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Unread 22 Sep 2014, 18:25   #51
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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Dear TheoDD and Kaiba,

Stop talking to each other.

Gratefully,

The rest of us.
QFT

also mz you should be part of stat team
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Unread 22 Sep 2014, 18:51   #52
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I refuse to be part of committees. I do this shit for fun. I have too many meetings as is.
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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Unread 22 Sep 2014, 19:35   #53
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Here's to keeping this thing on the tracks:

Cain, I like the posts you've made and they're good suggestions. Haven't had time to really chew on them enough to comment but you're pointing in the right direction.

I've avoided the 'alliance point system' thread intentionally because math scares me. I'll do what I always do when a sound (and more intelligent than mine) opinion is needed--Paging mz to that thread! :P
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Unread 23 Sep 2014, 09:27   #54
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

My initial suggestions on those threads are flawed in many ways (mainly the pop and gov suggestions). The alliance point system is the most important one to look at.

There has to be a scoring system in place where ANY action you make is rewarding towards your alliance points. I think this is mainly important for the casual players so they feel their actions have some impact.
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 08:11   #55
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

tbh, start of this round people were moaning hard about Papadoc's stats and personally think they've been a great success this round. Lots of race diversification, and no one race really dominating.

I dont necessarily think keeping these stats is a bad idea, but something similar?

Whatever you do, people will moan
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 08:48   #56
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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Originally Posted by Krypton View Post
tbh, start of this round people were moaning hard about Papadoc's stats and personally think they've been a great success this round. Lots of race diversification, and no one race really dominating.

I dont necessarily think keeping these stats is a bad idea, but something similar?

Whatever you do, people will moan
this set is ok, but it isn't finished. There are several flaws that you've probably haven't noticed. And at the pace we are preparing for R59, i sence another unfinished set again.
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 09:29   #57
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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this set is ok, but it isn't finished. There are several flaws that you've probably haven't noticed. And at the pace we are preparing for R59, i sence another unfinished set again.
Yeah it's been noticed :P Still, I'd like this set to be finetuned for perhaps not next round but the one after. It's a good set, and some minor changes and logic fixes would make it better (cutter price, or etd FR pod e/r as prime examples) (thief name :P).

That said, I'd be hard pressed to find something OP or particularly underwhelming (except perhaps zik as a whole :P) I do kind of miss the FR pods for cat, but understand why they were excluded.

Anyway since I'm a bit of a rogue I considered getting involved with this, but there's probably a LOT of other people far better for the job.

In any case, I did mess around early round with a somewhat different approach. It is on the main tab labelled "Support Classes"

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=482493826

(hope that works :P)

Make sure to read the comment on the right hand side.

I eventually dismissed it because there was put too much pressure on the FR/DE classes (with FI and CR not really being able to target one anoher), but it might inspire someone or something.

The idea was that every race can solo by using 2 classes (so by using FR+DE, or FI+CO), or team up with FI or CO (etc) only. I think this would allow for more creativity in alliance and personal strategies.
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 10:15   #58
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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Originally Posted by Machado View Post
Yeah it's been noticed :P Still, I'd like this set to be finetuned for perhaps not next round but the one after. It's a good set, and some minor changes and logic fixes would make it better (cutter price, or etd FR pod e/r as prime examples) (thief name :P).

That said, I'd be hard pressed to find something OP or particularly underwhelming (except perhaps zik as a whole :P) I do kind of miss the FR pods for cat, but understand why they were excluded.

Anyway since I'm a bit of a rogue I considered getting involved with this, but there's probably a LOT of other people far better for the job.

In any case, I did mess around early round with a somewhat different approach. It is on the main tab labelled "Support Classes"

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=482493826

(hope that works :P)

Make sure to read the comment on the right hand side.

I eventually dismissed it because there was put too much pressure on the FR/DE classes (with FI and CR not really being able to target one anoher), but it might inspire someone or something.

The idea was that every race can solo by using 2 classes (so by using FR+DE, or FI+CO), or team up with FI or CO (etc) only. I think this would allow for more creativity in alliance and personal strategies.
its not the etd fr pod e/r that is the problem its the cost compared to the fr fleet ships.
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 14:24   #59
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Machado is right.
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 15:16   #60
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

BS teamup is too good imo.
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 15:26   #61
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Still 5 races, still 6 classes. Just shuffled into a different order from last round. It gets old, do something different for once!!!
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 16:43   #62
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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Still 5 races, still 6 classes. Just shuffled into a different order from last round. It gets old, do something different for once!!!
You cant expect any major changes for r59 but r60 is nice round number and I cross my finger for smth good there
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 17:03   #63
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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You cant expect any major changes for r59 but r60 is nice round number and I cross my finger for smth good there
I know we all hold out hope but come on, the PA team doesnt even read the forums.

They have no drive to fix or improve the game, just oversee its death kneel whilst Lunar_Lamp syphons off some beer tokens for the weekends.

Why did they do ingame clickable advertising for a 2 day event like the World Cup but not for a 7 WEEK round of PA. Why dont they do something ultra basic like award 15 roids to you if you click all the AD banners, its all income into the game but they cant even be bother to do something simple like that.

I was thinking about asking to join this Stats Commitee, wether or not i would be wanted is another point entirely, but i decided from the responses from certain people/flamers/trolls that sum up this game it is not worth anyones effort anymore to try and help this game until the people at the top start caring.


It is no longer a case of tweaks and rehashes to keep things ticking over, a massive overhaul and original thinking session is needed to change the game to make things better/different/new.

Problem is though that opinions like those of the aforementioned are keeping this game in the dark ages, they are happy now they can actually do something in the game and get a decent rank now everyone who was any good at the game has now left or is idling and using Norton Airlines to commute to planets these days.
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Unread 25 Sep 2014, 17:25   #64
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

If the stats arent fixed by tomorrow im going hostile on the stat maker
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 14:05   #65
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Think I've waited long enough for this clown who has put up a draft set of stats on the beta server... http://beta.planetarion.com/manual.pl?page=stats

Where to start... Just rename the game to Spamatarion.

There is no ship strategy imagination, I'm trying to figure out if this is one big trollololol or you are just genuinely clueless to the combat engine mechanics and ship flaking.

I would welcome an explaination to the layout from the creator of these "stats" and how players are going to enjoy them.
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 14:54   #66
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Oh, Shhhhh, now you've done it. The mighty Paisley is mad!
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 15:34   #67
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Since my idea for the shipstats set is too different from what people are used to. I've asked appoc to free up the beta server for whoever else had a shipstats set they wanted to put forward.
And good luck to them in advance
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 19:14   #68
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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I refuse to be part of committees. I do this shit for fun. I have too many meetings as is.
A former Chairman of mine had a good quote on this subject, "Committees should always consist of an odd number of members ............. and three is too many".
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 19:31   #69
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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Since my idea for the shipstats set is too different from what people are used to. I've asked appoc to free up the beta server for whoever else had a shipstats set they wanted to put forward.
And good luck to them in advance
I got some stats i want to put up! they are allready finished basicly
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 19:35   #70
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I like these stats how ever, they are very simple and not so complicated.
It would be easy to make team ups as every race got FR
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 20:13   #71
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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I refuse to be part of committees. I do this shit for fun. I have too many meetings as is.
seconded



okay, everyone else, Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh has agreed that his stats appear to be a bit too controversial and is happy to step aside to let someone else set up their stats.


Tia's next up if he's still willing?
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 20:53   #72
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Ohh pls not Tia again... anyone except Tia
Or Bitcher
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 21:22   #73
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Shhhhhh all is forgiven, we will play with binary code if necessary, just not Tia!!!
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 21:28   #74
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Yeah please not Tia.
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Unread 26 Sep 2014, 23:11   #75
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Well my stats are basicly finished, if you still got em around they will be easy to load into the beta.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 01:32   #76
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Ok, please calm down the FLAME! unless BB wants to make his stats into ST and wants to rework them time to move on to something different.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 02:47   #77
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Stats loaded in. Bare in mind they are ST.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 04:08   #78
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Link please Tia, I'm lazy.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 06:21   #79
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

http://beta.planetarion.com/manual.p...n=174992789266

For those that are lazy to click beta.planetarion.com

Please if you have something to say make sure its productive. I am open to ideas and changes and suggestions but you must provide a reason for it.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 06:23   #80
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Might want to give Cath anti-Fi.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 06:58   #81
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I think i fixed all the misskeys when i entered them. Cath has anti Fi as does Etd.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 08:13   #82
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I think it would be a boring round with these stats... There are no guns!!!!!
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 08:48   #83
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

The fact that they are ST automatically makes me 30% more positive about them.

First thing I notice is how absolutely brutal xan looks defensively. Going to be 100% IMPOSSIBLE to keep any roids whatsoever.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:13   #84
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I was looking at that, Xan have weakness vs fi which is pretty obvious, but patrikc pointed out as well xan along with every race will need hulls3 to be able to target everything.

Now that usually isnt that big of a deal but xan's research makes it hard to keep up with things like core/hct/tt/hulls. So i was considering adding a Xan De that hits bs at low init to compensate but not atm.

As for the rest of xan, Banshee stops etd De and will eventually stop ter De late round because of d/c. Phantom and cutlass have the relationship i want. Pulsar stops zik fr but not xan fr.
Xan fr is good it roids all the Co, and defends well enough vs ter De. So other than xan losing hard to Fi I dont actually see a problem. I wanted these stats to have attack options everywhere. With still offering defense options for everything. But isilx if you see something specific about xan def that stands out as being wrong let me know and ill look into it.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:27   #85
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I thought Tia was banned from making stats?
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:30   #86
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

If you don't have something constructive to say then say it in private Because what we need less are people that are toxic towards other people.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:34   #87
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I don't have a problem with xan being quite open, as they are often very strong offensively. Both the Pulsar and the Spectre fire after fleets roiding them and have no ships flacking them, meaning that xans are pretty much not going to be able to cover fr and bs all round long.

I would look into adding another DE to xan, that either hits BS or FR.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:43   #88
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Well Pulsar stops zik fr dead in its tracks. Hitting at over 100% before they get to fire, and as for dealing with other xan fr's Viper/corsair/pulsar work quite well as a team but Fr/Fi was part of my plan for balancing with xan. As for the Added De, ive thought about it and if I were it would target BS(lots of fr targeters already) and it would be init 9 with a solid emp res but shitty a/c and moderate d/c.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:59   #89
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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If you don't have something constructive to say then say it in private Because what we need less are people that are toxic towards other people.
No what im saying is that your stats has a reputation to be boring and uncreative.
Id rathe see something wich is based around alliances being able to do strats.
You said yourself you never care for what strats are possibole, only that the stats looks good from a mathimatical prespective.

And i would gladly re-run stats, or continue working on the stats i prepared for last round.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 10:03   #90
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

What is the point of Roach targetting DEs when there are no DEs targetting CR?
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 10:18   #91
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Some Changes Added a few extra Ships to limit the need for every race to get to hull 3.

Slyph Ter Fr T1 Cr
Widow Cath Fi T1 De [Cath still require hulls3 for anti bs but not too worried]
Fireblade Xan De T1 Bs
Clipper Zik De T1 Bs
Rogue and Pirate got swapped Rogue now Steal vs bs init 19 and Pirate Normal vs Fr init 5 to counter the added ships that target Cr before steal.
Gryphon Etd Fr T1 Cr
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 10:22   #92
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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No what im saying is that your stats has a reputation to be boring and uncreative.
Id rathe see something wich is based around alliances being able to do strats.
You said yourself you never care for what strats are possibole, only that the stats looks good from a mathimatical prespective.
It's not up to the stats maker to make the alliance strats for them. Its the alliances decision what to do after the stats are published. Just because your not imaginative enough to come up with your own idea from a set of stats doesn't mean that every alliance wont. They seem to do it every round, and honestly every round in the past 10 rounds has been boring but not because of stats because of the idea that the game has to be based around team and alliance play when its a SOLO game played with friends.

Once again I say, if you don't have something constructive to say then keep it to yourself. If you just want to flame there is an entire Forum board call AD and there is plenty of room for trolls and toxic players there.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 10:30   #93
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I agree with Tiamat. Criticize stats, not stats makers. No matter what you may think of people, SD is emphatically not the place to vent.

On topic: signups open in 3 weeks (I think?), so there's plenty of time for people to make stats. Go forth!

[edit] Hmm, It's in 2 weeks. That's a little tighter. Perhaps it would be a good idea to have a existing set to fall back on?
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 10:32   #94
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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It's not up to the stats maker to make the alliance strats for them. Its the alliances decision what to do after the stats are published. Just because your not imaginative enough to come up with your own idea from a set of stats doesn't mean that every alliance wont. They seem to do it every round, and honestly every round in the past 10 rounds has been boring but not because of stats because of the idea that the game has to be based around team and alliance play when its a SOLO game played with friends.

Once again I say, if you don't have something constructive to say then keep it to yourself. If you just want to flame there is an entire Forum board call AD and there is plenty of room for trolls and toxic players there.
What rounds have you made stats in?
And ill come up with examples from these, where you went wrong in the past.
I havnt even looked through your stats yet, but im guessing i should go Terran, and i should be in forts with what ever Terran match up with, and ill cover all my bases with enough value.
Am i totaly off?
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 10:40   #95
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

You could try, and the only thing you would be effective against is Fi. But you go ahead thinking that. ST stats are very different then normal stats because of the value spread in order to "cover" your bases. It also makes for a much more attack oriented round with defense requiring active and smart race choices to cover things.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 11:22   #96
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

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You could try, and the only thing you would be effective against is Fi..
Well thats what im aiming at.
Last stats you made was extremly ter/* fort strats.
There was nothing but ter/* and cath in top20.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 12:02   #97
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

I dont necesary think adding more ships is the best idea. I mean from a balancing point of view maybe but what is the problem of needing hulls 3 to stop hulls 3 ships? That is perfectly fine.

I'm ok with Widow as it targets DEs but all the other ships targeting CR/BS arent really needed imo.

In a single target round every race SHOULD have holes. Speaking of that I think DE are a bit too powerfull compared to the other roiding classes
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 12:40   #98
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Not terrible at first glance.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 12:50   #99
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

cant say i disagree either :-p
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 14:00   #100
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Re: Stats - Round 59 and beyond

Having holes is one thing, having playable strategies is another.
FI/CO will rarely be a strategy when there is one CO race and one FI race.
I personaly dont like ST rounds.
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