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Unread 7 May 2003, 19:38   #1
xtothez
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Outsourcing

Whats the going rate for outsourcing projects these days? Specifically a short assigment on OO I need doing for this week, but have very little time to do so (the coursework is not based on any programming language, and is mainly UML diagrams).

Anyone up for a little on-the-side income? PM me on IRC if interested.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 19:41   #2
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What language like?

Stuff like this on rentacoder goes for around £20, dunno what Queball charged last time but as it went to charity (afaik) I'm sure you could stump up.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 19:53   #3
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It's all UML diagrams like:

Quote:
1
(a) Specify a UML use case diagram for these requirements as outlined in the scenario and within this domain. You are expected to demonstrate use of all major link types on your diagram.
There's no use of any coding language needed, its pure OO. And £20 is no problem if thats the going rate.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 19:54   #4
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UML I ain't encountered so I'll be no help, sorry =/

Queball, step up to the plate.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 19:57   #5
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Thumbs down

Don't you think you should do it yourself?

Whenever I've seen people have other people do their coursework, it always ends in tears....
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Unread 7 May 2003, 20:05   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
Don't you think you should do it yourself?
Of course I should.

However the perfect example of incompetance that is the Student Loans Company has left me with the only option of having to work my ass off doing extra shifts during my coursework/exam revision period to pay off essentials such as rent, food, petrol, etc. They find it hilarious to pay out the student loan several weeks later than it is needed. So now I have a busy weekend with 2 pieces of coursework left and exams starting next week I havent been able to revise for.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 21:01   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by pablissimo
What language like?

Stuff like this on rentacoder goes for around £20, dunno what Queball charged last time but as it went to charity (afaik) I'm sure you could stump up.
He hasnt provided me with a paypal account yet, im still waiting
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Unread 7 May 2003, 21:21   #8
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UML diagrams will take you 20 mins ffs. Instead of posting here sit down and do the work and your have it done in no time
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Unread 7 May 2003, 22:29   #9
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Re: Outsourcing

Quote:
Originally posted by xtothez
Whats the going rate for outsourcing projects these days? Specifically a short assigment on OO I need doing for this week, but have very little time to do so (the coursework is not based on any programming language, and is mainly UML diagrams).

Anyone up for a little on-the-side income? PM me on IRC if interested.
The idea of COURSEWORK is u do it urself, it proves what YOU can do. Not to get someone else to do it for you, it just doesn't work and defeats the point!
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Unread 7 May 2003, 22:51   #10
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Re: Re: Outsourcing

Quote:
Originally posted by Mit
The idea of COURSEWORK is u do it urself, it proves what YOU can do. Not to get someone else to do it for you, it just doesn't work and defeats the point!
You're a ****ing stuck up twat aren't you? Are you suggesting in the 'real world' you are not allowed to ask for help? If you are at work in a job you must do everything yourself with no help from anyone?

Wake up! Education doesn't matter, jobs don't matter, society doesn't matter. In 60/70 years time you will most likely be dead, where will your self-righteous mentality have got you then eh?

Use whatever skills you have to get by, be it your brain, your breasts or your wallet!
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:14   #11
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This guy isn't asking for help.

He's asking someone to do the entire thing.

In fact, if he had asked for help, he would of probably got all the answers he needs from other people, and all he would have to do is write them down and hand it in. But the fact he won't even do that little amount is the difference between just trying to get by, and plain laziness.

P.s If nothing matters, why spend all that time to write a reply complaining about someone's attitude. Surely their attitude doesn't matter.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:25   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
This guy isn't asking for help.

He's asking someone to do the entire thing.

In fact, if he had asked for help, he would of probably got all the answers he needs from other people, and all he would have to do is write them down and hand it in. But the fact he won't even do that little amount is the difference between just trying to get by, and plain laziness.

P.s If nothing matters, why spend all that time to write a reply complaining about someone's attitude. Surely their attitude doesn't matter.
How is doing the entire thing for him not the same a helping him? If you did his project, would you be hindering him?

As nothing matters, why not spend 'all that time' (60s) writing a reply....

Just because you can't do his UML is no reason to try and drag him (and myself) down!
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:30   #13
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Who said I couldn't do it?

In fact, because I can do it, and the reason for that is I learnt to do it through similar coursework myself while I was at uni, I see the benefit of someone doing the coursework themselves.

There is a difference between not knowing how to do something, and refusing to do it for someone else even though the task is given to them to reflect their ability in something. Would it be fair on the other students if the work I gave him was too such a high standard, theirs looked pale in comparison and they got a lower mark for it? Without him having done anything apart from lost $20.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:32   #14
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Re: Re: Re: Outsourcing

Quote:
Originally posted by ItotheDtotheI
Wake up! Education doesn't matter, jobs don't matter, society doesn't matter. In 60/70 years time you will most likely be dead, where will your self-righteous mentality have got you then eh?

Exactly as much as your education, job and society.

To be honest, uml diagrams are piss easy. Whip up your favorite spreadsheet program (Excel? Staroffice?) and it shouldn't take more than an hour or two. After all, what do you need that sleep for? You can sleep when you die.

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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:32   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
In fact, because I can do it, and the reason for that is I learnt to do it through similar coursework myself while I was at uni, I see the benefit of someone doing the coursework themselves.
Didn't you spend your entire university education in a permahaze of alcohol?
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:36   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dante Hicks
Didn't you spend your entire university education in a permahaze of alcohol?
And I STILL managed to get my damned UML done on time....
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:37   #17
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I'm working on some coursework now using UML, if someone asks for help that is fine, i don't mind helping (look on the forum, IRC etc) but when someone is asking u to do their entire coursework for them, that is just a bit too much. For a start, the mark they get at the end means NOTHING because they didn't do the work, thus what happens if they get a job, are required to do some UML (or whatever the subject may be) and can't do it at all, even thou they are 'qualified' on paper to do it!
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:39   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
Who said I couldn't do it?

In fact, because I can do it, and the reason for that is I learnt to do it through similar coursework myself while I was at uni, I see the benefit of someone doing the coursework themselves.
I wonder if you realize how unbelievably arrogant that is. He said he realized that it's better if he'd had the time, but at the moment he doesn't. Outsourcing is a completely legitimate way to get things done in the real world. Of course he'll be more independant if he is able to learn it properly. Hell, at my uni they actually encourage copying the coursework if you have no other way of getting it approved (only the exam counts for grades in this course).

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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:46   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mit
I'm working on some coursework now using UML, if someone asks for help that is fine, i don't mind helping (look on the forum, IRC etc) but when someone is asking u to do their entire coursework for them, that is just a bit too much. For a start, the mark they get at the end means NOTHING because they didn't do the work, thus what happens if they get a job, are required to do some UML (or whatever the subject may be) and can't do it at all, even thou they are 'qualified' on paper to do it!
He's not asking you to do it. He's offering to pay you to do it.

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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:47   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jester
I wonder if you realize how unbelievably arrogant that is. He said he realized that it's better if he'd had the time, but at the moment he doesn't.

Ok, lets say for an example Mr.X got through his GCSE's struggling. So Mr.X goes to college and pays for everyone to do his coursework for him, and they such a good job, it drags all his piss poor exam marks up, and he gets 3 C's. Now he goes to a fairly decent uni, with the same attitude. He pays someone to do all his coursework, AND his final disitation, and even tho he scrapes through his exams, he gets a 2:1 due to the high standard of his final project.

Now me and Mr.X go for a job. Mr.X gets that job. Is that fair? What happens when he sits down for his first day at his job and realises there is no one to do his work for him, no matter how much he will pay?

Obviously this is hypothetical, and a little over the top, but by what you are saying, it would be perfectly ok for Mr.X to do this.

And regards his jobs, either he should take enough time off (and to be completely honest with you, I'm guessing he could do most of the coursework while travelling to and from work, or simply go to bed 15 minutes later for 5 nights in a row, so that excuse doesn't cut it with me) or he should talk to his uni regarding his struggling time management and ask for an extension. If his money situ is that bad, he should talk to the uni, as when I was there they gave out emergency loans of upto 1000 pounds if your loan was late. Which would mean he doesn't have to do the extra shifts. And can do his coursework.

And I think you are missing the point here Jester. No one is saying they aren't going to do it because they can't be bothered, or to wind xtothez up. Most are just saying it is wrong, and xtothez would ultimately be better off doing the coursework himself. I can almost guarntee it will be in the exams in some form or another.....
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:49   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
Who said I couldn't do it?

In fact, because I can do it, and the reason for that is I learnt to do it through similar coursework myself while I was at uni, I see the benefit of someone doing the coursework themselves.

There is a difference between not knowing how to do something, and refusing to do it for someone else even though the task is given to them to reflect their ability in something. Would it be fair on the other students if the work I gave him was too such a high standard, theirs looked pale in comparison and they got a lower mark for it? Without him having done anything apart from lost $20.
The education system is not ment to be fair to students, if it was fair clever people wouldn't be made to do degradingly simple work or to work with cretins. They would be given work that required a suitable intelligence to complete. Quite often clever people that are not given enough incentive for self improvement don't bother as there is little point, and no sense of gratification can be gotten from doing something so pitifully easy.

Also, I charge £50 for doing peoples coursework, and so far the average grade has been around 80%.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:54   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by ItotheDtotheI
The education system is not ment to be fair to students, if it was fair clever people wouldn't be made to do degradingly simple work or to work with cretins. They would be given work that required a suitable intelligence to complete. Quite often clever people that are not given enough incentive for self improvement don't bother as there is little point, and no sense of gratification can be gotten from doing something so pitifully easy.
You haven't actually given one reason why he shouldn't do it. Only a couple of reason's why he doesn't want to do it.
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:56   #23
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I'd love to see Mr. X get that job. More power to him. In the mean time, back in Sbolly Fantasy Land you can start your own company, and laugh like a dog when the company hiring people like Mr. X who have no real world experience go bankrupt.

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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:56   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
You haven't actually given one reason why he shouldn't do it. Only a couple of reason's why he doesn't want to do it.
'because he doesnt want to'
'because he could do something more educational whilest someone else does his uml'
'because if he were going for a job that required uml after graduation he would be retrained to use it anyway'

count em!
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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:58   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
You haven't actually given one reason why he shouldn't do it. Only a couple of reason's why he doesn't want to do it.
He'll get evicted, won't be able to make it to the exams due to his car being out of gas and then he'll starve. THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

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Unread 7 May 2003, 23:58   #26
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Ok, but say this company was Jester Org. And you've just hired someone who looks good on paper, but 4 months down the line he's done nothing but waste your time, your clients time and actually cost more money than he made through incompetence.

Obviously I'm not saying xtothez is that sort of person, but I have seen far too many people hired who are completely useless. And most get in my damned way.
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:00   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by ItotheDtotheI
'graduation he would be retrained to use it anyway'
count em!
Why learn anything at uni at all? Or at A levels. Or GCSE level even. Because you will be retrained in everything once you start working! Woo!

When I started work, I received no formal training of any kind, and I managed because I was well educated, and prepared for working hard THROUGH my university.

They don't make you do coursework for fun you know.
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:04   #28
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geez, now i see I was lucky for not getting these twats on my thread about java
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:07   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
Why learn anything at uni at all? Or at A levels. Or GCSE level even. Because you will be retrained in everything once you start working! Woo!

When I started work, I received no formal training of any kind, and I managed because I was well educated, and prepared for working hard THROUGH my university.

They don't make you do coursework for fun you know.
today i had to spend 8 hours in a lab doing an assessed practical doing perl code.

it took 8 hours due to the **** facilities and the incapable group members i was working with

at home it would have taken less than 1 hour

the only reason you are given coursework is because the lecturers have a sense of humour.
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:09   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Flavius
geez, now i see I was lucky for not getting these twats on my thread about java

Actually if you had read what I said earlier, you would see I was happy with the idea of HELPING someone i.e in your Java thread you put up the problem, asked for help, tried to understand what you were told, learned, and then completed the coursework.

You didn't simply ask someone to do the entire thing for you.
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:11   #31
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I'm actually fighting my way through another piece of coursework now. This is the larger assignment, and I cant see it being finished before Saturday. As well as that I'm supposed to be working Friday and Sunday nights, not to mention handing in both assignments at 9am Monday morning, where I have a few hours to prepare for an exam on Monday afternoon.

Its got **** all with me not being able to do it, its not having the time thats the killer. This is the first time in my life I've asked for something like this, so its nice to see how well you all know me.
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:15   #32
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I don't mean to be rude, but when did you know about these courseworks? Were they handed to you a couple of days ago? Surprised onto you?

And as for not having enough time, from another thread you posted in :

Quote:
I'm intrigued* to know who did it. Throw co-ords in this direction ty.
*I dont really care, but checking this beats doing coursework
Also in the past day you have posted in 11 threads. Which makes me assume you have read x amount more. Which doesn't sound like someone who's hard up for time.

Just do the damned coursework yourself. You will feel better for it.
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:24   #33
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"time management" - something u will find very useful in teh real world (yes it does exist, and yes, u WILL have to go find it at some point sooner or later.
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Unread 8 May 2003, 00:47   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
Actually if you had read what I said earlier, you would see I was happy with the idea of HELPING someone i.e in your Java thread you put up the problem, asked for help, tried to understand what you were told, learned, and then completed the coursework.

You didn't simply ask someone to do the entire thing for you.

actually, I paid someone to do my java homework.

One of the reasons being lack of time, but i did sit down and study the code that was given to me prior to handing it in, so that i actually understand what was done.
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Unread 15 May 2003, 02:02   #35
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Originally posted by Mit
"time management" - something u will find very useful in teh real world (yes it does exist, and yes, u WILL have to go find it at some point sooner or later.
"Paycheck" - something that you get in the real world that means you dont have to work nights and weekends to pay for food and heating whilst trying to study for exams and do stupid piss poor waste of time UML for some meaningless entity.
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Unread 15 May 2003, 02:16   #36
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If you can't afford uni, maybe you should take a year out and save some money first?

Surely if you are working day and night just to SURVIVE your grades aren't going to be particularly good? Thus making the entire exercise pointless?
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Unread 15 May 2003, 02:42   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by SbOlly
If you can't afford uni, maybe you should take a year out and save some money first?

Surely if you are working day and night just to SURVIVE your grades aren't going to be particularly good? Thus making the entire exercise pointless?
Time is ALWAYS scarce, the only way to make sure you have enough time for everything would be to have time in your day not committed to anything in particular. "Free time is wasted time" and all that. It's a nice idea that it's possible to plan, say, two hours a day to study and then everything would work out. But it's just not that simple. When you consider that to do work you need to be relaxed, and that some work requires far far more grit than other work, and that it all depends or your mood or your roommate's mood or your computer's mood, it's clear that from time to time cheating IS the best option.

If someone says they can't be bothered they're either a lazy bastard or an intelligent but fallible human. In the first case I couldn't care less if they fail, they'll learn eventually. In the second case it's best to help. If you're worried perhaps you need to know the student better to make a decision - but xtothez posts here quite a lot and he seems bright and pragmatic, to me at least. It is important to make sure a student is aware of the importance of work, but I'm confident xtothez knows better than me how important this assignment is*. I'm surprised you make this sort of judgement as a previous student yourself.

*was
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Unread 15 May 2003, 03:22   #38
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the eternal struggle between ethics and pragmatism.
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Unread 15 May 2003, 09:02   #39
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the eternal struggle between ethics and pragmatism.
Ith thith like the Yorkthire/Lancathire thing? I know Ethics ith thomewhere near Thuthex but where ith pragmatithm?
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Unread 15 May 2003, 10:42   #40
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Unread 15 May 2003, 13:13   #41
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Unread 15 May 2003, 13:18   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by xtothez
Its got **** all with me not being able to do it, its not having the time thats the killer.
That's fair enough. Go to your tutor or whatever, explain: "I have no money right now, can't afford anything, thus have to work, thus don't have time to do coursework." What will then happen is you will either be given an extension, or a bye. Plus they should point you in the direction of your Uni Hardship Fund , and support your application.

The Uni want you to pass, to get a good degree. They'll do everything they can to help.

So you see; instead of trying to pay somebody to do it for you, you should just be honest with your tutors. They'll respect you for it, and it will make you a Better Person with Good Karma.

I work at a University, I know these things.

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Unread 15 May 2003, 14:01   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by queball
I'm surprised you make this sort of judgement as a previous student yourself.[/b]
I was lucky. I didn't have to work at all during my uni course. Instead I commited fraud, and managed to get myself about 10k into debt during the first 2 years of Uni. Thats NOT including my student loan.


But what the hell. I can afford to pay it all off now.

So I'm not the best person to talk about not having time for coursework etc, but all I meant was, from the sounds of it, this isn't a once off problem (i.e just this once everything has got on top of xtothez), but rather the way it is going to be for the rest of the course. Which isn't good, and for someone that has obviously worked so hard at their degree (even if it is through working to survive for money) get a mark they don't deserve (i.e they could of got better giving a slightly better chance) its a little harsh.

And there are quite a few 'safety nets' at uni. I'm surprised xtothez isn't using them.
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Unread 15 May 2003, 16:30   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mong
/me dashes off an email to Newcastle Uni...
Good job I dont go to Newcastle uni!




Also, I did the work.
Its probably not right, and definitely not complete, but its all done by me. Amazing what an all-nighter and calling in sick can do...
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Unread 16 May 2003, 09:56   #45
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Not good enough to get a real job then eh?
Don't be a dick all your life dear. I've had plenty of "real" jobs, and I can assure you that certain (non-academic) parts of a university work every bit as hard as in the private sector.

M.
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Unread 16 May 2003, 09:57   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by xtothez
Good job I dont go to Newcastle uni!
Hrm, come on! It was a good guess, surely?!

Quote:
Also, I did the work.
Its probably not right, and definitely not complete, but its all done by me. Amazing what an all-nighter and calling in sick can do...
That's what I like to hear! Enjoy your warm glow of satisfaction!

/me heartliy approves of xtothez

Anyway, I still insist that the smart thing to do is talk to your tutor about your problems, and look into the various "saftey nets" that are available to you.

M.
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