User Name
Password

Go Back   Planetarion Forums > Non Planetarion Discussions > General Discussions

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 09:48   #1
roadrunner_0
cynic
 
roadrunner_0's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
vile despicable people

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/s...re/4176094.stm


to me, the 'animal rights activists' who have done this are no more than terrorists, vile hateful little people who should be locked up and the key thrown away, no one deserved the amount of violence that the people who ran that farm have suffered, just for making a living. And as to animal use in general, are you seriously going to tell me that an animals life is worth more than a humans?
Christ i'm angry right now
__________________
lazy
roadrunner_0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:02   #2
roadrunner_0
cynic
 
roadrunner_0's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

i would say less hilarious and more ****ing absurd, that anyone can get away with this kind of thing in our society is wrong
__________________
lazy
roadrunner_0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:20   #3
NEWSBOT3
NEWSBOT
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: The enby cave!
Posts: 4,872
NEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriend
Re: vile despicable people

i was also gonna post on this.

It's ridiculous - these people are terrorists effectively.
__________________
[20:27:47] <nodrog-aawy> **** i think my housemate just caught me masturbating
[11:25:32] <idimmu> you are a little piggy arent you
[13:17:00] <KaneED> i'm so closet i'm like narnia
__________________
Pretty parks and funky scrap metal things here
NEWSBOT3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:28   #4
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Their behaviour makes perfect sense if you believe in animal rights.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:36   #5
CrashTester
I am an idiot
 
CrashTester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,145
CrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant future
Re: vile despicable people

I think they have done a sterling job in closing this place down and hopefully bankrupting this family. So it took digging up a dead little old dear to bring it home to this vile family that their activities and business has no place in our society.
CrashTester is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:36   #6
pyirt
nomen est omen
 
pyirt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Bristol, UK
Posts: 1,095
pyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond reputepyirt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: vile despicable people

The Universities that use animals in research can actually breed the smaller ones themselves, without having to out source them.
__________________

Me=Hans_Blix
Views expressed are those of the author and not of any company or organisation I am associated with. Electronic communication can be forged and the integrity of this message is not guaranteed.
pyirt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:38   #7
NEWSBOT3
NEWSBOT
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: The enby cave!
Posts: 4,872
NEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriend
Re: vile despicable people

oh i get it it's just a protest against out-sourcing jobs.









__________________
[20:27:47] <nodrog-aawy> **** i think my housemate just caught me masturbating
[11:25:32] <idimmu> you are a little piggy arent you
[13:17:00] <KaneED> i'm so closet i'm like narnia
__________________
Pretty parks and funky scrap metal things here
NEWSBOT3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:42   #8
pig
1up on you
 
pig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Birmingham, UK
Posts: 4,007
pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrashTester
I think they have done a sterling job in closing this place down and hopefully bankrupting this family. So it took digging up a dead little old dear to bring it home to this vile family that their activities and business has no place in our society.
well to be honest your talking about someones livelyhood here, Ive lived in that neck of the woods (thats near where my mother now lives I still live in the city centre) but in rural staffordshire, farming is there life. Its quite tough, and you know what im going to be a twat here but seriously why cry about animal testing? Why not cry about say Halal meat? Butchering in general, cow skining etc etc. They are only guinea pigs which are being bred, not like they are special primates who are gonna be extinct.

They have gone through shit to be honest and its twats attitudes like yours that dont help. At the end of the day, you feel so admirable about it how about you stop eating meat, stop using shampoo etc, and stop buying shoes and wallets.
__________________
pig
[1up]
pig is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:43   #9
pig
1up on you
 
pig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Birmingham, UK
Posts: 4,007
pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
Their behaviour makes perfect sense if you believe in animal rights.
I aggree it makes sense, but it isnt. Its like jihad makes sense to those commiting it but in the wider world it holds little validity.
__________________
pig
[1up]
pig is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:46   #10
Madina
TashTastic
 
Madina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,354
Madina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriendMadina needs a job and a girlfriend
Re: vile despicable people

Im sure none of the protesters have ever used any products that have been tested on animals
__________________
Its only gay if you enjoy it!
Madina is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:48   #11
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by pig
I aggree it makes sense, but it isnt. Its like jihad makes sense to those commiting it but in the wider world it holds little validity.
Well I agree - and I find the whole animal rights movement completely appalling. However, if I did believe that bunny rabbits or whatever had some sort of moral worth then I'd agree with these tactics. Same with the crazy anti-abortionists. If I thought someone was murdering babies on a mass scale I'd probably be keen to try and stop it. And if the people behind these "murders" (i.e. the doctors in an abortion clinic, or the farmers who breed animals for experimentation) got hurt, well that's a small price to pay.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 10:57   #12
pig
1up on you
 
pig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Birmingham, UK
Posts: 4,007
pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
Well I agree - and I find the whole animal rights movement completely appalling. However, if I did believe that bunny rabbits or whatever had some sort of moral worth then I'd agree with these tactics. Same with the crazy anti-abortionists. If I thought someone was murdering babies on a mass scale I'd probably be keen to try and stop it. And if the people behind these "murders" (i.e. the doctors in an abortion clinic, or the farmers who breed animals for experimentation) got hurt, well that's a small price to pay.
Yes thats true but to a certain extent its almost an acceptance of society to say "Oh they believe in it" and "Oh as long as they dont really hurt anyone I guess its ok", but once again there counterargument to me of course could be well you arent opening your mind up or some bs, god im angry this morning.
__________________
pig
[1up]
pig is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:06   #13
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
Their behaviour makes perfect sense if you believe in animal rights.
Indeed; the same applies to anti-abortionists in the US who actively target doctors/clinics. People really need to decide where they stand on issues, rather than taking generic wishywashy stances which are based on a generically liberal desire to avoid offending others , rather than on anything principled. If animals have rights then the actions of this group were totally justified. If they dont, then stop pretending you give a shit about animals. Oh and put the free-range eggs back on the shelf, you arent fooling anyone.

Last edited by Nodrog; 24 Aug 2005 at 11:22.
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:09   #14
Ste
Bored
 
Ste's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Nottm ->Shef ->Croydon ->Manc ->Durham ->Sheffield
Posts: 6,506
Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

can we please start a lynching campaign on the people who threatened their lives?
__________________
Wise men write because they have something to write about; fools write because they have to write something. - Plato

yeh so Plastic Brilliance is now known as FOXYSTOAT - Come on by and check it out!
Ste is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:19   #15
CrashTester
I am an idiot
 
CrashTester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,145
CrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant future
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by pig
well to be honest your talking about someones livelyhood here, Ive lived in that neck of the woods (thats near where my mother now lives I still live in the city centre) but in rural staffordshire, farming is there life. Its quite tough, and you know what im going to be a twat here but seriously why cry about animal testing? Why not cry about say Halal meat? Butchering in general, cow skining etc etc. They are only guinea pigs which are being bred, not like they are special primates who are gonna be extinct.

They have gone through shit to be honest and its twats attitudes like yours that dont help. At the end of the day, you feel so admirable about it how about you stop eating meat, stop using shampoo etc, and stop buying shoes and wallets.
I personally dont care about their livelyhood if it involves production of animals for needless animal testing. That is my position on this and similar matters.

Now, you dont know me at all. If you did, you would know that I do not eat halal meat because of how it is killed, I buy shampoo where its ingredients have not been tested on animals, I buy man made shoes and dont use a wallet. If I see a product has any association with animal testing I avoid it. I do my best to stick to my beliefs on this without being extreme.

As far as eating meat is concerned I admit to finding that harder to avoid, its a combination of weak will and my upbringing. Even so, I dont eat a lot of meat and did give up during and after the BSE scare except for occasional chicken dinners. I would have to be starving to even consider killing an animal to eat.

So what about you? Without being too presumptious I guess you stuff your face with as much meat as you can get, wear whatever fashion tells you too no matter how its made, and generally do what the hell you please because you are worth more than an animal. Well, as far as Im concerned people who abuse animals deserve nothing, they have no worth, certainly no more than even a lowly guinea pig.
CrashTester is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:19   #16
roadrunner_0
cynic
 
roadrunner_0's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

its ridiculous - its not like these animals are being use for cosmetic testing, they are for vital medical research, into diseases like cancer, things that kill hundreds/thouseands of people a year. As someone on the BBC site said, i hope that if these people have and courage in their convictions, they refuse any medication that has been tested on animals if they get any of these diseases, unfortunately, as i believe that they are cowards, i don't think that they will.
__________________
lazy
roadrunner_0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:24   #17
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadrunner_0
its ridiculous - its not like these animals are being use for cosmetic testing, they are for vital medical research, into diseases like cancer
Why does it matter whether its for cosmetic testing, or medical research? If the 'forced experimentation' that the Nazi's performed on Jews had actually been good science which led to the discovery of cures for major diseases, would this have made it anymore justifiable?

Last edited by Nodrog; 24 Aug 2005 at 11:31.
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:38   #18
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
Well I agree - and I find the whole animal rights movement completely appalling. However, if I did believe that bunny rabbits or whatever had some sort of moral worth then I'd agree with these tactics. Same with the crazy anti-abortionists. If I thought someone was murdering babies on a mass scale I'd probably be keen to try and stop it. And if the people behind these "murders" (i.e. the doctors in an abortion clinic, or the farmers who breed animals for experimentation) got hurt, well that's a small price to pay.
this isn't entirely a fair comparison, I feel, because while we could debate the likelihood of animal sentience until we're blue in the face, we can at least agree that it's a reasonable possibility. with a foetus in the early stages of development, however, there are no valid medical grounds for supposing this whatsoever - while the foetus is alive, it's alive in the same way a plant is alive.

Far more valid, even for someone who disputes animal sentience, would be infanticide (a la Chinese farmers under the one-child policy) - the sentience of the victim is disputable but at least there's something to dispute (facial recognition, learned reflexes, apparent emotions, ability to feel pain etc etc) - just as with animals.
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:39   #19
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horn
isn't this were the idea of rights seems a bit silly ?
surely most people agree that animals feel pain.
I dont think theres any firm evidence that shows animals feel pain. I suppose theres a small chance that higher level primates (apes etc) might, but I'd be amazed if guinea pigs felt or experienced anything.
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:41   #20
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phang
this isn't entirely a fair comparison, I feel, because while we could debate the likelihood of animal sentience until we're blue in the face, we can at least agree that it's a reasonable possibility. with a foetus in the early stages of development, however, there are no valid medical grounds for supposing this whatsoever - while the foetus is alive, it's alive in the same way a plant is alive.
That's missing the point slightly since the anti-abortion nuts don't view sentience as the defining characteristic of why foetuses be saved. My point wasn't really about whether the arguments were equally valid but that the logic behind both groups seems identical.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:42   #21
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
I dont think theres any firm evidence that shows animals feel pain. I suppose theres a small chance that higher level primates (apes etc) might, but I'd be amazed if guinea pigs felt or experienced anything.
kick a dog and see if it whines and runs away. you could argue that it's some kind of fight-or-flight mechanism, but then, isn't that what pain is?


actually, don't kick a dog. that would be pretty ****ish. but if you did, it would whine and run away, or possibly attack you if it was big enough.
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:43   #22
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phang
kick a dog and see if it whines and runs away. you could argue that it's some kind of fight-or-flight mechanism, but then, isn't that what pain is?
As I've said many times, if I "attack" a comptuer game character it could run away (if so designed). This doesn't actually really mean anything though in terms of what it's "feeling".
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:43   #23
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
That's missing the point slightly since the anti-abortion nuts don't view sentience as the defining characteristic of why foetuses be saved. My point wasn't really about whether the arguments were equally valid but that the logic behind both groups seems identical.
i thought 'killing a sentient life' was the main argument of anti-abortionists who were trying not to look religious?
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:44   #24
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phang
anti-abortionists who were trying not to look religious?
What, all three of them?

edit : Besides, a foetus at certain stage of development is probably more comparable to an animal than a plant.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:44   #25
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
As I've said many times, if I "attack" a comptuer game character it could run away (if so designed). This doesn't actually really mean anything though in terms of what it's "feeling".
well how do you explain the phenomenon?
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:45   #26
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
What, all three of them?
very droll.
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:46   #27
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phang
kick a dog and see if it whines and runs away.
This isnt evidence of it feeling pain. A spider will run away if you try to kill it, but spiders almost certainly dont feel pain.

Quote:
you could argue that it's some kind of fight-or-flight mechanism, but then, isn't that what pain is?
No, unless you want to argue that the bots I play against in Unreal Tournament experience pain.


edit: damn you darien
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:47   #28
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phang
well how do you explain the phenomenon?
Explain what? A computer game character has been consciously designed to run away when it experiences certain stimulus after (e.g. being shot) in a game like Half-Life 2 (say).

An animal has evolved to run away when it experiences certain stimuli through natural selection.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:49   #29
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phang
well how do you explain the phenomenon?
if ((health < 50) & (guess_heath(opponent) > 50) & (gun != BFG)) {run_and_find_armour();}
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:49   #30
roadrunner_0
cynic
 
roadrunner_0's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
Why does it matter whether its for cosmetic testing, or medical research? If the 'forced experimentation' that the Nazi's performed on Jews had actually been good science which led to the discovery of cures for major diseases, would this have made it anymore justifiable?
ouch, way to compare something completely different. You have said yourself in a different reply about animals feeling pain and sentience, so, you kind of answered your own question. of course the nazi experimentation could never be justified - they experimented on people, who didn't have a choice and the experiments were both appaling and painful, and were probably deliberately designed as such. As to your other point, yes, testing for cosmetic/medical purposes makes the world of difference. Cosmetic testing was banned as unneccisary, whereas they have yet to come up with a viable alternative to animal testing for medical purposes, although they are trying.
__________________
lazy
roadrunner_0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:50   #31
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
An animal has evolved to run away when it experiences certain stimuli through natural selection.
how on earth do you define pain?
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:53   #32
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadrunner_0
ouch, way to compare something completely different. You have said yourself in a different reply about animals feeling pain and sentience, so, you kind of answered your own question.
How have I answered my own question? If animals feel pain, then why isnt medical experimentation wrong? If animals dont feel pain, then whats wrong with cosmetic testing?

Quote:
Cosmetic testing was banned as unneccisary
Why is cosmetic testing worse than medical testing?
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:56   #33
Marilyn Manson
Gone
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,656
Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Exclamation Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
Their behaviour makes perfect sense if you believe in animal rights.
You keep saying this whenever this topic comes up, and it's always pretty fatuous.

If I was a Nazi, then the Holocaust would make perfect sense. But I'm not. So it doesn't.
Marilyn Manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:56   #34
roadrunner_0
cynic
 
roadrunner_0's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

just to add another point as well, if a slightly different one. About the difference in viewpoints, there seems to be very emotive language used in the viewpoints of the activists, with words like 'torture' and 'mass slaughter' (although why any lab would waste money just to best hundreds of guinea pigs to death with hammers or something is beyond me ) whereas the scientists seem to be come across as much more rational and calmer.
Why do you think this is?
__________________
lazy
roadrunner_0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 11:58   #35
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadrunner_0
just to add another point as well, if a slightly different one. About the difference in viewpoints, there seems to be very emotive language used in the viewpoints of the activists, with words like 'torture' and 'mass slaughter' (although why any lab would waste money just to best hundreds of guinea pigs to death with hammers or something is beyond me ) whereas the scientists seem to be come across as much more rational and calmer.
Why do you think this is?
MM already invoked Godwin's for this thread so **** it:

I bet the jews were a little tetchier than the camp guards.
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:01   #36
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson
If I was a Nazi, then the Holocaust would make perfect sense. But I'm not. So it doesn't.
Well there are plenty of people who formally support an idea of animal rights but then still shy away from this type of reasoning. So people support animal cruelty laws yet think the ALF or whomever are evil.

I don't know if there are any NAZI's who shy away from the holocaust though, so I don't know if that's a good comparison.

But yes, if there is someone out there who openly promots NAZI ideas but still thinks the holocaust was awful then they should probably be shown that one leads to the other.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:01   #37
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadrunner_0
just to add another point as well, if a slightly different one. About the difference in viewpoints, there seems to be very emotive language used in the viewpoints of the activists, with words like 'torture' and 'mass slaughter' (although why any lab would waste money just to best hundreds of guinea pigs to death with hammers or something is beyond me ) whereas the scientists seem to be come across as much more rational and calmer.
Why do you think this is?
I'm not sure what you mean. The Western world tends to be pretty emotive about the killing of a few million jews ("absolutely disgusting beyond words"/"the worst atrocity of the 20th century"), whereas the Nazi's seemed a lot calmer and detached about it - it was just a bit of social engineering to try and increase racial purity.

Last edited by Nodrog; 24 Aug 2005 at 12:07.
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:02   #38
roadrunner_0
cynic
 
roadrunner_0's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
How have I answered my own question? If animals feel pain, then why isnt medical experimentation wrong? If animals dont feel pain, then whats wrong with cosmetic testing?


Why is cosmetic testing worse than medical testing?

lets try this a different way then, if you ask most scientists, from whatever backround, they will say that they would rather not test on animals (and not just cos they are afraid of getting beaten up) BUT, as things stand, there is no viable alternative for medical purposes, in fact, if you could come up with one i think that you could probably make yourself very rich indeed. However, they did come up with a viable alternative to cosmetic testing, and therefore the govt' could legislate agains't it as being unneccisary.
__________________
lazy
roadrunner_0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:02   #39
Marilyn Manson
Gone
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,656
Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Exclamation Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadrunner_0
Why do you think this is?
Because the activists are incensed by the supposedly grossly morally objectionable activity of the scientists, whereas for the scientists it's both morally acceptable and banal.
Marilyn Manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:02   #40
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phang
how on earth do you define pain?
As I have said before, I'm happy to define pain in a way that animals feel pain. But then if you're also saying that bots also feel pain then (which your definition seems to imply) then the whole argument of "they feel pain therefore we shouldn't hurt them" is pretty silly.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:04   #41
pig
1up on you
 
pig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Birmingham, UK
Posts: 4,007
pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.pig has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrashTester
I personally dont care about their livelyhood if it involves production of animals for needless animal testing. That is my position on this and similar matters.
Well im sure that if you stopped for a minute, you could hopefully see that animal testing is often a means to end, to find new diseases, test new drugs which could help in the fight of cancer

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
Now, you dont know me at all.
what a relief judging that you support this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
If you did, you would know that I do not eat halal meat because of how it is killed, I buy shampoo where its ingredients have not been tested on animals, I buy man made shoes and dont use a wallet. If I see a product has any association with animal testing I avoid it.
Thats very admirable (there is no sarcasm there, I truly believe it) However I dont think I could do it, although as a person you are seeming alot better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
I do my best to stick to my beliefs on this without being extreme.
hrmmm but you said...

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
I think they have done a sterling job in closing this place down and hopefully bankrupting this family.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
As far as eating meat is concerned I admit to finding that harder to avoid, its a combination of weak will and my upbringing. Even so, I dont eat a lot of meat and did give up during and after the BSE scare except for occasional chicken dinners. I would have to be starving to even consider killing an animal to eat.
Ok so youre quasi vegetarian. Once again alot of respect to you, I know its difficult as my three sisters are all vegetarian.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
So what about you? Without being too presumptious I guess you stuff your face with as much meat as you can get,
I live in a family who are vegetarians who dont eat meat. So no I dont stuff my face with meat, although I love it and if its a choice between veg or meat, meat any day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
wear whatever fashion tells you too no matter how its made,
I think you will find I dont wear whatever fashion tells me. Saying this my older sister does buy me an array of fashionable clothes each time she returns from new york and yes I wear them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
and generally do what the hell you please because you are worth more than an animal.
Finally yes I am worth more than an animal. Being an equal to an animal is a load of bollacks. I can respect an animal, but I will never see them as an equal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtester
Well, as far as Im concerned people who abuse animals deserve nothing, they have no worth, certainly no more than even a lowly guinea pig.
Thankgod thats your opinion and not the consensus .
__________________
pig
[1up]
pig is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:05   #42
roadrunner_0
cynic
 
roadrunner_0's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.roadrunner_0 has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

why oh why do you keep relating this to the nazis?
__________________
lazy
roadrunner_0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:06   #43
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horn
If you consider it ok to sacrafice an animals life to save a humans' then that is one thing....
but to consider it ok to sacrafice an animal's life in order to feed your vanity then obviously it is different.
\Why?
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:06   #44
the_dastardley_chihuahua
Damn Dog
 
the_dastardley_chihuahua's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,249
the_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud ofthe_dastardley_chihuahua has much to be proud of
Re: vile despicable people

saw this on c4 news last night. i was utterly surprised, jon snow conducted the worst interview i have ever seen in my life

it would be a crazy world if it was decided that animals had rights.
__________________
"that's a stupid thing to say and you're a stupid person for saying it."
the tolling gang
the_dastardley_chihuahua is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:07   #45
Marilyn Manson
Gone
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,656
Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Exclamation Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
Well there are plenty of people who formally support an idea of animal rights but then still shy away from this type of reasoning. So people support animal cruelty laws yet think the ALF or whomever are evil.
I imagine you can be in favour of an end to these kinds of activities without resorting to terrorist and/or criminal methods. I assume the guinea pig farm would close should here be a change in the law, and would not actually require physical force to close it down.

The ALF use the methods they do presumably because they implictly recognise their views could never gather sufficent public support to come into law, not because it's 'the only way', legally speaking.
Marilyn Manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:12   #46
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadrunner_0
lets try this a different way then, if you ask most scientists, from whatever backround, they will say that they would rather not test on animals
Like everyone else, the attitudes and prejudiges of scientsts will be heavily influenced by their cultural surroundings. In the West, we tend to anthropomorphize animals and shy away from hurting them unnecessarily. With this in mind, it isnt really surprising that most scientists would prefer not to harm animals. But while this may be interesting from the point of view of cultural anthropology, it tells us nothing about whether animals feel pain or should be given rights.


Quote:
BUT, as things stand, there is no viable alternative for medical purposes, in fact, if you could come up with one i think that you could probably make yourself very rich indeed.
Here is a viable alternative - dont experiment on animals, and if that hinders the development of new medicine, then so be it. If medical progress required forcible experimentation on humans then I suspect most people would say "well in that case - to hell with medical progress!". If animals have rights, why is the situation any different?
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:14   #47
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson
I imagine you can be in favour of an end to these kinds of activities without resorting to terrorist and/or criminal methods.
I'm not really sure what this proves. Of course you "can" be in favour of whatever you like.

Obviously yes you can be tactically against certain approaches, but that's different from moral disgust which a lot of people seem to have.

And even if you're right about the ALF, I'd imagine that even if they believed that in 10 years time their view would be law that still wouldn't be enough ; 10 years of mass murder / torture of animals is probably quite unappealing to them.
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:23   #48
Marilyn Manson
Gone
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,656
Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Exclamation Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
I'm not really sure what this proves.
It proves that they're not being forced into their actions as the only course of action avaliable to them. They chose to do what they do instead of peacefully agitating in favour of their views.

Your earlier asertion that people who believe in animal rights are being disengenuous when they don't go along with these people is simply false.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
10 years of mass murder / torture of animals is probably quite unappealing to them.
It could take ten years to change the law, but it will take forever to scare all guinea pig farmers into submission. In fact, it will never happen.

Better the former than the latter.
Marilyn Manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:24   #49
CrashTester
I am an idiot
 
CrashTester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,145
CrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant futureCrashTester has a brilliant future
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadrunner_0
its ridiculous - its not like these animals are being use for cosmetic testing, they are for vital medical research, into diseases like cancer, things that kill hundreds/thouseands of people a year. As someone on the BBC site said, i hope that if these people have and courage in their convictions, they refuse any medication that has been tested on animals if they get any of these diseases, unfortunately, as i believe that they are cowards, i don't think that they will.
Why do people think that abusing animals for the sake of medicine is OK? It simply isnt.

I dont believe there are many people here who would stand by and watch someone kick a dog to death in the street. So why do these same people think its OK to torture animals for any reason at all? I personally dont.

We cant change what has happened before so any progress made as a result of animal testing was not ours to decide, so why shouldnt I or anyone else benefit just because I dont believe its right to continue animal testing now?

With the knowledge we already have and computer simulations I believe there is little need for animal testing at all, besides which the results are not always accurate - animals are not human afterall so how can they be?.

If we need to test experimental drugs or proceedures then why not use humans who have the condition that needs curing? The results will be wholly more accurate and useful and it would eliminate the need to torture animals. If I were ill with a condition or disease that could not be treated with anything but experimnental drugs/proceedures I would volunteer myself in a heartbeat instead of taking the healthy life of any other creature.
CrashTester is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 24 Aug 2005, 12:26   #50
Nodrog
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,476
Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Nodrog has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: vile despicable people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horn
you're (me) making a measured value of the animals life, i.e. why can't you consider an animal's life to be worth less than your daughters, yet worthy enough not to be ended in order for you to have extra glossy lipstick ?
Do you have any principled way of structuring your hierarchy of values here, or is it just down to personal choice? I mean if someone were to say "The development of a cure for cancer is worth more to me than the entire race of negroes - lets make them all subjects for forced experimentation!" would you have any non-arbitrary objection to this, or would it just be a matter of confliciting opinions? And is this really any different from the animal situation?

Quote:
you're (you, i think) making an assumption that rights must be assigned to a being that you consider worthy of them, but they are constructions we have made, they are not objective, they are subjective.
I dont really know what this means. I suppose it depends on how you are using the word 'objective'.

Last edited by Nodrog; 24 Aug 2005 at 12:32.
Nodrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 18:36.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2002 - 2018