User Name
Password

Go Back   Planetarion Forums > Planetarion Related Forums > Strategic Discussions

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 17:07   #301
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

More armor, lower damage means you lose less on average when you land and you need a greater number of ships to make landing inefficient?
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 17:16   #302
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haer View Post
More armor, lower damage means you lose less on average when you land and you need a greater number of ships to make landing inefficient?
You might loose less, depending on the ammount defending against you. (which will require a lot less, to stop the attacking force.)
Few to none people in this game wants value losses. As it rarely pays off.
By making ships have more armor and less damage, you require more value to break through the target clean, and it requires less value to stop you from landing clean. (If you can find such a target.)

There is no point in trying to land attacks that won't PAY OFF before round ends! May aswell war the mining page.

While the opposite: Boosting damage and lowering armor makes for a more offensive path... even with MT!
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 18:36   #303
isildurx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Noruega
Posts: 2,999
isildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I haven't looked in-depth at efficiencies but as far as I can see Xan FI + DE (with some wraiths for later on) and Cath CO + FR looks pretty viable setups.
__________________
"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of War"
isildurx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 18:45   #304
BloodyButcher
Propaganda Chief
 
BloodyButcher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 4,719
BloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheoDD View Post
the thing i dislike the most about this set, and last round set is the limitted class interaction. Are we seriously at the point, where we need to stop freesteal/freekill through stats? (And yet this happends) Just MH/PA Team that can't see past the obvious, and rather make stands elsewhere.

I wouldn't mind a ST set where there was more diversity, more viable strategies, and more viable counters. With this beta set, and last rounds limitted class interaction makes this more of a numbers game than anything. Which clearly was prooven last round!
I think having narrow, but more or less stats that actualy allows you to cover all your bases with say two cat/x or etd/x or cat/etd is better.
Take R56 stats for an example, there was no way to cover all Your needs With either one attack class or attack classes that interacted imho.
That resulted in two alliances NAPing each other from pt0-900 or what not, and they were able to fetch of all the smaller/lesser alliances just out of not having to focus on building def against each other.

R51 had to some extent brilliant stats, one of the preround blocks went for FR forts, FAnG went for CR/BS forts, and the small tags, ODDR, MegaLonia, and ROCK went for CO.
Each strat was working for everyone, while CO had a lot of holes defensively, they could easily roid most gals if they had enough numbers.
__________________
RainbowS

RB Ely MISTU Angel Fusi0n 1up ToF VisioN CT FAnG ROCK
BloodyButcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 18:56   #305
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheoDD View Post
Few to none people in this game wants value losses. As it rarely pays off.
By making ships have more armor and less damage, you require more value to break through the target clean, and it requires less value to stop you from landing clean. (If you can find such a target.)
I think this is where you are going wrong. You are making two assumptions about attacking which I don't think are correct.

Firstly, you seem to be suggesting that people will only launch on targets they can take with 0 losses. This is not always the case. If I calc that my fleet will suffer 0.05% value loss, but the defender will suffer 95% value loss, I can launch, safe in the knowledge that he is likely to run his fleet. In fact, from the targets point of view, if they are confident the attacker will land there is rarely any benefit to them staying. Unless the defenders can make the attacker suffer enough of a loss, it is fairly safe to assume he will land unopposed.

Secondly, you seem to be suggesting that losing any value when attacking is a bad idea. I do not think this is correct. The landing calculation is quite simple. If you are going to lose ships worth X amount of resources and gain Y amount of roids, then you can calculate:

T = X / (Y*250).

This will give you the number of ticks it takes for you to earn the resources you have lost back from the additional roids you have gained. I can't be bothered to go looking for examples, but to give a quick (and silly) case, if i lose 1 Vsh on my attack and gain 1 roid, I will be in profit after a single tick.

Clearly T will go up with X, the amount of value you lose. If you decrease damage and increase armor, X will in general be lower, meaning landing is more likely to be profitable and turning an attack into a recall will require more value defending and a greater number of defending fleets.

This in turn will lead to a lower chance of encountering defence as alliances will sooner run out of available def fleets.
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:20   #306
Patrikc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 957
Patrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant future
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

In general, high damage low armour favours fast initiatives, while low damage high armour favours slow initiatives. Neither make a set of stats offensive or defensive on their own. In the former it's easier to take roids for no losses, but once you start losing some ships it quickly becomes a recall, whereas with the latter you often start taking losses with minimal defense, but are harder to repel (making it easier to land for XP).
Patrikc is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:31   #307
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Both approaches have forces which can favour attacking, but is there any reason to assume they are of equal magnitude?

If attacks are easy to repel, alliances will be able to cover them with 1-2 fleets. If they are harder to repel, they will require 3-4 fleets (for example). The number of fleets available to an alliance is finite, so it seems like the second case would make attacking easier and defending harder.
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:31   #308
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Seriously Haer, your logic is still way WAY off!
You won't find any targets that you can hurt for 90% + and only suffer 0.05% yourself if you want a stat set that way.
You might find nubs that has 0% value against the class you are attacking with, but seeing as we are talking about MT sets... i find that very unlikely, if not impossible. And if you do find these kind of targets, then you are probably in the lower half of the universe. With no personal goal of achievements.

While those who actually play for ranks, will just init and init and init and init and sit on their roids... not launching anything, but defence.
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:32   #309
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrikc View Post
In general, high damage low armour favours fast initiatives, while low damage high armour favours slow initiatives. Neither make a set of stats offensive or defensive on their own. In the former it's easier to take roids for no losses, but once you start losing some ships it quickly becomes a recall, whereas with the latter you often start taking losses with minimal defense, but are harder to repel (making it easier to land for XP).
While low damage, high armour also favours initiative... BUT YOU NEED MORE NUMBERS!
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:42   #310
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheoDD View Post
Seriously Haer, your logic is still way WAY off!
You won't find any targets that you can hurt for 90% + and only suffer 0.05% yourself if you want a stat set that way.
Right, but as I explained, it doesn't really matter how much damage you do to the target. The calculation for the T value doesn't depend on the amount of damage you do, only on the amount of damage you take. If this is low enough, you will land. If you land, the defender gains nothing by staying (Losing 25% of my roids and 1% of my fleet is still worse than only losing 25% of my roids), so they will in general run. But even if they don't run, it doesn't matter. The only thing that counts is the value of T. If T is large (I havent really considered what a good threshold would be - 48/72 hours perhaps?), you pull. If it's small, you land.
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:48   #311
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I dont land anything that take more than 24 ticks to repay.
I can simply INIT AT A MUCH CHEAPER COST, and focus purely on defence for ally / gal
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:49   #312
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I'm not talking about the time to repay, I'm taking about the time for the roids you cap to produce enough to repay.

I haven't looked at initting as an alternative, but if its viable beyond ~300 roids, you can just increase the cost too. Not a huge problem.
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:55   #313
Patrikc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 957
Patrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant future
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I'm all for making initiating roids to 300 cheaper, to 500 the same and beyond that more expensive. Make people work for their roids!
Patrikc is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:55   #314
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

You've lost me entirely
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 19:57   #315
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

The cost of initting a roid increases as a function of the number of roids you have. You can adjust the rate at which it increases to make initting more or less efficient.
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 20:03   #316
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

You are just drifting further and further away.
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 20:07   #317
Patrikc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 957
Patrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant future
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Not really, you're the one that brought initiating into this and brought up a related issue.
Patrikc is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 20:11   #318
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrikc View Post
Not really, you're the one that brought initiating into this and brought up a related issue.
I said i'd rather init roids than loose ship value on attacks for roids...
And instead prod 100% value in certain key defships.
If stats are High armour, Low damage!
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 20:17   #319
Patrikc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 957
Patrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant futurePatrikc has a brilliant future
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Which is an issue, when (after a certain amount) initiating roids is more attractive than going out and capturing others'. At some point you're going to have to attack to grow.

If I recall correctly Cardi is the worst offender of this, I believe I have seen him initiate from 1500 to 2000.
Patrikc is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 20:17   #320
Mzyxptlk
mz.
Space Invaders Champion, Alien Invasion Champion, Mosquito Kill Champion, Squid Hunter Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Barts Watersports Adventure Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,495
Mzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrikc View Post
I'm all for making initiating roids to 300 cheaper, to 500 the same and beyond that more expensive. Make people work for their roids!
Let's do it.
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
Mzyxptlk is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 20:19   #321
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrikc View Post
Which is an issue, when (after a certain amount) initiating roids is more attractive than going out and capturing others'. At some point you're going to have to attack to grow.

If I recall correctly Cardi is the worst offender of this, I believe I have seen him initiate from 1500 to 2000.
i belive i have seen him init even higher. And i have myself initted at that size in the past.
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 20:22   #322
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheoDD View Post
I said i'd rather init roids than loose ship value on attacks for roids...
And instead prod 100% value in certain key defships.
If stats are High armour, Low damage!
Yes, and I responded that if this is the case, you can just increase the cost of initting until it is ineffective. The same calculation that applies to value loss applies for initting. If it costs X res to init a roid, you can calculate T=X/250 to figure out how long that roid will take to make you a profit. If initting is more attractive than attacking, you just increase X.
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 7 Oct 2014, 21:28   #323
BloodyButcher
Propaganda Chief
 
BloodyButcher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 4,719
BloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Offensive stats easily burns out alliances.
Top alliances should be abel to fetch of troll tags.
As the tag limits are so low, we need stats that should give you a chance to hold your ground, while it should also be possibole to land attacks, it a fine balance.
__________________
RainbowS

RB Ely MISTU Angel Fusi0n 1up ToF VisioN CT FAnG ROCK
BloodyButcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 8 Oct 2014, 06:17   #324
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Hence why i want this limitted class interaction removed... There lies the issue. It is better when each race has a clear edge against a specific class or two. That all viable team ups have a optimal counter, with overly limitted class interaction this is close to impossible to do in practise.

Fi - Targets and targetted by Co and De only
Co - Targets and targetted by Fr and Fi only
Fr - Targets and targetted by Co, De and Cr only
De - Targets and targetted by Fi, Fr, and BS only
Cr - Targets and targetted by Fr and Bs only
Bs - Targets and targetted by De and Cr only

This is even worse than last round. It utterly limits defence possibilities, and makes very unbalanced strats.

Last round was a clear case CO round, with same issue as this set. 2 Classes could hit it, where as one of those two classes had only 2 ships and both were required to make a dent. (Cutter + Ranger)

Next round if the current beta set remains as it is, it will be an excess ammount of xans.

Balanced?!? Not even remotely
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 8 Oct 2014, 10:31   #325
Mzyxptlk
mz.
Space Invaders Champion, Alien Invasion Champion, Mosquito Kill Champion, Squid Hunter Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Barts Watersports Adventure Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,495
Mzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Having each class only worry about a handful of other classes has been a staple of PA stats for ages. Classes commonly don't target themselves, and that already limits the remaining number of classes that Fi, Co, Cr and Bs can interact with to 3.

That said, I agree that reducing that to just 2 classes is very restrictive, and if one of those classes ends up being underused, you have a major problem. Unfortunately, that restriction is pretty much inherent in full ST stats. Roiding fleets with 3 ships are significantly weaker than those with just 2 because they have to spread their value around more, negating much of the offensive quality of ST stats. That limits your choices either to interacting with just 2 classes or allowing 0-loss defense.
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
Mzyxptlk is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 9 Oct 2014, 06:44   #326
Tiamat101
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 846
Tiamat101 is a jewel in the roughTiamat101 is a jewel in the roughTiamat101 is a jewel in the roughTiamat101 is a jewel in the rough
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

The way i look at is, ships should not target themselves, and no two ships should fire at each other at the same init and it just allows for stupid suicide def even if the effs favor the attacker the defender will always end up coming out ahead.

One thing that could be brought back into play that many people dislike is freefire ships. Now most of the time these ships have been +1 /+2 eta from the classes they target and have been wildly ineffective they still have been abused every time they have been introduced. Just another thought, there is a better way that you can use freefire ships which is leave pure holes in fleets so that they are freefired upon but in team-up their other race fills that hole, which I think B-Butcher would be more fond of ex:
Class / T1 / T2
Fr / Co / Fi
Fr / Cr / De

Fr / Fi / Co
Fr / Bs / De


Cr / Fr / De
Cr / Bs

Bs / De / Fr
Bs / Cr

Both Fr classes target Fi/co/De and either CR or BS and Both Cr and Bs classes Shoot into Fr/ De.
__________________
R50-55 Faceless
Tiamat101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 9 Oct 2014, 13:26   #327
Clouds
Registered User
 
Clouds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 1,386
Clouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to behold
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I'm not even going to bother looking at this conversation, but did ND make the stats that are currently up?

Basilisk Battleship
Judge Fighter

What stupid ship names.
Clouds is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 9 Oct 2014, 17:21   #328
jnz
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 9
jnz is infamous around these parts
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

i dont agree with ships not targetting themselves, it doesnt seem very 'realistic' that fighters wont shoot other fighters and so on

not a huge fan of ST either , as means have to build every ship to try help cover all kinds of inc and each class hard to cover, round will be a roid swap like r58

still, play with what we got (tx tia for effort)
jnz is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 9 Oct 2014, 18:05   #329
Clouds
Registered User
 
Clouds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 1,386
Clouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to beholdClouds is a splendid one to behold
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Who made this set?
Clouds is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 9 Oct 2014, 20:54   #330
BloodyButcher
Propaganda Chief
 
BloodyButcher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 4,719
BloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by jnz View Post
i dont agree with ships not targetting themselves, it doesnt seem very 'realistic' that fighters wont shoot other fighters and so on

not a huge fan of ST either , as means have to build every ship to try help cover all kinds of inc and each class hard to cover, round will be a roid swap like r58

still, play with what we got (tx tia for effort)
I think what tia means is that he dosnt wont xan FI shoot at other xan FI
__________________
RainbowS

RB Ely MISTU Angel Fusi0n 1up ToF VisioN CT FAnG ROCK
BloodyButcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 9 Oct 2014, 21:24   #331
Mzyxptlk
mz.
Space Invaders Champion, Alien Invasion Champion, Mosquito Kill Champion, Squid Hunter Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Barts Watersports Adventure Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,495
Mzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Xan Fi vs Xan Fi is indeed the most harmful variant. I don't think that ships should never target each other, but if you're going to allow it, you should have a good reason.
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
Mzyxptlk is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 9 Oct 2014, 23:54   #332
snoops^
p1mp
 
snoops^'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Bristol
Posts: 177
snoops^ has a spectacular aura aboutsnoops^ has a spectacular aura aboutsnoops^ has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

any reason why cath has 3 pod classes?
__________________

ReBorn-Fury-Wolfpack-1up-Newdawn-DLR-NFI-Apprime-

*CEO of the Forest fan club
snoops^ is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Oct 2014, 00:32   #333
Appocomaster
PA Team
 
Appocomaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,417
Appocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldAppocomaster spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Beetle Armour 11->13
Avenger Armour 71->80
Banshee Cost 51/51/51 -> 53/53/53
Illusion armour 6->5
Thief armour 36->34
Corsair armour 15->17
Dealer armour 36->40

final tweaks
__________________
r8-10 RaH r10.5-12 MISTU
Appocomaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Oct 2014, 07:25   #334
BloodyButcher
Propaganda Chief
 
BloodyButcher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 4,719
BloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by snoops^ View Post
any reason why cath has 3 pod classes?
Cus its EMP, it makes it easier to balance out the strats.
__________________
RainbowS

RB Ely MISTU Angel Fusi0n 1up ToF VisioN CT FAnG ROCK
BloodyButcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Oct 2014, 13:38   #335
snoops^
p1mp
 
snoops^'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Bristol
Posts: 177
snoops^ has a spectacular aura aboutsnoops^ has a spectacular aura aboutsnoops^ has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Cus its EMP, it makes it easier to balance out the strats.
i dont see how cath a race that roids easier than others anyway needs an extra pod class to balance stats
__________________

ReBorn-Fury-Wolfpack-1up-Newdawn-DLR-NFI-Apprime-

*CEO of the Forest fan club
snoops^ is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Oct 2014, 13:49   #336
isildurx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Noruega
Posts: 2,999
isildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Most classes without an EMP in them usually either a) becomes shit at attacking or b) too powerful. Having more roidfleets with EMP in them makes balancing the stats easier.
__________________
"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of War"
isildurx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Oct 2014, 20:44   #337
BloodyButcher
Propaganda Chief
 
BloodyButcher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 4,719
BloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Well said isildurx.
More zero loss def, "worse" the stats usual it
__________________
RainbowS

RB Ely MISTU Angel Fusi0n 1up ToF VisioN CT FAnG ROCK
BloodyButcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Oct 2014, 21:21   #338
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
More zero loss def, "worse" the stats usual it
we have loads of past MT sets that shows differently imo.
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Oct 2014, 23:04   #339
BloodyButcher
Propaganda Chief
 
BloodyButcher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 4,719
BloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheoDD View Post
we have loads of past MT sets that shows differently imo.
Why the "".
Read it how u want it.
__________________
RainbowS

RB Ely MISTU Angel Fusi0n 1up ToF VisioN CT FAnG ROCK
BloodyButcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11 Oct 2014, 02:08   #340
Tiamat101
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 846
Tiamat101 is a jewel in the roughTiamat101 is a jewel in the roughTiamat101 is a jewel in the roughTiamat101 is a jewel in the rough
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I don't even understand where this thread is going anymore....
__________________
R50-55 Faceless
Tiamat101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11 Oct 2014, 02:28   #341
Haer
Aquafresh
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: [^-^]
Posts: 261
Haer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura aboutHaer has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

To get things back on track a bit, i'd like to bring up the "stats committee" again. I think if such a thing is going to work, it needs to pretty much start now in order to hopefully have something ready for next round. I'd like to be involved, but I don't really have the community standing to take the lead.

Rather than spending ages talking about how to organise/run such a thing, why don't we just grab / use (#stats, #beta, #strategy?) a channel on IRC, aim to have a weekly discussion at some mutually agreeable time and try to have some more active / reasoned discussions on this forum?
Haer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11 Oct 2014, 09:12   #342
TheoDD
Registered User
Othello Champion, Solitaire Champion, Anime BlackJack Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 707
TheoDD has a spectacular aura aboutTheoDD has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

i think appoco and plaguuu are still in #pastats and its public and open for all, im sure appoco wouldn't mind letting anyone who wants use it or a committee.
TheoDD is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12 Oct 2014, 12:26   #343
isildurx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Noruega
Posts: 2,999
isildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Ugh, looks like a really xan heavy uni is gonna be the case So relieved I don't really have the time to play the next round
__________________
"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of War"
isildurx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12 Oct 2014, 13:23   #344
Kaiba
Valle is my hero
 
Kaiba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,569
Kaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud ofKaiba has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by isildurx View Post
Ugh, looks like a really xan heavy uni is gonna be the case So relieved I don't really have the time to play the next round
Busy with a different beta??
Kaiba is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12 Oct 2014, 13:43   #345
isildurx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Noruega
Posts: 2,999
isildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

No, work (thankfully )
__________________
"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of War"
isildurx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 14 Oct 2014, 20:34   #346
isildurx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Noruega
Posts: 2,999
isildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond reputeisildurx has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I propose next round we re-use my stats from a few rounds back, they deserve another go with lower effs on the beetle
__________________
"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of War"
isildurx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 14 Oct 2014, 22:39   #347
Papadoc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 155
Papadoc is a jewel in the roughPapadoc is a jewel in the roughPapadoc is a jewel in the roughPapadoc is a jewel in the rough
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by isildurx View Post
I propose next round we re-use my stats from a few rounds back, they deserve another go with lower effs on the beetle
That would be awesome.

Changing the beetle in those stats would make them play completely different
__________________
BOOM
Papadoc is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 14 Oct 2014, 22:57   #348
BloodyButcher
Propaganda Chief
 
BloodyButcher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 4,719
BloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud ofBloodyButcher has much to be proud of
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by isildurx View Post
I propose next round we re-use my stats from a few rounds back, they deserve another go with lower effs on the beetle
U had ur chance, lets run mine!
__________________
RainbowS

RB Ely MISTU Angel Fusi0n 1up ToF VisioN CT FAnG ROCK
BloodyButcher is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 15 Oct 2014, 11:18   #349
Mzyxptlk
mz.
Space Invaders Champion, Alien Invasion Champion, Mosquito Kill Champion, Squid Hunter Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Barts Watersports Adventure Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,495
Mzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldMzyxptlk spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

This is not done on a turn-by-turn basis. The best stats get picked. If you think you can do better than Isil, then by all means, make a set.

And a new thread, while we're at it..
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
Mzyxptlk is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 15 Oct 2014, 14:28   #350
Bastet
Registered User
 
Bastet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Teesside
Posts: 169
Bastet has a spectacular aura aboutBastet has a spectacular aura about
Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Bad PA rep?
Talking bout urself?
I don't have a bad rep and even if I did, it could never beat yours
__________________
Bastet.

Rounds 1-30, 42-65, 67-69, 73, 77, 80-82. RETIRED!

Mistu, LCH, Vengeance (the proper one), OUZO, Mercs, Fang, TiT, ToF, VSN, HR, xVx, ODDR, DFWTK, ROCK, TGV, TheFallen, Rainbows, CT, Future, ND and Stellar.

[22:03:16] <Hermiod> Im off to bed, I'll prolly dream bout Bastet, black dildos and gorillas -_-.
[22:03:21] <+Bastet> yay xD, what an epic combination, don't forget the whipped cream!


Bastet, perving on (semi-attractive) male PA players 2000-2019.
Bastet is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:05.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2002 - 2018