Planetarion Forums

12 Jul 2005, 16:42

I started analysing the races for myself last night and I had to write some of it down on paper to keep track of my mini-conclusions... by the time I had gotten to the end I had developed a bit of a system and I decided to copy it into Excel and try to share it with the rest of the community. Anyway, it has recieved good comments and feedback so I thought I should deposit it here too.

Race Analysis

Thanks to FlyingMonkey for helping me get it on the web from the Excel file

Melesse · 12 Jul 2005, 23:33

I like it, and I like the methodology.

However, I might have a suggestion or two. One, it might be worth putting on there that lower ratings are better, just so that people who are glancing at it can get that.

Second, it does not take into account commonality. I mean, for example, Zik and Xan frigates are poor against just about everyone, but Viper is one of your best defensive ships. It's just hard to predict that until the round gets going and fleets start flying. Of course, this is a the point where a race analysis would have be get psychic to tell.,...lol

Still, excellent in my opinion. It gets down to what matters.

Melesse

Appocomaster · 13 Jul 2005, 00:15

Xan Fr generally teams up well with De and gets the job done better then.

kamikaze69 · 13 Jul 2005, 00:26

I have just studied it, and I must admit I like the work that you have done with that report!!!

I would like to see a summary on what units people should steal to have a good defense. But I guess we can figure that out on our own from the report.

Jester · 13 Jul 2005, 00:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Appocomaster

Xan Fr generally teams up well with De and gets the job done better then.

So they're generally the best attacker and best defender?

kamikaze69 · 13 Jul 2005, 00:38

I would hardly call them best attacker and best defender, take a look at caths??? if you steal Corvettes left right and centre, then the only thing that a Cath will be weak against is ANOTHER cath CR fleet (so just build lotsa scarabs)!!!

Appocomaster · 13 Jul 2005, 00:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester

So they're generally the best attacker and best defender?

I'm just saying Xan fr is more viable than some people seem to think.
Xan are a bit too strong though, I might modify some efficiencies downwards.

kamikaze69 · 13 Jul 2005, 01:01

there was one thing that he missed out in his report, albeit not too important.

Xan FR attacking a Zik get hit by clippers too (noticed that while comparing Zik FR and Xan FR results) they would however be a (red) color so it's only 1 point, but that does make the cath a clear winner when it comes to attacking.

13 Jul 2005, 01:28

Ahhh, well spotted Kamikaze

I will update that, but it doesnt have alot of effect as you say... even less because a zik defending would likely move his clippers away so his marauders could steal as much as possible and so he doesnt lose the clippers.

Melesse · 13 Jul 2005, 01:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by kamikaze69

I would hardly call them best attacker and best defender, take a look at caths??? if you steal Corvettes left right and centre, then the only thing that a Cath will be weak against is ANOTHER cath CR fleet (so just build lotsa scarabs)!!!

Yea, but I also called Cath the offensive powerhouse last round as well, except for their dreadful lack of ability to hold onto roids. It's going to be frustrating, watching the roids I got the night before disappear the next day. XP whoring and running my fleet, here I come! lol

Also, I noticed a note about the ratings, dunno if I missed it before or what, but It's nice to see.

Melesse

13 Jul 2005, 01:44

There are a couple things it doesnt address, like cost effectiveness, race populus percentages, combination defence (particularly EMP)... but without getting getting complex I think its good a general idea of whats going on with attack/defence

All the information should be on that page btw, it does say a few things in the "Notes" that are worth reading.

Melesse · 13 Jul 2005, 02:49

I didn't mean to malign it, it's extremely useful.

I was just trying to be helpful

Mel

13 Jul 2005, 04:06

well thank you

It's not perfect though!

I'm glad it's useful for others, thats why I publicised it - hoping it would be.

Supersander · 13 Jul 2005, 09:22

Yup.. studied it and it's pretty good. GJ Junior

Kargool · 13 Jul 2005, 09:59

I would love to hear your reasoning behind why the Beetle is poor against FI

13 Jul 2005, 12:42

well, the EMP ships (remember that I didnt factor in cost efficiencies here) are just EMP, and so long as the defence isnt a combination of steal/norm and EMP then the attacker would have no problem with just over-running it.

I agree, I'm not 100% satisfied with that either

MAdnRisKy · 13 Jul 2005, 12:52

it's ok but my guess is you didn't do too much beta. a lot of these stats require races to attack with two classes of ships to increase effectiveness.

terran bs plus cr for instance hits every anti bs ship and all fast travelling anti cr ships (so it's less effective if attacking a terran or a zik, but they can't send defence against you which is the real biggie).

and unless the xan target is predominantly an fr de kinda guy, you walk over him

I know a lot of people have heralded xan as completely awesome, but you might find the truth is lsightly different.

same again goes for adding in spiders with the corvettes only lancers prove to be a worry then which again are not fast enough for alliance defence.
same again for adding Guards to the cr fleet

xan it's obvious that they'd double up the two classes.

and a zik cr bs combo will hit anything that would target it, albeit stealing which has it's pros and cons.

so it might be nice to try doing that tool again with that in mind.

Grog · 18 Jul 2005, 10:45

cool

Semi-useful

The thing that bothers me is when I have it minmized on my taskbar it just shows up as "Ship Anal..." & I keep wondering WTF that is.

Supersander · 18 Jul 2005, 11:05

It's a reflection of a xan attacking a ter

Rocko · 18 Jul 2005, 12:03

need to change that now,.. to corospond to the "change" in stats.,

Clogg · 18 Jul 2005, 13:05

Nice analysis, but in my opinion you missed a big thing. Virtually every race will attack with multiple ship classes this round. I also expect too see a lot of teaming up,for example as mentioned before cath + ter BS CR fleet will target every ship that might hurt tehm. So I find it a bit dissapointing that you haven't took that into the equation.

However I would be extremely pleased if your members will solely use this guide for their attacks ( other alliances aswell) will make it a lot easier for my MO's

Cannon_Fodder · 18 Jul 2005, 15:23

What do the asterixes represent?

Supersander · 18 Jul 2005, 15:39

Quote:

Starred = InterGalactic +1 (This ship travels fast enough around the universe to be possibly used as defence at other players' planets and is therefore an added threat to the attack fleet)

18 Jul 2005, 16:47

At some point, probably not until next round, I will do another one that accounts for cost effectiveness and combos

Not this time though, this one is just rough.

maddog · 21 Jul 2005, 05:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Appocomaster

I'm just saying Xan fr is more viable than some people seem to think.
Xan are a bit too strong though, I might modify some efficiencies downwards.

Noooo!!! You already punished our poor Peacekeeper enough! Leave our race alone, we don't deserve this!

Ultimate Newbie · 21 Jul 2005, 08:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by maddog

Noooo!!! You already punished our poor Peacekeeper enough! Leave our race alone, we don't deserve this!

The Peacekeeper was upgunned right at the last moment, actually.