Clusters

[Game']

Could someone please tell me the entire point of them?

[TheRat]

"The last remnants of a long forgotten system"

[Kal]

there is an eta -1 advantage for sending defence

[Game']

Originally Posted by Kal

there is an eta -1 advantage for sending defence

Name a cluster where this is actively used enough to justify its existance?

[I am Idler]

there has always been clusters, and there always will be clusters

[wakey]

Clusters have never had a point. They were supposed to aid defence for lesser players but were always too large to ever allow working relationships to be forged. Its one thing to put alliance politics aside for a small group of galaaxy members but to then be asked to do do the same with a number of other galaxies was always asking too much. The only thing I ever saw clusters really achieve was to split the haves and have nots further. A cluster alliance would be formed, the strong would soon be identified, the strongest galaxies would then break away taking the best galacies and those with alliances they were friendly with with them leaving the original cluster alliance to be farms for the new one.

All in all pretty much a complete waste apart from the maybe for those new players in c100+ during the pre p2p rounds

[Kal]

what if clusters were small - say for example only 2 galaxies

[Game']

Originally Posted by Kal

what if clusters were small - say for example only 2 galaxies

You would just be basicially combining them, and alliances would hit both gals at the same time.

[TheRat]

Clusters were nice for incluster wars. There are currently two issues prohibiting that:

1) Too few players, leading to too few gals leading to too few gals per cluster.
2) No incluster attack bonus

[Kree]

cluster wars were the best in any game though ( -1 eta nm if you attack or defend)

[Bashar]

Originally Posted by wakey

Clusters have never had a point. They were supposed to aid defence for lesser players but were always too large to ever allow working relationships to be forged.

Several alliances formed out of clusters.

[NitinA]

With ship value ratios of attack:defence being what they are this round, I think an in-game Cluster alliance system would actually help with the defence situation throughout the universe, would be intresting to see the results of such a system.

-NitinA

[TheRat]

Originally Posted by Bashar

Several alliances formed out of clusters.

C7R or whatever
(I hear they sucked )

[Tis]

Originally Posted by TheRat

C7R or whatever
(I hear they sucked )

(kicked and roided)

[TheRat]

Originally Posted by Tis

(kicked and roided)

[Alessio]

Originally Posted by Kal

what if clusters were small - say for example only 2 galaxies

I wouldnt wanna end up with 2 nub gals at the same time....
and 2 leet gals would have a double advantage over them...

I havent decided if I like it or not yet.. but it sounds bad to me at first glance
altho a permanent sister gal sounds cool

[ph8]

People simply can't cooperate properly in clusters. God knows why. People spend many rounds trying to set up cluster alliances and I've never seen a good one which is a damn shame. Perhaps a future feature suggestion should be a cluster section where you set your gal's relationship with the cluster (NAP/No NAP) things like that would help bring them back.

Round 4/5 saw some BRILL cluster alliances I remember channels of 50+ and really good def.. but alas, no longer

[lokken]

I think with such a small universe, we'd have to test in cluster warfare in the old sense to see if it would actually 'work', I fear it would end rounds quicker.

Clusters certainly do serve a purpose in terms of combat and up the need for political action though which can be fun for the better players.

[demiGOD]

Can't have galaxies without clusters. It just makes sense like that.

Politically, it's useless.

[Game']

Clusters will not work now as they used to due to the fact the strain on alliances is so much greater.

So if you defended your alliance everynight and attacked with them, when exactly would you have chance to defend your cluster as well, especially at the start given the mis-trust as to who is who etc.

At the moment clusters are just "there" because they have always been there, however they serve absolutly no purpose at all. However adjusting attack times again has its pro's and con's. As someone said earlier your risking having the haves and have not's split. But with the way galaxies are setup now, it is less likely to happen like this in my opinion.

[Kree]

who cares about cluster defense - make it -1 eta to attack incluster - cluster wars ahoy

[DJet]

Yeah nice one -1eta attack in cluster, only your galaxy could defend you against fi/co...
only thing clusters are good for now adays is making the co-ord system easy to understand, same with paralells!

[MAdnRisKy]

having alliance and cluster eta and making them cumulative and adding in cluster attack eta would be one way to promote urgance about the cluster.

you'd also see some alliance groups creating clster bgs, and attacking hostile ones, alittle bit like the parallel days of old. (with size difs ofc)

or folks would agree not to attack in cluster (and then break it towards the end political funness that that would be)

[Bashar]

Originally Posted by MAdnRisKy

having alliance and cluster eta and making them cumulative and adding in cluster attack eta would be one way to promote urgance about the cluster.

you'd also see some alliance groups creating clster bgs, and attacking hostile ones, alittle bit like the parallel days of old. (with size difs ofc)

or folks would agree not to attack in cluster (and then break it towards the end political funness that that would be)

I actually reckon this would make the game more interesting, and would bring back the old feeling of friendship and comradeship with your galaxy. It is something I would think is at least worth considering.

[Gio2k]

Cluster wars was THE single most stupid idea ever in PA. Lots of new and experienced people giving up the game because of the frustration of getting bashed incluster, without a decent chance at alliance defence. Been there, done that, let's not make the mistake again.

[SimbaX]

Originally Posted by MAdnRisKy

having alliance and cluster eta and making them cumulative and adding in cluster attack eta would be one way to promote urgance about the cluster.

you'd also see some alliance groups creating clster bgs, and attacking hostile ones, alittle bit like the parallel days of old. (with size difs ofc)

or folks would agree not to attack in cluster (and then break it towards the end political funness that that would be)

this would be ace, cluster alliances are something i dearly miss.

[Game']

To be honest id be more for making defence in-cluster -2, and attack -1. So the benefits of having a cluster which defends itself are there, but also there is the other side to the coin

[Shev]

Originally Posted by Game'

To be honest id be more for making defence in-cluster -2, and attack -1. So the benefits of having a cluster which defends itself are there, but also there is the other side to the coin

That actually sounds like a damn fine plan.

[GReaper]

Originally Posted by NitinA

With ship value ratios of attack:defence being what they are this round, I think an in-game Cluster alliance system would actually help with the defence situation throughout the universe, would be intresting to see the results of such a system.

-NitinA

One of the reasons why cluster alliances are so awkward to organise. There is little motivation in defending your cluster, trying to interact with other galaxies and planets isn't particularly easy.

I'd like to see something like:

• 5 galaxies per cluster with the aim of 20 people or so in a galaxy. This would result in clusters similar to the size limit of an alliance itself.
• Cluster forums, similar to galaxy forums with a ministers only section for all ministers.
• Cluster status screen, similar to the galaxy incoming screen but maybe for incoming fleets only. This could also be restricted to paid accounts only.
• No bonus for attacking in cluster, -1 ETA for defending. Would make defence possible and worthwhile.

[Alessio]

Its all fun etc to actually have a plan for working cluster alliances but
most people simply dont have enough fleets for it..

btw who really wants em anyway (and is planning to participate in incluster defence etc)?
it helps nubjes? I doubt it....

[Ultimate Newbie]

Originally Posted by ph8

Round 4/5 saw some BRILL cluster alliances I remember channels of 50+ and really good def.. but alas, no longer

Cluster allainces would have been totally pointless in R4, as it was Parallels that had ETA bonuses (on both attack and defence).

Whilst there was alot of co-operation with R4 paras, most of it was just the top 5 or so gals in each para that used the rest of their para as farms for the entire round, rarely venturing outside. I know, as the P alliance that i started was second-tier and we had to defend against stupid amounts of incoming every night .

I do remember, at round's end, having more than 1 million spiders (/me raises pinky to corner of mouth) .

[Ultimate Newbie]

Originally Posted by GReaper

One of the reasons why cluster alliances are so awkward to organise. There is little motivation in defending your cluster, trying to interact with other galaxies and planets isn't particularly easy.

Tbh, i quite like all of those ideas. I do believe, however, that not even paid planets should be able to see fleets going out of the cluster - as there will obviously be unsavoury ruffians in every one.

What i think would be the ultimate saviour of C alliances is - 1 extra fleetslot that can ONLY be launched in-C. That way, any players who have extra ships but not slots (i dont know about you but my main problem tend to be slots) are then able to defend random people in-C. Whether they do or not, ofc, depends - but i think it would go a very long way to encouraging in-C participation.

[Rocko]

call me crazy :P, but,... how about a single fleet slot, that can only be used in cluster? a fouth one,.... Thus even with your current three, sending out to attacks and deffend in the universe, u still have your 1 fleet u can use, but ONLY in the cluster (in gal included?? hmmm)

[Desse]

Originally Posted by wakey

Clusters have never had a point.

Actually, they have had a point for quite a few rounds, but after alliances was hardcoded into the game and the eta advantage was the same for Clusters as for Alliances they became more or less obsolete.

[Desse]

Originally Posted by Game'

To be honest id be more for making defence in-cluster -2, and attack -1. So the benefits of having a cluster which defends itself are there, but also there is the other side to the coin

I Like this one.

[SpaceLegend]

Originally Posted by Ultimate Newbie

What i think would be the ultimate saviour of C alliances is - 1 extra fleetslot that can ONLY be launched in-C. That way, any players who have extra ships but not slots (i dont know about you but my main problem tend to be slots) are then able to defend random people in-C. Whether they do or not, ofc, depends - but i think it would go a very long way to encouraging in-C participation.

i am playing a while now and over all those rounds i learned something:
Don't trust anyone in a cluster.
I've seen kinda every **** happen in a cluster, so before i ever will trust someone again in C, maybe 10 more rounds have to pass.

With a cluster fleet slot , i would
- attack in C and save a slot for outside
- defend my alliance mate in C and save a slot for outside
- run my ships at home if needed

tbh, as sad as it is, i think most people will do that

[Conall]

Originally Posted by ph8

People simply can't cooperate properly in clusters. God knows why.

I am not God, but I'll take a shot.

Priorities:
1. Alliance
2. Buddy Pack
3. Galaxy
4. Cluster

The first three may be interchangeable to some degree, but cluster are always last and by that time you have depleted your will to care.

Alliance politics are an issue as well. It's one thing to deal with 1-2 players from a rival alliance. In a galaxy they depend on each other to some degree. But a cluster full of competing rivals that have no real stake in your survival is practically unmanageable.

[G.K Zhukov]

Originally Posted by Gio2k

Cluster wars was THE single most stupid idea ever in PA. Lots of new and experienced people giving up the game because of the frustration of getting bashed incluster, without a decent chance at alliance defence. Been there, done that, let's not make the mistake again.

Yes, but goddamn how fun it was to play with the n00bs. And you had a cluster full, who was just YOURS.

/me goes to search for C26a

[ComradeRob]

Clusters need a unique advantage over alliance defence, otherwise they will always be an afterthought for most players. In my opinion, making clusters -2 eta for defence would achieve that.

[Nitros]

cluster wars were fun, however the FI/CO roid fleet made it impossible to get some decent defense if you were hit incluster

fastest defence from alliance was eta 7, incluster attack with fi/co was eta 6...sigh

i think that was the reason incluster attack was disabled

(didnt read the whoel thread..sorry if someoen already said it)

[Judge]

Forget Clusters and , just give every planet a unique identifier.

Galaxy Number and planet number

1:1
1:2

etc.

[Cayl]

Clusters are incubators for new alliances, the fact that they aren't on the radar of the major alliances is part of what allows them do act this way.

I also feel that in block wars there's a tactical advantage that i don't think anyone (including our block) is actually exploiting.