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View Poll Results: Should alliances be individual base or galaxy base and state your reasons below?
Individual based 36 78.26%
Galaxy based 10 21.74%
Voters: 46. You may not vote on this poll

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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 07:44   #1
Troglodyte
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Lightbulb Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Please make this into a poll:

Question: Should alliances be individual base or galaxy base and state your reasons?

Option A: Individual Based
Option B: Galaxy based (i.e the individuals of the gal all belong to the same alliance)


ps.put together a couple of pro's and cons for your suggestion, no matter what that suggestion is.

edit: the following scenario to highlight the options:
SCENARIO – Individual based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance XXX rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5
Player 3) 01:01:03 Alliance ZZZ rank 500

SCENARIO – Galaxy based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance 1UP rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5
Player 3) 01:01:03 Alliance 1UP rank 500


In which scenario do you think new comers would most probably stay active.
In which gal would there be a greater sense of community

Last edited by Troglodyte; 4 Jan 2005 at 13:37.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 08:09   #2
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Of course I would pick the controversial one, what else would you expect.

Galaxy Based:

PRO’s
a) I feel that this will aid NooBs in becoming better players, sort of like a mentorship program. It’s in the best interests of the more experienced players to aid the noobs. This will result in the new players having a more favourable experience and perhaps buying into the game.

b) Build a stronger community in the galaxy. All for one and for all and all of that. Less in-activity.

c) Probably result in a more even universe. I.e. the big planets can’t just stick together; they must help and aid the smaller planets in the gal if they are to succeed.


CON’s
a) Probably result in more exiles.

b) Big Alliances will be unhappy

c) Bashing of the entire gal (noah02 comments)

d) could cause unhappiness if there are certain individuals who want to belong to one alliance and others to an alternate alliance. The vote must be with the GC. I can see this causing quite a stir. But when you vote for the GC you are basically voting for that alliance. Mutiny could occur but to me that sounds rather interesting

Last edited by Troglodyte; 4 Jan 2005 at 08:24.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 08:36   #3
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

What makes you think that if planets in a galxy are forced into an alliance by their gc, that they wont just work to undermine that galaxy , and work with their currently established friends instead?
There is no ( imo ) reason to change the current system, or any method which can enforce the changes effectively.

Also, you CAN make your point you know without being snide and insulting all the time, you might get better responses from people that way
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 08:43   #4
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPedantic
What makes you think that if planets in a galxy are forced into an alliance by their gc, that they wont just work to undermine that galaxy , and work with their currently established friends instead?
Nothing ..nothing at all. however if they do figure out the mutiny, they would most probably just exile your ass.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPedantic
Also, you CAN make your point you know without being snide and insulting all the time, you might get better responses from people that way
If it makes you feel better. Plus, you never get good responses, no matter what you try. oops there im doing it again ...my bad :-)
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 08:48   #5
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

having exile as the only 'solution' is still not good enough to be perfectly frank.
Just because you exile someone, it doesnt mean you get someone just as good in return - infact you may just get a completely inactive account, which does nothing to help the galaxy out and really just weakens it totally.
What happens when you get a split galaxy, half votes for one person, and the other half votes for someone else.
does that galaxy remain allianceless? do the opposing sides arrange attacks on the other side hoping to get one of them to quit or bully them to vote the other way?
It would only tear galaxies apart and ruin rounds for several if this was the case.

Its an overly idealistic attempt to change the alliance situation where there isnt really going to much much change realistically and where no change is warranted.
People *like* it this way and no-one can force them to do something otherwise if they dont want to do it.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 08:55   #6
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Good points. I don’t want to force people to do anything. You either like the idea or you don’t. I personally think change is inevitable; my primary goal for this post is to help newbie’s get IN to the game and stay IN ( I think that is a worthy goal)

I take it your option is Individual Alliance, duly noted.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 08:58   #7
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Indeed it is
the best thing for new players imo really would be to give more experianced people a reason to train them up, to help them out. Maybe something like resource rewards, determined on a scale by which the new person finds them helpful?
Of course this is highly likely to get abused by unscrupulous people at some point - anything to get an edge ( sigh )
theres no easy way to do it, the best ways are at best abusable and at worst unworkable
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 09:19   #8
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Most people say that the strength of PA lies in the community i.e alliances.
What I’m getting at is that perhaps this is the key for growing the PA customer base, by using it’s strengths.

A new comer who has had an enjoyable experience is far more likely to want to come back and play more. And everyone knows that the success to pa is being in a good Alliance. This suggestion (well the gal alliance), however rough it may be, could potentially place newcomers into a good structure, which in return will achieve the overall objective.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 09:24   #9
MrPedantic
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Talking Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Possibly.
I agree that the strength of PA lies in the community for certain but like i ( and indeed you ) said they arent really likely (imo) to reorganise themselves to suit galaxy-based alliances quietly from an alliance point of view, and from a players point of view theres nothing binding them to the new system

Hopefully a way can be found that lets new people get into a decent alliance, get helped out by others and actually want to stay in the game for a round or two - hopefully longer.
We were after all, all noobs once


edit: Do you think i use (brackets) too much?
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 09:27   #10
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

MrPedantic for President !
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 09:29   #11
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

rofl

Coming to think about it - since we were all noobs once. shall we post why we stayed?
im guessing 99.9% of it will be because of friendships formed during the first round of playing but it could provide useful insights.

I personally, stayed because i made a bunch of friends and had fun at the same time - even if i didnt really know what i was doing
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 09:38   #12
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

I dont think they like the idea of making this thread a poll though .... phrased as a question
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 09:40   #13
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

maybe they`ve just not seen it yet. give them a couple of hours i`d say
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 10:59   #14
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Poll results:

A 90%
B 10%

byebye
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 11:12   #15
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Galaxy-based alliances will only 'work' with Private-gals. Random gals already mean yourplaying without your friends in-gal but random alliances as well? Never.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 11:24   #16
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

wow trogoladyte and mrpedantic managed 13 posts before martok ruined it by adding himself as a 3rd poster.....you suck the fun out of everything
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 11:25   #17
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

I must say I very much disagree with this, how good the intentions might be. What if you have people from different alliances in your galaxy? You might be forced to every round be in another alliance, so you don't have a 'homebase' so to say fall back on. I personally like to stick to one alliance and learn to know the people there over several rounds and watch the alliance grow.
It also takes some interesting elements out of the game which make it so addictive. It would just become galaxy wars then.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 11:31   #18
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:02   #19
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Orion Treet
I must say I very much disagree with this, how good the intentions might be. What if you have people from different alliances in your galaxy? You might be forced to every round be in another alliance, so you don't have a 'homebase' so to say fall back on. I personally like to stick to one alliance and learn to know the people there over several rounds and watch the alliance grow.
It also takes some interesting elements out of the game which make it so addictive. It would just become galaxy wars then.
I think that is the boring option. Play round after round with the same ppl. Break-out a bit, imaging playing against old friends… if anything I think it will add to the experience… plus theirs is nothing from saying that the old alliance could not stay together, it’s just a matter of convincing the other gal m8’s


(p.s. JC Thanks for creating the poll)
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:08   #20
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Troglodyte: i think you had a good idea, just the way that pa is at the moment, people dont want to play with people they dont know...they want to play with people they know and can trust
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:14   #21
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

point taken ...pity though


hmmm.. the red worm is looking rather long

Last edited by Troglodyte; 4 Jan 2005 at 12:28.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:30   #22
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

So, how do you intend for everyone in a gal to be in one alliance? What alliance will they be in? Will the alliance want them? As Mek pointed out, people want to play with their friends, that's probably the main reason why people keep coming back to play round after round. If this was changed to what you're suggesting, i think we'll see a sharp decline in playing numbers after a while.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:34   #23
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

my oppini0on is that I would play with my gal 100% in the end it's only a god gal that can save you from getting raped. But you can as well stick with your ally, or simply the ally that got most member in a gal join htat ally. I don't know because its a hard descition...
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:35   #24
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

The first thing that sprung to mind with having a galaxy based alliance is that it will be very hard to enforce. If you take away the individual rights of the player in a galaxy then there isn’t much fun with playing with your alliance. MrPedantic correctly pointed out that players who do not want to become a member of a certain alliances are pretty much going to either undermine the galaxy or not bother with the galaxy at all.

Then there is the issue that alliances may not want certain members joining their alliance. Opens the question what happens then? It would be next to impossible to enforce and if it was it would make many people unhappy.

Individual Based is still and probably will be for the foreseeable future the best way to go.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:36   #25
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by arbondigo
So, how do you intend for everyone in a gal to be in one alliance?
The GC heads up the gal and joins an alliance on behalf of the gal. if a new GC is voted in then they can decide on which alliance to join.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arbondigo
So What alliance will they be in?
Whatever alliance they want to be in

Quote:
Originally Posted by arbondigo
So Will the alliance want them?
Depends on the alliance… they can either say yes or no …if no then try a different alliance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arbondigo
So i think we'll see a sharp decline in playing numbers after a while.
That’s debatable
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:42   #26
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
The GC heads up the gal and joins an alliance on behalf of the gal. if a new GC is voted in then they can decide on which alliance to join.
So if the members don't like that choice they won't make an effort and will undermine the gal. Whereas now, they're in the alliance that they want to be in, are playing with their friends and are enjoying themselves. There's no real need to change.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Whatever alliance they want to be in



Depends on the alliance… they can either say yes or no …if no then try a different alliance.
So if they all say no then they're rather screwed. As it is now, the bigger planets usually try to help the smaller planets in their gal to get an alliance of some sort, so they meet new people, make new friends etc etc and are more likely to hang around longer.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
That’s debatable
Not really. If some newbie gc gets voted and puts his gal into his old alliance, who no one's ever heard of for instance, i don't think the big planets will hang around, or if they do then they'll just ruin the gc's round and perhaps a couple of other planets in the gal. I reckon they would leave, don't you?
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:44   #27
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blixxard
The first thing that sprung to mind with having a galaxy based alliance is that it will be very hard to enforce.
Why would you want to enforce it? … there’s nothing stopping ppl going to irc and forming a clan or whatever. Sort of an underground alliance. That’s human nature. I’m sure it happens now. It adds to the human element of PA …politics

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blixxard
If you take away the individual rights.
The individual has three options:
Try convince the other gal members to go to a different alliance.
Or be exiled. Or go underground
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:53   #28
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Option B: Galaxy based (i.e everyone in a specific gal belong to one alliance)
When you said everyone I assumed you ment everyone must conform to one alliance.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 12:56   #29
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Ok let me clarify things..

The vote for the GC is democratic. The galaxy can choose anyone who they believe is going to lead that gal to glory. If you don’t like a GC then convince the gal and pick a new GC . the GC chooses the alliance they wish to join. it’s that simple. They whole beauty is that like it or not your galaxy is a team and there is no ‘I’ in team. You have to grow together as a team if you are to be accepted into an alliance.

It is here were the benefits kick in. The community grows and the experienced players aid the newcomers, because now it is in their best interests. the Noobs have a better experience which hopefully result in a loyal player.


Blixxard: everyone in the galaxy belongs to the alliance that the GC joins. Exactly like now, however the galaxy is the entity not the individual

Last edited by Troglodyte; 4 Jan 2005 at 13:02.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:00   #30
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Ah, right. Misunderstood.

It's now become an interesting idea.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:03   #31
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Ok let me clarify things..

The vote for the GC is democratic. The galaxy can choose anyone who they believe is going to lead that gal to glory. If you don’t like a GC then convince the gal and pick a new GC . it’s that simple. They whole beauty is that like it or not your galaxy is a team and there is no ‘I’ in team. You have to grow together as a team if you are to be accepted into an alliance.
Same as it is now then with regards to the GC. Galaxies usually work together anyway, how would the top gals be where they are today without working together? Answer: they wouldn't. Sure, alliances play a big part in where they are, but without all the members of the gal working together they wouldn't be there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
It is here were the benefits kick in. The community grows and the experienced players aid the newcomers, because now it is in their best interests.
And it's not in their best interest if an ACTIVE newbie lands in their gal now? With the free accounts being random, if a gal gets an active one they will train it up and probably pay to upgrade it. So the community's growing. With your suggestion i can see a lot more people getting peeved than with what it is currently.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Blixxard: everyone in the galaxy belongs to the alliance that the GC joins. Exactly like now, however the galaxy is the entity not the individual
How is that exactly like now? The alliance would still be the "entity" if what you're suggesting is implemented as they still have to rely on the alliance for defence etc. I don't know what gal you were in last round, but didn't you give your gal details where they could get you defence from? Didn't they get you defence when you were asleep and under attack?
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:11   #32
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by arbondigo
Same as it is now then with regards to the GC. Galaxies usually work together anyway, how would the top gals be where they are today without working together? Answer: they wouldn't. Sure, alliances play a big part in where they are, but without all the members of the gal working together they wouldn't be there.
Yip that’s correct !!!! .. so why not make that more official? Why not make the gal the entity and not the individual. Why not formally recognize the gal structure as being as important as the individual.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:17   #33
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Yip that’s correct !!!! .. so why not make that more official? Why not make the gal the entity and not the individual. Why not formally recognize the gal structure as being as important as the individual.
Why need to make it official? It's fine as it is now. The gal is already important, why do you think people moan about them being in an inactive gal?

I also seem to remember you saying earlier in this thread that if they don't like it they can exile themselves. Doesn't this defeat the aim that you're trying to achieve? You'll end up with about 3 men galaxies, and the exiles will eventually end up in a gal with their mates, like they usually do somehow or other.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:32   #34
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Ok maybe an example will highlight what I’m trying to say

For example

SCENARIO – Individual based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance XXX rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5

Does Player 2 give a shit what happens to player 1 … I doubt it. He might help out now and then but if player 1 had massive incoming would player 2 do any thing about it …. Doubt it again .


SCENARIO – Galaxy based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance 1UP rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5

Does player 2 give a shit about player1 … I think he would, more than in the first scenario
Would player 2 help out if player 1 had incoming … again I think he would
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:35   #35
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
PRO’s
a) I feel that this will aid NooBs in becoming better players, sort of like a mentorship program. It’s in the best interests of the more experienced players to aid the noobs. This will result in the new players having a more favourable experience and perhaps buying into the game.
This was your original point. When a galaxy comes under attack from an alliance or BG, each individual's alliance can attempt to provide enough defence to that planet to save roids and structures. The Galaxy is the last line of defence.

If we have a whole galaxy with just one source of defence, it is so much harder to get enough defence from the alliance, and so its quite obviously favourable to have many sources of defence.

NOW, how does this relate to experienced players helping these 'noobs' you speak of?

Quite simple really, firstly, since defence is harder to get, these planets would surely be destroyed far quicker, and would probably just get bored of the game - so providing the 'noobs' decide to stick it out, why would this encourage an experienced player to help out a beginner any more than if the beginner could start in an alliance which plays at their own level? Surely someone new to the game would hate to be in a top-tier alliance such as 1up where they would be expected too much of?

As for alliances, why would this benefit them? Whether or not a player is in a top-3 alliance or a bottom-3 alliance, this will not substantially change their activity. Why would a top-3 alliance decide to provide defence and attacks to someone who doesn't give anything back to them?

For your idea to actually have any chance of working, the activity of each individual in the galaxy would have to be equal - so we would find ourselves with galaxies grouped by activity and skill, and most 'noobs' would be forced out of the good galaxies (thus meaning they will NEVER get a good alliance) and we would just find a wider range between top and bottom galaxies.

I know you put in alot of ideas to these boards - but alot have been suggested before, and failed - so please use the search feature.

P.S. I could give so many more reasons why this idea is bound to fail, but I think that point should be enough
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:44   #36
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Ok maybe an example will highlight what I’m trying to say

For example

SCENARIO – Individual based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance XXX rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5

Does Player 2 give a shit what happens to player 1 … I doubt it. He might help out now and then but if player 1 had massive incoming would player 2 do any thing about it …. Doubt it again .


SCENARIO – Galaxy based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance 1UP rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5

Does player 2 give a shit about player1 … I think he would, more than in the first scenario
Would player 2 help out if player 1 had incoming … again I think he would
Why would he give a shit either way what happens to Player 1? In reality, he would be more likely to help Player 1 in the first scenario as he can get defence from his alliance, then when he's covered he can then perhaps send his ships out to help Player 1, and even try and get defence from Player 1's alliance to help him too.

In your second scenario, player 2 is clearly the more active of the two. He's going to get himself defence first, and i don't think he would be that bothered if player 1 got none, as at the end of the day he's covered.

Plus, add in what The Real Arfy said. I think he's summed up why it shouldn't be implemented too.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 13:53   #37
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real Arfy
This was your original point. When a galaxy comes under attack from an alliance or BG, each individual's alliance can attempt to provide enough defence to that planet to save roids and structures. The Galaxy is the last line of defence.
Good point


Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real Arfy
NOW, how does this relate to experienced players helping these 'noobs' you speak of?
Because now they are in the same boat.. for the alliance that the gal belongs to to increase it’s power it needs to build up it’s player’s.. Not just the Big planets but the noobs as well. In this aspect the better players will want to aid the smaller guys in the hope that they can grow and become more influential.

Secondly, if a player is offline, there will most probably be more chances that someone can alert the alliance for defense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real Arfy
Surely someone new to the game would hate to be in a top-tier alliance such as 1up where they would be expected too much of?
Another good point. But that is totally dependant on the player themselves. My guess some would really love being in a renown alliance, other’s will choose to be exiled and try somewhere else…who knows.



I think what I’m getting at …if a new player joins and they feel alienated in their gal; they are more likely going to become inactive. If the gal has a vested interest in the player knowing that the next player that comes along might be 10 times worse than their current guy, well would most probably show more interest in the little guy
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 14:04   #38
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

I thought we had a suggestions forum for these things.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 14:14   #39
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Because now they are in the same boat.. for the alliance that the gal belongs to to increase it’s power it needs to build up it’s player’s.. Not just the Big planets but the noobs as well. In this aspect the better players will want to aid the smaller guys in the hope that they can grow and become more influential.

Secondly, if a player is offline, there will most probably be more chances that someone can alert the alliance for defense.
First. They will be more likely to help them to get into an alliance so that they can look after themselves. If they're in the same alliance it will be the newer and smaller players who will get ignored by the bigger ones. They won't work together nearly as well as you seem to think that they will.

Second. I don't know what galaxy(ies) you've played in before, but this is pretty standard if the gal has incoming. You alert the other players's alliances so that they get defence even when they're asleep. I said this earlier in the thread, but you seemed to either not see it or chose to ignore it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
I think what I’m getting at …if a new player joins and they feel alienated in their gal; they are more likely going to become inactive. If the gal has a vested interest in the player knowing that the next player that comes along might be 10 times worse than their current guy, well would most probably show more interest in the little guy
I think the majority will agree with me here. If the new player makes an effort to get on irc, be active etc then his gal WILL help him, regardless of his alliance. What you don't seem to understand is that the gal IS still important, the players still DO have a vested interest in the gal. Why else would people complain about small inactive players? They will always be a problem, regardless of how the gals were set up.

Also, say that the alliance was still capped at 100 players. If 2 of those gals are under attack, that's a fifth of the alliance who could be bashed. Now, i reckon out of those 100 members, say half of them are really active. You're not encouraging the less active, smaller players to join. You're hindering the active players because of the inactives holding them back.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 14:56   #40
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Desse
I thought we had a suggestions forum for these things.
I thought we had a report post button for these things.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 16:05   #41
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Desse
I thought we had a suggestions forum for these things.
If there is a problem of any kind on this board (PD) feel free to send me a PM or use the report post button as suggested. I try my best to do everything but even i'm not perfect.

This thread didnt start off as a suggestion, it was merely a question. Half way through the thread i thought about moving it over but decided to see how it developed while i did more important things such as revision for my exams. I will now send it over there.
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 23:15   #42
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

tbh your describing a mix of forced gameplay and ******** all in one big soup.

Im not enjoying it
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Unread 4 Jan 2005, 23:35   #43
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Ok maybe an example will highlight what I’m trying to say

For example

SCENARIO – Individual based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance XXX rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5

Does Player 2 give a shit what happens to player 1 … I doubt it. He might help out now and then but if player 1 had massive incoming would player 2 do any thing about it …. Doubt it again .


SCENARIO – Galaxy based

Player 1) 01:01:01 Alliance 1UP rank 1325
Player 2) 01:01:02 Alliance 1UP rank 5

Does player 2 give a shit about player1 … I think he would, more than in the first scenario
Would player 2 help out if player 1 had incoming … again I think he would
Well, I know that at the start of the round I got a msg from Stals just after I'd signed up (yes, even in the ev0l #1 gal ) that if I was new the to the game, and/or had a free account, and showed I was interesting in learning they would pay for my account if I was unable to and teach me/sort me a decent alliance. And I've seen that same kind of behavior in a lot of low ranked gals with experienced players in them I've been in as well. Usually if new people show they are willing to learn and to put effort into it, the experienced players are more than happy to help them along, besides hoping to have a new PA player who will hopefully stick around for a few rounds it also helps the gal out.
I have seen very few who 'give a shit' about new players who are willing to try and learn, even if they don't do good that round.
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Unread 5 Jan 2005, 08:28   #44
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Does this happen often ...or is it quite a random thing. What i'm getting at is that i'm sure there are some ppl who help the noobs out, but is it the norm?

Is there enough of this 'help' to ensure the sustainability of PA or should it be built into the game?
Are there more ppl leaving then joining PA ?
Do we need to do something about it ? (if no...then this thread is a waste of time)

Last edited by Troglodyte; 5 Jan 2005 at 09:04.
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Unread 5 Jan 2005, 15:04   #45
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

I think that all experienced players help out beginners. They can do no harm as long as they are taught correctly.

If they show effort, then yes, they will be rewarded. As long as we have exile, it is inevitable for a noob to be discarded when they don't pull their weight.

And IMO, no, nothing has to be done about it.
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Unread 5 Jan 2005, 20:11   #46
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Beginners will defend you. They have no/few other friends than you to give priority defence to. You can make sure they join a friendly alliance. No risk of them not reporting defence if they see it comming and you are not online. Or even guide in the hostiles as soon as you go to bed.

It's in their interest to help.
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Unread 5 Jan 2005, 20:35   #47
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

in this scenario - the good players join an alliance, the bad players arn't let in and so are left totally defenceless. the little players get screwed.

cunning
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Unread 5 Jan 2005, 21:36   #48
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troglodyte
Does this happen often ...or is it quite a random thing. What i'm getting at is that i'm sure there are some ppl who help the noobs out, but is it the norm?

Is there enough of this 'help' to ensure the sustainability of PA or should it be built into the game?
Are there more ppl leaving then joining PA ?
Do we need to do something about it ? (if no...then this thread is a waste of time)
The mentor team was created for this sort of thing, but got merged into the support team when it started to confuse members if they were meant to go to the mentors or support people for help. For the last round or two i've been fully for a link (like the support one) and / or a private thread on the gal forums (so no one can read each other's questions) for newer players to ask questions and be given answers / suggestions / help that's properly publicied. Some players just use the support link, but I think maybe a new big flashy button would be nice for new player .
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real Arfy
I think that all experienced players help out beginners. They can do no harm as long as they are taught correctly.

If they show effort, then yes, they will be rewarded. As long as we have exile, it is inevitable for a noob to be discarded when they don't pull their weight.

And IMO, no, nothing has to be done about it.
Not all experienced players teach, but every time I join a smaller galaxy, I generally announce to the players if they have any questions about what to build and so forth to pa mail me. I never did get any mails, but maybe that's because I didn't tell them how to mail me .
Some people don't like to ask - I think there should be a nice option in preferences to turn on / off some sort of "handy hint" function (default = on), for new players to know what to construct and research.
I'd much prefer this sort of thing to some sort of galaxy alliance system, which would make it far far easier to crush alliances (which would be amusing but have a few alliances "doing a Phraktos" a round)
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Unread 6 Jan 2005, 01:05   #49
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mist
in this scenario - the good players join an alliance, the bad players arn't let in and so are left totally defenceless. the little players get screwed.

cunning
Yes - why would any alliance want a bad player?

However, you make it sound as though all beginners are doomed from the start - The players get good by getting help from others. Others will only give (notice I said give, not offer) advice and training to those who show willing and are not cocky bastards that nobody wants to talk to anyway, or those who don't at least try to make any attempt to learn or even be contacted.
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Unread 6 Jan 2005, 14:44   #50
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Re: Individual Alliances or Galaxy Alliances?

with there being a limit of only 99 ppl and maybe less soon does that mean if you have inactives in your gal there kinda stuck in your alliance to and that only 10 galaxies may join the alliance?
Like i said in another thread this should only apply to cluster alliances with a full galaxy alliance without some big galaxy pretending to be in cluster alliance then to suddenly see incoming from them then an apologey after stealing your roids saying something stupid like sorry didnt know.
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