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Unread 4 May 2003, 16:48   #1
QazokRouge5
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Bring back the old Milscan

As a Defence Commander... some people dont realize how much of a bitch it is to sort defence when you cant tell where or what the attacker is sending.

Therefore I propose to bring back the old milscan for Round 10. not only would it take a load off of mine and other DC's shoulders... It would help the players who do defence themslf.

problem with milscans now

Fleet 1 Fleet 3
Spider 2000 Scarab 2000

Anyway... enough of my ranting..
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:03   #2
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this is one of the few things that adds an element of surprise to this boring game, keep it
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:03   #3
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With the example you used, it's simple: Spiders and Scarabs don't have the same ETA, so do a news scan and you have your answer.
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:06   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cochese
With the example you used, it's simple: Spiders and Scarabs don't have the same ETA, so do a news scan and you have your answer.
Exactly. It's the 200 vults or 200 vults + 20k pulsars that kills me
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:16   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gayle29uk
Exactly. It's the 200 vults or 200 vults + 20k pulsars that kills me
since you're xan I don't think it would actually kill you very much at all

there IS however a cunning news scan trick for that one too
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:17   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by jornx
this is one of the few things that adds an element of surprise to this boring game, keep it
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:19   #7
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I was blessed with this kind of milscan on my incomings some time ago.

fleet 1: 1k pegs
fleet 2: 900 azteks and 100 pods

I want to see this kind of 31337 fakes in the future as well, keep the scan as it is.
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:28   #8
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keep the scan as it is, gives us 'some brain usage'
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Unread 4 May 2003, 17:32   #9
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The current style of mil scans adds an extra dimension, to the people who use it correctly, compared to older rounds.

Effectively you can fool a target into believing he has 200k Xan Fi and Co incoming, or just a mere single xan Fi/Co
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Unread 4 May 2003, 18:28   #10
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Hey, why don't we also make it impossible to defend other people? That would make the DC's jobs even easier!
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Unread 4 May 2003, 19:11   #11
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One of the worst things about Planetarion is how scripted everything is, I know how many asteroids I'll gain before I launch, and I know what I'll lose because I can scan the defenders. The new military scans is one of the few issues which have ever really tried to address this.
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Unread 4 May 2003, 20:27   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hicks
One of the worst things about Planetarion is how scripted everything is, I know how many asteroids I'll gain before I launch, and I know what I'll lose because I can scan the defenders.
How about losing the roids info from the sector scan. Just a total roids figure !!

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Unread 4 May 2003, 21:06   #13
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this is one of the few things that adds an element of surprise to this boring game, keep it
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Unread 4 May 2003, 21:12   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by jornx
this is one of the few things that adds an element of surprise to this boring game, keep it
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Unread 5 May 2003, 14:10   #15
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u guys just want pa as simple as it always was in the old rounds .. u dont want any changes which keep this boring game a bit "fun" if that word is correct in this game anymore?
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Unread 5 May 2003, 14:13   #16
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It's more to do with the fact 95% of current DCs/BCs/MOs are wank and need all the help they can get
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Unread 5 May 2003, 14:45   #17
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Keep the scans as they are. Yes it can be annoying when u run cos you think you have lots of xan inc to find only 100 vults to steal your roids but atleast its something that keep your brain active....
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Unread 5 May 2003, 15:06   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Colt
Keep the scans as they are. Yes it can be annoying when u run cos you think you have lots of xan inc to find only 100 vults to steal your roids but atleast its something that keep your brain active....
you should leave enough ships home to kill 100 vultures then. If he had sent a big fleet then you only lose a few ships.
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Unread 5 May 2003, 18:14   #19
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it's good as it is.
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Unread 5 May 2003, 18:34   #20
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Re: Bring back the old Milscan

Quote:
Originally posted by QazokRouge5
As a Defence Commander... some people dont realize how much of a bitch it is to sort defence when you cant tell where or what the attacker is sending.

Therefore I propose to bring back the old milscan for Round 10. not only would it take a load off of mine and other DC's shoulders... It would help the players who do defence themslf.

problem with milscans now

Fleet 1 Fleet 3
Spider 2000 Scarab 2000

Anyway... enough of my ranting..
so because it makes the game more difficult for you, they should get rid of it? That's pretty selfish. Most of the time you can tell what's being sent by what the defender's fleet looks like. It's really not that difficult. And if you really can't tell, just plan for worst-case scenario. Again, really not that difficult. It's a feature, instead of complaining about it, why not use it to your advantage? As a DC you should know how easy it is to make this work for you instead of against you.
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Unread 6 May 2003, 12:08   #21
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Keep them as they are.....I used to love the whole bluffing game with Fury BC's and to make matters worse they were good at it as were we.

I agree with Hicks though, the game becomes to scripted, anything to add a random factor (within reason) makes the game more interesting.. and tbh the bluffing is the FUN part.
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Unread 6 May 2003, 12:22   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hicks
It's more to do with the fact 95% of current DCs/BCs/MOs are wank and need all the help they can get
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Unread 6 May 2003, 12:26   #23
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what a load of rubbish.

I think the new scans are wicked and enhance gameplay. The only ppl that need worry are those that send ships incorrectly (i.e. soeone offerd cath so they send his entire fleet including 5k roahes to defend fr).

Most of the time they dont even scan there fakes, so its easy to work out which the fake is sent at.

Why bitch - at worst you may lose some roids, at ebst you defend the incomming.
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Unread 6 May 2003, 15:05   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by The_Fish
you should leave enough ships home to kill 100 vultures then. If he had sent a big fleet then you only lose a few ships.
Better yet, send everything away when enemy is ETA1 so you can be sure he lands. Then just before tick recall just enough Thieves & Marauders (& a few EMP ships) to steal all those 100 Vultures in 1 tick.

If you were wrong, you lose a bit. If you were right, you just gained 100 free Vultures with complimentary salvage.

On topic: Milscan is just fine as it is. Other scans could use a bit more inaccuracy as well. Like an earlier version of unit scan showing just ship classes, not individual ships.
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Unread 6 May 2003, 15:13   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Urkki
If you were wrong, you lose a bit.
If you're wrong each time, you're below 100 roids in roughly 2 or 3 days. Sounds like a plan!
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Unread 6 May 2003, 15:49   #26
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Nothing ever happens because of scans. I use a battle calc to see how successful my battle will be hours before i land, then i decide whether to retreat or stay. As soon as someone launches on me i can work out how much defence i need to get and so whether i can cope with the incoming or run my fleet. There is no element of surprise. I wuoldnt mind playing the game without mil scans and news scans, it would certainly make things more interesting.
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Unread 6 May 2003, 17:33   #27
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Very true, Planetarion is essentially a war game with no battles
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Unread 6 May 2003, 17:35   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by jornx
this is one of the few things that adds an element of surprise to this boring game, keep it
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Unread 6 May 2003, 18:44   #29
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I agree with JC and Hicks.

There's no element of surprise any more. Mil scans are ***. It's way more fun early on in the round.

News scans are also way to detailed. It would be more fun to have your agents tell you: there are 5 friendly fleets incomming. And then you can gamble or pull. No news at all would be a bit cruell if you have worked on your planets for weeks and lose all in one attack.

If this is insufficient info, you could give coords and either number of ships or original eta. Both would give too much info. (If I see 1000 ships eta 6, from a terran it will be pretty easy to figure out what he sent).
1000 ships eta 6 can be anything (could be ingal Bs or in universe fighters, might even be 1 k vultures with 1 mln cloaked ships).
1000 ships from a terran at unknown eta could also be almost anything. Would be real fun (I have 600 wyvern, so I send 600 harpies).
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Unread 6 May 2003, 19:12   #30
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Mil scans are fine as they are. PA is so so easy, it's unbelievable. Being big in this game (and playing fairly) simply requires time online, some common sense, being a member of a winning alliance, and mostly luck.

There is very little 'skill' to it, however, any less information on scans, such as no coords on news scans, would simply improve bashing, and would be a terrible idea, in my opinion.


However, scans will most definately not be exactly as they are now, next round.
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Unread 6 May 2003, 19:15   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hicks
It's more to do with the fact 95% of current DCs/BCs/MOs are wank and need all the help they can get
soooo true
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Unread 6 May 2003, 21:39   #32
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Unread 6 May 2003, 23:16   #33
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Unread 6 May 2003, 23:28   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by jornx
this is one of the few things that adds an element of surprise to this boring game, keep it
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Unread 6 May 2003, 23:30   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hicks
Very true, Planetarion is essentially a war game with no battles

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Unread 7 May 2003, 01:32   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hicks
Very true, Planetarion is essentially a war game with no battles
Perhaps.

However, it can be compared to sword fighting. In a 1 v 1 battle, with one guy having a sword, and one guy having a kitchen knife, it's pretty easy to see who's going to win, in most cases.


Get 500 people, 250 on each side, put them in a big field, give them a selection of swords of different sizes, and let them fight. Now here you can't tell who is going to win, similarily in PA. Unless you calc every ship, which is possible in big battles, although rarely done.

So in that sense you're wrong. But I hate comparing PA to anything else, and I'd generally agree that the way everything can be calced may be a little un-war like.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 01:41   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scouse
Get 500 people, 250 on each side...
Although PA is more like 350 on one side, 150 on the other...
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Unread 7 May 2003, 01:52   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by xtothez
Although PA is more like 350 on one side, 150 on the other...

Yeah, but my point still stands. You don't know where the losses are going to be. In both PA and the sword fighting example you might have a decent idea who's going to win but you don't know exactly.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 11:33   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by Leshy
If you're wrong each time, you're below 100 roids in roughly 2 or 3 days. Sounds like a plan!
Well, if attacker sent just 1 fleet, which is either 100 Vultures, or 100 Vultures and enough other ships to make him cap 5%, you can be almost certain it's a fake. If you're wrong every time, then you're either very unlucky, or very bad at guessing if it's a fake or not.

And fooling attacker into believing he gets free roids so he lands, and then capturing Vultures with profit resources is sweet, especially when attacker is a lot bigger than you and you can't really do anything to him in any other way.

[Edit: Also, looking at this round, what you mean "below 100 roids"? Do you have any idea how hard it was to stay above 100 roids no matter what?]
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Unread 7 May 2003, 11:38   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by hAl
How about losing the roids info from the sector scan. Just a total roids figure !!
That's a good idea actually! Although the farmers will still know what they are going to get

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Unread 15 May 2003, 00:27   #41
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its only crap when defending against xan all the rest its ok ish for as they can fake with just pods. so xan and faster etas unknown numbers and which fleets:/ maybe having it so you can tell if a fleet is home or out maybe a good idea but not what eta they are to there destination. so fake launchs are needed also.
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Unread 15 May 2003, 09:23   #42
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You could also remove the mil scan from both the waves and galaxy pages and move it to the galaxy status page only. So you would only be able to do mil scans on planets with fleets in your gal status. That would be a usefull measure.

Nowadays to many people rely on scans from their alliance which is utterly wank.

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