Massive scanning - rank #1 point of view

[Tomkat]

I'm not sure where my opinion lies here. That way of winning sucks, it's hardly as if you played "well" to get there, by clicking loads. However, on the other hand, can you even play "well" in this game? The people who reach the top usually have some dubious tactics on their side, be it escorts, farming, bug abuse, or something else.

I'd be pissed too if I was you, and the score jump you had was taken away. However, I'd be pissed if I was the person who was expected to get #1, and I was overtaken by someone who clicked and clicked and clicked, while I'd been slaving away every night, being active.

[The_Fish]

Originally Posted by Tomkat

However, I'd be pissed if I was the person who was expected to get #1, and I was overtaken by someone who clicked and clicked and clicked, while I'd been slaving away every night, being active.

And thats my opinion

[Nadval]

*sigh* "it doesn't say in the rules that i can't do it so why shouldn't i!?"

What happened to common decency? wherever did morals ever go? It's not in tennis rules to shake hands at the end but everyone still does it, it's called sportsmanship. PA is not about finding the way to win using the least amount of skill, it's about using attacking/ship strategies and politics to your advantage. It doesn't say in the rules that we shouldn't destroy other pa player's computers, so shall we do that aswell and eliminate opposition? You said it yourself, you became inactive and stopped roiding - how the hell did you think you deserved to win over people who put alot of time and effort in? This is pathetic, just when you think pa players can't get any lower - someone manages to prove you wrong.

[Colt]

hmm, interesting, i agree with the ppl who say it is a lame way to win, though it is a legitimate way to win nonetheless...

[CrazyConrad]

Originally Posted by Colt

hmm, interesting, i agree with the ppl who say it is a lame way to win, though it is a legitimate way to win nonetheless...

Agree here...

Totally lame way to win Yogi but nevertheless a valid tactic and I dont agree with Spinner to remove either your xp or this way of getting xp.

[Oghy]

Originally Posted by SteInMetz

You should be glad they didnt reset the XP more than 48 hours, stfu whiner

Uhm, how would that affect me you moron? I didnt do any real scanning before that. Read the full thread before making dumb comments, classclown.

[Oghy]

Originally Posted by Tomkat

I'm not sure where my opinion lies here. That way of winning sucks, it's hardly as if you played "well" to get there, by clicking loads. However, on the other hand, can you even play "well" in this game? The people who reach the top usually have some dubious tactics on their side, be it escorts, farming, bug abuse, or something else.

I'd be pissed too if I was you, and the score jump you had was taken away. However, I'd be pissed if I was the person who was expected to get #1, and I was overtaken by someone who clicked and clicked and clicked, while I'd been slaving away every night, being active.

Wether or not they would be pissed. I planned to use a valid tactic. I did not roid or do anything else, as I was quite sure of my win. IF the creators did a proper job, I would have kept roiding. I was about 1k roids ahead of Chika, and would have just as actively roided as him. But since I choose another tactic, I did not want to risk any high losses.

[Oghy]

Originally Posted by Nadval

*sigh* "it doesn't say in the rules that i can't do it so why shouldn't i!?"

What happened to common decency? wherever did morals ever go? It's not in tennis rules to shake hands at the end but everyone still does it, it's called sportsmanship. PA is not about finding the way to win using the least amount of skill, it's about using attacking/ship strategies and politics to your advantage. It doesn't say in the rules that we shouldn't destroy other pa player's computers, so shall we do that aswell and eliminate opposition? You said it yourself, you became inactive and stopped roiding - how the hell did you think you deserved to win over people who put alot of time and effort in? This is pathetic, just when you think pa players can't get any lower - someone manages to prove you wrong.

This is all total BULLSHIT
Sure its lame.
BUT if all of you are HONEST, you ALL would have chosen the same path if you were offered the possibility.
I had the round pocketed, why would I bother and risk attacking? Its like being #1 with 10k roids lead. IF i did not have this lead, I would attack. As i did not get to my rank without any effort. Seriously Nadval, you are full of shit. You would have done the same.

[The_Fish]

heh.

Had you spent your resources on ships, and not scans, 22:8 would be comfortably in the lead now.

You personally, would be very close to winning too.

I dont see why 22:8 went for the scans options, when it was obvious that it was risky.

[Oghy]

Originally Posted by The_Fish

heh.

Had you spent your resources on ships, and not scans, 22:8 would be comfortably in the lead now.

You personally, would be very close to winning too.

I dont see why 22:8 went for the scans options, when it was obvious that it was risky.

Incorrect. I've only scanned about 30mil resources, no more then 300k score. As you can see I am much further away from that.

We as a galaxy were too ambitious
Wanted to win with a 15mil lead

[The_Fish]

Ok, fair point about yourself, I was more thinking about 22:8. You might still win, but you blew your chances of winning with honour.

On a personal level, all you needed to do was send 1 attack a day, and by your score, its obvious you are active enough to recall. You didnt need to take risks, but if you landed on a few planets, you would have gained roids and score. I remember only a few days ago, being told you had 1.8 billion resources saved (gal). And I thought, 9m score, thats us beaten. And we were. I will never understand why you didnt take the sensible win?

[Barrow|Pony]

It sounds to me like risks are the modern plague.

[[Graham]]

you know what bugs me about this so called abuse, the way that all its mainly everybody against the fang/mistu block thats posting here does that not class you as fairly sad? i H A T E fang but from what i can see is 22:8 found a way to win using the most efficient way THAT is what this game is about, others prefer when people run thier fleets so they get 'free' roids thats efficient so was scanning.

if you didn't want ppl using scans as a valid way to gain score faster WHY THE **** would you make scans give 3x the score?

to be quite honest its a slap in the face for 22:8 who were smart enough to be efficient with resources only to suddenly have it removed, yeah pa team clearly rock.

server abuse and scripts are just bollocks made up by pa team to cover thier own stupidity in thier code and spurred on by the people against the FM block to try and get those people deleted.

[Cayl]

They'd have probably gotten away with it if they had just been a little more considerate of server issues. Only one in the galaxy at a time, only do it for about 10 minutes at a time tops, give 30 min between people doing it. Maybe start earlier in the game.

Waiting for later in the round and hammering the server 6 times a second for prolonged periods of time was bound to draw someone's attention. Don't you know the theory behind DOS attacks?

[[Graham]]

yes im sure they all scanned at once in a clearly mallicious plot to kill pa servers. GIVE ME A ****ING BREAK.

ive noticed all this is being targetted on 22:8 when CLEARLY 13:2 and 17:10 have found the way of scanning.

[Oghy]

Originally Posted by Cayl

They'd have probably gotten away with it if they had just been a little more considerate of server issues. Only one in the galaxy at a time, only do it for about 10 minutes at a time tops, give 30 min between people doing it. Maybe start earlier in the game.

Waiting for later in the round and hammering the server 6 times a second for prolonged periods of time was bound to draw someone's attention. Don't you know the theory behind DOS attacks?

You sir need to read the entire thread before pointing out things which have already been addressed.

[The_Fish]

Originally Posted by '[Graham

ive noticed all this is being targetted on 22:8 when CLEARLY 13:2 and 17:10 have found the way of scanning.

I suggest you retract that statement, or you get a clue. Look at our roid count over the past week or so. We have been the top owning gal for most days. That is part of the reason we are so close to 22:8 now. Nothing to do with scanning.

[The_Fish]

and whilst I'm at it, our value compared to their value, we have 6m more value, yet only 700k more score. I wonder how long they have been abusing the game

[[Graham]]

Originally Posted by The_Fish

I suggest you retract that statement, or you get a clue. Look at our roid count over the past week or so. We have been the top owning gal for most days. That is part of the reason we are so close to 22:8 now. Nothing to do with scanning.

i will not retract it. feel free to explain how you suddenly got so far ahead WHILE being like 7k roids behind then suddenly yours roids jumped to catch up with your scan score

so please do not deny it as you are kidding nobody, its just you are not scorned upon being ND your NOT in the opposing block therfore everybody looks the other way.

[xontas]

i did not read all of that

i think no-one should be able to win the game by clicking a button as many times as he can!

thats just lame

[Oghy]

Originally Posted by The_Fish

Ok, fair point about yourself, I was more thinking about 22:8. You might still win, but you blew your chances of winning with honour.

On a personal level, all you needed to do was send 1 attack a day, and by your score, its obvious you are active enough to recall. You didnt need to take risks, but if you landed on a few planets, you would have gained roids and score. I remember only a few days ago, being told you had 1.8 billion resources saved (gal). And I thought, 9m score, thats us beaten. And we were. I will never understand why you didnt take the sensible win?

Our galaxy wasn't all inactive, it was just less then it used to be. I'm sure there were atleast 5 or so planets that launched attacks each night still, they just hit tough luck.

And seeing we had a 4-5k roid lead... Who'd have thought 13:2 would gain such huge amounts in such short time

[The_Fish]

Originally Posted by [Graham]

i will not retract it. feel free to explain how you suddenly got so far ahead WHILE being like 7k roids behind then suddenly yours roids jumped to catch up with your scan score

so please do not deny it as you are kidding nobody, its just you are not scorned upon being ND your NOT in the opposing block therfore everybody looks the other way.

It's common sense. 22:8 decide to stockpile all their resources. 13:2 decide to spend everything, attack all the time, and see what happens. After about 3 days, we had a very similar roid count, so we were growing at twice the rate of them on resources, because we were spending, they were saving. And on top of that, for every landed attack, we gained XP and therefore score.

That means we should be growing at more than double the rate that 22:8 were. And oh my, those are the facts.

Well done.

[gzambo]

its abuse of a bug
so do us all a favour and piss off
kthxbye

[Oghy]

Originally Posted by gzambo

its abuse of a bug
so do us all a favour and piss off
kthxbye

And we managed so long without flames :/

ask the creators you moron, it wasn't a bug.

[Synthetic_Sid]

Originally Posted by The_Fish

I suggest you retract that statement, or you get a clue. Look at our roid count over the past week or so. We have been the top owning gal for most days. That is part of the reason we are so close to 22:8 now. Nothing to do with scanning.

Blatant roid donation by ex-phraktos to an ex-phraktos member in your galaxy did you no harm either. 12k fi attack on a 5 mill xan who runs all his anti-fi to a planet not under attack just before attack lands? What the scanners did was lame - but so were the actions of one of your galaxy at least - defecting from his alliance then farming his way up the rankings isn't something that should make the rest of your galaxy proud of your roid gains.

Note: I'm in no way saying all of you did it as I know most of your attacks were totally legit. But end of the day, which fence-sitting cheating galaxy finishes #1 is only of real interest to 20 players.

[The_Fish]

Originally Posted by Synthetic_Sid

Note: I'm in no way saying all of you did it as I know most of your attacks were totally legit. But end of the day, which fence-sitting cheating galaxy finishes #1 is only of real interest to 20 players.

I have never fencesit. I never will. Yes, i'm in a FM gal whilst an ND member, but I have deffed against and attacked FPM throughout the round. I have also deffed against gal mates all round. I have not fencesit.

[Kal]

Originally Posted by The_Fish

I have never fencesit. I never will. Yes, i'm in a FM gal whilst an ND member, but I have deffed against and attacked FPM throughout the round. I have also deffed against gal mates all round. I have not fencesit.

yes , but magically you still have a planet, that FPM really should have killed etc - there is a certain amound of double standards around as my gal has FPM enemies in it and yet magically FOM is aloud to hit them and in one case completely kill them, whereas you are aloud to live.

[mist]

how many page changes will the average user manage in an hour?
how many will a deacent planet manage?
how many did you manage doing 5-6 a second for 10 minutes?

while there's no statistics about the first two, the latter gives 3000 page changes.

are you really suggesting that 3000 pages in 10 minutes isn't an abnormal load? has anyone playing "normally" changed that many in a *day* before, let alone 10 minutes?

the strategy itself was good, and hats off. a little lame, but good. the execution was lacking

-mist

[KoeN]

yogibear in "still 0wning the rest of you n00bs" non-shocker.

pld.

[fuz]

It wasn't a bug, just another brilliant idea from pa-team, i know it can be hard to tell the difference some times


How could those who scanned know that the servers couldn't handle it? (The servers didn't handle anything yesterday either, after the xp was removed.) When i tried it, the server was always fast, since u use practically no server load while you push the button, it just had to send some more info when u stop clicking the button.

This must mean that it will be breaking the EULA if we do a lemmingrun tonight, since the server will collaps from everyone pressing "launch", dont even mention a battlereport ^^

[fuz]

btw, i feel the users in this game have no rights what-so-ever..
If users has a decision they wanna complain about, they might as well go to the church and pray to god pa-team will change their mind..
No matter how much a player argues (as we have seen many times), pa-team seems to find new reasons all the time. It seems like pa-team is searching for a good reason blind-folded here.. reasons to stop the scanning-planets, and reasons the servers has been no good from tick 1. Did people scan then too?

[mist]

Originally Posted by fuz

How could those who scanned know that the servers couldn't handle it?

Originally Posted by fuz

This must mean that it will be breaking the EULA if we do a lemmingrun tonight, since the server will collaps from everyone pressing "launch", dont even mention a battlereport

you ask how people were to know that a lot of page changes would be a problem, and then demonstrate you know that a lot of page changes are a problem. genius.

furthermore, your example is blatantly dumb. huge cheating asside, a lemming run implies a lot of people hitting the servers. that'd be a lot of people, each engaged in normal use. clearly within the eula. i fail to see how this has any bearing on a few people hitting the servers for all they're worth - which clearly IS an excessive use.

Originally Posted by fuz

No matter how much a player argues (as we have seen many times), pa-team seems to find new reasons all the time.

you'd rather the pateam did things without a reason? this seems to be the only alternative. you wouldn't just be looking for excuses to argue, would you?

i'd love to hear what your solution would have been tho, i'm sure it'd be much better.

-mist

[fuz]

Originally Posted by mist

i'd love to hear what your solution would have been tho, i'm sure it'd be much better.

-mist

i would NEVER have given 3X the score for scanning in the first place, this is a problem pa-team made for themselves.

I would not have removed xp people got from it, and if i did, i would at least give back res people spent on it.
and, i would've acted a MONTH earlier than this, don't come and tell me pa-team hasn't seen the planet with 7-8mill score and 1mill value? #1 launching planet?

[mist]

claiming that you'd never have made mistakes in the first place seems fairly useless. assuming that you'd not made this mistake, i have faith that you'd have made another instead. i was under the impression that this is about how mistakes were dealt with, not about how to be perfect in the origonal instance.

not removing xp from people who did it is an interesting idea. they clearly broke the rules to get it, whatever you may claim the rate at which they requested pages was excessive. do you want to send out a message that breaking the rules is ok untill you get caught? i'm sure you'd be all for farmers having their roids removed etc etc. how is this case different?

giving the resources back... again i'm going to fall back on the farming example. if someone's caught farming and their roids are removed (taking pods which die when capping) would you give them back the resources they lost in pods? or would you tell them that cheating doesn't pay? this case seems fairly similar to me...

acting a month earlier. again, a nice idea. however neither of us knows what the pateam sees. they're not allowed to play the game 'cus people complain about it (see here for an example) so noticing isn't particularly easy. if you take that to someoe who doesn't play, or even someone who plays casually there's no guarentee that they'll think anything untoward is happening. plus, afaik spinner's the only one who knows how a fair amount of stuff works so there's no way you can guarentee that the pateam knew what was going on, even if they knew something was going on. again, seems to be dealing with perfection in the first instance rather than dealing with the problem

nice try tho. very fair, totally unbiased, and not at all in favour of the rule breakers.

-mist

[fuz]

to me it's madness to give 3X score for scanning, so im 100% sure i would never do that.
ofx max u can give for scanning, would be same as shipbuilding, more than that is plain crazy..

and your examples..well, farming isn't allowed, there's no limit for scanning.. i know you're trying to just make a point, but i dont agree still. Some planets where so clearly scanning alot right infront of everyone's noses for weeks before this happeneds, i haven't seen anything that has been more obvious this round, so it's not weird people started to do this at all, since it seemed people were allowed to do it. a bit annoying to see a guy with 200 ships, 1mill value and 7mill score, passing you on rankings because of scanning. Not weird some people was tempted to do it as well?
and people couldn't know the servers couldn't take it, since it's no problem when you scan (yes i've tested this), the server was fast as normal, and working alot better than it did yesterday, when people had stopped scanning.

[mist]

Originally Posted by fuz

and people couldn't know the servers couldn't take it, since it's no problem when you scan (yes i've tested this), the server was fast as normal, and working alot better than it did yesterday, when people had stopped scanning.

bollocks, utter bollocks. everyone knows that when the pages are hit a lot the servers die. as you yourself said a few posts back. if you're going to make excuses at least try for one that you don't shoot down yourself.

that and your claims of omnipotence asside, i await your further justifications for your "solution"

-mist

[fuz]

excuses for what?

i highly doubt people was thinking: "**** now the servers went down for the 100th time this round, maybe it was because i have started scanning alot? even tho i did that 30mins ago" ....

i know people have lost 200-500roids instead of loosing planet, when they have been suspected for accountsharing, which must mean they were guilty, why take roids from them if they were not?
So that means you get punished harder if u scan alot, than if u accountshare? not in all cases ofc, but in some.

the thing i complaing most about here, is that when it takes a month, or almost a whole round, before pa "discovers" that people scan alot, when many, many other players have seen this long time ago, it gives people a feeling that this is a part of the game. Ofc it's not a good way to win, but there's no good way to win this round, and im sure pa-team know how the players of this game are.. if some planets does this for long time without pa-team taking action, this is doomed to happend... sad but true

[mist]

Originally Posted by fuz

the thing i complaing most about here, is that when it takes a month, or almost a whole round, before pa "discovers" that people scan alot

ideally, yes, the pateam should notice dubious behaviour when it first happens. however, ideally players should report such blatant problems, rather than abusing them. was it reported?

on a completely seperate note. imo account sharers should be closed. all this leaving them open and takinga few roids just gives the impression that it's ok really.

-mist

[fuz]

Originally Posted by mist

ideally, yes, the pateam should notice dubious behaviour when it first happens. however, ideally players should report such blatant problems, rather than abusing them. was it reported?

on a completely seperate note. imo account sharers should be closed. all this leaving them open and takinga few roids just gives the impression that it's ok really.

-mist

obvious things seldom gets reported..heh, it's more those things hard to discover that people report, this scannign i think most players thought pa-team knew of. Would be very strange if pa-team hasnt checked #1 launching-planet this round..

i totally agree to you on the account sharing, taking a few roids leaves many questions open too.. why did they take those roids? has he cheated or not? not good ofc..

[mist]

if you didn't report the problem, i have slight problems with the credibility of your demands to know why nothing was done...

-mist

[fuz]

i and i know others asked if scanning was supposed to give 3x score in #support, and they said yes.
i did not know this caused servers to go down

[mist]

Originally Posted by fuz

i did not know this caused servers to go down

given that you know a lot of people launching does, you don't paint a flattering picture of yourself

-mist

[_o0o_]

Let's clear the air a bit here. Scanning in itself is completely legitimate. If the code was messed up and it allowed 3x score, then so be it.

What is not okay is the greed that filled peoples eyes that led them to attempt to scan several times a second. This served absolutely no purpose other than to attempt to exploit the wave scan scoring system...and boost their score, which is a violation. This has been openly admitted to several times in at least 2 different threads. Stop mixing apples with oranges and trying to wash over the actual problem.

If you started out at Tick 1 and decided "Hey, I think I will scan my way to the top because I think I get more score from it..." then so be it. That is your choice on how to play this game. If you legitimately scanned and got the results after each scan, then nobody in the community could utter a word in protest to you. However, if you decided (like others have stated already) "Hey, I get more score from scans than building ships, so I will scan my way to the top. By the way, I want to achieve the most score in the fastest way, so I will click as quickly as possible..." then you have discovered a way to exploit the system.

This is the total argument...not that the scanning was done, but that it was exploited...not with an attempt to actually use the scan (as you would normally have waited to see the results), but with an attempt to abuse the scoring system.

[Tactitus]

Originally Posted by _o0o_

This is the total argument...not that the scanning was done, but that it was exploited...not with an attempt to actually use the scan (as you would normally have waited to see the results), but with an attempt to abuse the scoring system.

This is the inevitable and predictable result of all 'honor scoring' systems.

<PA> We're going to give points for doing scans because we think they should be rewarded.
<player> Hm, I think I'll just do scans then.
<PA> Oh, wait!

[Chika]

Originally Posted by Lord_Thunderball

P.S. The thing I still don't get, why would anyone want to win planetarion with a feature like gaining massive score from scanning, or abusing the gal fund feature?? In my eyes a valid tactic(so I support you in the unfairness of it) but so sad that people are seeking ways around winning in a normal way....

I agree m8. but what gets me, is not the fact that they tried to win an unfair, and lame way, but the fact that they are mad because they couldn't win this way. How lame is that. "I am the #1 planet, I clicked go 3k times per minute" How sad. And they are trying to justify it. Sad that this is what PA has come too. Trying to scan to win.

[Sonny]

We had already won via combat.

And to prove the point even with being idle for 25% of the round, we still will, including copping a decent penalty for our trouble of doing nothing wrong.

What is the most shaming thing is that you failed in your attempts to deny us our deserved spot. Just so you could take a stab at the title without us as competition.

Cordially,
Sonny.

[Chika]

Originally Posted by Sonny

We had already won via combat.

And to prove the point even with being idle for 25% of the round, we still will, including copping a decent penalty for our trouble of doing nothing wrong.

What is the most shaming thing is that you failed in your attempts to deny us our deserved spot. Just so you could take a stab at the title without us as competition.

Cordially,
Sonny.

lol. ummmmm, no m8. you are off. We were giving 22:8 your props., and defending u when peeps claimed u were farming. it wasn't until you guy's sleeping lameness woke up that we figured you were twats and didn't deserve to win. but you have been punished for ur actions, thing is, you guys just didn't come up with the idea on the span the pa team caught you. You guys were doing it longer. You just started "OVER" doing it when we out played you all over that 72 hour span. All in all. GG. I like you guys. Anyone that can practice being a twat, and then get on Forums and complain about it, is alright in my book. I actually think your idea was smart, BUT, I know who you got it from.

[Deurges]

Taking away the massive points for scanning owk.. but taking away all score is kinda harsch.. you could do that but still give back 30-40% of the resources spent...

[Nadval]

Originally Posted by Oghy

This is all total BULLSHIT
Sure its lame.
BUT if all of you are HONEST, you ALL would have chosen the same path if you were offered the possibility.
I had the round pocketed, why would I bother and risk attacking? Its like being #1 with 10k roids lead. IF i did not have this lead, I would attack. As i did not get to my rank without any effort. Seriously Nadval, you are full of shit. You would have done the same.

I would not have done the same, had i known i would have got more amps and scanned myself rather than relying on other people - but i wouldn't have stockpiled resources so i could mass scan, that is simply lame. To me PA isn't all about winning - otherwise i would have tried, it's about having fun. And i don't see it as fun just sitting and mass scanning - winning like that wouldn't make me feel proud or as if i've played better than anyone else, tbh it woulda just made me feel like a twat. But then i guess i can't blame you cuz it's just a typical human feature - 'winning is everything'. I stand by what i said before - Pathetic!

[Coaxmetal]

As long as you followed the rules it shouldn't be your problem that due to fifth season's shite servers you ain't allowed to, and in addition get subtracted your score.

All of you saying scanning your way to the top is low: it is the rules that makes it that way. I've seen a lot of wankers in previous rounds making their way to the top with pure cheating, though people tend to look the other way when they are benefiting from it. It is the same with this case. People on the other side of the block keep flaming him (though I'm merely guessing who is in what block, as I've been in the army the last year, and haven't been able to keep up with pa). Just stfu allready, I'm so ****ing tired of the hypocracy.