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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:12   #51
Tietäjä
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashar
I notice how all Omen members keep trying to appeal to Insomnia/ND members to hit 1up rather than play second fiddle to 1up. It's very amusing to see that they consider it as ND/Insomnia wanting 1up to win rather than ND/Insomnia wanting Omen to not win.

The logic all such people are using is "Stop 1up winning! You have the ability, just not the balls". Maybe they ought to think of the potential logic behind saying to them "Congratulations, you wanted Omen to not win and had the balls to see to it, well played!"
Allright. On an official Omen perspective to this. Congratulations to 1up for the impressive work they've done playing both political and score schemes for their good through the round. I would also like to congratulate Insomnia (and whoever else was on it, ND perhaps) for reaching their goal (according to what Bashar says), in Omen not winning the round. It remains to be seen, if either of these alliances reaches their secondary goal, which is, the race for the 2nd rank on the alliance tables.

The fight for final rankings still leaves a bit to rumble with.

The alliances I see winning things at the moment (other than 1up) are Omen and Safety in Numbers. Omen, even if not proving to be the "second eXilition" as apparently touted by the "responsibilities" given to them in taking down the near legendary 1up, along with certain other alliances, have provided with an impressive debut and still live on despite some setbacks (compared to Hydra, or Insomnia, and the rest that have broken under more or less pressure in the past).

We've done our mistakes, but we're fairly new around and our active command staff isn't the most experienced on the pitch, and the fact that we've not crumbled under huge pressure speaks for us, even if my (lack of, in compared to some of the game history's most respected commanders) leadership skills always wouldn't.

SiN has prooven their ability to set up a solid alliance with a solid small core, and several planets in the top ranks. For an alliance of their membercount, they're performing very impressively at the moment. For this I would like to give SiN a truckload of respect.

.edited SiN abbreviation, excuses.
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Last edited by Tietäjä; 30 May 2006 at 19:20.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:16   #52
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tietäjä
Strength in Numbers.
Safety in Numbers.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:25   #53
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

I didn't say it was their goal Keizari, I pointed out how I find it amusing the way that all Omens instantly assume that everyone elses goal should be the same as theirs: preventing 1up from winning.

Were Insomnia and ND to try this, it would leave Omen with the best chance it could have of winning as 1ups targetting would have to include ND and Insomnia. This means less on Omen, more on those below it and a lot more on 1up. It's blindly obvious politics, the only thing I know of less subtle than Omen politics is falling masonry. By doing what Omen is suggesting (ND/Ins taking on 1up), they would be doing your dirty work for you, and realistically could only expect to trade 1up winning the round for Omen winning the round, yet do shitter themselves.

What would you do if you were them? Would you target the top alliance in order to finish worse off yourself and allow an alliance that has tried to take advantage of you all round to win? I don't see myself what incentive there is for them to do it, the only people who gain is Omen, who are being dumb even trying to suggest it as it's nursery school politics.

As for the strength of Omen, I have not said anything to contradict that. I have been impressed with Omen, especially with its attitude towards fighting 1up when it came, you stood and fought like men rather than whining left right and centre (ok, you have a few who are whining like little girls when big brother pulls barbies leg off on here, but they are very few) and took what we gave you and are still standing. Your member count has stayed up and you haven't collapsed or begged for a ceasefire or similar. You have fought with dignity and honour, no doubt about that, and haven't crumbled (unlike plenty before you). For all that you have my utmost respect, especially as a new alliance.

There is however one thing I really ought to point out, and that is that your politics sucked (and I mean REALLY sucked). Hopefully you'll have learnt that now though.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:30   #54
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tietäjä
Omen, even if not proving to be the "second eXilition" as apparently touted by the "responsibilities" given to them in taking down the near legendary 1up, along with certain other alliances, have provided with an impressive debut and still live on despite some setbacks
i just wanna make it clear that you got nothing in common with eXilition apart from some eXi members playing for you this round. i am kinda fed up with ppl calling Omen eXi on IRC, so just wanted to state that this is not the case once and for all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tietäjä
and the fact that we've not crumbled under huge pressure speaks for us
but yet you give up the fight for #1 10 days before the round ends?


edit: made the post readable
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:35   #55
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

I would never compare Omen to Exilition. Omen fight their own wars when they get them, they try politically to get similar alliances to help them, but they don't try and get every small bloody alliance in the game to flak for them.

Omen feels more like a gaming alliance rather than a barbaric machiavellian horde.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:36   #56
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashar
By doing what Omen is suggesting (ND/Ins taking on 1up), they would be doing your dirty work for you, and realistically could only expect to trade 1up winning the round for Omen winning the round, yet do shitter themselves.
I would prefer if this thread did not become a thread where political choices are evaluated, as there's a thread where this has been discussed. We never expected anyone to take on 1up without us, sufficient to say, we were very - perhaps too - careful stepping up with it, as we had a very bad experience of ND and Insomnia representatives promising us things then when we wheel and turn bringing the knife in.

I believe, Insomnia for example could have done "better" not hopping in with 1up, as this could have given them a chance to go for #1, while Omen and 1up would have been stuck with a probably little longer and more intensive war instead of just 250 hostile fleets on one side's screen. Them pledging their allegiance to 1up at the point when wars started only showed their interest in playing for rank two instead of any ambition and faith in themselves being capable of taking #1. I'm done with political rant now on this thread, though.


.edit. adding things

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almeida
i just wanna make it clear that you got nothing in common with eXilition apart from some eXi members playing for you this round. i am kinda fed up with ppl calling Omen eXi on IRC, so just wanted to state that this is not the case once and for all.
Yes, I am very sick of it too, as there isn't that many "old eXilition members" around in Omen, although a bunch of people eXilition is working on recruiting - who haven't been in their ranks before. I guess we agree here, then. We really have very little in common with eXilition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almeida
but yet you give up the fight for #1 10 days before the round ends?
Nowhere have I said so, or? To add an icing to the cake, Omen goal never was to "prevent 1up from winning". We entered the round to make a debut for Omen as an alliance, and to perform as well as possible for us. I did mention Insomnia and ND have done good work if their goal was to prevent Omen from winning - as if they keep on working for that goal, there's no realistic way to punch through it. Tides *could* change, though.
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Last edited by Tietäjä; 30 May 2006 at 19:43.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:40   #57
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bashar
I would never compare Omen to Exilition. Omen fight their own wars when they get them, they try politically to get similar alliances to help them, but they don't try and get every small bloody alliance in the game to flak for them.

Omen feels more like a gaming alliance rather than a barbaric machiavellian horde.
didn't say you did compare em. several ppl on IRC did.

u might understand that your view on eXi politics is a bit different than mine
especially as the round u are talking about 1up had their own little flak allies as well (my personal opinion ofc which i can't proove, as much as u can't proove your statement)

and maybe u didn't experience this but in Ins DC room we saw quite some small allies flaking for Omen this round as well.

so your entire post is a bit flawed
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Last edited by Almeida; 30 May 2006 at 19:53.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:43   #58
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tietäjä
I would also like to congratulate Insomnia (and whoever else was on it, ND perhaps) for reaching their goal (according to what Bashar says), in Omen not winning the round.
this sounded like it for me. apologies if i misunderstood. didn't wanna insult Omen, i just would like to see fighting until the end, from all allies (no matter who vs. who)

this round was very fun and entertaining for me; would like it to last until the end
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:44   #59
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

rock the microphone

ahhahhaa
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Round 17 - Rank 3 - Omen (Zik)
Round 18 - Rank 2 - eXilition (Zik)
Round 20 - Rank 7 - Destiny (Zik)
Round 24 - Rank 2 - Conspiracy (Xan)
Round 28 - Rank 4 - Ascendancy (Xan)
Round 66 - Rank 9 - Ultores (Etd)
Round 83 - Rank 10 - #METOO (Zik)
Round 85 - Rank 3 - QQ (Etd)
Round 89 - Rank 2 - VGN (Zik)
Round 91 - Rank 9 - VGN (Zik)
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:49   #60
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almeida
and maybe u didn't experience this but in Ins DC room we saw quite some small allies flaking for Omen this round as well.

so your entire post is a bit flawed

I don't see the point in the first part of your post, as it's utterly meaningless to me. I pointed out that I didn't even try claim Omen was eXilition remake merely because you quoted (picking up a text from it's context) me saying something that could distantly refer to it. What comes to eXilition politics and whatsoever is really beyond my interest.

When attacking Insomnia, we never coordinated with any other alliances; this is a solid fact, and if you choose not to believe it then there's little I can do. Once, there was an opportunity for it though, when a certain alliance made a surprising move and said they would help on it if needed.

Now, I could go rant about how many alliances struck galraids on Omen galaxies when Insomnia (and NewDawn) were attacking us, but I'm not going to be going on with it as we both know that'd be just far fetched - quite as your claims. If my post was flawed, yours most certainly was equally flawed.

Excuse me for pushing this thread towards a political what or not, I was baited to it. I'll try not to do it again.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:52   #61
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

aahhh, damn bad timing :P

the post u mean was an answer to Bashar; gimme a sec i'll edit
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:56   #62
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

I still think that Insomnia will take second, not that i want your too roid them or anything. but looking at there roid count, and seeing how active some of my friends are in that ally, i think theyll grasp it.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:57   #63
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almeida
and maybe u didn't experience this but in Ins DC room we saw quite some small allies flaking for Omen this round as well.
If it did happen (which I didn't notice on any large scale), it didn't happen nearly so bad as it does when exilition played last.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 19:58   #64
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almeida
this round was very fun and entertaining for me; would like it to last until the end
I'm so jealous
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Unread 30 May 2006, 20:01   #65
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

dear Bashar: U lack common sence in your posts tbh.

It was NOT one of Omen's goals to "prevent 1up from winning"
The sole goal of Omen was to win the round.

U are saying that it was not the sole goal of ND/Ins. ? THen they just might want to choose another game. Single player, perhaps...

U say "Omen tried to make everyone attack 1up, boohoo"... That was most logical, simplest, and obvious political move. I dont see ANYTHING wrong with such, as it also gives more hope to above mentioned ND/InS to get #1 spot if Omen indeed was heavely beat up by that confrontation. At least the chance for #1 spot would have been there, as opposed to now, its highly unlikely that 1up will actually loose this round.

Have you thought about what would u do in the situation Omen ended up being ? After whoping both, ND and InS and leading score and roid wise (with a considerable lead, i might add) over those 2, still being hostile to one another, and then 1up emerges with, obviously, very hostile plans towards Omen because of their VERY close standings. Now its a war on 3 fronts with very worthy opponents. There are 2 obvious moves for alliances rank 2-4.
1). U fight 1up for #1
2). U go, sit somewhere and watch some TV while everyone else stuggles, hoping for, pretty much, nothing.
If Omen chose the 1st option, we had to do what we had to do. At that point, it was obvious that after a long confrontation with ND and InS omen just COULDNT take on 1up by themselves. So we asked ohers what would they wanna do abot the rest of the round, and they chose to sit it out.

GL next round. Congrats 1up on well played round. I do, also, think that Omen deserves any and all props that they get. Eventho there is 1st place and then there is second place, we still put on a nice show of force and showed to everyone how should this game be played, if we were to take 1up out of the equasion.

Both NewDawn and Insomnia WISH they would have our mamberbase, our tools, and some of our command. (Afterall, it worked better then theirs)

And anout everyone saying: "oh, what, now Omen will give up and not try to catch up with 1up" i say, no. But, objectively speaking, its not an equal fight anymore. And its being less and less equal with every roid Omen looses to 1up.

In conclusion, imho, Omen was the only alliance played "right" this round (besides, obviously, 1up). Given higher possibility of rational desicions from Other top alliances, we would have done better. The philosophy "Lets not let Omen win" does not really work if your alliance does not win either......

Or am i just too stupid to understand "subtleties" of alliance tactics and either Insomnia or ND will come up with all that score they need to beat 1up in last few days ?!

/ramble
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Unread 30 May 2006, 20:02   #66
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashar
I'm so jealous
u exiled into my galaxy this round, u saying that hasn'T been entertaining for you? :crymeariver:
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Unread 30 May 2006, 20:18   #67
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
Have you thought about what would u do in the situation Omen ended up being ?
I'd have smacked 1ups planets out of tag as soon as I had a reasonable list of them and a reasonable lead at the front. I wouldn't have sat around whinging about it trying to get other people to hit them.

I'd have gone to other alliances and offered to lead the way in hostilities against 1up, and I'd have done it.

I wouldn't have tried AD politics (trying to make an alliances members fall in line with my own views in an attempt to influence their alliances politics). I also wouldn't have insulted every other alliances members intelligence by using such blatent propaganda attempts that a toddler could see through. I also wouldn't assume that other alliances would chose to trade current leader for myself at their own expense when they have nothing to game.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 20:48   #68
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashar
I'd have smacked 1ups planets out of tag as soon as I had a reasonable list of them and a reasonable lead at the front. I wouldn't have sat around whinging about it trying to get other people to hit them.

I'd have gone to other alliances and offered to lead the way in hostilities against 1up, and I'd have done it.

I wouldn't have tried AD politics (trying to make an alliances members fall in line with my own views in an attempt to influence their alliances politics). I also wouldn't have insulted every other alliances members intelligence by using such blatent propaganda attempts that a toddler could see through. I also wouldn't assume that other alliances would chose to trade current leader for myself at their own expense when they have nothing to game.

I am not saying everything Omen did was perfect, far from it

But what you are saying is wouldhavebeens... It does not really answer the problem at hand were trying to discuss. Now, currently, 1up is leading by a crapload, and there is very little that we can actually do. So the question is, what would u do NOW, not before, some undefined time ago when 1up's lead was but a speculation based on rumors (that just happened to be true). its NOW that we have to act, and reminissing about past differences in oppinions does not erally help the situation. Hence i lack to see anything usefull from your post.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 20:55   #69
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
Given higher possibility of rational desicions from Other top alliances
Actually, this round most alliances' rational choices blocked each other off and we saw an amusing form of the prisoner's dilemma leading to 1up emerging with the victory. It was difficult for ND and Insomnia to do much of anything from the get-go once omen napped angels.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 20:58   #70
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

I'd kill myself for getting myself get into such a shitty position.

I confess, I've been thinking about this since your first post and, after Omens politics this round, I can't see a way out for Omen that involves winning.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:01   #71
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Oh, and I have to say, I hadn't seen that quote that JBG just posted, but in response to that quote myself:

Rational for WHO? That's Omens major problem this round, and it's why they are now helpless. All round they've assumed that everyone else does or should have the same interests as them. It simply isn't the case, other alliances have their own interests to look after.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:04   #72
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Actually, this round most alliances' rational choices blocked each other off and we saw an amusing form of the prisoner's dilemma leading to 1up emerging with the victory. It was difficult for ND and Insomnia to do much of anything from the get-go once omen napped angels.
... we all have realize that sometimes its much needed to stop the current war and help eachother against a greater enemy (StarGate SG-1 style). Even if temporarily, the 4 alliances WOULD have brought down 1up (and probably still can, as 1up just will not be able to target all 4 alliances) U can view it as pro-Omen propaganda (which it is, i admit it, I am loyal to my alliance and i will do everything to better its situation), but if u realisticly weigh your chances to win the round, ND and Insomnia, and even angels, would have been better off with helping Omen trying to take down 1up. Any one of them would have their chances to win the round significantly increased in that scenario, as opposed to looking at 1up's lead increasing faster and faster over time.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:07   #73
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashar
Oh, and I have to say, I hadn't seen that quote that JBG just posted, but in response to that quote myself:

Rational for WHO? That's Omens major problem this round, and it's why they are now helpless. All round they've assumed that everyone else does or should have the same interests as them. It simply isn't the case, other alliances have their own interests to look after.

/me slaps himself on the forehead.

What is the overall point of that thread.
Given, youre not in Omen's position. Position of ND and Ins is not that much better then Omen's. The only position, currently, I would take over Omen's is that of 1up.

Bashy, U are either a looser by nature or just dense enough to realize that what did happen, already happened, time to deal with it. Ambition is the key to success...



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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:10   #74
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashar
I'd have smacked 1ups planets out of tag as soon as I had a reasonable list of them and a reasonable lead at the front. I wouldn't have sat around whinging about it trying to get other people to hit them.

I'd have gone to other alliances and offered to lead the way in hostilities against 1up, and I'd have done it.

I wouldn't have tried AD politics (trying to make an alliances members fall in line with my own views in an attempt to influence their alliances politics). I also wouldn't have insulted every other alliances members intelligence by using such blatent propaganda attempts that a toddler could see through. I also wouldn't assume that other alliances would chose to trade current leader for myself at their own expense when they have nothing to game.
did you missed out the nd/ins tagteam vs omen? they did a great job dragging focus away from your planets, was prolly part of the plan as they still got their tounges so far 1up ass they will have the taste for several rounds

so what whould you do diffrent bashar?
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:14   #75
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
/me slaps himself on the forehead.
There's a nice hard wall in the corner.

Quote:
What is the overall point of that thread.
Given, youre not in Omen's position. Position of ND and Ins is not that much better then Omen's. The only position, currently, I would take over Omen's is that of 1up.
I think you've misunderstood me quite a bit here. I was not trying to say "this is why Omen are where they are", I was trying to say "this is why Omen won't get any help from other alliances". That is also why I referred to why it's causing Omen specifically problems. I wasn't saying the others are in a better position than Omen, just simply excluding them due to the fact the same political trouble doesn't apply to them.

Quote:
Bashy, U are either a looser by nature or just dense enough to realize that what did happen, already happened, time to deal with it. Ambition is the key to success...
For someone who completely misread the post, calling me a loser wins the irony point.

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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:16   #76
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
... we all have realize that sometimes its much needed to stop the current war and help eachother against a greater enemy (StarGate SG-1 style). Even if temporarily, the 4 alliances WOULD have brought down 1up (and probably still can, as 1up just will not be able to target all 4 alliances) U can view it as pro-Omen propaganda (which it is, i admit it, I am loyal to my alliance and i will do everything to better its situation), but if u realisticly weigh your chances to win the round, ND and Insomnia, and even angels, would have been better off with helping Omen trying to take down 1up. Any one of them would have their chances to win the round significantly increased in that scenario, as opposed to looking at 1up's lead increasing faster and faster over time.
Yes but was winning the round the goal of those alliances? Also you have to bear in mind that from their perspective omen were looking for an edge and 1up have a propensity to target, or at least threaten to target, in order to best affect your rational choice strategy, ignoring their own. This shows some of the difference between self-interest and enlightened self-interest in terms of overall strategic decision-making.



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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:18   #77
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by robban1
did you missed out the nd/ins tagteam vs omen? they did a great job dragging focus away from your planets, was prolly part of the plan as they still got their tounges so far 1up ass they will have the taste for several rounds

so what whould you do diffrent bashar?
How about you read my post that answered your question before repeating the question.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:22   #78
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Yes but was winning the round the goal of those alliances?
And I think more appropriately, was siding with Omen the best way they saw to do that, or did they just see it as trading 1up for Omen, but with 1up hostile to them?
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:23   #79
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashar
How about you read my post that answered your question before repeating the question.
well all of the stuff you said was ofc tried and didnt work so my question is still valid.

edit dunno why i typed non there :/ kinda trashed the point with my reply hehe

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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:28   #80
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Yes but was winning the round the goal of those alliances? Also you have to bear in mind that from their perspective omen were looking for an edge and 1up have a propensity to target, or at least threaten to target, in order to best affect your rational choice strategy, ignoring their own. This shows some of the difference between self-interest and enlightened self-interest in terms of overall strategic decision-making.



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ok. IF winnign the round is not one of the goals alliance set infron of them, then my entire slue of posting was redundant. I just cannot comprehend, how is it possible, that winning the round is not set as one (and main one at that) of the goals of ANY given alliance. That just does not fit in my head.

If that is indeed, the case, then I appologize for my rude language, go on with your merry day.

I play to win, I do everything to win. I guess that my rl training. Being a buisnessman in New York City (that i just happen to be), you have to aim to win. That is my life's philosophy. Thats what i aim for. As i said before, there is #1 place, and then there is #2 place. In life, its not so easy, usually, but we are playing pretty simple game, based on some pretty simple rules and including some pretty simple politics with pretty simple political decisoins involved. its not quite clear to me why play this game at all, if not for the reason to win. If not personally (coz i just dont have enough time to devote to it) then your galaxy, and/or your alliance.

Do some people really really play just to be a pain in someone else's ass ?!
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:30   #81
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by robban1
well non of the stuff you said was ofc tried and didnt work so my question is still valid.
Quote:
so what whould you do diffrent bashar?
OK, I'll help you out here.

"What would you do different" means "how would you change what happens"

"non(e) ot the stuff you said was ofc tried" means "none of the things you said have happened"

"my question is still valid" means you don't understand your own question and should go and hide in a corner somewhere.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:32   #82
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Mighteh - goals can be reassessed.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:36   #83
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

but after that reassessment, not always reached.

Actions have to be OKed on the fly, Spontaneous actions sometimes are not only beneficial, but nessecary.

Besides, reassessed to WHAT exactly ?
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Unread 30 May 2006, 21:51   #84
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

xVx and SIN have done SUPERBLY this round.
Avg almost the same as Angels or bigger
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Unread 30 May 2006, 22:14   #85
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
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Do some people really really play just to be a pain in someone else's ass ?!
Yes. A thousand times yes. Plus people play to have fun or the community aspect or just to be together with their friends. Have you thought that maybe after six weeks ND and insomnia couldn't really be bothered with an exhausting war to give themselves a probably less than 10% chance of winning the round?
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Unread 30 May 2006, 22:39   #86
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by robban1
well all of the stuff you said was ofc tried and didnt work so my question is still valid.
nobody tried to smack down 1ups out of tag members whilst they were out of tag, and Omen definitely didn't try to lead the way in attacks on 1up.

If (and I SINCERELY doubt this) I am wrong on these points, then the exact reason Omen are where they are, and will not be able to get a win this round is that they are militarily equivalent to Laurel and Hardy.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 22:45   #87
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Mighteh, while a lot of what you are saying might be true, the main reason Omen are in the position they are in now is because they failed to take the initiative in hitting 1up. If when you asked ND/Ins to hit 1up with you you had been prepared to take the lead in the hostilities then the situation now may have been very different.

The fact is you didn't, you wanted ND (dunno what you told Ins) to attack first and take the brunt of the retals on the first day. Along with the fact that ND would then have had days of major hostilities from 1up (as has been confirmed by Sid) and you can see that our chances of winning by agreeing to your proposal were probably overestimated by Jonny.

If you had been willing to take the offensive then ND/Ins would have hit 1up as it genuinely would have given them a decent chance of winning the round. What you wanted us to do did not.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 22:48   #88
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Paddy, this has been explained to them many a time in many a thread. Give it 5 minutes and you'll get the generic "ND/Ins broke the deal" coupled with "now you have no chance of winning because you didn't do what we wanted to do that would incidentally have won us the round" and "so you're now 1ups puppets instead of ours and we think you're stupid for not being our puppets!!11234" responses.

It's all getting tedious and repetitive.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 22:54   #89
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
Both NewDawn and Insomnia WISH they would have our mamberbase, our tools, and some of our command. (Afterall, it worked better then theirs)
oh please, dont flatter yourself

every single one of theplayers in my alliance have given 100% to the game and to insomnia. i wouldnt trade them for anybody, let alone anybody in omen, and i do hope to hang onto the majority of them for next round. Insomnia command is one of the most tight knit command ive seen and i regard every single one in that HC room as a friend, so please dont try and disrespect us with your bullshit please
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Unread 30 May 2006, 23:02   #90
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by robban1
did you missed out the nd/ins tagteam vs omen? they did a great job dragging focus away from your planets, was prolly part of the plan as they still got their tounges so far 1up ass they will have the taste for several rounds

so what whould you do diffrent bashar?
heres some straws...why dont u clutch at them?
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Unread 30 May 2006, 23:11   #91
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
Both NewDawn and Insomnia WISH they would have our mamberbase, our tools, and some of our command. (Afterall, it worked better then theirs)
I can't speak for NewDawn but I have to say i'm vry pleased with InSomnia this round, the memberbase / tools / command has impressed me vry much, you have no idea what you're talking about so plz stfu :-).

But since you're making silly comments i'm not going to hold back either:
Omen WISH they had our sexyness, our nice command, drunk/stoned memberbase, an equal amount of fun like we've had. They WISH they had a command that was better at politics, so they didn't have to recieve incoming from all over the universe.

InSomnia is happy to be where it is right now, and as it appears Omen is not, caus if you were you would do less whining.

And before you try and press that reply button, try to come up with somethign different than "ND/Ins broke the deal" coupled with "now you have no chance of winning because you didn't do what we wanted to do that would incidentally have won us the round" and "so you're now 1ups puppets instead of ours and we think you're stupid for not being our puppets!!11234" style of reply.

PS: TY for all the roids you've given me this round, i apreciate it
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Unread 30 May 2006, 23:30   #92
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
Mighteh, while a lot of what you are saying might be true, the main reason Omen are in the position they are in now is because they failed to take the initiative in hitting 1up. If when you asked ND/Ins to hit 1up with you you had been prepared to take the lead in the hostilities then the situation now may have been very different.

If you were arsed to actually do your background work and have a real clue what is - and was going on, you'd know better. First, the time *we* approached people on this, we got hit by ND/Insomnia. The second time, when the "famous" meeting was held, *we were approached* - and they wanted us to take the lead. And we know what happened the first time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Veedeejem!
InSomnia is happy to be where it is right now, and as it appears Omen is not, caus if you were you would do less whining.
We're happy with our performance this round, and so far we have outperformed Insomnia. And, unlike Insomnia some earlier rounds, we haven't broken apart even if we've taken a lot of heat. I'm proud to see us 2nd on the tables with how the round has been.

On the other hand, I've had Insomnia members tell me they are unhappy with the current situation and would like their alliance to change their policies.
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Unread 30 May 2006, 23:43   #93
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tietäjä
And, unlike Insomnia some earlier rounds, we haven't broken apart even if we've taken a lot of heat. I'm proud to see us 2nd on the tables with how the round has been.
Oh plz, that was r15, get over it. So InS broke apart then, what difference does that make on this round? That's right you've guessed it, absolutly nothing.
And the round isn't over yet, both InSomnia & NewDawn still have a shot at #2 rank, you might think the round is over but it isn't...
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Unread 30 May 2006, 23:49   #94
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Its pretty fly...
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Unread 31 May 2006, 00:46   #95
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tietäjä
If you were arsed to actually do your background work and have a real clue what is - and was going on, you'd know better. First, the time *we* approached people on this, we got hit by ND/Insomnia. The second time, when the "famous" meeting was held, *we were approached* - and they wanted us to take the lead. And we know what happened the first time.
Ok, the first time you approached you talked to us on a Saturday night, asking for help from Monday onward. Not surprisingly we already had raids sorted for that Saturday night and they happened to be on you. You just couldn't see past the fact that we hit you and let that one night get in the way of any chance you had at the number one spot.

I will admit that I don't actually know what happened at the meeting. What I do know is that at one stage you would only hit 1up if we launched 6 ticks before you (I don't know if this corresponded with the meeting or not).
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Unread 31 May 2006, 01:28   #96
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
Mighteh, while a lot of what you are saying might be true, the main reason Omen are in the position they are in now is because they failed to take the initiative in hitting 1up. If when you asked ND/Ins to hit 1up with you you had been prepared to take the lead in the hostilities then the situation now may have been very different.
OK. Given, Guilty... I never said otherwise (i never, pretty much mentioned it before, but i do accept that Omen lacked initiative to attack 1up out of tag. U gotta realize, that by then Omen was fighing a long 2 sided war for a while, and out total power needed to be rebuilt, we could have used a bit more time tbh )

So now what. And i only said if you can be Omen's puppets, and then turn on us, your masters, you have slightly higher chance of winning. SO. Imo, its would be a right thing to do. If you dont think so, i dont care anymore, right now numbers speak for themselves. If you dont like your chances higher, I rest my case. I base my debates on the fact that people have cold logic, ambition and common sence. For me, numbers work. Fluffyness of people around me, dont. If i, personally, dont benefit from an action (IE dont increase my chances of winning) I dont take it. Unless friendship is on the line, if i dont know you from a hole in the wall, i care about you even less then that above mentioned hole in the wall.
(/me tries to look as nice as possible)

And Bashar: it does get repetetive. But considering I am saying "apples" here and getting responce "oranges" it hasnt really worked out into a full blown conversation. people need to understand eachother (and at that have difference of oppinions) to have a full blown debate... Right now it looks just like alot of people have alot to say


to those InS, about member base:

IN NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM did i try to dis your own memberbase, tools or highcommand. I just like mine better And if you dont think we all have a blast here, treat eachother like old friends, etc etc etc, you are wrong

and there is plenty drinking and smoking going on. Ask Keiz how many times to i jump on IRC completly shitfaced and stoned. U think i am not making much sence now ? have u actually seen what i type drunk and/or stoned ?

I only mentioned that aspect because in no other alliance i have ever heard of, have i seen such a level of devotion from members. Ofc, i am just a dumb newbie, and i havent seen much. But I made my statements from what i did see and hear. =)

besides, Omen's tactics was superior to that of your own (again, untill 1up was actually on the political map) and, hence, better memberbase *g*

This statement reflects my, and only my oppinions. Those who read it are in full power to either agree or disagree with it, Not take it seriously, or return their newly purchased sence of humor as defective and demand refund.
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Unread 31 May 2006, 02:03   #97
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy
Ok, the first time you approached you talked to us on a Saturday night, asking for help from Monday onward. Not surprisingly we already had raids sorted for that Saturday night and they happened to be on you. You just couldn't see past the fact that we hit you and let that one night get in the way of any chance you had at the number one spot.

I will admit that I don't actually know what happened at the meeting. What I do know is that at one stage you would only hit 1up if we launched 6 ticks before you (I don't know if this corresponded with the meeting or not).
and it just happen to be a joint attack with ins with no piggies oh how sweet of you to tell all facts m8,

are we done now with all the bs on 6h crap and the rest you ppl like to drag up?
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Unread 31 May 2006, 02:42   #98
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
So now what. And i only said if you can be Omen's puppets, and then turn on us, your masters, you have slightly higher chance of winning. SO. Imo, its would be a right thing to do. If you dont think so, i dont care anymore, right now numbers speak for themselves.
I think what you miss is the impact Omen being napped to Angels had on things. Were it not for that, and IF nd/insomnia rated both Omen and 1up as their main threats then they could have approached Angels - and agreed that the three of them would take out first one of Omen/1up then the other. Angels' apparent lack of ambition largely stymied any innovative approaches from ND/Insomnia - and left them in the unenviable situation of pretty much being forced to either act in a way which would help Omen win, or act in a way which would help 1up win.

It COULD have been a lot different if early in the round they'd hit Omen for longer - then insisted as part of any ceasefire that Omen joined in attacking 1up as part of the deal. By backing off Omen too soon they left themselves in an untenable situation.

I still think they were correct to hit Omen first - in part because you had (or it would be assumed you had) the support of Angels, so had more friendly firepower than 1up all other things being equal.

To get back to the actual topic of this thread: I don't think 2nd place has been decided yet. I'd personally rate the chances as around 60% Omen, 20% ND, 20% Insomnia: Omen's big roid growth today suggests them possibly have more resilience/activity than the other two. If the topic refers to something other than who finishes #2 then I'd need to know precisely what before I could give any meaningful view.
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Unread 31 May 2006, 04:20   #99
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Id put money on Omen finishing 3rd or 4th this round, theyve got nothing in there locker.
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Unread 31 May 2006, 07:36   #100
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Re: Winners of R17 (1up not included)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh

to those InS, about member base:

IN NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM did i try to dis your own memberbase, tools or highcommand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
Both NewDawn and Insomnia WISH they would have our mamberbase, our tools, and some of our command. (Afterall, it worked better then theirs)
and what part of that is not disrespectfull??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
besides, Omen's tactics was superior to that of your own (again, untill 1up was actually on the political map) and, hence, better memberbase *g*
if the tactic was to shoot yourself in the foot and burn the bridges with 2 of the top 5 alliances that you need to help you win the round by killing 1up for you, then yes....you totally outplayed us there #

and a memberbase doesnt define your tactical effectiveness your command does, as they are the one who decide what tactics are used and if they mess up its on their heads imho. so on a scale of 1 - 10 for tactical 1337ness this round id give Omen a 2.5...could do better, see me after class
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