Birmingham Riots

[roadrunner_0]

i don't think we have the right exposure to the right (wrong?) kind of people to be able to spread rumours well to be honest

[Cannon_Fodder]

Originally Posted by pig

It was quite weird as I went back home this weekend but on saturday night and sunday night I went out came back and waited with my baseball bat, no one came and did some proper rioting.

Noone picked up on this?

Does this mean pig needs an ASBO?

[Tomkat]

Originally Posted by sniborp

Noone picked up on this?

Does this mean pig needs an ASBO?

Haven't you read the numerous threads pig has made about his keen interest in baseball?

[KaneED]

He was on his way to a game when the riots started.

[Yahwe]

And the jews say 'Goyim' as a reference to non jews.

It doesn't justify anti-semiticism though does it?

[Paisley]

Originally Posted by horn

there was a good documentary recently about the integration of muslim communities into britain (panorama maybe), one of the points raised was how a lot of practicing muslims refer to non-muslims as "a word i forget" which roughly translates to inferior (a non believer).
While it should not be considered that all muslims have this mind set (there were a few muslim academics on the programme blaming it for several problems related to muslim communities not integrating well) it does appear to be a problem. Especially when people subtely couple it with "they're nicking jobs" and "they don't like my bacon sarnies !"
should we try to enforce our secular libertarian views ?
is it simply a means to tolerance and freedom or is itself an ideology that we are just trying to impose on others

Goes to show you leave a group of mixed toddlers in a nursery and they will play with each other quite happly. When the same people meet in say high school they stay away from each other. Somewhere these kids have picked it up to avoid other races. My mate once said to me, doesn't matter if you are black,white,chinise,hindu, or even Scottish, arses will be arses.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by horn

there was a good documentary recently about the integration of muslim communities into britain (panorama maybe), one of the points raised was how a lot of practicing muslims refer to non-muslims as "a word i forget" which roughly translates to inferior (a non believer).
While it should not be considered that all muslims have this mind set (there were a few muslim academics on the programme blaming it for several problems related to muslim communities not integrating well) it does appear to be a problem. Especially when people subtely couple it with "they're nicking jobs" and "they don't like my bacon sarnies !"

should we try to enforce our secular libertarian views ?
is it simply a means to tolerance and freedom or is itself an ideology that we are just trying to impose on others

The japanese use a word to denote foreigners which can also mean barbarian. The word barbarian itself comes from the greek word barbaros which means foreigner. Languages evolve over time. You should never try and enforce your beliefs. However do not let others enforce theirs on you. It is not intolerant to ask to remain an individual.

[pig]

Originally Posted by Tomkat

Haven't you read the numerous threads pig has made about his keen interest in baseball?

actually I got my baseball bat from the USA with a ball and pad, when its put in the boot, its also with a ball and a pad

Officer: Sir can I look in your boot
Me: sure
Officer: Just pop it open
Me: Its popped open *g*
Officer: Whats this a baseball bat
Me: Why yes it is
Officer: What are you doing with this in your boot
Me: Im an avid baseball fan and player:
Officer: Well....
Me: Well what?
Officer: Well, dont you need a ball
Me: Why yes I do
Officer: Well as you dont have a ball I am going to arrest you
Me: Dont do that
Officer: Why not?
Me: Because its all legal
Officer: How is it legal?
Me: I have a ball and a glove
Officer: mmmmmm
Me: Go on have more of a look around the boot
Officer: So you do
Me: So does that mean im free
Officer: I guess so
Me: sweet, means I dont have to get yahwe to defend me
Officer: What THE Yahwe
Me: yes THE Yahwe
Officer: Last time I met him in court he managed to get this guy off
Me: lollyroffle
Officer: No not like that, as in the guy didnt go to prison
Me: oh
Officer: He was called Dace
Me: o.0
Officer: There was a load of paedophilia offences he had commited but somehow this Yahwe character won him the case
Me: Lucky you didnt arrest me then
Officer: Yes so it seems
Me: Can I go now?
Officer: Yes, have a good day.
Me: Bye <3
Officer: Bye <3

[JonnyBGood]

I hope horn finds stormfront sooner rather than later.

[Yahwe]

Originally Posted by horn

It's just that our use of the word barbarian is not simply a reference to a foreigner.

I use the term sewer

[Tomkat]

Originally Posted by horn

it's overtly "tackling the issue", i.e. teachers telling children how bad racism is, when they probably wouldn't have even thought of there being a difference until it was rammed down their throats.

If I have to tell a kid off for calling another one a ****** in my class, I'm pretty sure he already is aware of different races and the potential difficulties between them

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by horn

surely if the word simply means "foreigner" then there is not much a "problem". It's just that our use of the word barbarian is not simply a reference to a foreigner.
It is a word specifically used to premote self worth and unity amongst those who use it, it would be like christians refering to non believers as heretics. I think anyway, i can't remember the exact wording in the documentary, but i do remember several muslim academics condeming it and basically painting a picture of an insular community disregarding non-believers as lesser people.

The point is that languages evolve due to historical circumstances and they do not translate perfectly.

"You should never try and enforce your beliefs. However do not let others enforce theirs on you. It is not intolerant to ask to remain an individual." - i agree, but how do you accomodate people who want different things for the "community", for instance what if a group of people want piggybanks banned (i think that was an earlier point) because it offends them ?

Nobody ever has a right to have piggybanks banned, however if they boycott stores that produce them and these stores stop selling them as a result that's perfectly acceptable. Basically whenever you think the government is involved scream and run.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by horn

ok but that kind of majority rule can be rather oppressive at times !

What? It's the exact opposite of majority rule you lunatic.

the language point is fair enough, but in this case it is not simply a cross-cultural shock factor misunderstanding, it's not like they use the word bastard but actually mean friend. It literally means they value the person whom they label with it as "inferior"

Look evolution is happening right now. Right now the word is changing meaning.

[JonnyBGood]

If the majority boycott them and the minority do not that does not necessarily mean that the piggy bank makers will go out of business. It just means they'll have a smaller market. Considering the current nature of the global economy it'd still be fairly simple to purchase a piggy bank. Regardless the essential point is that people should learn to tolerate individual differences rather than permanently relying on the government to enforce acceptance.

[Paisley]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

If the majority boycott them and the minority do not that does not necessarily mean that the piggy bank makers will go out of business. It just means they'll have a smaller market. Considering the current nature of the global economy it'd still be fairly simple to purchase a piggy bank. Regardless the essential point is that people should learn to tolerate individual differences rather than permanently relying on the government to enforce acceptance.

Aye Britain is too PC, At what point do you draw the line?

[roadrunner_0]

Originally Posted by Tomkat

If I have to tell a kid off for calling another one a ****** in my class, I'm pretty sure he already is aware of different races and the potential difficulties between them

not neccissarily... i am a great believer in the power of words without the majority of people knowing why they have power...

that child may have used the term ****** - or any other racially derogatory term- simply as an insult, which will almost certainly be how they have heard it used. without knowing why it is an insult... To your average 10 year old, it is probably just a 'bad' word like any other

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by buddies

Aye Britain is too PC, At what point do you draw the line?

At the point where the state tells individuals what they can and cannot do even when it does directly impinge on the rights of other individuals.

[Paisley]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

At the point where the state tells individuals what they can and cannot do even when it does directly impinge on the rights of other individuals.

Nicely put.

[Yahwe]

To put this faux argument aside.

There are still piggy banks for sale for any who choose to buy them.

The bank in question (if you even bothered to remember that truth) was the National Westminster Bank (a part of the Bank of Scotland). Yes it stopped it's promotional offer to young bankers of the series of piggy banks. The company stopped it. The company stopped it because the company decided that it was in the 21st century now so it should drop an outdated and silly promotional campaign.

THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ISLAM.

That is what we call a commercial decision. Now if you have a child or a neice or a nephew (or as i do a goddaughter) You can still buy a piggy bank that looks like a pig.

NOW surprise surprise it's not that easy to find them. I should know. I trawl the floor of Ede and Ravenscroft and yet i find none. I go through every level of harrods and harvey nicks and all i get is a cocktail bar. Piggy banks aren't fashionable.

Their decline has bugger all to do with Islam.

[Paisley]

Originally Posted by Yahwe

That is what we call a commercial decision. Now if you have a child or a neice or a nephew (or as i do a goddaughter) You can still buy a piggy bank that looks like a pig.
NOW surprise surprise it's not that easy to find them. I should know. I trawl the floor of Ede and Ravenscroft and yet i find none. I go through every level of harrods and harvey nicks and all i get is a cocktail bar. Piggy banks aren't fashionable. Their decline has bugger all to do with Islam.

Aye you've got a point,It could be argued it might just be simple supply and demand. I have a big bottle of whiskey to keep my coppers in.
Reinforces the happiness Is at the bottom of a glass message

[Yahwe]

Originally Posted by buddies

Aye you've got a point,It could be argued it might just be simple supply and demand. I have a big bottle of whiskey to keep my coppers in.
Reinforces the happiness Is at the bottom of a glass message

goodness knows nat west had that 'method' (the piggy banks grew up with the amount of money you put in) back when i was small. we have to expect them to change it nowadays.

[Nusselt]

Originally Posted by horn

should we try to enforce our secular libertarian views ?

lol

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by horn

how about homosexuality, what if that is deemed as wrong and what if employers with this belief decide not to employ based around this belief

I'm down with it.

surely telling people to be tolerant is imposing your beliefs..
i.e. some believe there is a "right way", a definitive moral way for things to be (the bush administration :/), telling them to put up with others point of view/ways of life is no matter how you dress it up with negative freedom accessories basically saying they're wrong and that you're right.

No, the way I have described is amoral, in the classical sense. It is the absence of the enforcement of belief. Much like, despite what those daft undergraduate philosophy professors tell you, skepticism does not refute itself the idea is logically sound.

Have you ever read some John Stuart Mill of your own free will (with due credit to monty python)?

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

Basically whenever you think the government is involved scream and run.

Well yes, but it's not like the government is the only body capable of oppressing* people. Sure, they may hold a monopoly on the legitimate use of violence, but it's not like business's can't make people lives utterly shit.

* = In the widest possible sense of the word.

[roadrunner_0]

Originally Posted by Yahwe

To put this faux argument aside.

There are still piggy banks for sale for any who choose to buy them.

The bank in question (if you even bothered to remember that truth) was the National Westminster Bank (a part of the Bank of Scotland). Yes it stopped it's promotional offer to young bankers of the series of piggy banks. The company stopped it. The company stopped it because the company decided that it was in the 21st century now so it should drop an outdated and silly promotional campaign.

THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ISLAM.

That is what we call a commercial decision. Now if you have a child or a neice or a nephew (or as i do a goddaughter) You can still buy a piggy bank that looks like a pig.

NOW surprise surprise it's not that easy to find them. I should know. I trawl the floor of Ede and Ravenscroft and yet i find none. I go through every level of harrods and harvey nicks and all i get is a cocktail bar. Piggy banks aren't fashionable.

Their decline has bugger all to do with Islam.

i can't get you a piggy bank, but i can probably get hold of a nice limoges white pottery money box for you

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Well yes, but it's not like the government is the only body capable of oppressing* people. Sure, they may hold a monopoly on the legitimate use of violence, but it's not like business's can't make people lives utterly shit.

* = In the widest possible sense of the word.

Form some sort of pressure group and do some funky shit against the machine then.

[Dace]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

I hope horn finds stormfront sooner rather than later.

You don't find Stormfront ... Stormfront finds YOU!!!

[Dace]

Originally Posted by buddies

Goes to show you leave a group of mixed toddlers in a nursery and they will play with each other quite happly. When the same people meet in say high school they stay away from each other. Somewhere these kids have picked it up to avoid other races. My mate once said to me, doesn't matter if you are black,white,chinise,hindu, or even Scottish, arses will be arses.

Your mate a philosopher is he?

[Kurashima]

Originally Posted by Yahwe

oh i see, so it is there fault that they are being attacked is it?
their own fault that disgraceful lies and propaganda are said about the?
their own fault that criminals are destroying their property? physically attacking them and attempting to ruin their business.

some times your idiocy transcends even you.

Spoken like someone who hasnt seen an ethnic minority unless theyre in the dock or giving a witness statement.