Boys are better than girls

[JammyJim]

It seems that a recent study undertaken in America would suggest that although Girls are 'ahead' at school and get better results in examinations they are ill prepared for the real world.


This is how i understood what i read :


Girls represent 'old school' learning. They might be great at maths, english etc etc but if you put them infront of a computer or ask them to program a tv etc etc they cant.

However men have embraced new technology and a far larger percentage know what theyre doing with it. However, this isnt assessed and isnt taught at schools.

In effect,

Women are preparing for a society that not longer truly exists. One which revolved around the industrial revolution.

Men are preparing themselves for a society that embraces technology and the future.




http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/3494490.stm



what do you guys think?

[the_dastardley_chihuahua]

i think its a load of bollocks.

[Snurx]

sexist pig, go to hell

[meaple]

Im glad I hate women

[Sandsnake]

or it may just be that women are still socialized in such a manner that discourages them from using technology, ie boys get a game cube and girls get a barbie. The women who break the moid (ie "tomboys") tend to be just as prepared in the real world as men.

Of course, this argument's been going on for ages....behaviourists vs naturalists. Is it genetic or environmental?

[JammyJim]

Originally Posted by Snurx

sexist pig, go to hell

i hope your being "funny"

[Qdeathstar]

I think this had to do with the demand for video games.

most video games are male oriented...

to play the newest video games, you nead to update your technology=finding out about your technology....

[queball]

It's strange how they present reams of fairly well-known statistics, then present a rather hand-wavey (well, historically based) argument.

The simple version of the argument misses out the non-vocational aspects of education, which is a bit funny seeing as it's sociology, which doesn't fit in to the whole industrial-educational complex thing as nicely. But again you could look at how our schools rarely even pretend to study social, managerial, human endevours (maybe that's more to with those being adult things, I haven't thought about it too much).

I had to think about the argument a bit before seeing what they're actually saying. This is a reaction against male-female differences, yeah? School can't provide well for boys or girls, but people only worry about the differences (or it's only the differences that make news), and then need a book to explain that's wrong. That's seems a bit watered-down to me, but I guess it's good for arguing against "girls are better than boys" arguments.

More political context is needed! Why don't people already know this, don't they have sympathy for their children? Do you know anything more than the article? Do they present any concrete proposals? I can't imagine British schools being properly hacker-centric so I'd like to hear more about how things could be done better. I'd hate to think this sort of reaction will prompt top-down, ineffectual changes in the National Curriculum etc like IT Key Skills. It's great to see people tackling the big misconceptions out there though. And pld them, school/uni was/is shit.

[queball]

Originally Posted by JammyJim

i hope your being "funny"

You seem to have taken a particularly belligerent view of this report. Educational discipline found to be largely pointless, as evidenced by relative achievement levels between sexes, between education and industry. Girls tend to take an 'old school' approach to education, boys take a 'new school' approach - that doesn't show anything about the relative merits of the sexes to me. Perhaps I'm Danteing your humour, and that wasn't your intention.

[I am Idler]

that is probably the dumbest thing I've ever read.

[Evergreen]

Women excel at what they are told to do and taught to use.

Men excel at using things they aren't told anything about and creating things as nature has always demanded.

As it stands Education these days is ridiculously out of date and you'll never hold the vast attention of a male teaching them about things that are irrelevant to coping with life's modern pressures in industry and technology, Women are just frankly too easily led and encourageable.

[Phil^]

i think your life is in danger from about 50% of the population now

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by queball

Perhaps I'm Danteing your humour, and that wasn't your intention.

Don't verb me you hate fascist.

This report is stupid. The majority of people are just shit. Fortunately most jobs are shit too. It's a nice balance. It means we can all live meaningless dull lives doing pointless tasks until our bodies decay and we die. Who gives a flying **** if one group is .5% ahead of another one in achieving promotions in these meaningless crap jobs? Wow, I'm a white man I feel so ready for the knowledge economy. Does that get me out of checking 500 rent letters later, or writing some stupid correspondence to idiotic half-wits for directors who can't be bothered to do it themselves?

-- Dante Hicks reporting on Monday Morning.

[Vaio]

Bad day Dante ?

Vaio

[Dante Hicks]

I was awake until 4am writing a stupid letter. Up at 6:45am.

Still, I'm sure the day will improve.

[roadrunner_0]

Originally Posted by Phil^

i think your life is in danger from about 50% of the population now

52% if your in england

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Don't verb me you hate fascist.

Don't make me adverb you.

YOU DON'T WANT TO BE ADVERBED

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

52% if your in england

30% if you're at Peterhouse.

[Radical Edward]

true dat. plus if you turn a little boy over, they are just like a little girl.

[Radical Edward]

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

52% if your in england

you're.

[Nodrog]

Originally Posted by JammyJim

Women are receiving a proper education which involves learning how to think in general principles, even if they have to be somewhat adapted to apply to concrete problems.

Men are preparing themselves for a lifetime of shitty office/management jobs involving typing things into computers.

I fixed the last part of your post.

[Nodrog]

On a side note. any study involving mainly state schools and the "National Curriculum" is going to be essentially meaningless due to the worthless of the state education system.

Do a fully private school only survey and then I'll take notice. Id be surprised if there were significantly different inter-gender performance levels within real schools, or universities.

[Tomkat]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

any study involving mainly state schools and the "National Curriculum" is going to be essentially meaningless due to the worthless of the state education system.

On what grounds do you base that?

[Stew]

Originally Posted by JammyJim

Boys are better than girls

ITT JJ states the obvious

[roadrunner_0]

Originally Posted by Radical Edward

you're.

damn you

oh, and T&F, i am a male who likes my job, and it does entail a hell of a lot of work, despite what people say about it (i work in a library dont'cha know)

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

damn you

oh, and T&F, i am a male who likes my job, and it does entail a hell of a lot of work, despite what people say about it (i work in a library dont'cha know)

Nobody likes their job. Don't contradict Marx you player hater.

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

oh, and T&F, i am a male who likes my job

And yet in this thread, you complained of low pay, and asked for madi to fwd you job ads.

I can feel the <3 for your job from here.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

And yet in this thread, you complained of low pay, and asked for madi to fwd you job ads.

I can feel the <3 for your job from here.

Yeah because wanting to get paid more for what you do is obviously an indication you hate your job. In fact my complaining about not getting paid for browsing the internet shows that in fact I hate using the internet. Holmes I must congratulate you and your team of trained chimps for working this one out and saving the rest of us so much hassle.

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

Yeah because wanting to get paid more for what you do is obviously an indication you hate your job. In fact my complaining about not getting paid for browsing the internet shows that in fact I hate using the internet. Holmes I must congratulate you and your team of trained chimps for working this one out and saving the rest of us so much hassle.

You forgot to write something sarcastic and pointless about the wanting another job bit.

Don't worry, you've got plenty of time.

p.s. And complaining about low pay (i.e. your standard of pay being significantly lower than others) is differerent from simply wanting more money. But you're a bright lad so I'm sure you knew that. xxx

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

You forgot to write something sarcastic and pointless about the wanting another job bit.

Don't worry, you've got plenty of time.

p.s. And complaining about low pay (i.e. your standard of pay being significantly lower than others) is differerent from simply wanting more money. But you're a bright lad so I'm sure you knew that. xxx

One person is paid more than him and he writes "damn you i only get paid x" on the internet. This is totally unrelated to overall standards of pay (and I'm sure he gets paid more than the worldwide average). Neither did he mention how many hours he worked versus how many hours madi worked.

Say my name bitch.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Toccata & Fugue

Dante 1 JBG 0

Pld.

[JonnyBGood]

You've become a bit of a MrL-style poster recently. On a sidenote thinking your employer is a bastard doesn't mean you hate your job either. What is it with these arguments? Did someone use my account on the weekend to call you two gay or something?

[MrL_JaKiri]

Scores like a fox

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

You've become a bit of a MrL-style poster recently. On a sidenote thinking your employer is a bastard doesn't mean you hate your job either. What is it with these arguments? Did someone use my account on the weekend to call you two gay or something?

lol ur gay

[edit]

Internet subcategory cool

[JonnyBGood]

Deep river runs its course
To a warm horizon
Shadows of falling leaves
October moon and rusty skies
Ever changing feelings
The seeds of autumn in my mind

The hiding sun, like the hiding sun
Feels like it's just begun.

[MrL_JaKiri]

As so with that, I thought I'd take a final walk
The tide of public opinion had started to abate
The neighbours, bless them, had turned out to be all talk
I could see their frightened faces
Peering at me through the gate

I was looking for an end to this, for some kind of closure
Time moved so rapidly, I had no hope of keeping track of it
I thought of my friends who had died of exposure
And I remembered other ones who had died from the lack of it

And in my best shoes I started falling forward down the street
I stopped at a church and jostled through the crowd
And love followed just behind me, panting at my feet
As the steeple tore the stomach from a lonely little cloud

Inside I sat, seeking the presence of a God
I searched through the pictures in a leather - bound book
I found a woolly lamb dozing in an issue of blood
And a gilled Jesus shivering on a fisherman's hook

[JonnyBGood]

I have to start looking for a job soon. Running out of drinking money

Sort of difficult to find decent jobs in Dublin at the minute. It'll be worse when those damn eastern european immigrants arrive though!

[MrL_JaKiri]

I'm off to work, as it happens!

[JonnyBGood]

I'm sitting here in my dressing gown doing my cv.

[djbass]

Originally Posted by Toccata & Fugue

This is all nonsense anyway becasue all the girls I know care about their jobs whereas all the men I have met hate their jobs unless it is a job where they don't actually have to try in any way. Also since when were boys not good at maths as I understood it that was the only good thing they were good at. This whole debate reminds me of the neoteny debacle.

Most cases I have seen where men hate their jobs it's due to customer/management relations breaking down. Women do not get ridden as much partly due to how society treats that gender and partly I'd say because the laws tend to be in their favour (anti-sexism, harassment etc).

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Toccata & Fugue

When you say laws in their favour, you mean the right to be respected and not be groped and otherwise demeaned?

People hate their jobs becasue many people have other priorities in their lives then their jobs. Furhtermore it is hard to find a job that suits and of course not everyone has the luxury of choice and has to take whatever job comes along. BUT even if one finds a nice job, after a while the grind can get you down.

As for society treating women better, it is still the case that women get paid less than men.

Maybe that's because women are shit at shit?


At this point in time I'd like to nominate myself for greatest person on the internet ever.

[roadrunner_0]

dante: just to clear some stuff up about my job, i work for local govt. on scale 1 pay, this means i am on the lowest pay scale that you can get for my job.
i love my job though, i am working with books, i have always loved books, always will do, i would love to get a career as a library professional
if you had access to various e mails and pm's, you wouild know that the job ad's madi sends me are for information and library professionals, thus trying to stay within the same sphere of work, as i really do like it (although i am thinkking about trying to get ahead in the university library sector as working in local govt. atm seems like banging my head against a brick wall)

in summary: i love my job but acknowledge that my employer is shit

[roadrunner_0]

hehehehehe
sorry if that came across a bit harsh btw, i have been on my soap box for the last couple of days due to various events both on and offline :/

[JammyJim]

I would like to point out that i dont agree with the results.
Attitude isnt taken into account. Why they embrace technology isnt etc etc.

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

i love my job but acknowledge that my employer is shit

I'm probably being pedantic here, but it sounds like you like the work you do, but dislike your job. Your job includes your conditions (rates of pay), the people you work with, etc.

Saying you love your job but are looking for a new one, aren't paid enough, aren't treated by your employers well, etc sounds a bit odd.

I really love computers and like helping people, but didn't really like doing the specific job of working in tech support.

[madi]

girls and boys are different
each are better than the other at different things generally
dont think either is better or worse when considered as a whole

[roadrunner_0]

hm, ok, try a different way of putting it, i like my job, i like the actual work and find it interesting, i like the challenges it brings me, i even dont particularly mind the pay (im 23 and earning £11k a year, not a lot but its paying my bills)
the downside is the actual attitude of the employers themselves, our ultimate boss is a politician rather than a library and information proffesional, this mean he makes really really bad decisions (such as withdrawing support for external training courses), that is what i dont like, it doesnt directly affect my personal job, but it does affect me as a person, as it is making me look elsewhere for personal development, as i know that my department are not going to pay for this

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

i like the challenges it brings me

like reading am i rite?

[roadrunner_0]

mark, i do a hell of a lot, and you should know this, i have stayed over at your house after meetings and stuff

[KoeN]

girls are crap at mario kart.