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Unread 8 Feb 2008, 15:31   #1
Ave
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Bots and alliance attack page

Attacking bot planets are lame and gives no pleasement of winning/beating your opposition, aparently the bots dont even fight back decent?

here
[15:35:21] (Ave) there are aparently some bots in 1:1 that are allowed to be hit... to roid them... but I dont see point in that...
[15:35:27] (Ave) something was written in forums
[15:35:46] (Ave) I dont know how well they are made to game
[15:36:09] (everlast) I know it's allowed, as in not against the rules
[15:36:24] (everlast) that doesn't make it allowed in my eyes
[15:38:05] (NitbiT) Plz explain to me why not; appareantly some find it lame, but others for smaller players (what's small, ie roids or score)
[15:38:24] (NitbiT) Besides that, it's part of the game, but according to some you shouldn't use it?
[15:38:36] (everlast) because you know they won't hit you back and it's very unlikely that they don't get def
[15:38:46] (everlast) *very likely
[15:39:21] (Ave) SpM had a few bots round or 2 that actually fought back, but they were kind of made too powerfull and their actions too random
[15:39:43] (Ave) those disturbed the game play a bit
[15:40:15] (everlast) there's no thrill of multiplaying when you attack them and know they're bots
[15:40:18] (Ave) well our attacks aint aimed at those bot planets atleast, so we are cool about it... but if its feature purpousedly made by creators
[15:40:28] (Ave) we can only whine those to be nonsense
[15:40:50] (Ave) but since its clearly a planned feature, its no abuse nor farming in that case
[15:40:56] (everlast) I know you wouldn't attack them either Ave
[15:41:07] (Ave) that doesnt stop us from killing those lamers using them tho
[15:41:39] (everlast) yes it's the creators I blame most about this
[15:42:32] (Ave) make a forum post and I can come as your support
[15:42:33] (Ave)
[15:42:53] (NitbiT) So am I correct it's an "unwritten rule" of (some of) ASS not to target them?
[15:43:42] (everlast) well it's my unwritten rule :P
[15:44:44] (everlast) Ave: making bigass forum posts is not my cup of tea, it's your's
[15:47:16] (Ave) I dont understand it... the game I feel is more about knowing your enemy and annoying them like hell and beating them with diff tactics and methods... I dont see how u get a plesement from roiding a coded bot
[15:47:25] (Ave) the bot wont even feel annoyed about it
[15:47:31] (NitbiT) LOL


Also then we come to a feature to help non irc people to attack with the alliance, expesially helpfull for the less seriours alliances, to make them more serious IF now dead people would take an easy bot target to hit for example, seeing in alliance screen, someone needs his/her fleet, he/she might choose to go there instead... also simply helps to organize and see who has claimed targets allready...

[16:05:32] (Ave) yep, well the alliance attack page should allow teaming up on redy claimed target
[16:05:58] (Ave) and the first claimer could choose an option, closed,need a partner, or join if u like
[16:06:16] (Ave) could suggest to forums someday
[16:06:17] (everlast) that's a good idea
[16:06:57] (Ave) but since I am lazy I suggest on closing all bots in 1:1 same
[16:07:07] (Ave) mind if I loan some of your lines from here eve?
[16:07:12] (everlast) feel free
[16:07:18] (Ave) just for some credibility
[16:07:25] (NitbiT) and don't forget my name
[16:08:09] (NitbiT) if those teamups are possible kind a way we came upon, indeed, bots may be removed for my sake
[16:08:40] (csillag|afk) hehe
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Unread 8 Feb 2008, 15:38   #2
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

why do we attack in the middle of the night? as theres less chance ur target will be awake to deal with what you have sent at him.

Planetarion is not about knowing your opponent. Its maximising gains whilst minimising losses. Occasionaly a good war pops up to keep the romantics intrested but at its core its simple math and i gain no more pleasure nicking 200 roids off sum1 who woke up and had 5mins to try and sort out his planet b4 he had to go to work, than i do from capping 20k off ships from a bot planet who at least had all the eta of my incoming to do whatever it is coded to do

From talk in #transcendancy, it seems a few people have been caught out by bot planets.
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Unread 8 Feb 2008, 15:49   #3
Ave
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

Firstly I go to work too and have the same 5 mins in the morning to fix things as my opponent as everlast said its all about the game beeing an online community... its different than just completing a task the game offers u... its like playing chess vs computer or with live friend... I atleast would enjoy the live friend to be able to read my play and respond to it... switch tactic and beat me up with some clever moves, rather than learn a way to beat the machine anytime I want.
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Last edited by Ave; 8 Feb 2008 at 15:57.
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Unread 8 Feb 2008, 15:53   #4
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

Bot planets are putting a lot more roids in the universe. Whether this is a good thing or not, I don't know. It allows lower score players to get roids that they normally wouldn't have access to.

Unfortunately, they're still small players so these roids are taken from them with relative ease by somebody bigger than them. Which are then taken by somebody bigger still.

We don't need to get rid of bot planets, we need to get rid of roids.
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Unread 8 Feb 2008, 16:08   #5
Ave
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

and they learn to fight with alliance/gal by attacking a dull bot? atleast make the bots clever enough so u need a right fleet to roid them (make them educational) and add it to be one of the quest tasks and limit attacking bots to some x few times, when there is no time to participate on real battle... you have a quest to def... why not one to attack also...

still best would be to get rid of them alltogether... but if u still deside to keep em... make real educational use out of them...
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Unread 8 Feb 2008, 17:06   #6
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

I think it's lame when you attack a bot when you don't really need "a weak opponent"

I do think it's a way to quickly recover (and stay in the game) once you had to endure some bad landings, leaving you behind with almost no fleet and vere few roids to rebuild. Once you've rebuild and be able to attack, the game is over. Then attacking bots for getting the means to rebuild isn't lame in my opinion.
Besides that, the bots are a way to bring more roids in the game, more roids is more targets to aim for.
But, there should be a limit on when someone is allowed to attack. (ie a planet with a massive fleet but few roids can easily pick a target on its own; a smashed fleet with loads of roids is capable of recovering on its own; both shouldn't be allowed)

On the other hand, the smaller/not really experienced/new players learn much more from teamup/piggying with the bigger/experienced/hardcore players.
That way the new/less experienced players are stimulated into teamplay, are more succesfull and eventually more fun.

As proposed by Ave, I think expanding the attack page is a way to get the smaller/new players more actively in the game, resulting in more fun.
And more fun is probably a returning player.

In short, when there is an other way for small planets / or messed-up players to grow in conjuction with the alliance, bots may be gone imho.

Greetz,
NitbiT

Last edited by NitbiT; 8 Feb 2008 at 19:33.
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Unread 8 Feb 2008, 20:45   #7
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

Oh, how I love Planetarion. People whine when they get hit by bigger planets. But when those bigger planets hit bots it's considered "lame". You are all whining scum, get off my internet.

P.S.
Posting an IRC log like this one as a suggestion makes for shitty reading, please state what the hell it is you want.
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Unread 9 Feb 2008, 00:25   #8
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

While reasonable sized planets hitting bots for easy roids is lame, its really not any more lame than a reasonable sized planet hitting smaller planets. I know id rather seem hitting the boy planets rather than the unsuitable real targets as its not adding to the woes of players at or below the bot planets level.

And while the bot planets aren't ideal they do serve a couple of purposes.

The first is it provides a added level to the game so the lower end do not have to resort to cannibalising each other. It can be a problem when the lower end of the game just feed off each other and keep each other down.

The second is it provides a 'training area'. Something which keeps alot of people down is fear. Picking on bigger targets is somewhat unnatural and breaking people of this mindset and fear can be tough. These bot planets can be used to highlight the possibility and be the first step in getting over the fear. At F-Crew we have had a few of our new, small members have a run at these planets so they can get used to a bcalc and start to get over the fear with the knowledge that there will probally be fewer surprises to initially catch them out and it has seemed to help get them ready for a proper target

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
P.S.
Posting an IRC log like this one as a suggestion makes for shitty reading, please state what the hell it is you want.
Mzyxptlk is right, you shouldn't be posting IRC logs. It doesnt present a well formed suggestion, is hard to read ect ect. It really wouldn't have taken much to summaries the discussion and would hve been much more useful.

Normally the thread should be deleted but i'll let you off this time but in future please stick to the forum guidelines
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Unread 9 Feb 2008, 22:03   #9
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
Oh, how I love Planetarion. People whine when they get hit by bigger planets. But when those bigger planets hit bots it's considered "lame". You are all whining scum, get off my internet.

P.S.
Posting an IRC log like this one as a suggestion makes for shitty reading, please state what the hell it is you want.
The bigger planets should hit the other bigger planets and cover those each set raid? that is just my ideology... maybe it doesnt fit in yours?

Where do you see me whine either? I just simply stated my opinion that there shouldnt be any bots in the gaming field... unless they served a higher purpouse which they certainly do not right now.

I am lazy, u can read it anyway and it states the message that I had to say. So serves all purpouse. I dont plan to post a proper structrual detailed essee everytime I post here, I might slip something more careless once in a while. Just leave it unread if its too hard for you
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Unread 9 Feb 2008, 23:42   #10
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

No, it does not. What I (lets pretend I have a big planet for a moment) "have to do" isn't any of your business, so keep your nose out of it. As for your second point, where did you see me mention your name in conjecture with the word "whining"? I was in fact referring to NitbiT's post, not yours. This was because I failed to get the point of your post, and why I asked for a clarification, which you are apparently unwilling to give. If you're too lazy to make your post into something readable, I'm sure it's not interesting enough for me to spend time reading it. Next time, either post "properly", or don't post at all.
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Unread 10 Feb 2008, 02:33   #11
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

Its not about having to do... it is something I would expect. The whole thing called I, is what is the worst part of the game as I said several times... if people played for their alliances or gals, we could have some sweet fights.

When we get to the point, which was to remove bot targets, since all fleets launched on them are away from "real" battles what the game is all about. Also going for easy bot roids, instead of risking to get retalled and actually fought back is simly quite lame... only way I could want them is to include it to quests to add attack part there also, not just the def mission.

alltho I am not great fan of quests either...

My second point in all simplicity is to re-do/improve the ingame alliance attack page, to let multiple people claim same waves/targets, or leave a mark to either close the joinings or even require them. (gains are to less the need of communication via tools and bc's not to harrash people who has a target allready and make it easier for smaller people to find an attack partner.)
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Unread 17 Feb 2008, 17:37   #12
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny
Bot planets are putting a lot more roids in the universe. Whether this is a good thing or not, I don't know. It allows lower score players to get roids that they normally wouldn't have access to.

Unfortunately, they're still small players so these roids are taken from them with relative ease by somebody bigger than them. Which are then taken by somebody bigger still.

We don't need to get rid of bot planets, we need to get rid of roids.
It would be interesting if your resources came from a source that an attacking planet cannot take away from you. Lets say if the only way to increase your resource gain was via construction/research or something equivalent, then when a planet was attacked he would lose his ships but not his ability to gain resources to build new ones (sounds lame i know) BUT! there are several potential benefits to this

1- planets would recover quicker and newer or less experienced players wouldn't get so disheartened (again sounds lame i know).

2- because of planets recovering quicker imagine the revenge attacks because you know yourself if a planet is utterly slaughtered revenge is never an option because the attacking planet has very much out distanced itself too much for that to ever happen. You get rid of roids and that's one problem solved. POlanetarion would be more about kicking ass than maths as cynically but truthfully described in this thread.

3- protecting resource gains would while allowing active players an advantage in the respoect of them being around and able to maximise turn times of constructing mines etc! It would also keep the game a little more even and stopo the more powerful growing so much more powerful that at some point they cannot be reached and the results/rankings have already been decided when the round is half over.

Not bad for something completely off the top of my head.
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Unread 17 Feb 2008, 17:53   #13
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladel
It would be interesting if your resources came from a source that an attacking planet cannot take away from you. Lets say if the only way to increase your resource gain was via construction/research or something equivalent, then when a planet was attacked he would lose his ships but not his ability to gain resources to build new ones (sounds lame i know) BUT! there are several potential benefits to this

1- planets would recover quicker and newer or less experienced players wouldn't get so disheartened (again sounds lame i know).

2- because of planets recovering quicker imagine the revenge attacks because you know yourself if a planet is utterly slaughtered revenge is never an option because the attacking planet has very much out distanced itself too much for that to ever happen. You get rid of roids and that's one problem solved. POlanetarion would be more about kicking ass than maths as cynically but truthfully described in this thread.

3- protecting resource gains would while allowing active players an advantage in the respoect of them being around and able to maximise turn times of constructing mines etc! It would also keep the game a little more even and stopo the more powerful growing so much more powerful that at some point they cannot be reached and the results/rankings have already been decided when the round is half over.

Not bad for something completely off the top of my head.
Ok, first of all this is a completely different suggestion mate so you should really have started a new thread.

Second, I hope the contents of your reply are there to try and out-irony my own response, and you're not actually suggesting this?
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Unread 17 Feb 2008, 22:55   #14
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

i didn't make a new thread because it is not a suggestion (i believe that answers both of your points). I merely said it would be interesting! nor did i infact state i wanted it to happen.
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Unread 18 Feb 2008, 01:40   #15
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Re: Bots and alliance attack page

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Originally Posted by Vladel
i didn't make a new thread because it is not a suggestion (i believe that answers both of your points). I merely said it would be interesting! nor did i infact state i wanted it to happen.
There was me thinking that this was a forum for suggesting features we wanted adding.

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