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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 04:35   #1
Truhatred
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Cov-op Race change

Cov-op stats per race should be static. There shouldn't be 1 race that is the go to race for cov-oping. Every race should start with the same stealth and same regrowth stealth. This being said it should be around 70 starting stealth with a regrowth of around 7. This will enable everyone to choose a race that fits their strategy and still start with cov-ops or end up getting cov-ops and being useful. This round as Terran I end up getting cov-ops to try to steal some fi pods for my harpies....it was a challenge. I failed about every other op on people with 0 guards and 0 sec centers. Mostly due to starting with 65% stealth using a 11 man op reduces u to 55% so if you random a 20 you only have 75% stealth which anyone can have by setting population to 50% on security from start. We shouldn't give the game such a useful research like cov-ops then limit the races to use it to 3. Cath is used the most for res hacking. Zik/ETD are best for ship hacking due to the highest probability of success enabling you to hack almost anyone's ships.

There should also be less randomness with hacking. You can already never see if someone set population to security. You can find out their government but that is very difficult at times if they have constant ships in production. We don't need to add a random roll of 1-20 for bonus stealth to see if you are successful. You can balance this by 1 of 3 things. 1) Reduce the random roll to 1-10 and raise base stealth to compensate for being able to have 100% stealth. 2) Reduce the random roll to 1-10 and increase the number of success mission bonuses to 15 from 5. 3) Keep the roll 1-20 but have a way to determine if someone has population set on security and/or determine their race. There still needs to be some randomness to cov-ops but not 3 hidden factors like there currently is.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 06:29   #2
Patrikc
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Re: Cov-op Race change

I've had the same thoughts regarding Racial attributes. It'd be much more interesting to give races equal footing so we could see some more strategies come out, especially now that you can steal ships.

The randomness generally only counts later in the round; early on you pick targets that you'd be able to get through even with a 1 - but I agree that it's not a fun mechanic to rely on.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:28   #3
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Re: Cov-op Race change

I like the 2nd option. I also think giving all races Equal stealth is good but i do think we should have SOME variability in the regrowth.
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Unread 27 Sep 2014, 09:46   #4
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Re: Cov-op Race change

I like the idea, instead of making it race dependent make it research related.
All races start with a default of 65 stealth and 5 stealth growth and need to spend a day or 2 maybe to get it up to 75 stealth and 10 regrowth.

Maybe something like:

Agent training (1200 RP)
  • + 5% max stealth (68,25 rounded down to 68)
  • + 1 stealth growth
Advanced training (2400 RP)
  • + 10% max stealth (71,5 rounded down to 71)
  • + 2 stealth growth
Full ninja (3600 RP)
  • + 15% max stealth (74,75 rounded up to 75)
  • + 2 stealth growth
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Unread 28 Sep 2014, 01:23   #5
Plaguuu
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Re: Cov-op Race change

Having everyone at the same footing to me just seem wrong. As for me atleast part of picking a race is weighing pros vs cons, and if there are ways to overcome the obstacles.
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Unread 28 Sep 2014, 07:05   #6
Truhatred
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Re: Cov-op Race change

Cov ops shouldn't be different by race though. To say that it should would be like scanning should be different by race. The only difference the race plays for scanning is if you want to be ter for high amps or cath for quick j scans. Making cov ops the same would allow more/all races to be played more equally which would balance the uni more. Currently if you go ter/xan and you get any cov ops your dumb. You will end up depending more resources on trying to cov op people than you would benefit from. It's truly pointless. You have to go cath if you want to get the most benefit. Or go zik/Etd if you won't some benefit all round and don't want to have to cov op every other tick to play optimally.

There have already been several good suggestions on how to change it in this thread. You also have to realize when picking your govt for cov ops you can have the bonus or not. So that is the differnece and the choice you are given. Races should separate it. If anything give like socialism a 20%stealth increase and drop all base stealth to 65 for all I care. Then I know if I want to cov op optimally I can as long as I go social. Then If I want to change govt later on I can.
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Unread 28 Sep 2014, 10:02   #7
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Re: Cov-op Race change

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truhatred View Post
Cov ops shouldn't be different by race though. To say that it should would be like scanning should be different by race. The only difference the race plays for scanning is if you want to be ter for high amps or cath for quick j scans. Making cov ops the same would allow more/all races to be played more equally which would balance the uni more. Currently if you go ter/xan and you get any cov ops your dumb. You will end up depending more resources on trying to cov op people than you would benefit from. It's truly pointless. You have to go cath if you want to get the most benefit. Or go zik/Etd if you won't some benefit all round and don't want to have to cov op every other tick to play optimally.

There have already been several good suggestions on how to change it in this thread. You also have to realize when picking your govt for cov ops you can have the bonus or not. So that is the differnece and the choice you are given. Races should separate it. If anything give like socialism a 20%stealth increase and drop all base stealth to 65 for all I care. Then I know if I want to cov op optimally I can as long as I go social. Then If I want to change govt later on I can.
You're not dumb going covop with xan and ter, you're just dumb if you DONT go it with the other races
" Making cov ops the same would allow more/all races to be played more equally"
We could also remove cloaked ships from xan and emp from cath construction points from terran etc its not necessarily a good move. And as you said scanning IS different for race And I think most people know that scanning IS different by race
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Unread 28 Sep 2014, 15:59   #8
Truhatred
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Re: Cov-op Race change

Ok, if your that set on cov ops being different for every race we can still have that and make it viable for all races. Cath can remain at 70 with 10 re growth. Etd/zik remain as well. But we can boost ter/xan from 65-70 and keep their re growth at 4. This would enable you to still be able to covop well with all races but each race is still very different in cov-ops
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Unread 28 Sep 2014, 17:15   #9
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Re: Cov-op Race change

Ter/Xan at 70/4, Cat at 70/10, and Zik/Etd at 75/6 seems reasonable to me.
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Unread 28 Sep 2014, 17:39   #10
Plaguuu
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Re: Cov-op Race change

Id call that a nerf then oO
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Unread 28 Sep 2014, 21:00   #11
Mzyxptlk
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Re: Cov-op Race change

I thought Ter had 4 recov, so that nerf was unintended. 6 is fine too. Everything else stayed the same or was buffed.
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