plan, please feel free to point them out.

Dante Hicks · 19 Sep 2005, 14:57

A lot of companies have beaten you to it.

Weeks · 19 Sep 2005, 15:00

By companies do you mean governments?

acropolis · 19 Sep 2005, 15:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

A lot of companies have beaten you to it.

it's somewhat scary to see the evolution tho.

I remember the first call a few years ago. I just said "no, no no no no no" and at the end, they gave up. I didn't get signed up. The next time i tried no no no no, I got signed up, but then I just called up and cancelled. Then it happened pretty much the same way again. But this last time I feel kinda trapped. I'm almost afraid to cancel now (my plan is to get a job at their company and use my office computer to look up my file to get my order number) because I think the next iteration will involve them killing me and throwing my body in their basement so they can cash my social security checks over the next 50 years.

Ste · 19 Sep 2005, 15:24

i'm not sure how you plan to make money.

I would refuse to pay and you wouldn't be able to do anything because your trick of getting them to sign up is confusing and I could claim 'unfair terms' in the contract or something.

acropolis · 19 Sep 2005, 16:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ste

i'm not sure how you plan to make money.

I would refuse to pay and you wouldn't be able to do anything because your trick of getting them to sign up is confusing and I could claim 'unfair terms' in the contract or something.

of course you'd refuse. but every month you'd see on your credit card bill that my company had charged you some nominal fee.

you can always cancel if you feel like. we have a helpful staff awaiting your request. and while we have a contract on file here that you can access as soon as you've validated your ID, i'm unsure of what lawyer is going to take an interest in you getting screwed out of $10-20 a month. stop by my offices and trip on a crack, then you'll have me worried.

Yahwe · 19 Sep 2005, 16:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by acropolis

of course you'd refuse. but every month you'd see on your credit card bill that my company had charged you some nominal fee.

try not to give out you credit card details to anyone who asks.

Ste · 19 Sep 2005, 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by acropolis

of course you'd refuse. but every month you'd see on your credit card bill that my company had charged you some nominal fee.

you can always cancel if you feel like. we have a helpful staff awaiting your request. and while we have a contract on file here that you can access as soon as you've validated your ID, i'm unsure of what lawyer is going to take an interest in you getting screwed out of $10-20 a month. stop by my offices and trip on a crack, then you'll have me worried.

Do you understand how credit cards work?
I wouldn't pay it. I would ring up my credit card company and say "I didn't authorise this"
Then the onus would be on you to prove I gave my consent for you to charge me.

Dante Hicks · 19 Sep 2005, 18:02

Most companies rely on consumers forgetting to phone up their bank and cancel the charge. It's usually quite easy to start a contract (over the phone) but then to cancel they mysteriously need it in writing. I've worked for a company that relied on such consumer laziness to make a great deal of money.

With a lot of contracts it's not enough to just cancel it at the bank - you are still incurring a debt each month the contract continues.

To be honest, this practice will continue until more consumers take up massacring the directors of the companies involved. There's no incentive to change for companies without very good products in the first place. If you thought such actions might involve getitng shot through the lungs you might vote against it at the next board meeting.

Ste · 19 Sep 2005, 18:34

Also what Yahwe said - Where would you get my details from?

acropolis · 19 Sep 2005, 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ste

Also what Yahwe said - Where would you get my details from?

Quote:

Originally Posted by acropolis

Many business plans are unable to go this route, because even if you 'sign up,' they can't charge you unless you give your credit card number or somesuch. Under my busniess plan, I will make a deal with a major credit card company so this is unnecessary, and then my salespeople will only contact this company's card holders.

i guess i didn't make it clear enough. the company never needs you to give them any information whatsoever, they go directly to your credit card company and get them to send checks in your name without you ever being involved in anything (besides "signing up").

s|k · 19 Sep 2005, 18:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by acropolis

i guess i didn't make it clear enough. the company never needs you to give them any information whatsoever, they go directly to your credit card company and get them to send checks in your name without you ever being involved in anything (besides "signing up").

No credit card company would ever do this, and if they did I could simply cancel my card.

acropolis · 19 Sep 2005, 19:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by s|k

No credit card company would ever do this, and if they did I could simply cancel my card.

I can guarantee the first part of that as being untrue.

For the second part, that does seem the correct response. atm tho i'm paying 0%. it would appear that one gets what one pays for.

Kurashima · 19 Sep 2005, 19:36

Im pretty sure its a terms and conditions thing here whereby if you specify you do not want your details provided to bank related companies / relevant third parties / selected companies (DONT EVER TICK THIS BOX, ITS GIVING THEM CARTE BLANCHE) etc etc , you can sue if these companies mailshot you having got your details from the card provider.

Data Protection is the bane of my existence in work, but outside of it, can be damned profitable if the company does something stupid like leave a message on your answerphone with bank details on it.

Yahwe · 20 Sep 2005, 00:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by acropolis

i guess i didn't make it clear enough. the company never needs you to give them any information whatsoever, they go directly to your credit card company and get them to send checks in your name without you ever being involved in anything (besides "signing up").

in my country we call this 'crime'

Raging.Retard · 20 Sep 2005, 02:38

If this thread was meant to be funny... it failed.

If it this was meant to be a serious plan... it failed.

If it was meant to just be shit... then I believe you are a winner.

acropolis · 20 Sep 2005, 02:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raging.Retard

If this thread was meant to be funny... it failed.

If it this was meant to be a serious plan... it failed.

If it was meant to just be shit... then I believe you are a winner.

i refuse to believe that any human being could possibly completely miss the point of this by that far a margin.

Raging.Retard · 20 Sep 2005, 03:48

It looked to me like a satirical plan attempting to highlight the degradation of business practices among a growing number of unscrupulous companies. I did not find it particularly amusing, and felt a simple post highlighting your point would have been better.

If thats off the mark, then please... show me some "neg-rep lovin". If not, see previous post.

acropolis · 20 Sep 2005, 12:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raging.Retard

It looked to me like a satirical plan attempting to highlight the degradation of business practices among a growing number of unscrupulous companies. I did not find it particularly amusing, and felt a simple post highlighting your point would have been better.

that's much closer to the mark; yes, it is an attempt to highlight 'degradation in business practices,' nothing particularly satirical.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'a simple post', I guess I could have changed the title from 'My Perfect' to 'Evil Unethical,' but the rest of the post is just a description of the system i encountered.