Save The Caths...

[noah02]

Originally Posted by _Kila_

Umm iirc top cat was #5 which isnt a bad position. Beta was pretty balanced as I remember hitting top terr near end of round when he was #2.

for the 100th time kila my young freind, speedgame/beta = completly ifferent from real rounds m8.

[Neferti]

Originally Posted by noah02

for the 100th time kila my young freind, speedgame/beta = completly ifferent from real rounds m8.

I thought that was the point he was trying to make guess I misread it.

[Gio2k]

Still waiting for an answer from PA crew. And if you feel Cathaar needs a change in the stats, don't let this thread fade away before we get an answer.

[Rinoa]

Think there trying to sweep us under the carpet Gio in the hope that we will dissapear :/

[Kal]

Cathaar probably do need an adjustment for next round, as I am sure all races will. However mid round stats changes are not a good idea as just a small change can have a big affect. Every round there thends to be a weaker race that looses out, this round it is Cathaar, but there will be no mid round stats changes to try to change this. One of the reasons for this is that stats require a significant amount of testing and there aimply are not the resources avaliable to do this mid round and it would remove resources from round 14 development which we can not afford to do.

[Rinoa]

yeah i cant quite easily accpet that Kal and hope that all the time spent for next round pays off. And i agree that most rounds have a slightly less able race, but would you not agree this round that the caths are so much weaker than any other weak race in a previous round?

[bwtmc]

The Cath in question landed more attacks than anyone else in the game, you can't expect to do that in r13 with cr/co.

[truler]

totally agreed, caths suck big time this round

[Banned]

Originally Posted by Rinoa

well think its safe to say by now that pa team jester etc arent replying ....

Hi.

ofc they wont change stats midround

Of course.

but i hope that this has given u a rough idea of what needs changed for next round.

Yes, your whining has opened my eyes in a way that nothing else ever could have.

This is potentially the most work ive ever had to do for £5 of my own money.

Welcome to PA, please leave your life at the door.

And Ive Also Learned that if i want to play next round i HAVE to play a beta or else it my own fault for turning up and expecting races to be semi equal at tickstart :/

Nah, no need to play beta, just choose your race based on the round you expect rather than your greed.

[Rinoa]

Heh i just made this original post because rest of caths knew theyd get flamed as much as i did. But heh if you dont speak up who's going to hear you?

[Banned]

Originally Posted by Rinoa

But heh if you dont speak up who's going to hear you?

Someone who cares enough to ask.

[Wishmaster]

caths sucks donkey c0k this round

All know that - all more or less agree

Would suck to change stats mid round though.

When I looked at stats I didnt take corsairs enough into consideration.

My own bloody n00b mistake.

Still with pretty low activity I find myself fighting for top 100 spot.

Impossible to win as cath I think, but u can get a -decent- rank, and the beetles r good for defence, so r ur cr in gal.

Next round nerf the corsairs and all should be fine

[Gio2k]

I don't think that upgrading the killing power of tarants would unbalance the round. I think it's a change needed to actually _restore_ some balance. But whatever. I think this thread has served its purpose.

[Wishmaster]

rather than killing I want to c the tulas as effective emp CRs which can take out big numbers of corsairs..

I dont wanna kill a few k of em.. I wanna freeze tons of em.

I dont care if I m an attractive target - I just wanna be able to land an attack.

[Jackal2112]

I have to agree Cat turned out to be a big let down, but I can live with my own mistakes and being a total noob at reading a statistics table for one round I suggest everyone does the same. Better luck next time

[Gio2k]

Are you really suggesting that it's the fault of every cathaar out there for not reading the stats?
If you really assume that every PA player out there should be have a good understanding of the stats and the manual and foresee the game mechanics, then you should for sake of consistency also remove prelaunching, go back to private gals ,etc.
I know this will win me some enemies, but i will say it again, Stats this round are _not_ balanced. And those who say this have been the most balanced stats in a long time, are either blind or have their heads up Jester's ass knee deep. Rinoa has right in everything he posted, and represented the feelings of almost all Cathaars out there, and Jesters reply just shows how much he "cares" about mending his own fk ups.

[furball]

Originally Posted by Gio2k

Are you really suggesting that it's the fault of every cathaar out there for not reading the stats?
If you really assume that every PA player out there should be have a good understanding of the stats and the manual and foresee the game mechanics, then you should for sake of consistency also remove prelaunching, go back to private gals ,etc.
I know this will win me some enemies, but i will say it again, Stats this round are _not_ balanced. And those who say this have been the most balanced stats in a long time, are either blind or have their heads up Jester's ass knee deep. Rinoa has right in everything he posted, and represented the feelings of almost all Cathaars out there, and Jesters reply just shows how much he "cares" about mending his own fk ups.

By the sounds of things, you have your head even further up Rinoa's ass than he does.

The stats this round are excellent for a 'first round' (where totally new stats are created, as opposed to old ones being refined). Yes, the Corsair is too powerful, but that's about it really. There is nothing else that really has major problems.

There will be no change to the stats this round. Accept it. It would affect every player, depending on how they built their fleet, in different ways. There was an outcry when it was done in Round 4, and there'd be an outcry from the 75% of other players if it was done this round.

The majority of people asking for a change are, in general, fools. When I went Cath this round, I underestimated the strength of the Corsair. As a result, it was my own damn fault for going for a CR fleet which I can't go back on.

If you choose a race without looking at the stats, you're a bit of an idiot. If you did look at the stats, as I did, then face it - you probably made a mistake.

And to claim that Rinoa represents most of the Cathaar players out there - only if he also can be considered to represent the local village idiot.

[jerome]

I don't think anyone disagrees that cath are equal to say, ziks in term of racial strength this round. But I'm fairly certain that the majority would also rather not risk an upheaval by changing the stats mid-round.

[demiGOD]

Yeah, mid-round stats changing is a bad idea unless you stop the ticks for a beta-testing of a modified stats in mid-round (which is a very stupid ****ing idea that I shouldn't even be mentioning it).

I also honestly think that there is really nothing wrong with Cath stats. It's the bringing back of the stealing feature (of Ziks) that messed everything up, I think.

[DrunkenViking]

Zik itself are ok, but they're "too" powerful. Every zik i know has a larger cath fleet than me...and same for other races. But i like being cath, its rewarding at times, even tho i've accepted that i cant keep roids/value, so i'm tha xp wh0re

[Rinoa]

Originally Posted by Gio2k

Are you really suggesting that it's the fault of every cathaar out there for not reading the stats?
If you really assume that every PA player out there should be have a good understanding of the stats and the manual and foresee the game mechanics, then you should for sake of consistency also remove prelaunching, go back to private gals ,etc.
I know this will win me some enemies, but i will say it again, Stats this round are _not_ balanced. And those who say this have been the most balanced stats in a long time, are either blind or have their heads up Jester's ass knee deep. Rinoa has right in everything he posted, and represented the feelings of almost all Cathaars out there, and Jesters reply just shows how much he "cares" about mending his own fk ups.

^^ idd what gio says
but just checking one last time, that the majority of experienced pa players here are saying that any new pa player has to sit in front of stats and work them out for them selves before they even play? ARE YOU REALLY TRYING TO SAY TO ME ?

[Gumbie]

They should play terran, as the hints say on signup

[Rinoa]

Gimbie ill give u that one that is true i guess :/

[Gio2k]

Originally Posted by Nonentity

By the sounds of things, you have your head even further up Rinoa's ass than he does.

If you care to read the date of some of my posts and threads, you will notice that i was one of the first ones to point out that Caths are unbalanced with respect to Ziks. So my supporting Rinoa's thread here is not something i do out of mere following the leader. I don't even know Rinoa.

Originally Posted by Nonentity

The stats this round are excellent for a 'first round' (where totally new stats are created, as opposed to old ones being refined). Yes, the Corsair is too powerful, but that's about it really. There is nothing else that really has major problems.

Ofc, that's about it really.
If you ignore the fact that every other race can get through on a Cathaar, since it's piss easy to flak the pods. A xan with 18K xan fi can get through with full cap on a Cath with 10K beetles. And this is not something you get out of the stats, this is something which you have to figure after reading the manual and several other threads. It's the whole battle engine that makes Cathaar totally underpowered.

Originally Posted by Nonentity

The majority of people asking for a change are, in general, fools. When I went Cath this round, I underestimated the strength of the Corsair. As a result, it was my own damn fault for going for a CR fleet which I can't go back on.

Unlike you, not all Cathaar people went blindly CR when they noticed that they are inefficient. Many of us have switched to CO fleets long time ago. But guess what? Co fleets are only a bit more efficient than CR fleets. Plus, you still have to build CR for your own defence, since you can't target CO or FR efficiently without CR ships. So you're stuck wasting resources on fleets you can't use for attacks so that you don't get even more fkd than you already are by the stats and game engine.

Originally Posted by Nonentity

If you choose a race without looking at the stats, you're a bit of an idiot. If you did look at the stats, as I did, then face it - you probably made a mistake.
And to claim that Rinoa represents most of the Cathaar players out there - only if he also can be considered to represent the local village idiot.

As I said, stats alone would have never told you that Cathaar would have been so damn weak this round. So you are only making a fool of yourself by saying that "it's our own fault for not looking at the stats". I for one took a look at them, and although Cath were definitely _not_ the strongest race, they didn't look that bad either. My goal was not to choose the perfect race, but to chosse a race with which i could be comfortable playing and could have fun with. When i finally discovered in one of the strategy threads that the combat engine combined with the stats would make Cathaar terribly underpowered it was too late. But then again, you can't expect all players to do in depth analysis of every single factor that can fk up their race decission.

[_Kila_]

Originally Posted by noah02

for the 100th time kila my young freind, speedgame/beta = completly ifferent from real rounds m8.

I was merely teling everyone who says: "play the beta" etc that caths ended decently there...

[Cannon_Fodder]

*sigh*

Ive got one attack through in the last two weeks and that was 100 roids for the loss of 2k beetles. Thats despite teaming up etc...

[Banned]

Originally Posted by sniborp

*sigh*

Ive got one attack through in the last two weeks and that was 100 roids for the loss of 2k beetles. Thats despite teaming up etc...

Tried teaming up with a Xan with a nice FI/CO fleet?

[Rinoa]

The point is we shouldnt be reduced to having to team up to land attacks.....
And not everyone has access to teamups imho

[Cannon_Fodder]

Originally Posted by Banned

Tried teaming up with a Xan with a nice FI/CO fleet?

Ive tried teaming up with pretty much everyone...

[bwtmc]

The Xan is covering for five classes while the Cath covers just one Class. It's hardly an ideal combination.

[Banned]

Originally Posted by bwtmc

The Xan is covering for five classes while the Cath covers just one Class. It's hardly an ideal combination.

But the Cath is covering the one class Xan has a hardest time with. Obviously the Cath can bring Spiders too.

[jerome]

However unlike Xands who have the luxury of having each one of their numerous Fi/Co ship providing various uses, I find that spiders are usually ignored in terms of being built, due to the general involvement of beetles.

[Cannon_Fodder]

Spiders also suck in terms of an FI ship targets CO. I must say i was suprised to see someone had 15k of them...

[jerome]

There are medium ziks with 50k xanda fi's and other medium ziks with 15k beetles.. nothing is surprising anymore.