go go go Exilition

[Jumo]

Originally Posted by Phil^

mud sticks.
post all you want, I dont think you are going to change the opinion of some people here, myself included.
My gut feeling tells me that exilition are not completely cheat-free, this feeling being based on what i saw from them while i was multihunting, and investigating them.
Just because i didnt get enough evidence to close them all doesnt mean they arent potentially cheating you know.

Is any alliance cheat free Phil^? What about the other alliances that had closures?

1up and Wolfpack was it?

[Spritfire]

Originally Posted by Jumo

Is any alliance cheat free Phil^? What about the other alliances that had closures?

1up and Wolfpack was it?

I would bet you a penny on that eXi have the highest amount of closed planets during this round.

Anyone else wanna take the bet ?

[Phil^]

Yup, other alliances had closures too, but not near the scale exilition had

[virogenesis]

Originally Posted by SteInMetz

WP at mass recruiting to keep #1 spot non-shocker

Posting crap again..... spot non-shocker

[Virall]

Originally Posted by Phil^

mud sticks.
post all you want, I dont think you are going to change the opinion of some people here, myself included.
My gut feeling tells me that exilition are not completely cheat-free, this feeling being based on what i saw from them while i was multihunting, and investigating them.
Just because i didnt get enough evidence to close them all doesnt mean they arent potentially cheating you know.

End of.

[virogenesis]

All alliances have a few bad apples thats all even fury took some in back in the day

Enf of.......

[Spritfire]

Originally Posted by Phil^

Yup, other alliances had closures too, but not near the scale exilition had

My point is proven.

If there was a reason for closing them. ( I BET there was one ).
This is good enough proofs.

Exilitions should be removed. Planetarion dont like cheaters.
And members saying they dont cheat. Right.. my name is barney and I am green ?

[virogenesis]

Originally Posted by Spritfire

My point is proven.

If there was a reason for closing them. ( I BET there was one ).
This is good enough proofs.

Exilitions should be removed. Planetarion dont like cheaters.
And members saying they dont cheat. Right.. my name is barney and I am green ?

Can't win without a merge so trying to get the enermy removed thats sad....a few cheat so all those that don't have to suffer get real.....
Hi Barney

[TheRat]

Originally Posted by Jumo

An amazing amount of shit

Originally Posted by Bash.org

i'm going to become rich and famous after i invent a device that allows you to stab people in the face over the internet

[Zh|l]

Originally Posted by virogenesis

All alliances have a few bad apples thats all even fury took some in back in the day

Enf of.......

You seem to like attracting my attention nowadays.

Fury was never known for any mass cheating, nor in it's history did we have any repeated/mass closures.

[Spritfire]

Originally Posted by virogenesis

Can't win without a merge so trying to get the enermy removed thats sad....a few cheat so all those that don't have to suffer get real.....
Hi Barney

Your patetic <-- what does that have to do with this thread ?
Nothing.

Same as your post it has nothing todo with this thread.

We wount win with the merget neither, it wasn't the point. Who has been told in another thread.

[Virall]

Originally Posted by virogenesis

Can't win without a merge so trying to get the enermy removed thats sad....a few cheat so all those that don't have to suffer get real.....
Hi Barney

Ok ok. You're quite correct:

We can't win without a merge.

Trying to get the enemy removed IS sad (but necessary).

A few do cheat.

[Amycus]

Originally Posted by Jumo

Congrats on knowing nothing and spreading lies.

How about you go buy a clue, and realize that none of Dragons HC who organized the mass botting, got closed, etc. from the last pia round are affiliated with EXilition.

I'm glad you pointed that out.

Pia??????? All this horse shit flowing on these boards are based on another f-ing game???

Who the hell plays ******** anyway? Worse yet who plays that horrible clone with so much seriousness to bring your politics to this game?

Take your crap play and your crap attitudes back to your crap game and boil over your little conspericies.

[Amycus]

Originally Posted by Spritfire

We wount win with the merget neither, it wasn't the point. Who has been told in another thread.

Horse shit. That whole merger was to try to shoot to the top. I am sorry now that SiN had to pick ND considering your representation of them here.

Your a loser and can't do anything about that so you have to make stupid accusations.

I hope all of ND isn't like this, seems that the alliance is going downhill now that the old BlueTuba members are fading away.

[aNgRyDuCk]

Originally Posted by Amycus

I'm not trying to take a side here and I could be wrong, (correct me Phil^?) but from what I have seen in other games, one way in dealing with planets and investigating is a temp. suspension while the issue was being investigated.

There is a possibility that this was what happened with the reopened ones. Maybe not I don't know.



That almost makes me want to play next round

no, his "intel" comes from the info posted by Kal in the #alliances channel the night they were closed

[Amycus]

Um what does what I said have anything to do with your comment?

[aNgRyDuCk]

Originally Posted by Jumo

Is any alliance cheat free Phil^? What about the other alliances that had closures?

1up and Wolfpack was it?

we're not talking about other allianes, we're talking about Exi

[TheRat]

In this thread I post a lot of crap noone cares about, so they can flame me with a lot of crap I dont care about. This all continues until a mod has had enough and closes it. Then we start a new thread and press rewind.

[aNgRyDuCk]

Originally Posted by Amycus

I'm sure your intel is 100% accurate too?

Please say yes because if you do that means 2 things:

1) your lying

2) your lying?

I was glad to see SiN make the move to try to win this round by joining with ND, but it is a shame that they now have members that are total sore losers.

my bad, got the wrong post quoted earlier..... anyways, the "intel" came from Kal in the #alliances channel the night the closure's happened

[aNgRyDuCk]

Originally Posted by Amycus

Horse shit. That whole merger was to try to shoot to the top. I am sorry now that SiN had to pick ND considering your representation of them here.

Your a loser and can't do anything about that so you have to make stupid accusations.

I hope all of ND isn't like this, seems that the alliance is going downhill now that the old BlueTuba members are fading away.

the reasons for the merger were explained VERY clearly in other threads, as someone posted earlier to you, read the posts first so you know what the hell your talking about please.... suppose we should consider the source though, go Exi!!!

[Bashar]

Originally Posted by Jumo

Is any alliance cheat free Phil^? What about the other alliances that had closures?

1up and Wolfpack was it?

1up had 2 closures that I know of. Both members were instantly booted. They were however allowed to return when multihunters reopened the planets. Most alliances have had closures this round, and a lot of the closures have been very suspect. I don't doubt this applied to some exilition closed, however I do very much doubt it applied to all closed exilition.

[virogenesis]

Originally Posted by Zh|l

You seem to like attracting my attention nowadays.

Fury was never known for any mass cheating, nor in it's history did we have any repeated/mass closures.

Please quote me on my statement about mass cheating I merely stated fury took in some known cheaters in the past.
All alliances suffer from cheating, some hcs suspect something is going on, some promote it & some will kick you out & use you as a farm.
To say an alliance is complety clean is insane.

Lets look at the ratio in school classrooms.....30 pupils.....one in 30 is more than likey to be a total prick...

Zh|l you hate how everyone compares both ecl & 1up to fury.
They always say llook out here comes fury....bla bla bla 1up don't play fair & all that crap....

Don't you think eXil are sick & tired of being compared to dragons\ldk.
To have their core brought up every second must get extremely annoying for them as it does for you.

Please don't say fury never accepted cheaters because I know they did.
They recruited a known closed r6 top10 planet in r8 if you have any concerns about this little fact feel free to message me.

I personaly know no dragons/ldk.... or anything like that nor have I seen this round properly progress so my opion is somewhat weak but can you honestly say 5% of the allie do infact cheated


As for you Spritfire if your allie didn't post towards other allies then maybe I wouldn't post flamebait (as some may call it I don't personaly I call it the truth as it hurts)
But I have seen ND flame vsn, hr & wp but why?
Any need?
Do you get brownie points?
I haven't actually seen any other alliance flaming & trolling the board infact mayibe I'm just walking around with my eyes closed who knows.
Point is all alliances have cheaters proving a cheat is another thing.


Zh|l I am aware of fury kicking out cheaters aswell as letting them in.

[Bashar]

Virogenesis, stop reading things into peoples posts that aren't there. The post you just made is mostly bullshit. For example, point out where Zhil said fury never had any cheaters. If you want to argue with someone, at least argue about something they said.

[Spritfire]

Originally Posted by Amycus

I'm glad you pointed that out.

Pia??????? All this horse shit flowing on these boards are based on another f-ing game???

Who the hell plays ******** anyway? Worse yet who plays that horrible clone with so much seriousness to bring your politics to this game?

Take your crap play and your crap attitudes back to your crap game and boil over your little conspericies.

Hi and Hello.
I dont know if you have read the threads posted longer up ( ppl usually have a scroll wheel on their mouse, if not you can use the up and down arrows on your keyboard , if you not have crushed them when you go to mad and slapped the keyboard )

PA Team confirmed that exi have hadd the most % amount of PLANETS closed by all alliances.
That is proof enough. You guys cheat, someone else prolly do to. But their alliance dont protect them. Thats the problem here, a cheating alliance.

We inn SiNND would have kicked a cheater right away, but you would have asked for his vnc login and pa user/pass. little different here.

Sorry if you find our intel to good for your brain to absorb. That is not our problem tho, but yours.

Conclusion is still: Exilition cheat, they belive wining a game with atleast 50% of the players have been closed once for cheating is actually wining it.
We other alliances who dont cheat, but play fair ( yes we prolly have one or two cheaters around to, I didn't say that. ( but if we find them they are byebye )) dont think your win is a win. We belive that if you end first , the right first spot is in #2

So I will never congrats you with the win. I doubt many else will to.

[virogenesis]

Originally Posted by Bashar

Virogenesis, stop reading things into peoples posts that aren't there. The post you just made is mostly bullshit. For example, point out where Zhil said fury never had any cheaters. If you want to argue with someone, at least argue about something they said.

Nor did I mention fury had a record of mass cheating I was clearly stating all alliances have bad apples my argue was all alliances have cheaters thats all now trying looking back in my thread to see were I said Fury had a record of cheating I stated a fact nothing more nothing less....now go back read or learn to.... even.... if you can infact read how about proving it by saying sorry?
Could be a start....i guess

[Spritfire]

Dont find any good answers for your post virogenesis.
We flame whatever we feel like.
All alliances have cheateres. yes thats prolly true. But there's a big different in % here ( as stated above from phil^ ).
We have kicked 1 players this round for cheating, We reported him ourself.
Does this make you feel bether ?

[Bashar]

Originally Posted by virogenesis

Please don't say fury never accepted cheaters because I know they did.

Explain this before you start accusing me of not being able to read, unless you are having a pre-emptive argument.

my argue was all alliances have cheaters

Ummm, right, so that was your 'argue'. Tell me what the relevance of that argument is? Also tell me where anybody ever suggested otherwise. The point is not an issue of whether or not all alliances have cheaters, it is that a certain alliance has a culture of cheating.

To say an alliance is complety clean is insane.

To be using this as an argument in the context of your post, you imply someone has said that, this is not the case.

if you can infact read how about proving it by saying sorry?

I am sorry you miss the point so much. Zhil was not saying that you had accused Fury of such cheating. I guess I could reword his post slightly so you might understand its meaning better:

Originally Posted by Zh|l

Unlike Exilition, Fury was never known for any mass cheating, nor in it's history did we have any repeated/mass closures.

I hope this clears things up for you.

[Cooling]

Originally Posted by virogenesis

Nor did I mention fury had a record of mass cheating I was clearly stating all alliances have bad apples my argue was all alliances have cheaters thats all now trying looking back in my thread to see were I said Fury had a record of cheating I stated a fact nothing more nothing less....now go back read or learn to.... even.... if you can infact read how about proving it by saying sorry?
Could be a start....i guess

Your point had already been made earlier in the thread, read up next time?

The people making intelligent posts in this thread (and no you are not one of them) already realise that there exists in every alliance an undesirable element that do cheat. That is almost a truism these days.

The argument is that Exil may or may not have a higher proportion of cheaters than other alliances. Perhaps you could make some posts regarding that, instead of reiterating irrelevancies.

[Amycus]

Spritfire how you became HC of ND is beyond me. It seems that all you can do is insult, and jump behind any running "eX is an alliance of cheaters" support.

I could care less how many former eX planets got closed due to them cheating.

Why??

Because they are gone and if they are not gone then they did nothing wrong. So why are we still kicking your ass?

I pay to play this game just like you do. I feel wronged if I lose to cheating bastards just like you do. The difference between us is that I'm not likely to jump on the next "we are sore losers so we are calling EVERYONE in eX cheaters because they had more cheaters than we do" bandwagon.

Don't fall off else you may become the next cheater.

[Treveler]

Originally Posted by Amycus

I'm glad you pointed that out.

Pia??????? All this horse shit flowing on these boards are based on another f-ing game???

Who the hell plays ******** anyway? Worse yet who plays that horrible clone with so much seriousness to bring your politics to this game?

You seem a little defencive there peon. You knowingly joined an alliance/core of players with a history of cheating. Now, naturally, you are "marked" as one as well, or at least as someone who dont care if your own alliance organise cheating at the highest level.

Btw, the Dragon/ldk core has a history of cheating in both pia and pa, so no matter how you look at it you lose.

Take your crap play and your crap attitudes back to your crap game and boil over your little conspericies.

I assume this was meant for your own alliance right? As they just came from that crap game with their crap attitude and their crap bot abuse...

[I am Idler]

Originally Posted by Jumo

Congrats on knowing nothing and spreading lies.

How about you go buy a clue, and realize that none of Dragons HC who organized the mass botting, got closed, etc. from the last pia round are affiliated with EXilition.

Did your parents have any children that lived ? I bet they regret that!

I am pretty sure you know that quite a few of the chaps in exil have gotten planets closedin earlier rounds of planetarion.. ofcourse this wasnt their fault as I am sure you will claim.

Here, let Peter North spray some cum in your face.

:Tripplesquirt:

[Cooling]

Originally Posted by Amycus

I pay to play this game just like you do. I feel wronged if I lose to cheating bastards just like you do. The difference between us is that I'm not likely to jump on the next "we are sore losers so we are calling EVERYONE in eX cheaters because they had more cheaters than we do" bandwagon.

Don't fall off else you may become the next cheater.

This might go against the 'party line' so to speak, but this is probably one of the better points in this thread.

But I dont understand the part about being sore losers quite yet; as I'm sure the argument from 1up's perspective does not go:

1) We are losing the round
2) Lets grasp at straws to explain our loss

Therefore

3) Exil are cheating scum.

If people in 1up thought that, THEN we would be sore losers, and that would be rather shit. All people should be doing at this stage is raising a concern as to these allegations, irrespective of alliance bias (if that is even possible). No doubt there would be people in EX who would be equally as pissed off if certain members of their alliance were caught.

If I were an Exil member I would want these allegations cleared up, and PROVEN to be false, rather than adopting a defensive stance. It is in your best interests, unless you lot want to be known as LDK 2, and have the effort you put into doing so well this round be under a cloud of suspicion and rumor, because in PA you really ARE guilty until proven innocent (as shit as that sounds).

[SteInMetz]

Originally Posted by virogenesis

Can't win without a merge so trying to get the enermy removed thats sad....a few cheat so all those that don't have to suffer get real.....
Hi Barney

tbh, the goal for the merge was never to win, and i kinda now as im very involved in it..
oh, and did it or did it not make the round more exciting?

[Kjeldoran]

Originally Posted by Cooling

because in PA you really ARE guilty until proven innocent (as shit as that sounds).

And that's exactly why I gave Phil a hard time in r10 with all my bitching and complaining about the way multihunters work and how accused pple get dealt with.

In most legal systems you're innocent till proven guilty. In PA ,when accused, you're guilty unless proven innocent. And as JBG posted elsewhere, it's easier to prove someone IS doing something wrong then for that person to proven he's NOT doing anything wrong ...

[Cooling]

KJ the point was intended to be more subtle than that, I was reffering to Guilt in the eyes of the rest of the playerbase, not the multihunters.

Exil may or may not give a flying fcuk about their public image at the end of the round, they might not even care that people suspect they won by cheating (sour grapes?). But that does put a dampner on your alliances achievements, having the question hanging unanswered and unresolved does nothing for an alliances reputation.

I am prepared to admit at this point that the evidence is hardly compelling, in fact most of it is circumstantial at best, yet the question still remains. It hasnt been proven, it hasnt been disproven, and my argument is simply that the best way to clear up these allegations is for Exil themselves to open up their players to further scrutiny. Though how they could practically manage this is beyond me.

It boils down to this, 1up's win last round has been said by some people to be well deserved etc, assuming exil win this round, would people say the same thing? Do Exil 'deserve' recognition for a well played round with such a skeleton still rattling in their closet? Should they even care what the rest of pa thinks?

The answer is probably no to both questions.

[qebab]

Originally Posted by Spritfire

My point is proven.

If there was a reason for closing them. ( I BET there was one ).
This is good enough proofs.

Exilitions should be removed. Planetarion dont like cheaters.
And members saying they dont cheat. Right.. my name is barney and I am green ?

Aha. Lets remove an alliance from the game. That would surely mean everything will be okay afterwards! What brilliance! Why noone thought of that before, is beyond me.

Yet, saying an entire alliance should be removed because it had higher amount of closures (please, do read as closures and not deletions), than other alliances, well, the only place one could expect to find an attitude such as this is indeed the internet. I do know it is a wild comparison, yet bear with me, I'm just trying to be sarcastic:

There are more nazis in germany (no idea wether it is true or not, and not meaning to insult anyone either) than other places, so just remove the country. A-bombs finally got their use!
Oh wait...

Originally Posted by Spritfire

Hi and Hello.
I dont know if you have read the threads posted longer up ( ppl usually have a scroll wheel on their mouse, if not you can use the up and down arrows on your keyboard , if you not have crushed them when you go to mad and slapped the keyboard )

PA Team confirmed that exi have hadd the most % amount of PLANETS closed by all alliances.
That is proof enough. You guys cheat, someone else prolly do to. But their alliance dont protect them. Thats the problem here, a cheating alliance.

Thank you for explaining to people how to work a scroll wheel and the arrows on their keyboard. Also, it is possible to use the mouse, dragging the sliding bar up and down.

Yet again, eXilition had the most % amount of planets closed, and the reason they were not deleted was probably that they (PA multihunter team) did not have sufficient evidence of cheating to delete them, or, that they were not actually cheating. Pardon for voicing that possibility, no matter how unlikely you think it is, someone had to say it!

A cheating alliance... An alliance that cheats in other words. An alliance breaking the EULA? Or an alliance with members breaking the EULA? In that case, all alliances (most of them anyway) can be defined as 'cheating alliances'. I realize though, that the idea that sprung to your mind, is that all eXi's were cheating, and thus, the entire alliance should be removed. Correct?
Being no eXi myself, I won't guarantee that it is not true, yet, judging by the people I know in said alliance (I do not know too many of them), I very much doubt it is anywhere near truth.

Originally Posted by Spritfire

Conclusion is still: Exilition cheat, they belive wining a game with atleast 50% of the players have been closed once for cheating is actually wining it.
We other alliances who dont cheat, but play fair ( yes we prolly have one or two cheaters around to, I didn't say that. ( but if we find them they are byebye )) dont think your win is a win. We belive that if you end first , the right first spot is in #2

May I stress once more, that having had 50 % of your members closed (I must say, I believe that number is quite exaggerated, though I don't know for sure). I myself have been accused of cheating, and someone even tried getting me closed! I also know people who have been closed, and reopened because they did not actually do anything wrong.

A win is, regardless what way, a win. See it whatever way you like, if eXi finish #1 on rankings, they will be the winners of the win. If 40 eXi's are deleted for cheating, they won't finish #1, but they will still get the rank they achieved. You don't have to like it, neither do I (having experienced being bashed and beaten by bots in 'that other game', I feel myself entitled to having an opinion on that matter).

Finally, I want to say, I do in no way support cheaters, I support 'justice' and 'law' (or, my idea of justice, and pa mh teams idea of law). eXi has cheaters, and I do hope they get caught (of that I am 100 % sure), but as long as the Pa team can not delete them, I don't think you should blame the entire alliance for what noone can prove a few (or several, I don't know how many) are doing. I picked your posts, Spritfire, because they were the most radical, but it accounts for a lot more of the people writing in this thread. Lastly, I have no grudge against anyone here, even though this post might have made it look otherwise.

[Kargool]

Originally Posted by Spritfire

Dont find any good answers for your post virogenesis.
We flame whatever we feel like.
All alliances have cheateres. yes thats prolly true. But there's a big different in % here ( as stated above from phil^ ).
We have kicked 1 players this round for cheating, We reported him ourself.
Does this make you feel bether ?

Yet your players are abit strange I have to admit Spritfire. My ND galmate sendt me his login and password. So I reported him and he got closed.

Maybe ND should explain their players how the rules work?

[Wishmaster]

always the same shit.

In pa u r clearly guilty b4 proven innocent, and it is IMPOSSIBLE to be PROVEN innocent.

so - all r guilty?

[Tesla]

/me eats qebab again

EDIT:
HI WISHYWASH!!1

[Wishmaster]

lo honey

[Virall]

Personal Opinion Time:

We seem to be going around in circles here. This is obviously an issue that will always be supported from the stance of an individual's alliance. If I were in Exilition and i didn't believe that we were cheating, I'd launch an investigation to ensure that my attitude towards it was followed by the members.

People are quite correct in stating there is no sufficient proof. I can't remember how many times I have read that in this post, but we must remember why there isn't sufficient proof; it's (the use of VNC) virtually undetectable.

The scary thing for me isn't the fact that Ex are winning (although it is annoying), it is the fact that I was sceptical about their guilt until I was convinced by integral characters left, right and centre. It isn't the fact Ex are winning that is frustrating people, it is the fact that you look guilty. I would wonder how many Ex players would deny that they even look suspicious. But the fact is you do and the consequences for this could be catastrophic for the game.

I'm sure you are all experienced enough to imagine what these consequences are and how detremental they would be for all of us and the game; we have had cheaters before, multi's farms and bots. But an alliance based on cunning and bending/breaking the rules just disappoints me.

I want to believe you, I really, really do. But I can't.

[zen]

Originally Posted by Virall

... But an alliance based on cunning and bending/breaking the rules just disappoints me.

But an alliance based on dedication, activity, cooperation and skill is quite impressive. Go Exilition, go.

[Hugin]

I know VNC is not used. Just ask some peoples phonebills, heh.
Farming? Look at average score, again a not valid point.
Closed planets? I can remember 3. Two in the same city and last one for a rather odd reason.

Get a life

qebab <3

[G.K Zhukov]

Originally Posted by Phil^

Yes, they can get reopened with a cap if they explain some, but not all of the evidence to the satisfaction of the multihunter handling their case.
Just because they CAN get reopened does not mean that they will
it is up to the multihunter investigating them, and ultimately to the head multihunter (Xontas) at the end of the day

How stupid, if you explain some then your left out without a real penalty. So let me say it again, you let those cheaters have to many options to get themselfs out of it without beeing deleted.

Then help out and gather evidence to assist the Mhs rather then just whinging about it.

1) Im not wasting time on this game anymore 2) I have done in the past, and it led to nothing.

The multihunters are far from incompetant, and the tools have been improving (slowly) for a few rounds now.
The relatively high demand for evidence is there BECAUSE PEOPLE PAY TO PLAY.
Would you like it, if at the whim of a multihunter you got closed just because you unwittingly attacked someone who later turned out to be a farm planet?
Would you also like it if you lost the credit you had paid for when you got deleted?
I think not.
Incidently the burden of evidence required has decreased since r10,r11. Before it used to take a substantial amount, and a pretty much certainty that they couldnt possibly be innocent or explain anything of it at all

1) Oh? Letting people off with a cap isnt incompetence. I guess we differ on that.
2) The rounds who were free, just as recently as 9.5, were not really better in terms of MH'ing. Various alliances (including some of the regular cheaters) used swarms of small planets with just fi/co ships to attack and defend with. These small planets were so active, that they were online 24/7 almost. And the cheaters didnt even bother just using them 2-3 times, oh no. But did the MH's managing to close them, nope. I reported several such planets in r8, who got used by Darki, and they sure didnt get closed either.

3) And even if they pay to play, doesnt mean they have the right to ruin the game for the rest. I know there will be pressure to let cheaters go (like with a "cap"), so that they sign up next time, just for bringing in the money. However, treating the majority of the players that way (becouse you treat them like sh*t, when you let someone cheat and get away with it) will lead to fewer of them signing up to a next round. Its not that fun beeing attacked at 5 every night, couse someone is account-sharing/multying etc.

Stop thinking about it that way. Think like this: "Lets get those cheaters AWAY from Planetarion, so that we can create a game with a level playing field who is able to attract more players".

Besides, it's a 5 quid per planet or so, not 21 year in jail we are talking about.

Those are there already. Its called "Detector admin" in the admin tools.
Ofc you wouldnt exactly know this since you havent seen the tools they have available

So the exhiltion planets got cought by that system? And still, if such a system is going to be of some use, you gotta stop letting people go "with a cap" eh.

On their own, i disagree.
In combination with other evidence - it already is.
Some people use a proxy unknowingly, Those on AOL for instance.
When they use the aol browser it puts them through one of several aol proxies.

You know Im not talking about those poor people using AOL and similar shitty ISP's.
Remember the incident were someone from Europe suddenly logged in from Mexico? And than from Europe again, faster than a plane could have brought him back? It's still posible to catch cheaters that way, even if I suspect people who multi/account-share have been more aware of it. Again, your just to nice to suceed.

See above point about people paying to play.

See above my points in care for the majority.

Incase you didnt hear, i retired a while back.
Still im sure that the rest of pateam/jolt has listened and will probably respond in more or less the same way i have.

Still not getting it?

[lokken]

These alliances, while complaining, perhaps should be more pro-active. If Exilition are as 'active' as they claim to be, they could simply choose to pick a proportion of suspicious Exilition galaxies, and have them monitored day in day out by pa team. Their role would be to up their dedication, make sure these planets have no more than 40 minutes sleep at any time (and to stick to only those targets), and if they're that dedicated, they'll be unable to play in a matter of days or they'll be caught in some shape or form. Even if you don't catch anyone, you've ensured that 100 individuals have had a miserable time of it physically for days on end, so they might quit in anycase if they're that bothered about winning.

[Nolez]

Wow. So many idiots, so little time...

Let's see... Where do we start...

Originally Posted by Treveler

Erm, more or less everything you've said.

Yes very good. You've done two BRILLIANT things here. First off, you've accused an alliance of something in another game that you personally have no proof of and know very little about. However, I will not deny this fact as I have seen good evidence against the fact that there was botting. Then, the next great thing you did, was you associated another alliance's actions in another game to EX's in PA. EX didn't bot. Dragons did. It wasn't in Planetarion. It was ********. So really, you have no point there. Are there cheaters in EX? Most likely. Are there more than any other alliance? No, we have no proof of that. I'll let qebab handle that.

Originally Posted by qebab

Yet, saying an entire alliance should be removed because it had higher amount of closures (please, do read as closures and not deletions)...

Exactly. Really, everyone just "thinks" they know that EX is cheating, and they are just SO sure of it. No one, at least no one that has posted here, has proof of EX cheating. It's not hard to syncronize fleets between a few people. It's not hard to call others to wake them up for defense and attacks. So really, unless you can show us/me something and say they are cheating because ____, you really shouldn't talk, as it makes you look pretty stupid.

Lastly...

Originally Posted by big_horn

i cheated in round 1/2 i was in an inactive gal so i made another account in the hope the gal would be more active. This was done with the absalute intention of closing the other account if this one turned out to be in a decent gal. Of-course the minute did that the older account's gal started to pick up.... i ended up playing the round with two accounts.

I did that too, in round 3. But I actually had an entire 25 man gal of accounts. I named them Matt1 of Matt1 through Matt25 of Matt25. I actually played for quite a while before I got closed, and then I couldn't figure out why...

Needless to say I haven't since

[lokken]

Originally Posted by Nolez

Yes very good. You've done two BRILLIANT things here. First off, you've accused an alliance of something in another game that you personally have no proof of and know very little about. However, I will not deny this fact as I have seen good evidence against the fact that there was botting. Then, the next great thing you did, was you associated another alliance's actions in another game to EX's in PA. EX didn't bot. Dragons did. It wasn't in Planetarion. It was ********. So really, you have no point there. Are there cheaters in EX? Most likely. Are there more than any other alliance? No, we have no proof of that. I'll let qebab handle that.

Exactly. Really, everyone just "thinks" they know that EX is cheating, and they are just SO sure of it. No one, at least no one that has posted here, has proof of EX cheating. It's not hard to syncronize fleets between a few people. It's not hard to call others to wake them up for defense and attacks. So really, unless you can show us/me something and say they are cheating because ____, you really shouldn't talk, as it makes you look pretty stupid.

The first paragraph while understandable, seems to be lacking 'experience'. The general trend is that usually those who cheat in similar games using those methods cheat here. I for one am left in two minds, either there are some fantastic liars on this thread OR that there's a section of exilition planets (who may well come from a 'dodgy' background) that indeed are cheating, it's just that they are keeping it to themselves if cheating is indeed going on. I believe the latter half is the most likely myself.

The second paragraph seems to be more of the same. While they have no concrete evidence to prove x, y or z there are certain fleet actions and growth rates from earlier in the round that are thoroughly consistence with previously closed cheats. They've got every right to be suspicious, they're simply frustrated with the fact that they can't nail anyone with cast iron proof (and to be honest there are players who exilition have recruited might well be worth of a 'reputation') - last round I found 3 top 100 LCH/VsN planets farming each other to prevent enemies from taking roids (farming being the voluntary movement of roids from one planet to another), but because they had done it on a one off, remained open, when even the PA team member who I spoke to agreed that they were cheating (considering they had a shared galaxy channel which they even invited me to on one occaison and were in friendly alliances), there was simply no way of securing a closure/deletion because the system in place was inadequate and couldn't legislate for one-offs and highly suspect behaviour.

The idea of 'beyond reasonable doubt' in planetarion is not necessary, this is civil law and only requires the burden of proof of 50/50. If a PA team member honestly believes someone is cheating, he should feel under no pressure not to close/delete him, provided he gives time to the planet in question to persuade him otherwise.

The r12 system in my view allowed a top 10 planet to roid another voluntarily to achieve a higher rank, and if a couple of steps are taken, then there should be no problems - this cannot be allowed. if 'capping' planets is the only way round this (to ensure you can punish planets when you believe they are cheating, but can't prove it to achieve deletion), then I'm happy it's in place, personally I'd penalise those planets on what XP they can gain, chop their fleet in half and remove all their score in XP.

[pig]

Originally Posted by lokken

personally I'd penalise those planets on what XP they can gain, chop their fleet in half and remove all their score in XP.

once again Lok, a great post and the majority of it I aggree with, especially this part. XP and fleet is what makes this round, not roids. Im sure if you asked the top 10 roids or fleet, you would get the reply fleet, likewise with XP. In certain rspects I feel for the pa team, as they are obliged to serve all members of the pa community from exilition to F-Crew, but it must be rather frustrating when they themselves admit cheating is most likely occuring, yet nothing is going on.

I think something for round 14 needs to sort out these issues in clear black and white.

[G.K Zhukov]

Seriously, Lokken and pig, what happened to actually closing a planet? When did you get soft?

[pig]

Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov

Seriously, Lokken and pig, what happened to actually closing a planet? When did you get soft?

Im not a pateam member, if it was up to me, I would close where I felt a substantial amount of evidence was there to close. However im not a multihunter thus I cant comment. If they arent going to close planets, where suspicion reigns then the only thing one can do is accept the lack of closure but try to develop a system which is just as painful, hence the proposal of removing xp and fleet rather than roids.

I still feel full closures are the way to go, but if for a number of reasons this is not possible then I wont push a for a lost cause so to speak.