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Unread 7 Oct 2004, 22:59   #1
Sunday8pm
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Opinions wanted on Graphics Cards for PC gamer Tower on Tight Budget

First post updated please read

Ok here's the deal...

He wants a system that's capable of performing gaming wise for stuff like World of Warcraft, UT2k4, Doom 3, Newer RTS's and the likes, however he isn't financially affluent.

Now I've invested a lot of time and research into the best PC tower system for cost I can get him.

Here are the details.

Intel Pentium 4 Processor 2.8GHZ FSB800 512kb Hyper Threading
512 mb DDR400 PC3200 RAM (Samsung/infineon/Apacer one of those brands)
ASUS P4P800S MotherBoard
MAxtor 80gb 7200 bog standard thingie.
LG 52X CD-RW
One of the ATI Radeon cards pending on Advice(Total price will reflect an ATI 9600 Radeon XT 128 MB DDR AGP8X DVI TV-out)
Creative Sound Blaster Audigy 5.1
Linkworld Black Tower Case
400Watt PSU

Total Price = $1068 Canadian after Taxes (483 British Pounds)

Ouch about $130 over budget before Taxes.... please help...

Now I'm going to work on hyperlinking to the items listed there for reccomendations/Advice on these components, we are pretty much just overbudget as it was as he was not looking to go above $800 before tax(15%).

Yes yes we know, needs to account for an OS, Monitor, Peripherals... got that taken care of.

So am I making any massive Faux Pas? I'll definately look into every reccomended alternative for whatever reasons you post to check the costs. I appreciate all input even if it's just a 'sup it looks good ' so if you've taken the time to read, posting something to let me know is great.

We are settled on the Processor, the PSU, The Tower CAse, the Soundcard, the Motherboard, the Ram (we can add another bar of 512 later), but not the Videocard which seems to be a massive point of contention so please Dazzle me with your facts especially with regards to foresight about price drops in the ATI series with regards to the X800 series just out.

Last edited by Sunday8pm; 9 Oct 2004 at 11:39.
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Unread 7 Oct 2004, 23:10   #2
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

You have freinds ?
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Unread 7 Oct 2004, 23:12   #3
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

I took the time to read but I'm not much help

I'm hopefully upgrading soon and was intending to go with AMD & ATI but you've given me something to think about.
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Unread 7 Oct 2004, 23:19   #4
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

I put this together for you sunday
Code:
Black Case - Antec Sx1040BII File Server Tower Case with 400w Power Supply 
 $138.72 
CDRW - LG or BenQ 52x Read 52x Write 32x Re Write CD Re Writer with Recording Software
 $39.90 
AMD Athlon XP 3000+ Barton @333 MHz Boxed
 $205.80 
Kingston - PC3200 @400MHz - 512MB DDR
 $126.07 
Asus A7N8X-E Deluxe Socket-A nForce2 AGP8x Lan Audio Serial ATA 1394 333FSB 3DDR Usb 2.0
 $134.64 
Creative labs Sound Blaster LIVE 5.1 OEM
 $52.80 
Geforce 4 FX5200 128MB DDR 8x TV out, DVI Retail Box
 $84.66
just under 900$ (can) after taxes
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Unread 7 Oct 2004, 23:25   #5
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Shouldn't this be in a different sub-forum?
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Unread 7 Oct 2004, 23:50   #6
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blastoderm
Shouldn't this be in a different sub-forum?
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 01:55   #7
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

The first thing that strikes me about that system is the graphics card. If he's planning to run Doom 3 or most modern games well on that decrepit shit heap then he's got another thing coming. You should really consider at least a fx5600, there shouldnt be much difference price wise, but it'll run a lot better. Another thing: why use a Sound Blaster Live? The Sound Blaster Audigy is much better and the Audigy Player is dirt cheap, we're talking £35 here, and it should be even cheaper in the US. While you're at it, you may as well splurge for a gig of ram, I refuse to believe that it will cost that much more, and it will significantly future-proof his machine.

With regards to the Power Supply, as long as you get a Full ATX size PSU and a Full ATX case it shouldnt be a bother fitting it.

Hope this helps.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 02:27   #8
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Okies, Thanks for the tip on the Graphics card req's.

I'll also suggest the audigy, I'm not too hot on soundcards meself, always settled for shite in that department.

With regards to nVidia cards, is the fx 5600 just the minimum you reccomend, or is there a better card that's come down to what you'd consider 'base' price for that card... as in not overpriced and likely to drop by 50% in price come xmas.

My main considerations is that while Doom 3 capabilities will be nice he's heavily into World of Warcraft, which doesn't do too bad on my Geforce MX440(could do a lot better though), so basically what card is becomming the average/most likely mainstay for the immediate 12 months with regards to running games that isn't going to ruin your wallet?
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 02:29   #9
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Psi_K
I put this together for you sunday
Code:
Black Case - Antec Sx1040BII File Server Tower Case with 400w Power Supply 
 $138.72 
CDRW - LG or BenQ 52x Read 52x Write 32x Re Write CD Re Writer with Recording Software
 $39.90 
AMD Athlon XP 3000+ Barton @333 MHz Boxed
 $205.80 
Kingston - PC3200 @400MHz - 512MB DDR
 $126.07 
Asus A7N8X-E Deluxe Socket-A nForce2 AGP8x Lan Audio Serial ATA 1394 333FSB 3DDR Usb 2.0
 $134.64 
Creative labs Sound Blaster LIVE 5.1 OEM
 $52.80 
Geforce 4 FX5200 128MB DDR 8x TV out, DVI Retail Box
 $84.66
just under 900$ (can) after taxes
That's cool but I've decided to either go with a H.Thread Pentium 4 or a 64 bit AMD and gotta work around that as I get the feeling they'll have a greater lifespan in the immediate 12-24 months.

I also need a CD/DVD hybrid, DVD doesn't need to be rewriteable though.

I do appreciate all the input I'm getting here, and from what I've found Kingston is about$14 more expensive than the Samsung/Infineon.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 02:33   #10
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Actually i'd say that the 5700 Ultra might be a good bet, it shouldnt be too much more expensive than the 5600 and it gives you a hefty bit more bang for buck. Should last him.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 02:36   #11
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyr0 MK III
Actually i'd say that the 5700 Ultra might be a good bet, it shouldnt be too much more expensive than the 5600 and it gives you a hefty bit more bang for buck. Should last him.
Thanks I'll put that to him, he's a massive graphics freak in a way (just broke)... he loves WC3 and SC not for the game but for the worldmap editor feature, it gives him stimulation for his 3d models.

The basement is full of shit that pisses on the stuff you'd see in a games workshop with regards to battlefields/scenery that they play on.

That aside, yah he'll definately make extra room for making sure he's got a graphics card that meets his costs/visual pleasure.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 02:42   #12
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

If he's really into his gfx then he may as well stretch for a 6800 which can be his for the sensible price of £130.

This will last him for a long long time and will run doom 3 quite nicely
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 08:55   #13
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Why buy soundblaster 5.1 when there is 5.1 sound on the mobo? Or is there something about it I don't know.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 09:27   #14
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

the other thing, why a combo drive?
you would do a lot better with seperate cdrw and dvd drives and it wouldnt cost that much more
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 09:52   #15
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flayer
Why buy soundblaster 5.1 when there is 5.1 sound on the mobo? Or is there something about it I don't know.
onboard sound is shit ? (and eats cpu cycles)
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 11:52   #16
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

what 64 bit apps are you going to be running?

i've not heard of any games being released in 64 bit yet

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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 12:00   #17
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

duh, mist its a bigger number so it must be better
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 12:47   #18
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Mist its not just about the number. They can process 32 bit and 64 bit concurrently anyway, but the main thing is an Athlon64 3000 will wipe the floor with a P4 3Ghz. They're simply a much better processor, but boy oh boy do you pay the money for it.

Oi, sunday, you tart:
I'd recommend either a Radeon 9800Pro (can be had for about £160 at the low end) or if that's too much then a Radeon 9600XT (£112ish). Why ATI cards? The earlier GeForces don't have DirectX 9 support in hardware, something which both of those cards I've suggested do have. This makes an enourmous difference in games like Doom 3.
DO NOT use a GeForce 4 for heavens sake. I'm still saddled with one of them and you're lucky to get 20 frames/sec out of it at 640x480 in Doom 3. My mate runs a 9600XT in a similar spec machine to mine and gets much better D3 performance than me and my GeForce.

As for your processor choices, I'd say go for the Intel.
While that's practically blasphemy coming from me, you smiply cannot afford an Athlon64 system on that budget. If you're looking at upgradeability there's no point getting the cheaper Athlon64 chips, because they are based on Socket 754 motherboards which AMD is intending to kill off in about a year. The rest are Socket 939, but you're looking at £120 for the cheapest processor that'll run in that board.

So basicly:
Intel processor
ATI 9800Pro ir 9600XT

[edit]
While my prices are quoted in GBP cos obviously I'm in the UK, a direct conversion to CAD doesn't apply because you lucky gits get everything cheaper there. However, it should give you a rough idea.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 13:02   #19
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

i wasn't aware that they can do them concurrently, i just thought they could do them on the same die.

also, i was more looking at the 32 bit amds. only time i'd buy intel is for a laptop :P

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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 13:21   #20
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

I'd opt for an ATI radeon, i bought the GF MX 5200 a while ago myself, and with a few games it just won't support the extra's the latest games have implemented.

Don't ask for the specifics, cause i got a crap memory, just take my word for it, the card doesn't support all the advanced new graphics and if he's a gfx freak he'll miss out :)

Petru bought himself a radeon the other week, and coming from a geforce as well, he's absolutely smitten with the card it seems (ofcourse that's providing the card wants to work - but that's just how the GFX card business works, you gotta be lucky to get the 1 in 3 card that isn't faulty :oP but that's where retailer service kicks in if you're lucky )
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 15:03   #21
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

The only place I can see you slipping up is RAM, that is not enough RAM by any stretch of the imagination, at least add another 512, at least.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 17:57   #22
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Thanks for the input, as I said trying to keep cost efficient here.

512 mb more ram is going to hurt to the tune of $110 which is an unwanted cost, Combo drive over seperate drives wanted because it's cheaper and it's not a total concern.

ATI Radeon arguments I'm hearing well with regards to Direct X9.0 Especially as WoW is running in the latest of the Direct X 9.0c drivers or something there of, Can someone tell me which Geforce cards are designed to run 9.0 so I can make some cost comparisons, cause I'm kinda caught between the fact that nVidia lend direct support to software developers vs ATI being cheap and powerful.

Soundcard wise prolly will step upto the audigy but it'll hurt for $35 more.

Processor and mobo definately going to sit on what we have selected.

Atm our other things are scanning EBAY for auctions :P a lot of the companies that prebuild pc's in North America (even Dell) Auction on Ebay (most of them have ratings of 2k+ for feedback) and hence you can grab some systems if you are lucky for much under the retail price you'd of bought it from (done some investigation and saw you can save upto $200 on the final auction price).

Anyway much thanks for the input and I'd love any info you can reveal about Direct X9 with regards to nVidia vs ATI with regards to the cheapest cards with 128 mb onboard ram that can run em and any other insights you have.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 18:25   #23
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Two points which I want to react on.

Intel CPU's are not "more supported" than AMD ones. The latter ones running hotter, is nowadays a myth based on the older Thunderbird & Thoroughbred processors. Since the Barton, AMD temperatures are not significantly higher than Intel's. In fact, a P4 will run at higher temperatures than the new Athlon64's.

Regardless, I can't disagee with meglamaniac on the CPU choice. On the budget market, the P4 currently has the upper hand, especially considering the competing Athlon XP CPU's are the almost obsolete Socket A.

Pretty much same story goes for nVidia/ATI. Neither of them is "more involved" in the gaming industry than the other. They are very much equal opponents, with ATI currently having the upper hand in pretty much all of the market segments, so definitely go for an ATI there.


At any rate, the statement that nVidia/Intel is the better combination because they spend a lot of time on making sure stuff runs on their hardware, is bollocks. Everything that nVidia/Intel can handle, AMD/ATi can handle equally well or better. In fact, when it comes to games, AMD generally is the better CPU, whereas Intel has slightly better performance in the application section, and stuff such as audio/video encoding.

Oh, and nVidia and ATI are both equally involved in the DirectX creation process, as well as on the 3DMark advisory team and whatever graphics organisations there pretty much are. The only difference between the two that matters to you, is in the performance of their cards. Which is in ATI's favour atm.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 19:25   #24
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunday8pm
Thanks for the input, as I said trying to keep cost efficient here.

512 mb more ram is going to hurt to the tune of $110 which is an unwanted cost, Combo drive over seperate drives wanted because it's cheaper and it's not a total concern.

ATI Radeon arguments I'm hearing well with regards to Direct X9.0 Especially as WoW is running in the latest of the Direct X 9.0c drivers or something there of, Can someone tell me which Geforce cards are designed to run 9.0 so I can make some cost comparisons, cause I'm kinda caught between the fact that nVidia lend direct support to software developers vs ATI being cheap and powerful.

Soundcard wise prolly will step upto the audigy but it'll hurt for $35 more.

Processor and mobo definately going to sit on what we have selected.

Atm our other things are scanning EBAY for auctions :P a lot of the companies that prebuild pc's in North America (even Dell) Auction on Ebay (most of them have ratings of 2k+ for feedback) and hence you can grab some systems if you are lucky for much under the retail price you'd of bought it from (done some investigation and saw you can save upto $200 on the final auction price).

Anyway much thanks for the input and I'd love any info you can reveal about Direct X9 with regards to nVidia vs ATI with regards to the cheapest cards with 128 mb onboard ram that can run em and any other insights you have.

wtf ??
512mb ram can be got for like 50 quid here. where the **** are you buying ram from ?
also, dvd burners aer now 50 quid here. so drives arent really expensive either.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 19:30   #25
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

110 Canadian dollars is around £50, so that isn't any more expensive than where you are buying it from. The problem is that he is considering $110 to be a lot, whereas you are not.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 19:31   #26
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

enby, he's talking in CAD isn't he, which makes it about the same...
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 19:33   #27
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

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110 Canadian dollars is around £50, so that isn't any more expensive than where you are buying it from. The problem is that he is considering $110 to be a lot, whereas you are not.
Thats because Ze Americans and Ze Canadians get hardware at stupidly cheap prices. Damn them!
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 19:35   #28
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

hmm

50 quid isnt a lot in pc terms

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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 20:08   #29
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunday8pm
Intel Pentium 4 Processor 2.8GHZ FSB800 512kb Hyper Threading
512 mb DDR400 PC3200 RAM (Samsung/infineon/Apacer one of those brands)
ASUS P4P800S MotherBoard
LG Combo Drive 52X CD-RW 16X DVD ROM
nVidia FX 5200 128MB DDR with TV-out, AGP 8X
Creative Sound Blaster Live 5.1
Linkworld Black Tower Case
480 Watt Colorsit Power Supply with 12 cm Fan
Here is what I suggest:

Intel P4 processor 2.8Ghz FSB800 512kb Hyper Threading
512 mb DDR400 PC3200 UNBRANDED
Gigabyte GA-8IPE1000-G or the better one of the same model
CD-RW 52x24x52
DVD 16x
nVidia FX 5600 or better
Audigy sound card or stick with the motherboard sound (8 channel) till more cash comes in
Case of your choice
The Power supply with the case should be checked and 400W should do. What are you gonna do with 480W, power an aeroplane?

Its better to have two separate drives tbh but its your choice. As for the motherboard, I reccomend it. It's great and reliable and I can run Doom 3, UT2K4, Splinter Cell 2, Theif 3 and the like. My Gfx is Gforce 4 Ti 4800 and it makes my games smooth and crisp. And I had it since two years ago.

As for the ram, I personally dont see any clear and blatant difference between a branded or unbranded but if your iffy about having unbranded rams then go for whatever. But try and get another 512 or at least a 128 on top.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 21:06   #30
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quick point to make, $2.21 = 1 quid for those wanting to do conversion rates.

Yah as I said NB3, We are working to a very tight (he really can't afford a pc but he's got good credit and intends to work it off) budget, so where it's preferrable, if it's something we can upgrade later without incurring any costs too much we'll do that.

As for extra RAM, Don't worry about it, buy more later if neccessary when have cash.

As for my nVidia vs ATI argument, while they are both equally involved in DirectX development I've been hearing a lot of problems with patch support from software companies for ATI cards over nVidia cards cause nVidia send in people to beta test the software where as ATI doesn't, hence my preference, I know ATI is really powerful, I am just familiar with people having to wait on the software companies releasing patches for ATI problems rather than nVidia, then again it might be a case of personal experience, however I am waivering towards ATI purely for cost reasons now that we are debating this(I've only ever used VooDoo/nVidia so this is unexplored territory for me).

As for the drives, will prolly now settle on just a cd rw for now and get the dvd later as an optional to help the cost side out, thanks for your input there about not bothering with combo.

Definately Audigy or bust now thanks for the heads up there.

Seeing as I'm hearing not much in the news of 64 bit being overly needed in the immediate future I'm going to stick to the 2.8 h.thread P4.

I'm interested in the mobo Inferno has suggested but I am concerned about costs, I've only used ASUS before and had no problems with them, hence I'm leaning towards the ASUS board but if I can hear reccomendations for this other board and furthermore if it's better priced in retailers around here, I may well change opinion.

Finally with regards to ATI radeons, is the minimum I'm looking for 9600? or will a 9200 do?
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 21:16   #31
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

The minimum you'll want to look for is a 9500 Pro, if you can still find it. They're actually somewhat faster than their 9600 Pro counterparts, but they've been all but replaced by the newer cards. So likely you'll be looking for a 9600 Pro model as a minimum.

The Radeon 9200 is, if I'm not mistaken, the AGP8x version of the 9100, which in effect was nothing but the renamed Radeon 8500, which is an old DirectX 8.1 card, so you'll want to skip that if it's games you want to be into.

And nVidia is mostly known in the game scene for being the company that brought out drivers that strongly bent 3DMark performance in their favour by telling the videocard in advance what should be rendered and what not, saving muchos calculations.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 22:12   #32
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

i still don't understand why you're going with intel rather than amd, who're cheaper and faster...

-mist
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 22:29   #33
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mist
i still don't understand why you're going with intel rather than amd, who're cheaper and faster...

-mist
Id say hes probably had better reliability in the past with Intel over AMD. I agree with his decision, as in my experience Intel Chipsets seems to last that little longer unless youre a tech-head overclocker, in which case you get what you give.

I appreciate this may not be your opinion , or even the general opinion, but its mine and im happy with it.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 22:41   #34
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunday8pm
I'm interested in the mobo Inferno has suggested but I am concerned about costs, I've only used ASUS before and had no problems with them, hence I'm leaning towards the ASUS board but if I can hear reccomendations for this other board and furthermore if it's better priced in retailers around here, I may well change opinion.
I tell you now tis a bargain and tis well worth it. Got it for £60 at my nearest Computer Fair. It is excellent and it is ALWAYS within the budget.

Your Asus cost just the same here. Just 2 squids less.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 23:07   #35
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mist
i still don't understand why you're going with intel rather than amd, who're cheaper and faster...
Because the P4 with HT performs very well compared to similar AMD CPU's. Granted, the Athlon64 makes mincemeat out of anything with Intel written on it, but the old AthlonXP series doesn't nearly do that much of a trashing.

Aditionally, the AthlonXP's are running on Socket A, which AMD has cancelled in favour of the new Socket 939. This means that if the guy wants to upgrade his CPU in a year or two, or perhaps even sooner, he's going to have to buy a new mobo if he's stuck with a Socket A one now. If he goes for a P4 now, he'll at least be able to stick a P4 4,0GHz into the mobo, and higher models as well if Intel does not do a Socket switch.

I'll grant that AMD produce high quality chips that are no longer any less reliable than a P4, do not run any hotter, and are not in any way incompatible, and have a much better price/performance ratio. But if you want to go for an absolute budget model now, with the option of upgrading for little money later, you're better off with a P4/HT.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 23:12   #36
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

guess so. although, how long it'll be before you need to change the mobo for a p4 is up for debate.

any idea if the dual die on a chip type thingies will use the same socket, otherwise the point may be rather mute...

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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 23:27   #37
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Intel hasn't announced a socket change, as far as I know, and as said, there will be at least a P4 4,0GHz which is regular Socket 478. One presumes they won't change architecture overnight, so expect a few more models to be available in that flavour.

No idea about the latter.
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Unread 8 Oct 2004, 23:41   #38
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Cheers for the info on Processors, very valuable leshy.

the mobo thing I'll look into if the difference is just a paltry 2 squid then I'm not going to go into uncharted territories just yet unless absolutely neccessary.

I'll talk to him tonight and see what happens.
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 02:50   #39
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Ok emergency post....

ATI Power Color Radeon 9550 256MB DDR, DVI, TV-Out $135.00
ATI Power Color Radeon 9600 SE 128MB DDR , DVI, TV-Out $99.00
ATI Power Color Radeon 9600 Pro 256MB DDR, DVI, TV-Out $199.00
ATI Power Color Radeon 9600 XT Ultra 128MB DDR , DVI, TV-Out $236.00
ATI Radeon 9600 AIW 128MB, DDR, AGP, DVI, TV-Out $209.00
ATI Radeon 9600 XT 128MB DDR, AGP8X DVI TV-Out $239.00
ATI Radeon 9600 XT AIW 128MB, AGP, DVI, TV-Out $285.00

Can I get some input here?

I'm settled on the ATI 9600 from advice here but it's added rather a lot on the price (given the originally planned video card was $124 cheaper) however I've bolded the cards I desperately want info on, with regards to if the 9550 card is good enough with regards to price and is it desperately important to get AGP8X over AGP.

Can I also get input on the All-In-Wonder models with regards to what they have over the other cards? (AIW)
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 09:49   #40
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

First of all, it is not desperately important to get AGP8x over AGP4x. The actual performance gain is extremely small, despite the AGP8x feature being used by both ATi and nVidia to release new versions of cards with a shiny badge and price tag.

With that out of the way, the AIW is not a card you're looking for. The AIW is equipped with, as I recall from memory, both a TV chip and a TV-in port, and probably some other features like that. This allows you to both watch TV on your PC and hook up video equipment to the card, and that sort of thing. AIW's are excellent cards, but If you are going for a gamer's one, it's not the one you want.

As for those cards, I suggest you look for the Radeon 9700, 9700 Pro and 9800, and see how they compare in terms of price. Especially the 9700 non-Pro may be economically viable if they're still on sale, and will outperform any of the 9600 family. Do beware of the 9800 Shit Edition (9800SE).

Out of the ones above, I'd suggest visiting http://graphics.tomshardware.com/gra...004/index.html and see if the Radeon 9600XT performance justifies the extra cost. I believe the 9550 is supposed to compete with the GF4MX and FX5200 by the way, so I'd kinda skip that.
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 10:29   #41
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Have you actually got a hard drive yet? Can't see one mentioned...

Got me a 160GB one from Maplins for £72.
There are smaller cheaper ones available of course: 80GB for £40 etc
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 11:41   #42
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

tbh the 9600 is starting to get into the economically unviable region...

How does the 5700 nVidia measure up in comparison to the 5200 performance wise and versus the 9600?

(I had really hoped the 9550 would be something better than a 5600/5700 but not quite a 9600 and hence save in there.... as I said working to a very tight budget, may in the end just reccomend one that'll do for WoW which would be a 5200 nVidia and upgrading later when he can afford it)

p.s. Thanks for pointing that out, I had accounted for it in the costs but realised I missed it out in the description.
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 13:38   #43
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

so how much is left exactly for the GFX card?
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 13:42   #44
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leshy
Do beware of the 9800 Shit Edition (9800SE).
I disagree. I bought a 9800SE last year, which I successfully softmodded to a 9800 Pro AIW. Great deal!
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 13:47   #45
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flayer
I disagree. I bought a 9800SE last year, which I successfully softmodded to a 9800 Pro AIW. Great deal!
unmodded they are around R9600Pro/XT speeds though
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Unread 9 Oct 2004, 20:19   #46
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luckeh!!!!
so how much is left exactly for the GFX card?
Really $200 at max, which is why it's fustrating that thingss are 40-60 above the price limit and the alternatives are well under.
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Unread 10 Oct 2004, 01:54   #47
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Re: Opinions wanted on helping friend buy a PC tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunday8pm
Really $200 at max, which is why it's fustrating that thingss are 40-60 above the price limit and the alternatives are well under.
I'm assuming CDN since its mentioned above i think.

Anyway I checked Newegg (i know they don't ship to canada though), seems like you should be able to get around R9600Pro or R9600XT for that money,
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