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Unread 20 May 2006, 14:54   #1
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I want a Second Planet

We were having a conversation about having a second planet. It all started off with me being asked to be on at a particular time to scan several galaxies. I joked "why cant you just have my login details". Now obviously I dont multi but I am a scanner.

My life is ineherintly boring this round (down to my choice of course) But any alliance needs scanners. Most alliances dont have a general scanning problem. If you need a scanner you sms them on <3 elviz. So we were talking about how stupid is it that you need people to have a shit round to just do something on demand, yet they have to login.

Perhaps instead lets look at it from a different angle.

People buy two accounts (or one if they wish)

They can maintain both accounts. There first account may be there real hardcore planet, there second may be a scan planet. Both may be fairly hardcore.

Now I have suggested this over and over again but people always shoot it down. But its a new round and I resuggest it.

My suggestions would be people are limited to 2 accounts.

The accounts can be used in anyway the owner wishes.

However interaction of the two accounts (except scanning) is strictly prohibited. The two planets

Cant

- Defend One another
- Attack Together
- Attack the same targets
- Defend the same targets

essentially I believe the second account would be used as a scan planet, as the maintainence of two planets is in general tough.

Now Multihunters/Coders whatever can surely code something to prevent the two accounts crossing paths in the ways I suggested.

I dont see having a scan planet as being some form of abuse, I hate the fact that in pa we are so reliant on scanners when really its just a hinderence for all.

Anyway discuss/amend/suggest this idea.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 15:00   #2
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Clearly having 2 accounts is always branded as multy-ing, but if we can make sure interaction is strictly forbidden, by severe punishments as in "Any interaction between 'your' 2 planets will result in direct deletion of both planets".

I do think though, attacking the same planet should be allowed, but NOT at the same wave, as that would be direct interaction. Allowed should be waving that target, this is ofcourse up for discussion.

In general I vote in favor of this suggestion.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 15:12   #3
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Re: I want a Second Planet

I don't care about interaction, people should be allowed to have as many accounts as they can be bothered to pay for.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 15:15   #4
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by pig
Cant

- Defend One another
- Attack Together
- Attack the same targets
- Defend the same targets
I would add that they can't:

Be in the same alliance
Be in the same galaxy
Attack the same galaxy

If these restrictions were in place I wouldn't see a problem with it really.

Also make it so that you can only multi if both your planets are upgraded.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 15:18   #5
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Re: I want a Second Planet

All these limitations are boring.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 15:18   #6
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Re: I want a Second Planet

personally i would just alter the game to remove the need for specialised scan/covertop planets so that everyone can play every aspect of the game
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Unread 20 May 2006, 15:25   #7
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Re: I want a Second Planet

What about people who want to play more than one race?
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Unread 20 May 2006, 16:01   #8
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Re: I want a Second Planet

I don't like the idea of more than one planet at all. Rather do what Kal said.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 16:32   #9
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Re: I want a Second Planet

I remember Heartless pointing out the inherent flaw in limiting interactions. There are 3 people:
Person A, with 2 accounts
Person B, with 2 accounts
Person C, with 2 accounts.

These accounts aren't allowed to interact. However, all the 1st accounts can interact together and all the second accounts can interact together. Say you then want to hit an alliance. All the first accounts can hit one planet, all the second accounts can hit the second planet. Double the coverage.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 16:38   #10
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Appocomaster
I remember Heartless pointing out the inherent flaw in limiting interactions. There are 3 people:
Person A, with 2 accounts
Person B, with 2 accounts
Person C, with 2 accounts.

These accounts aren't allowed to interact. However, all the 1st accounts can interact together and all the second accounts can interact together. Say you then want to hit an alliance. All the first accounts can hit one planet, all the second accounts can hit the second planet. Double the coverage.
Fortunately, this problem solves itself when you allow interactions among accounts.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 19:10   #11
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Interaction sounds fun, but too many people would cry if they got attacked.

Perhaps another possible solution is to pay for a scan/covop account. Thats all the account can do is scan/covop people. Of course you can get scans through a normal account as well, but the scan/covop accounts can be put in some kind of galaxy in c200 or something. That way you allow people to have second scan accounts and will potentialy bring more income. Say 250 get these accounts thats a considerable figure there.

I know I and many others would buy one.

I like jesters thoughts though
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Unread 20 May 2006, 19:26   #12
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by pig
Interaction sounds fun, but too many people would cry if they got attacked.
Let them. Someone who's crying cares about the game.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 19:35   #13
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Have scans and 'other research' as separate research branches?
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Unread 20 May 2006, 19:41   #14
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned
Let them. Someone who's crying cares about the game.
sounds like a plan, we just need to convince appoco or we could go to biffy and be like

"dude we got a way to make this game make more than 100 profit, you in"

of course hes in, money speaks to jolt.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 20:00   #15
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Allowing most of those interactions probably would make the game a lot more fun, for those people with two accounts. It's quite hard to sell the game when you're sending out the message that it's difficult to win with just one account though.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 20:15   #16
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Don't let Assassin see this :s

He'll have a fit!
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Unread 20 May 2006, 21:41   #17
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Re: I want a Second Planet

What about a scan planet per alliance, accesible for HC/DC/BC.

Can do nothing but scan, scan, scan. And would ofc still need to have roids and build amps etc.
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Unread 20 May 2006, 23:11   #18
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Congratulations! Let's just award the round to the person who can afford the most planets now and save ourselves the time.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 01:24   #19
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned
Fortunately, this problem solves itself when you allow interactions among accounts.
Actually that just shifts the problem towards the group of people which can afford more planets than the other group.

edit: next time I should read the whole thread, furball pointed this out nicely already.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 01:48   #20
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Re: I want a Second Planet

make the 2nd planet (with whatever limitation you like) part of the game. From your only account you can take control of a 2nd planet once :
- you've reached a certain size (in that case your first planet can't get any more roids).
- you've researched that new tech tree branch: 'Deep Space Exploration' allowing you to visit the unexplored systems in cluster 100.

make it up to peoples skill, not up to people's money.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 02:37   #21
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo
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Unread 21 May 2006, 03:36   #22
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
Congratulations! Let's just award the round to the person who can afford the most planets now and save ourselves the time.
I've always wanted to win a round!
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Unread 21 May 2006, 04:02   #23
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by XelNaga
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo
If you have nothing consturctive to add to the thread dont post here. You made your opinion aware to us the first time with little constructive criticism, no need for shite the second time with less opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Furball
Congratulations! Let's just award the round to the person who can afford the most planets now and save ourselves the time.
Im not proposing those who can afford an army of planets etc. My proposal is to allow people to have a legal scan planet, thus making scanners void to a certain extent. I hate pa's reliance on scanners.

If we look at it in more depth it would be advantageous to those alliances who arent as big and strong such as F-Crew (no offence f-crew but I dont see you being a professional alliance, hence you dont have dedicated scanners) It would also allow those alliances who are small to have scanners without having to rely on inactive friends.

Not only that but it would give more income to planetarion and possibly more future development. This idea is a double edged sword. If managed properly could be better for all including jolt (which is a rarity)

Quote:
Originally Posted by clogg
What about a scan planet per alliance, accesible for HC/DC/BC.

Can do nothing but scan, scan, scan. And would ofc still need to have roids and build amps etc.
I like this idea, but I think it would be better for all if people can have a scan only planet. If I wanted to multi to have a scan planet im sure I would be able too quite easily, however I like to stay within the rules of pa and want to make this game what it should be (ie great) by providing more money and in the eyes of jolt more players we may see an increase in investment, advertising, development and ultimately players. Which is something I would like to see.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 04:22   #24
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Re: I want a Second Planet

As long as there can be no interactions its fine by me. This game should, however, not be decided by whoever can afford the most accounts.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 04:27   #25
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Completly agree with that point, no game should be decided by money. Im sure thats one point we can all agree on.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 04:35   #26
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned
I don't care about interaction, people should be allowed to have as many accounts as they can be bothered to pay for.
Heh, this would be fun. Think I would buy a three pack or two and have 1 of each race plus a scan planet and 2nd zik planet. Maybe a limit of 6 planets per person would work. Jolt would make 4 1/2 times the money they get from me now but the fun I would have.

Ofc without limits the 1 man alliance thing would be a reality.

Multi FTW!

No easy solution to getting your scans when you need them.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 04:36   #27
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Re: I want a Second Planet

What if your other paid accounts still got the limitations of a free planet?
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Unread 21 May 2006, 08:25   #28
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Wouldn't something like this just make every player start a scanplanet to get free scans?

I think maybe having some sort of scanner speciality would be better. I think it could work if scanners were able to do scans for a cheaper prize, but having their accounts limited somehow to make sure that you couldn't be able to win a round by being scanner, but still be able to have fun on the same time.

Maybe something like this could be done with ppl choosing scanner as speciality:
Cheaper scans ofcause. And give them only 2 launchable fleets and 1 unlaunchable fleet only for running ships, but make it possible to do jgp-scans without having to do that annoying fleetlaunch first. Then maybe some restrictions on hct and only make them able to build 2 of the different kinds of ship factories.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 08:59   #29
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
Congratulations! Let's just award the round to the person who can afford the most planets now and save ourselves the time.
Having bested multies* before, I don't think this necessarily holds true.

*With my single account, and friends with single accounts.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 09:47   #30
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChubbyChecker
I would add that they can't:

Be in the same alliance
Be in the same galaxy
Attack the same galaxy

If these restrictions were in place I wouldn't see a problem with it really.

Also make it so that you can only multi if both your planets are upgraded.
Not allowing them to be in the same alliance would cause things like a pack of alliances, one for score and one for scanning. I don't see why they can't stay in the same alliance.
Better not be in the same galaxy, you're right
Attacking... It could be made so that scanner planets can't have any military activity. They are for scanning after all... no abuse that way.

Quote:
make the 2nd planet (with whatever limitation you like) part of the game. From your only account you can take control of a 2nd planet once :
- you've reached a certain size (in that case your first planet can't get any more roids).
- you've researched that new tech tree branch: 'Deep Space Exploration' allowing you to visit the unexplored systems in cluster 100.

make it up to peoples skill, not up to people's money.
That'd be a nice idea

Or perhaps, a more radical change: make max constructions 50 instead of 150 (and possibly make things as refineries more effective). People will be done with amps/distorters sooner and still have a good round!

@banned: all restrictions gone wouldn't help. It'd give deadly combinations as cat and zik. One planet for scans, one for cov op, one for Harpies, one for Phoenix, one for Mandrakes etc. It WOULD depend on how much money you put into it. You could have ship/roid farms, being zik and stealing your own ships or just stealing your own roids for xp. It'd be a mess.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 10:42   #31
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Link
You could have ship/roid farms, being zik and stealing your own ships or just stealing your own roids for xp. It'd be a mess.
I don't think I ever said this should be done in conjunction with legalized farming.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 10:50   #32
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned
Having bested multies* before, I don't think this necessarily holds true.

*With my single account, and friends with single accounts.
What about someone with 10-20 accounts who takes on a galaxy per night?

Even 9:2 (r16 distorter whores, rain's gal) could have been ripped to pieces by someone like that. One planet set up as a scan planet, the rest as a spread of races. You could take on anyone.

Of course, co-ordinating defence between them would be a bitch. But I have no doubt that someone would do it.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 11:10   #33
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
What about someone with 10-20 accounts who takes on a galaxy per night?

Of course, co-ordinating defence between them would be a bitch. But I have no doubt that someone would do it.
I'm not quite sure I see your point. Is it that 10-20 accounts cooperating bad for the game? Is it worse if they're represented by one person than if it's 20 people ripping you apart?
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Unread 21 May 2006, 11:50   #34
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Perhaps a conclusion to this would be the idea which i said the other day in #planetarion. As far as i can understand this new coded portal/passport system was supposed to be a system where you could login, then ofc click on PA the game and go straight into it? Bit like those soccer online games you get where you get the topion to have 3 games running at the same time and you click on one to join it. Well, why not have this idea in this new passport?

So, for example. We have a beta server just sitting around dont we? (last time i heard) well why not use that for a second game? A complete different universe, and have both games coded into the passport so you can switch inbetween the 2? This ofc allows you to play 1 accounts in each different game. Meaning this would solve the problem with having 2 accounts in the one game which i beleive as a stupid idea as people would abuse them.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 11:57   #35
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willzzz
Meaning this would solve the problem with having 2 accounts in the one game which i beleive as a stupid idea as people would abuse them.
Did you actually read the reasons pig presented for wanting to allow people to have 2 accounts?

His specific need was for people to have a way to do their own scans while still playing fully competitively. Your solution does to address that.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 11:59   #36
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Yes, and have you witnessed everytime somthing is brought into the game its abused?

Edit: Second as far as im concnenred there is no benefit of it other then its giving people 2 ways of playing the game which i dont see as fair. You either play properly or play as a scanner. You cant have both options im afraid. Life is tough, guess youll just have to live with it.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:13   #37
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Re: I want a Second Planet

the whole idea of the scan research tree is absurd, just allow all scans from the start and people who want amps/dists will go build them in constructions as they see fit.

this is ofcourse hoping that pa won't remain the stagnant boring piece of bottom feeding shitfest it is now where it's silly to not have 60 finance centres.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:14   #38
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Personaly, i hate this idea. People know how i feel about allowing multiple accounts. Mainly why people say i am somtimes to strcit on rules Here are the reasons why i feel this shouldnt be allowed:

1) It would kill the game (i really feel that)
2) It would go back to the old days before Multihunters were brought into play (round 1 where everyone was abusing this completly, if you cant remmember that far back, then beleive me you dont want to experience it again)
3) I dont see this as skillfull to be allowed 2 chances of winning a round (or more if you really beleive you ashould even have more then just the one extra account)
4) As willzz said above people will simply abuse this further then it will be allowed. You speak of it will be fine as long as its hard coded into the game. But anything can still be abused.
5) I hate the idea becuase surely anyone would see this as cheating? You may not be able to interact with each other with a hard coded system, but, how could you then use a planet to be a scanner for example? It wouldnt be able to jumpgate the targets your other planet is roiding for example in a hard coded system. Would be pretty pointless.
6) Your given a choice. You can of course either play as an active player or a scanner. You cant be both by having 2 accounts i am afraid.

Now, if you look at my signature youll see a quote from Zeus regarding cheaters within alliances. I hate cheating at all scales, Some say it ruins the game now when multiple accounts isnt allowed, never mind if we just sat back and allowed it to happen. So i am 100% against this idea i am afraid.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:19   #39
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Re: I want a Second Planet

The problem is that scanners might go inactive if they get bored of a round. If they are atleast able to build 1 decent attack fleet they might find the round more interesting, and more likely be active during the whole round.And by giving scanners more fun during a round, you migth easier convince allym8's to go scanner. Even though getting scanners for big alliances might not be a problem atm, there's still many alliances suffering from not being able to get enough scanners.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:32   #40
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Re: I want a Second Planet

I think perhaps the most interesting question to ask is - why is having multiple accounts cheating - why back in whatever round it was banned was this decision made - are the reasons the same as they are now, are the effects of multiple accounts the same as they are now etc.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:45   #41
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willzzz
Yes, and have you witnessed everytime somthing is brought into the game its abused?
I can't parse this sentence, can you help me? (No sarcasm, I don't get how it relates to my post.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerome
the whole idea of the scan research tree is absurd, just allow all scans from the start and people who want amps/dists will go build them in constructions as they see fit.
I'm inclined to agree so far.

Quote:
this is ofcourse hoping that pa won't remain the stagnant boring piece of bottom feeding shitfest it is now where it's silly to not have 60 finance centres.
I disagree here. Constructions are a question of planet management. Do I build FCs, do I build jammers or do I build amps? In my experience I've been able to able to get as much XP (not particularly valid anymore) and extra roids out of jammers as I would have been able to get out of FCs. My favorite targets when I had jammers were of course people who prioritized jammers or FCs over amps.

Rob's made this point quite well a few times, so if you want a better explanation I suggest you search for some of his posts on the matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assassin
Personaly, i hate this idea. People know how i feel about allowing multiple accounts. Mainly why people say i am somtimes to strcit on rules
I don't

Quote:
Here are the reasons why i feel this shouldnt be allowed:

1) It would kill the game (i really feel that)
It's nice that you have a strong opinion on the matter, but I really don't think your gut instinct should be a driving factor in this discussion.

Quote:
2) It would go back to the old days before Multihunters were brought into play (round 1 where everyone was abusing this completly, if you cant remmember that far back, then beleive me you dont want to experience it again)
I'm afraid you're going to need explain this more fully. I saw a lot of multying in round 3 and 4 that wasn't killed off by the multihunters, but by p2p.


Quote:
3) I dont see this as skillfull to be allowed 2 chances of winning a round (or more if you really beleive you ashould even have more then just the one extra account)
I disagree! I don't see what's skillful about getting dozens and hundreds of people to defend your butt. Planetarion is a game of planet management with some elements of metagame alliance play necessary to enjoy it fully. I don't see why shifting the focus back from the metagame to planet management is any less to do with skill.

Quote:
4) As willzz said above people will simply abuse this further then it will be allowed. You speak of it will be fine as long as its hard coded into the game. But anything can still be abused.
5) I hate the idea becuase surely anyone would see this as cheating? You may not be able to interact with each other with a hard coded system, but, how could you then use a planet to be a scanner for example? It wouldnt be able to jumpgate the targets your other planet is roiding for example in a hard coded system. Would be pretty pointless.
I agree, which is why I don't think there should be hardcoded limits.
Quote:
6) Your given a choice. You can of course either play as an active player or a scanner. You cant be both by having 2 accounts i am afraid.
My problem isn't that I have to choose. I've done both and enjoyed them both. My problem is that if I choose the former, I have to rely on someone who chooses the latter.

Quote:
Now, if you look at my signature youll see a quote from Zeus regarding cheaters within alliances. I hate cheating at all scales, Some say it ruins the game now when multiple accounts isnt allowed, never mind if we just sat back and allowed it to happen. So i am 100% against this idea i am afraid.
It's not cheating if it's allowed. It's not abuse if it's a feature..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal
I think perhaps the most interesting question to ask is - why is having multiple accounts cheating - why back in whatever round it was banned was this decision made - are the reasons the same as they are now, are the effects of multiple accounts the same as they are now etc.
Now we're getting somewhere.

In my opinion the main problem is/was that with unlimited access to free accounts, the game becomes an issue of how many accounts you can manage. With paid accounts it becomes an issue of how many accounts you want to pay for. Since paying for accounts benefit every player indirectly, and since it's not feasible to play an arbitrary amount of paid planets for an arbitrary number of rounds, anti-multying rules are obsolete.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:49   #42
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilatus
The problem is that scanners might go inactive if they get bored of a round. If they are atleast able to build 1 decent attack fleet they might find the round more interesting, and more likely be active during the whole round.And by giving scanners more fun during a round, you migth easier convince allym8's to go scanner. Even though getting scanners for big alliances might not be a problem atm, there's still many alliances suffering from not being able to get enough scanners.
With the alliance fund set up I'm sure scanners could build an attack and a defence fleet!

Perhaps smaller alliances should take a different approach. The vast majority of scans they'll want to do for attacks and defences will be under thirty amps or so. It doesn't take much effort for each player to pursue that. The smaller ones who can't really afford to scan can always depend on the alliance fund system that's been introduced. For bigger alliances, that can even support quite sizable planets that want to scan and attack/defend.

There's only a need for these planets if you're dealing with a small minority of players. Part of the point of the current system is that your success or failure can be decided by the research and construction paths you choose. I imagine the #1 planet this round has a load of Finance Centres and that decision have and will contribute considerably to their sucess this round. They're rewarded for anticipating well the way the round is going. That's not really a bad thing.

On an individual level, i'm pretty sure it's possible to finish the round towards the very top with twenty amps and the odd favour. Having 100+ amp scanners at your disposal twenty four hours a day is only an issue if you choose to make it one.

jerome`'s thoughts, having the research tree perhaps except FA already done would make the start a lot less interesting. It's fun attacking relatively blind.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:55   #43
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Incidentally, I remain convinced that PA is very schizophrenically designed when it comes to whether or not it actually wants people to be scanners.

On the one hand, there's the alliance fund (only useful for exchanging resources and donating to the smallest people in the alliance) and the need for people with early scan tech and high amp counts.

On the other hand, there's the fleet requirement for JGPs without any form of automation (ie you have to manually launch the fleet = effort), the lack of any way to quickly scan galaxies and share the scans.

Whenever alleviation for the problems are suggested, I've seen implications that 'people shouldn't be encouraged to be scanners' and whatnot.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 12:58   #44
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Re: I want a Second Planet

why? most of the time you barely need scans, as if it matters

jester, point made


on an unrelated note, why has pa always allowed things such as the scan planet to exist? i've never understood why anyone would want to submit themselves to such a role. let alone why the game forces such roles to exist.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 13:14   #45
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Re: I want a Second Planet

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Originally Posted by Banned
On the other hand, there's the fleet requirement for JGPs without any form of automation (ie you have to manually launch the fleet = effort), the lack of any way to quickly scan galaxies and share the scans.
In a game where the aim of the designers is to make you waste as much time as possible contributing to the sense that 'I've spent all that time doing that, I'm acknowledging I've just wasted my time if I quit now,' that has a place.

In PA it really doesn't. It's about routine, and we'd be a lot better off if the routine was less painfully tedious.

The more time we spend thinking about what we want to do, and the less time we spend fiddling around in game to make it happen, the better.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 13:17   #46
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Re: I want a Second Planet

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Originally Posted by jerome
on an unrelated note, why has pa always allowed things such as the scan planet to exist? i've never understood why anyone would want to submit themselves to such a role. let alone why the game forces such roles to exist.
For me it was a way to set different goals for a round in which I wouldn't be able to get online during the night to help my galaxy (and it was a 'serious' galaxy, so I would've felt like I was bailing on a commitment). I helped my galaxy's rank by helping my galmates' planet rank. It was pretty cool, except that the round after people kept asking me for scans. Semi-random strangers even!

I could never scan for an alliance though, for me a big part of it was that I was scanning for friends and my closest allies (galaxy). Alliance scanners get too many random PMs for me to have been able to bother spending time on it.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 14:26   #47
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Re: I want a Second Planet

as an aside, plans are in place to be able to scan a full galaxy at once to some degree.


Jester, while you've covered one person running many accounts, you've not yet mentioned sharing accounts between people. I take it that it'd still be the case that this is against the rules?

I think that allowing planets to play in different styles would make the game more interesting [if also more complex].

Scanners are obviously relied upon, but there seems to be two separate points here. On the one hand, there's the point that playing hardcore relys on players being scanners to assist you. Either you need a planet playing as a scanner, or the tech tree needs to be adjusted so it's easier to research scans. We have to keep in mind that many feel they can't play active and want to help, and traditionally do so by becoming scanners.

On the other hand, we have the issue that with p2p, will one user bother signing up lots of accounts and paying for them? Also, how is it possible to show that a free planet signed up by the same player is going to become a paid account? from a Multihunter perspective, closing 2 free accounts that are "going to upgrade in the next week or so to become paid accounts and therefore be 'legal'" is always going to be problematic and hard to enforce.

If we are going to introduce the ability to have more than one planet, it'd have to be either by having an extra ingame option for paid planets or some sort of clearly defined and simple system for signing up more than one planet.
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Unread 21 May 2006, 14:40   #48
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Re: I want a Second Planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Appocomaster
as an aside, plans are in place to be able to scan a full galaxy at once to some degree.
Yay! What about JGPs only requiring a free fleet?

Quote:
Jester, while you've covered one person running many accounts, you've not yet mentioned sharing accounts between people. I take it that it'd still be the case that this is against the rules?
I'm really not sure. Part of the problem is that it is very difficult to police either fairly. Being closed is very arbitrary and relies in large on how good you are at convincing the multihunters that you're not cheating (whether or not this is true).

Quote:
I think that allowing planets to play in different styles would make the game more interesting [if also more complex].
They already can and do, don't worry too much about that.

Quote:
Scanners are obviously relied upon, but there seems to be two separate points here. On the one hand, there's the point that playing hardcore relys on players being scanners to assist you. Either you need a planet playing as a scanner, or the tech tree needs to be adjusted so it's easier to research scans. We have to keep in mind that many feel they can't play active and want to help, and traditionally do so by becoming scanners.

On the other hand, we have the issue that with p2p, will one user bother signing up lots of accounts and paying for them? Also, how is it possible to show that a free planet signed up by the same player is going to become a paid account? from a Multihunter perspective, closing 2 free accounts that are "going to upgrade in the next week or so to become paid accounts and therefore be 'legal'" is always going to be problematic and hard to enforce.
I'm not following how the latter has anything to do with scanners. As for payment, I'd say that if they're not upgraded by the time they're out of protection, no mercy. But for a planet to be legal, it has to have the same (typoes allowed, I guess) personal details (name, address). If the passport (hah!) system were enabled, they could all be accessed via the unified login.

Quote:
If we are going to introduce the ability to have more than one planet, it'd have to be either by having an extra ingame option for paid planets or some sort of clearly defined and simple system for signing up more than one planet.
Yeah, see above about the passport (again, hah!).
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Unread 21 May 2006, 15:08   #49
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Re: I want a Second Planet

If one were to legalise multying the way to do it would be to allow multiple planets to be associated with a single passport - and to only allow multiple paid accounts, not a paid/free combination. One could even limit the maximum number of planets someone coule have. I think it might also under thist sort of scheme to think about how alliances would work.

That would make account sharing and passport multying still an offence
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Unread 21 May 2006, 15:18   #50
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Re: I want a Second Planet

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Originally Posted by Kal
If one were to legalise multying the way to do it would be to allow multiple planets to be associated with a single passport - and to only allow multiple paid accounts, not a paid/free combination. One could even limit the maximum number of planets someone coule have. I think it might also under thist sort of scheme to think about how alliances would work.

That would make account sharing and passport multying still an offence
In case it wasn't clear, I pretty much agree with this.

I find it problematic that judgement is pretty much arbitrary, but this would allow multihunters to spend more time dealing with problematic stuff like account sharing.
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