Planetarion Forums

JammyJim · 27 Dec 2002, 13:04

http://edition.cnn.com/2002/HEALTH/1...ing/index.html

suggest you read.

be amazing if they have. and the implications are massive...

Ste · 27 Dec 2002, 13:43

hmm... good thing... bad thing...
designer babies...
It's probably a good thing that we have the technology to do it... A bad thing if it gets carried out any more than very rarely.

27 Dec 2002, 13:46

The world will be an even more elitist place. I can't decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing; regardless the standards will increase, people will be more resistent to decease and virus, ultimatly granting us eternal life. There's boud to be a screwupp somewhere along the run..

queball · 27 Dec 2002, 14:09

Quote:

Originally posted by RiCo
The world will be an even more elitist place. I can't decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing; regardless the standards will increase, people will be more resistent to decease and virus, ultimatly granting us eternal life. There's boud to be a screwupp somewhere along the run..

heh
notice the similarity:

Quote:

http://www.faqs.org/faqs/ai-faq/genetic/part6/

ELITISM:
ELITISM (or an elitist strategy) is a mechanism which is
employed in some EAs which ensures that the CHROMOSOMEs of the
most highly fit member(s) of the POPULATION are passed on to the
next GENERATION without being altered by GENETIC OPERATORs.
Using elitism ensures that the minimum FITNESS of the population
can never reduce from one generation to the next. Elitism
usually brings about a more rapid convergence of the population.
In some applications elitism improves the chances of locating an
optimal INDIVIDUAL, while in others it reduces it.

I don't really care if other people clone themselves. It's pretty clear to me cloning is a bad decision to make for myself, but that doesn't make it controversial.

Mushroom · 27 Dec 2002, 14:18

can you imagine if someone like Hitler had human cloning at his disposal?

Ye gods, the clone wars could become a reality! :eek:

[GAP]Obiwan · 27 Dec 2002, 14:25

Quote:

begun the clone wars have

Gayle29uk · 27 Dec 2002, 14:31

Quote:

Originally posted by Mushroom
can you imagine if someone like Hitler had human cloning at his disposal?

Ye gods, the clone wars could become a reality! :eek:

Never mind that, someone could clone Yahweh! Clearly a horrible concept

Ragnarak · 27 Dec 2002, 15:06

Quote:

Originally posted by Gayle28uk
Never mind that, someone could clone Yahweh! Clearly a horrible concept

and here i was thinking we'd kicked him outta the gene pool for ever :/

KaneED · 27 Dec 2002, 15:13

all the sci-fi dreams become reality.

:/

xtothez · 27 Dec 2002, 15:22

Quote:

...religious movement called the Raelians, the doctrine of which asserts that life on Earth was created by extraterrestrials

Quote:

Eventually the group wants to learn how to clone an adult, then "transfer the brain to the clone."

AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

27 Dec 2002, 16:41

Pld all those fit women who will be kidnapped and then cloned ...

W · 27 Dec 2002, 16:45

Cloning someone does not copy that someone's mind.

27 Dec 2002, 16:49

Quote:

Originally posted by W
Cloning someone does not copy that someone's mind.

Have any evidence?

Gayle29uk · 27 Dec 2002, 16:49

Quote:

Originally posted by W
Cloning someone does not copy that someone's mind.

NEWS JUST IN: MEN CAN BE CLONED WITH TODAY'S TECHNOLOGY! Women will have to wait a few years till they learn how to copy a mind

Cochese · 27 Dec 2002, 17:27

We are far too ignorant as a civilization to be cloning people.

There are other uses though...cloning organs, etc, which is good...but entire people=very, very bad.

Haer · 27 Dec 2002, 18:02

Any technology which helps my goal of living forever is a plus in my book.

Ste · 27 Dec 2002, 18:32

Quote:

Originally posted by Androme
Have any evidence?

Because your memory isn't stored in your DNA.

Quote:

Originally posted by Haer
Any technology which helps my goal of living forever is a plus in my book.

Except it won't be you living forever... It'll just be someone who looks like you....

Chrism · 27 Dec 2002, 18:36

Living forever would be a bit crap really. Eventually you'd just get bored.

Ragnarak · 27 Dec 2002, 18:44

Quote:

Originally posted by Chrism
Living forever would be a bit crap really. Eventually you'd just get bored.

i agree but...

i wonder what our preoccupation with mortality is preventing us from discovering/inventing/etc

if people no longer had to worry about death (say someone 'backs up' their mind on a hard drive, if they are in a car crash and die, just upload their brain to a cloned body and it's as if nothing happened) then they could really concentrate on greater things

just think what a mind like penrose or hawking could acomplish given millenia to investigate a problem with no worry of death hanging over their shoulder

W · 27 Dec 2002, 19:01

Quote:

Originally posted by Androme
Have any evidence?

I have reason, and no accepted theory to counter it.

BesigedB · 27 Dec 2002, 19:08

Quote:

The Raelians, who claim 55,000 members worldwide, believe human life was created by DNA brought to earth by an alien race

Quote:

The group's headquarters, called UFO Land

These quotation lead me to doubt the organisation in question.

Emperorn · 27 Dec 2002, 19:49

Quote:

Originally posted by Ragnarak
i agree but...

i wonder what our preoccupation with mortality is preventing us from discovering/inventing/etc

if people no longer had to worry about death (say someone 'backs up' their mind on a hard drive, if they are in a car crash and die, just upload their brain to a cloned body and it's as if nothing happened) then they could really concentrate on greater things

'someone' would still be dead

[Cymru] · 27 Dec 2002, 20:32

Quote:

Originally posted by RiCo
The world will be an even more elitist place. I can't decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing; regardless the standards will increase, people will be more resistent to decease and virus, ultimatly granting us eternal life. There's boud to be a screwupp somewhere along the run..

-------------------------------------------

Anyone seen the film Gattaca, basically about designer babies, the cloning ideas and all that. A society in which normal conventional babies are seen as illegitimate outcasts of society. All babies will be made with a job and function in mind.

S C A R Y !

BesigedB · 27 Dec 2002, 20:35

Quote:

Originally posted by [Cymru]
Anyone seen the film Gattaca, basically about designer babies, the cloning ideas and all that. A society in which normal conventional babies are seen as illegitimate outcasts of society. All babies will be made with a job and function in mind.

S C A R Y !

I saw that when it was on BBC1, quite a worrying story.

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 20:46

Quote:

Originally posted by RiCo
The world will be an even more elitist place. I can't decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing; regardless the standards will increase, people will be more resistent to decease and virus, ultimatly granting us eternal life. There's boud to be a screwupp somewhere along the run..

We don't have the genetic knowledge to alter anyone's DNA to produce desireable changes of that sort; we don't even know what causes it.

Quote:

Originally posted by Mushroom
can you imagine if someone like Hitler had human cloning at his disposal?

Ye gods, the clone wars could become a reality! :eek:

Clones would still require the same upbringing as normal babies, they just have identical dna.

Quote:

Originally posted by KaneED
all the sci-fi dreams become reality.

:/

Hardly.

And in general:

1. We don't know it's real or not.

2. Every other cloning attempt has had an extremely low success rate; it would be possable to clone a human now, but at what cost?

3. Eugenics is a long way off whatever happens.

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 21:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Ragnarak
if people no longer had to worry about death (say someone 'backs up' their mind on a hard drive, if they are in a car crash and die, just upload their brain to a cloned body and it's as if nothing happened) then they could really concentrate on greater things

Yeah but say you did it yourself,and you died in a car crash and your conciousness was loaded into a new body from a backup that person would think and act just like you but you'd be dead.
People would just continue on and not give a second thought to the fact that that person really isnt you.
So it really doesnt benifit you.

If I died I'd prefer ppl to mourn me and get on with their lives rarther than have died and someone who's supposed to be me boning my gf,spending my money and drinking my beer.

Ragnarak · 27 Dec 2002, 21:09

Quote:

Originally posted by IncubusGod
Yeah but say you did it yourself,and you died in a car crash and your conciousness was loaded into a new body from a backup that person would think and act just like you but you'd be dead.
People would just continue on and not give a second thought to the fact that that person really isnt you.
So it really doesnt benifit you.

If I died I'd prefer ppl to mourn me and get on with their lives rarther than have died and someone who's supposed to be me boning my gf,spending my money and drinking my beer.

but would it be you or not?

is a 'soul' (or whatever you want to call it) a tangible thing that can be transfered?

what is it that makes you you?

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 21:50

Quote:

Originally posted by Ragnarak
but would it be you or not?

is a 'soul' (or whatever you want to call it) a tangible thing that can be transfered?

what is it that makes you you?

Clearly it wouldnt be me ,Id be dead,but to the guy created from the backup nothing would be amiss,it'd seem like he'd lived my life uninterrupted.

My 'soul' would be dead.

That's my point.
And anyway,he'd only be created from a backup and would have missed out on bits of my life as well...plus the moment he is concious he isnt me,he has new expreiences.

So basically your handing the keys of your life over to someone who's almost exactly like you but isnt you..

Im just wondering who would do that?

W · 27 Dec 2002, 21:54

Quote:

Originally posted by IncubusGod
Clearly it wouldnt be me ,Id be dead,but to the guy created from the backup nothing would be amiss,it'd seem like he'd lived my life uninterrupted.

My 'soul' would be dead.

That's my point.
And anyway,he'd only be created from a backup and would have missed out on bits of my life as well...plus the moment he is concious he isnt me,he has new expreiences.

So basically your handing the keys of your life over to someone who's almost exactly like you but isnt you..

Im just wondering who would do that?

Do you have teleporterphobia too?

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 21:57

Quote:

Originally posted by W
Do you have teleporterphobia too?

Yeah,that's what I was thinking too...fs

I dont wanna be copied then suffer a horrible death.

SCREW YOU FUTURE! THIS IS ONE EXOTEMPORAL EXISTANCE YOUR NOT FU*KING WITH!

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 22:00

Quote:

Originally posted by IncubusGod

How do you know you're not replaced every night with a replica of yourself with the same memories?

JonnyBGood · 27 Dec 2002, 22:04

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
How do you know you're not replaced every night with a replica of yourself with the same memories?

In fairness, that has more impact when I say it. At least some people think I actually believe it then.

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 22:04

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
How do you know you're not replaced every night with a replica of yourself with the same memories?

Cue: PARANOIA!

AuuUuuGHhHHHH!!!

Hehe,well,I'll find out tonight then won't I...if Im killed I'll have a brief moment of knowing the truth b4 Im snuffed out.

Then the next version of me can lead what's known as my life...honestly I doub that'd happen as it'd be something interesting happening to me for once :P

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 22:07

Quote:

Originally posted by IncubusGod
Hehe,well,I'll find out tonight then won't I...if Im killed I'll have a brief moment of knowing the truth b4 Im snuffed out.

I can't remember going to sleep last night. How can I be sure I did?

W · 27 Dec 2002, 22:11

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
How do you know you're not replaced every night with a replica of yourself with the same memories?

Even if I am, I would not wish to shorten my already drastically short life expectancy by stepping into a machine that disassembles me, then puts together a copy somewhere else. That copy too would have a very short life expectancy, as he would be convinced teleporters are perfectly safe and transfers your "soul" along with the body.

Anyway, you need to read the nights dawn triology by hamilton, along with the other end of time triology by pohl.

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 22:14

Quote:

Originally posted by W
Even if I am, I would not wish to shorten my already drastically short life expectancy by stepping into a machine that disassembles me, then puts together a copy somewhere else. That copy too would have a very short life expectancy, as he would be convinced teleporters are perfectly safe and transfers your "soul" along with the body.

Don't worry, there's a machine that gives you your soul back.

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 22:14

Think about it though,if a soul does exist and trancends to another level of existance when you die,then if teleporter's,hard drive copies and clones are gonna exist then the afterlife is gonna be clogged by "you's" and thousands of other versions of the same people.

hehe

Actually that may mean there could be enough Kylie's,Natalie Portman's and Kelly Brook's to go around!

I CANT WAIT TO BE DEAD!

Radical Edward · 27 Dec 2002, 22:19

Quote:

Originally posted by IncubusGod

Actually that may mean there could be enough Yahwe's Sunday8pms, MightyGoats and George Bushes to go around!

I DON'T WANNA DIE

W · 27 Dec 2002, 22:21

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
Don't worry, there's a machine that gives you your soul back.

I couldn't give a **** for my soul. It's my own existance I worry about. You see, I REALLY like existing.

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 22:22

Quote:

Originally posted by W
I couldn't give a **** for my soul. It's my own existance I worry about. You see, I REALLY like existing.

There's a machine for that too.

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 22:23

Just bury your etherial head into a hot celebrities breasts and you'll soon forget bout all the Sundays,MightyGoats and George Bushes...

Believe me

Radical Edward · 27 Dec 2002, 22:26

Quote:

Originally posted by IncubusGod
Just bury your etherial head into a hot celebrities breasts and you'll soon forget bout all the Sundays,MightyGoats and George Bushes...

Believe me

hmm... are you not forgetting the yahwe's too? I am honestly concerned for you :P

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 22:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Radical Edward
hmm... are you not forgetting the yahwe's too? I am honestly concerned for you :P

Hmmm...that does make a bit of a difference..

Maybe if we kill them all now we wont have to worry bout it,there'll only be one of each in the afterlife then

Radical Edward · 27 Dec 2002, 22:27

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
There's a machine for that too.

It's called a shotgun :P

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 22:30

Quote:

Originally posted by Radical Edward
It's called a shotgun :P

Not a pan lid or pair of binoculars then?

IncubusGod · 27 Dec 2002, 22:39

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
Not a pan lid or pair of binoculars then?

That makes about as much sence as Gravel Flavour Noodles

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 22:40

Quote:

Originally posted by IncubusGod
That makes about as much sence as Gravel Flavour Noodles

Not to you maybe, but it makes sense.

Radical Edward · 27 Dec 2002, 23:10

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
Not a pan lid or pair of binoculars then?

gimme the video training girl anyday.

MrL_JaKiri · 27 Dec 2002, 23:20

Quote:

Originally posted by Radical Edward
gimme the video training girl anyday.

With or without the axe?

Radical Edward · 27 Dec 2002, 23:23

Quote:

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
With or without the axe?

I think dominating women are a kind of turn on