Help

[Marilyn Manson]

I need friends in the local area. I have been in the local area for over a year and have made one friend as a result, who doesn't actually live here and is the daughter of an MP. You will no doubt laugh at this, but I don't actually have any people that I would really term 'friends' who are goths, although I know a lot of friendly people within 'the scene.'

I rate this as 'sad' on the old evaluation machine.

I admit that I haven't had much chance to go out around here over the last year, as a result of other pressures, but what can I do?

I don't particularly have any problems talking to people, it's just that I can never really gain any deeper bond with them than the bond that exists between people in pasing conversation. I can't actually 'strike up' a friendship.

I'd just like some general advice here. How does one go about getting friendly with people nowadays?

[Ste]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

I'd just like some general advice here. How does one go about getting friendly with people nowadays?

Dodgy forums and chatrooms.

[Quazi Starbucks]

get plastered

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by Quazi Starbucks

get plastered

I tried that last night, and I was merely insulted by my girlfriend.

[Deciduous]

Casual sex, Bonobo style.

[Deciduous]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

I tried that last night, and I was merely insulted by my girlfriend.

Duuuuude, we have something in common

[Ste]

Actually I seem to have made most of my current friends whilst drunk... but then I am a student...

[Nodrog]

Arent you gay? I thought gay communities were always organising social events and being happy happy happy and carefree.

[Evergreen]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

Arent you gay? I thought gay communities were always organising social events and being happy happy happy and carefree.

I think he's anything with a hole and breathes?

[Kurashima]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

Arent you gay? I thought gay communities were always organising social events and being happy happy happy and carefree.

Most single gay men tend to move from their native towns to Big Cities with thriving gay communities, like, erm , London.

[Kurashima]

Originally Posted by Evergreen

I think he's anything with a hole and breathes?

Breathing Optional.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by Kurashima

Most single gay men tend to move from their native towns to Big Cities with thriving gay communities, like, erm , London.

Manchester?

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

Arent you gay?

No.

[Nodrog]

can you pretend

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by MrL_JaKiri

Manchester?

Blackpool, Brighton and Trimdon to name a few others.

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

can you pretend

Do you want me to dress up as well?

Something for the weekend, etc?

[queball]

You could get one of those self-help books like "How to win friends and influence people", then report back to us if it works.

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by queball

You could get one of those self-help books like "How to win friends and influence people", then report back to us if it works.

I'm looking for serious suggestions here. I suppose I shall have to wait until Dante comes online.

[Nodrog]

I'm not sure what answers you could seriously be expecting other than "Try and talk to everyone you meet until you find people you get on with, and go to places where you are likely to meet others with similar interests as yourself". "Good" friendships are often a function of time, so if you meet someone you imagine you could grow to like a lot, get their phone number and try and talk to them regularly etc etc. You say you dont have a problem talking to people so youre probably ok at doing the gay smalltalk thing; learn how to steer conversations onto more interesting topics after the first few minutes or so.

[Ste]

you've also got the obvious 'Join a local club' option.

[Nodrog]

queball's suggestion probably isnt that bad either, to be honest.

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

I'm not sure what answers you could seriously be expecting other than "Try and talk to everyone you meet until you find people you get on with, and go to places where you are likely to meet others with similar interests as yourself".

I think I'm not trying hard enough.

Originally Posted by Nodrog

"Good" friendships are often a function of time, so if you meet someone you imagine you could grow to like a lot, get their phone number and try and talk to them regularly etc etc.

I haven't found anyone yet. I don't have a phone either, but my girlfriend says she's going to give me her old one next week.

Originally Posted by Nodrog

learn how to steer conversations onto more interesting topics after the first few minutes or so.

I have no problems in theory or practise in speaking to people, it's more the fact that I haven't learned nifty little tricks like the above that's the problem.

I'm not as adept at it as you, Gordie.

Do you mind if I call you Gordie?

Originally Posted by Nodrog

you've also got the obvious 'Join a local club' option.

What sort of club?

[MrL_JaKiri]

If you like a lot of chocolate on your biscuit?

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by Deciduous

Duuuuude, we have something in common

Are you the person that keeps on posting leaflets for dance nights through my letterbox?

[Ste]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

What sort of club?

OY!

Sports club (walking, darts, snooker, climbing, skiing, gym etc...)
Drinking club
Swingers club
Roleplay club
Computer club
help old grannies club
use your imagination club

[Marilyn Manson]

Oh, I see, an association or similar where other gentlemen congregate.

[Nodrog]

Arent you at uni? They have societies there and stuff. Take up a hobby or start doing new things or something.

[Marilyn Manson]

All the socieites here are moribund, comatose, or six feet under, AFAIK.

[Deciduous]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

Are you the person that keeps on posting leaflets for dance nights through my letterbox?

Do I sense a touch of disdain?

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by Deciduous

Do I sense a touch of disdain?

It's primrose oil, actually.

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by Deciduous

Do I sense a touch of disdain?

I disdain all the heathens that walk the earth, spreading their filth.

Julian, my pet skull says "You gotta pick a pocket or two, boys."

[Deciduous]

Originally Posted by MrL_JaKiri

It's primrose oil, actually.

Without getting all Sunday on you, you're fking doing it again MrL

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by Deciduous

Without getting all Sunday on you, you're fking doing it again MrL

How is my reply any less sense making than MM's?

[Deciduous]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

I disdain all the heathens that walk the earth, spreading their filth.

Guilty as charged.

MrL, I dunno, just seemed like you were going off on one again It's MM's thread anyway, surely he can do what he wants with it

[MrL_JaKiri]

So what you're saying is that I'm posting a one off 'humourous' comment in a thread that doesn't appear to have any sort of logic to it?

oh no

[Deciduous]

No need to get upset, note the winking and grinning.

I did laugh at the primrose oil thing btw :P

[Phang]

i liked this thread. lets do this again sometime.

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

I'm looking for serious suggestions here. I suppose I shall have to wait until Dante comes online.

Much as though I always try and post helpful answers, I doubt I've anything to contribute here. All my male friends were made over a decade ago, and now I go out of my way to not to speak to people (not counting females when drunk out of my mind).

My own very limited experience in this area seems to come down to noticing that there are people who act as "friendship hubs". The sorts of people who know everyone, or arrange a pointless amounts of social activity. Often (though not always) it's impossible to be genuinely friendly with them as they're too shallow / busy to be a friend. But hanging around with them is probably the easiest path to success.

The voluntary association route is probably the best path if education & work have both failed to yield results. Aren't there political groups in your area? Clubs of other kinds also work as mentioned.

Also, if your real-life attitude is anything your posting style, you're probably an arrogant **** who doesn't suffer fools particularly well. You might want to avoid that. The people who seem to make friends quickest are those willing to extend themselves, take risks, etc, etc. Conversation is almost always banal at first, but you to try ignore that through social steps (e.g. going to see a movie together or something)

Finally, while it's often rejected, have you tried the on-line route? I presume you use sites such as (don't laugh) http://www.netgoth.org.uk and the like? I am one of the London mailing lists (I know it's different) and they are always arranging pub type meets. They have an IRC server too. Similarly, there are sometimes forums/communities around a particular club or whatever.

Good Luck.

[Nodrog]

I laughed

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

I laughed

Even when I asked so nicely?

[Phang]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Even when I asked so nicely?

it a class struggle but with internet goth support groups instead of poor people

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by Phang

it a class struggle but with internet goth support groups instead of poor people

Wasn't it Theodor Adorno who implied that all politics is identity politics?

[Phang]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Wasn't it Theodor Adorno who implied that all politics is identity politics?

Yes, but did not Plato say "This whining angsty crap is bullshit, I'm off to get rat-arsed"? I think you'll find he did

[Deffeh]

How do you define friend? If your going by the hollywood "confide all" definition your not going to have a lot of luck. Friends are people to talk with about interesting events and common interests, to drink and play sports with. Its certainly true of my life that i am never short of someone to "hang" with but i know very few people who have the whole "trust my life with x" thing going down.

[Marilyn Manson]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Much as though I always try and post helpful answers, I doubt I've anything to contribute here. All my male friends were made over a decade ago, and now I go out of my way to not to speak to people (not counting females when drunk out of my mind).

Which to me seems to be a very big problem here. People are very fixed wiyth regard to their relationships and making a new friend seems to be nigh on impossible with some people. Most people, obviously, aren't as sad as me and so feel quite content with their position, which leads to them being enthusiastic about meeting new people, etc.

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

My own very limited experience in this area seems to come down to noticing that there are people who act as "friendship hubs". The sorts of people who know everyone, or arrange a pointless amounts of social activity. Often (though not always) it's impossible to be genuinely friendly with them as they're too shallow / busy to be a friend. But hanging around with them is probably the easiest path to success.

Mabye.

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

The voluntary association route is probably the best path if education & work have both failed to yield results. Aren't there political groups in your area? Clubs of other kinds also work as mentioned.

I suppose I shall simply have to investigate this route more thoroughly.

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Also, if your real-life attitude is anything your posting style, you're probably an arrogant **** who doesn't suffer fools particularly well. You might want to avoid that.

I am an arrogant shit, but that I am also, mercifully, tactful when I want to be.

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Finally, while it's often rejected, have you tried the on-line route? I presume you use sites such as (don't laugh) http://www.netgoth.org.uk and the like? I am one of the London mailing lists (I know it's different) and they are always arranging pub type meets. They have an IRC server too. Similarly, there are sometimes forums/communities around a particular club or whatever.

Most of the people I meet online are self-infatuated wankers, and netgoth people are worse than most in this regard. Not to mention that the site (in my humble opinion) is ridiculously badly managed, and (from what I can gather.) horribly underused, considering it's constituency. I find penetrating IRC cliques nigh on impossible as fell, and I long ago gave up on it generally as a useful medium here.

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Good Luck.

Thanks for the advice!

[JonnyBGood]

Get a hobby, join some sort of group, make insulting comments towards other extremely similar groups, get accepted, go out drinking a few times, have some friends.

[roadrunner_0]

if it helps, you didnt come across as arrogant in any way when we were at that party at MrL's house
scarily tall perhaps... but not arrogant

[skiddy]

Party?

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

if it helps, you didnt come across as arrogant in any way when we were at that party at MrL's house
scarily tall perhaps... but not arrogant

I thought that was my job (on both counts)?

[Madina]

/me hopes this isnt a serious thread