Planetarion Forums

Ninja_spammer · 9 Sep 2004, 23:07

Probably been asked before but I was wondering, if it is racist to call a 'person of african type' descent 'black' then are the MOBO awards racist in and of themselves??

tired and bored.

Snurx · 9 Sep 2004, 23:09

It's not really racist, it's a description. However, the word is often used in racist context, and thus, it should be used with care, to avoid misunderstandings.

LHC · 9 Sep 2004, 23:09

No, no.

JonnyBGood · 9 Sep 2004, 23:31

There's nothing intrinsically "wrong" with racism, it's just that a lot of people carry it to fairly stupid extremes.

Kurashima · 9 Sep 2004, 23:34

and if you had a "Music of White Origin" awards youd be considered racist and barracked by everyone.

Two sides to every argument ....

Snurx · 9 Sep 2004, 23:35

2 entries found for racism.
rac·ism P Pronunciation Key (rszm)
n.
The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Is there nothing wrong with that?

JonnyBGood · 9 Sep 2004, 23:42

Quote:

The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability

I don't think this has been proved or disproved to any huge extent so as it is a "belief" I don't see anything wrong with it per se. If you're going to allow people to worship ****ing trees this seems to also fall under the "freedom of belief" idea.

Quote:

and that a particular race is superior to others.

This clearly follows then (although superior is a very poor word as it fails to specify in what areas "superiority" counts).

Quote:

Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

I'm opposed to this if it's written into law, however I support people's freedom to choose who to associate with or emply or engage in hot gay sex with or whatever floats your boat.

Superpig #1 · 9 Sep 2004, 23:53

Im against rascism strongly but I use the word black to describe coloured people. It doesnt sound as posh. I use it in un-offensive contexts though so thats good in my opinion.

Deepflow · 10 Sep 2004, 00:00

black is the word for it...

so...

no

Kurashima · 10 Sep 2004, 00:12

Racism used to be called "Patriotism" and then it became "Xenophobia" and so on until the current state of play.

Political Correctness is the bane of my existence.

Dante Hicks · 10 Sep 2004, 07:12

What? I've never met a person who considers the term "black" racist.

In fact, I've never met a black person who didn't refer to themselves as black either.

And as I've said n times before, nothing is stopping you from setting up a Music of White Origin awards if you wish. Imagining some sort of political correctness task force who are opressing you somehow is fairly ridiculous.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

I'm opposed to this if it's written into law, however I support people's freedom to choose who to associate with or emply or engage in hot gay sex with or whatever floats your boat.

Supporting someone's right to do something is different from the supporting the notion itself.

It's perfectly valid to say "taking heroin is bad", "killing yourself while you're healthy isn't so cool", "listening to techno is shit" or "writing books calling for the death of the jews is bad" while still supporting people's freedom to carry out such activities, for instance.

I'd say racism is bad as a general rule. However, it's fairly obvious that some traits are racial/genetic in origin (e.g. skin colour, hair-type) so examining racial differences more generally isn't racism. There could be psychological or neurological differences (e.g. Chinese people could be better "innately" at long-division or somesuch) but there isn't that much strong evidence for this.

Besides, people seem to be overly concerned about such matters. I'm not sure why it would matter if Chinese people were generally better at x or y activity since we can only usefully compare individuals, not populations.

IncubusGod · 10 Sep 2004, 08:44

I've had this conversation with a m8. He refers to himself as black. I would call him black, he doesn't have a problem with this. He says he's never met anyone else who has a problem with this.
The reason it came up was another guy in the group was trying to be P.C. and kept refering to 'junior' as "coloured" which to be honest, pissed Junior off more than anything.

He told the guy to call him black, "Im black, look at me, its ok, it's who I am, your white, thats ok too, thats you. I'm not coloured, I'm no ****ing chameleon".

Im paraphrasing there, there was alot more cursing in a Ghanian accent.

And yeah, if you want to set up a Music Of White Origin, then there's nothing stopping you. Why not celebrate white culture just as selectivly? Only the die-hard P.C'ers and extreemists on the anti-racist sides will decry you. Just about as many as the amounts of racists who decry the Mobos.

roadrunner_0 · 10 Sep 2004, 09:27

you would get ****ing mobbed if you tried to set up a MOWO awards, it wouldnt work

positive discrimination and all of the related bullshit sucks

madi · 10 Sep 2004, 09:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

And as I've said n times before, nothing is stopping you from setting up a Music of White Origin awards if you wish. Imagining some sort of political correctness task force who are opressing you somehow is fairly ridiculous.
Supporting someone's right to do something is different from the supporting the notion itself.

anyone remember the backlash that girl got for setting up a social group for white children at her school when the social group for black children was quite acceptable?

it makes me mad bloody political correctness positive descrimination crap

the UK police force are currently talking about fast tracking applications and lowering entrance requirements for anyone who doesnt have white skin in order to make the force racially reflective of the population
what the **** is wrong with only employing the best people for the job?

Stew · 10 Sep 2004, 11:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by IncubusGod

The reason it came up was another guy in the group was trying to be P.C. and kept refering to 'junior' as "coloured" which to be honest, pissed Junior off more than anything.

"Coloured" used to be the 'correct' term to use I think but quite a while ago it was considered racist and "black" became the 'correct' word to use.

NEWSBOT3 · 10 Sep 2004, 11:10

so can i call them wogs ?

Stew · 10 Sep 2004, 11:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEWSBOT3

so can i call them wogs ?

You can call 'them' whatever you like but be ready to face the consequences.

Tomkat · 10 Sep 2004, 12:19

I used to have a golliwog. He fell apart though when I was 10 or so. Cheap sweat-shop products.

LHC · 10 Sep 2004, 14:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by madi

the UK police force are currently talking about fast tracking applications and lowering entrance requirements for anyone who doesnt have white skin in order to make the force racially reflective of the population
what the **** is wrong with only employing the best people for the job?

Often a black person will make a good policeman, as black people commit crimes all the time, and they "know the enemy" or something.

CrashTester · 10 Sep 2004, 15:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kurashima

and if you had a "Music of White Origin" awards youd be considered racist and barracked by everyone.

Two sides to every argument ....

Yeah....And a MOWO awards sounds shite!

Boogster · 10 Sep 2004, 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomkat

I used to have a golliwog.

Same.

Deepflow · 10 Sep 2004, 15:51

what kind of music would we HAVE in MOWO though?

vampire_lestat · 10 Sep 2004, 16:01

hardcore racist country western people?

LHC · 10 Sep 2004, 16:02

Classical.

Tomkat · 10 Sep 2004, 16:06

Non-shit music?

vampire_lestat · 10 Sep 2004, 16:08

we have white only music awards, remember alternative music award things.

Stew · 10 Sep 2004, 16:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomkat

Non-shit music

Superpig #1 · 10 Sep 2004, 16:47

Eminem and the streets

Dante Hicks · 10 Sep 2004, 19:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

you would get ****ing mobbed if you tried to set up a MOWO awards, it wouldnt work

Would you really? I don't think you would. What do you mean by "****ing mobbed". Do you think you would be physically beaten?

Quote:

Originally Posted by madi

anyone remember the backlash that girl got for setting up a social group for white children at her school when the social group for black children was quite acceptable?

Again, what do we mean by backlash? Yes, you are right, if someone set up a MOWO awards they would be criticised. Liberal writers in the Guardian might write pithy editorials about you. The Equal Opportunity Commission might even raise questions.

BUT SO WHAT? Jesus Christ, you guys are ****ing faggots. Oh noes, we're being attacked by the political correctness mafia. Grow a pair of balls. Unless force is used, you don't really have anything to worry about.

Setting up most things attracts criticism. Events like the Notting Hill Carnival attract their own critiques. Hell, people criticise the MOBOs. But the organisers don't give a shit what you think.

As for what could be present at a MOWO, I suppose you could have Country, Classical, Folk, Rock, Punk & Metal sections. I'd probably pay attention to it.

1-X · 10 Sep 2004, 20:05

I think the MOBO's are just badly named. Idiots mistakenly think the awards are for black artists, when really it's just musical genres that originated in black communities.

I may criticise gangsta rap and rnb songs that all sound alike but I've got no problem with the blues, jazz, even ragtime :eek: (though I know little about any of them)

Snurx · 11 Sep 2004, 02:19

Dante, punk is not really white music, the scene that's popular is just dominated by white listeners, but then again, so is rap...

Embroglio · 11 Sep 2004, 02:22

isn't punk pretty much the only music we didn't steal from black people?

Dante Hicks · 11 Sep 2004, 07:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snurx

Dante, punk is not really white music, the scene that's popular is just dominated by white listeners, but then again, so is rap...

Were the originators of punk mainly white?

I don't think "white music" is a meaningful term here, we're talking about the origins. The majority of people who listen to Jazz are probably white (especially these days) but it has it's roots in black culture, ergo it's considered music of black origin.

Nodrog · 11 Sep 2004, 08:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

BUT SO WHAT? Jesus Christ, you guys are ****ing faggots. Oh noes, we're being attacked by the political correctness mafia. Grow a pair of balls. Unless force is used, you don't really have anything to worry about.
.

But force is being used