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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 07:54   #1
Ultimate Newbie
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Generic Startup Guide(s)

As there seems to be somewhat of an influx of old PA players who are not used to the way that PA has evolved, i thought a thread that outlined the best way all races can start with areas such as research, construction and engineering setup looked at in particular.

If you have a different view as to how to start up, or variations that take advantage of each race's special abilities, feel free to add them. My hopes is that this thread will provide enough of a guide to get players off to the best start regardless of race.

Engineering
Make sure you set your Engineering Priorities before starting a Research or Construction!!

I usually have my Engineering setup as follows:
1st Priority: Mining
2nd Priority: Research
3rd Priority: Construction.

Keep in mind that i am usually a Xandathrii and thus i have slightly faster construction but 10% slower research. I personally make up for this by building alot of Research Centres, and using my Engineering setup to initiate as many Roids as i can at the beginning, however most players have Research as Pri 1 and try to do as much research as fast as possible at the beginning. At some stages, i am ahead of them, and at others they are ahead of me. Its just a personal preference i feel. Remember this is merely a guide - but it gives an indication that you shouldnt do something silly such as have Security as Priority 1 as no-one can use Covert Ops during Protection anyway . Its generally agreed that Mining, Research and Construction are the best starting priorities - the only difference is which order you place them in.

Note: With the Research and Construction ticks to complete below, i have only written the 'base' amount of ticks it takes to complete. Your Race, Engineering setup and Research Labs should reduce this time significantly - eg a Xandathrii with Construction as the Third Engineering Priority takes 9 ticks to complete a Construction - instead of the 12 as listed. Terrans, with Eng 1st Priority, can take as little as 4 ticks to complete a construction. Keep this in mind, but the guide should still be fairly useful.

Starting Research
1) Improved Resource Handling - 16 Ticks to complete
2) Heavy Cargo Transfers II - 24
3) Fighter Class Hulls - 24
4) Jumpgate - 16
**End of Protection**
5) Infrastructure Upgrade - 16
6) Heavy Cargo Transfers III - 24
7) Warpgate - 32
8) Advanced Core Extraction - 24
9) Heavy Cargo Transfers IV - 48
Then, about this time you'll need to try and get as much Scan technology as you can whilst keeping up with your roids (at least untill Unit scans).

The way i have outlined this, is so by tick 72 you are able to build Fighters/Corvettes that have a -1 ETA in universe. So for those races (all except terran) with FI/CO pods, you'll have a better chance of being able to launch and land an attack very early on. Terrans, as they need DE classed pods, may need to invest more time in Ship research/construction than the other races - noah02, being the resident Terran, would you like to elaborate? That path has served me fairly well in the past (though i admit i only loosely follow it) as a Xan - but the idea is to ensure that you have enough research in Roids to keep getting as much income from them as you can - and in between those researches doing everything else. heh .

Constructions
1) Research Lab - 12 ticks
2) Refinery - 12 (the number of which Refinery depends on your race. If you are Terran, focus on Metal Refineries as your ships cost alot of Metal. Cathaar = Crystal and Zikonian = Eonium. Eonium is no longer fuel, but is as important as Metal and Crystal - so keep it in mind ).
3) Refinery - 12
4) Refinery - 12
5) Light Factory - 12
6) Research Lab - 12
**End of Protection**
7) Refinery - 12
8) Refinery - 12
9) Amplifier - 12
10) Refinery - 12
11) Research Lab - 12
12) Medium Factory - 12

This way, you should be getting alot of resources from your Refineries, so you should be able to initiate alot of roids of your particular type (M/C/E). You might want to build 1 of the other two resources, or you can choose to focus on the one type. Edit: The reason why you should start with Refineries (many people call them Mines - me included ) over Finance Centres is that Finance Centres only start producing 1000 resources (the amount 1 Mine makes per tick) once you have reached ~800 roids. This means that early on, Mines produce alot more resources than Finance Centres, but later on Finance Centres will (eventually) produce more resources. Think of Linear and Exponential growth - Mines give income in a Linear way, whilst Finance Centres are exponential - ie small growth at the start, but becomes much larger over time as your planet grows.

Also Note: Terrans (only) who have Constructions as Engineering Priority 1 should start their first construction as a Metal Refinery followed by a Research Lab - this is because their constructions will only take 4 ticks to complete (!!). So, instead of your Research Lab sitting idle for ~6 or more ticks whilst you are waiting for that first research to complete, you are actually gaining resources (at that stage of the round, 4000 more metal is actually alot) and have less idle time. If that doesnt really make sense to you, then dont worry - its explained in more detail in one of the later posts (below...)

Well, this should give you a good start (if not the absolute best start - though 'best' depends on personal preference, race, activity and a small degree of luck ) and should get you on the right track to doing well in R14.

Feel free to post comments/criticisms/additions at will .
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Last edited by Ultimate Newbie; 26 Apr 2006 at 02:18.
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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 08:27   #2
Guran
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

You might want to add, when it becomes more useful to build Finance Centres over Refineries. I know they are not usually built right in beginning but as this is a startup guide, you could explain why.
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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 09:36   #3
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

you can knock down the 5th constuction to 6th,... because at 5 constrcutions you'll still be on 20%

(disclaimer don't read if you already know)
Research centres give you a bonus, but only up to 20%. You need to do this by having 1/5th of your constuctions a research centres,.. thus constuctions 1, 6, 11, 16, 21, 26 ,31 etc, should be a research centres (by this point most of the research should be done, so you might want to stop this and focus on other things)

Enginearing
1st Research
2nd Mining
3rd Construction
At that early stage, the diffnerence between 1st and 2nd mining being your enginearing priority is very small, BUT the difference between research being 1st and second is VERY big.
Terrens should strive to come out of protection being able to build frigs and destroyers. Two reasons, one is to deffend agasint CO attacks with your griffins, the other is to send out DE pods straight away, especialy caths since they dont get anti DE untill their 3rd hulls research.
Thus i feel hulls research is quite important for most races.
I'd rarther focus on raising the roid cap, and getting hulls researched early on,.. the the deep core drilling.
I can get more from the initated roids, then i can from the 2.5k of each resources,.. HOWEVER, it does cost resources to init roids,.. where as the 2.5k each resource is free once you researched it,.. personal choice.
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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 18:45   #4
Guran
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko
Research centres give you a bonus, but only up to 20%. You need to do this by having 1/5th of your constuctions a research centres,.. thus constuctions 1, 6, 11, 16, 21, 26 ,31 etc, should be a research centres (by this point most of the research should be done, so you might want to stop this and focus on other things)
As constructions are built much faster than research is done, especially later on, you might be able to build several constructions (up to ~10) before you need to begin your next research, thus it might not be necessary to follow your plan of 'every 5 constructions a research lab' exactly.

As a general guideline it will do.
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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 18:53   #5
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

If you go a race that cant hold on to its roids, or in a bad galaxy/alliance, drilling might be a better choice, but i believe roids get you more resources over short to long term periods.
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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 18:56   #6
Guran
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko
Enginearing
1st Research
2nd Mining
3rd Construction
At that early stage, the diffnerence between 1st and 2nd mining being your enginearing priority is very small, BUT the difference between research being 1st and second is VERY big.
I disagree. If we are talking of early stages, and take as an example a research which takes 24 ticks to finnish. With first engineering priority set as research, you will research 15% faster and priority as second, you will research 10% faster.

Basic 24 ticks
2nd 21 ticks
1st 20 ticks

With researches that take less than 36 ticks, you are always gonna win only 1 tick. If research takes 36 ticks or longer, you will win 2 ticks or more per research. Granted, Xandathrii being 10% slower by default, every bit you can make it faster might be of value to you.
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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 19:31   #7
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

I personally don't do any Core Resources research until I've research full ETA, Siege Weapons (being a non-Xan), jumpgate scans, as far up the Infrastructure ladder as I need to and as far up HCT as I need to. This is because Core Resources do not help you achieve the two most important things: Capping roids and defending your alliance. Sure, they give you a nice resource boost but taking it early on just hinders your long term development.

I was thinking of putting Research on priority 1 for the main round (I usually go Mining, Research, Construction) but after reading Guran's post I think I'll stick with what I usually have. What I like about Mining is that it helps you no matter what you do. If for whatever reason you're a couple of ticks late on starting a new Research or Construction then you've pretty much wasted whatever bonus you had anyway.
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Unread 16 Jul 2005, 19:44   #8
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Here's the tick plan I was going to use for next round as a terran:
http://www.soton.ac.uk/~hvm103/pa/TickPlan.htm
(If the columns seem out, refresh then it should work)

With this you can have a destroyer fleet built by the end of protection and enough roid research done to use the roids you cap by the time it lands, assuming you've initiated up to about 200. I'd go for battleships as quickly as possible because at the start of the game I think theres going to be less bs defence around - people won't expect you to have bs that quickly. (At least thats what I found happend last round )

I don't bother with constructions really at the start. I rely on my alliance to do my scans so don't need amps and as a terran with faster constructions I can catch up later

After I'd researched all that I'd focus on travel techs. I don't know about whats best for the other races as I've only played terran before.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 12:12   #9
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

I think my main effort goes into actually never missing a tick tbh
I think I only missed 1 research tick last round and that was doing like the last roid research
But tbh I know my tick plan off by heart I just never write it down coz I know it as i go along if you know what i mean :/
but yeah I agree with flying monkey on getting out the BS as soon as possible as it did wonders for me last round just walking over everyones defence and fake attacks where very very easy
I just dont like dragons stealing tbh I would rather they where far more usefull killers.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 12:40   #10
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

I think the main point for choosing RH over Core Extraction is the fact that even tho CE might seem a better choice the first few tick your gonna need the support for more roids.
You're bound to go over the 200 roids early on so you need the support for that. With CE research instead of RH you're gonna miss out on more and more resources as the game advances (assuming you keep growing the first ticks out of protection).
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 12:42   #11
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

noah: what engineering setup do you use? To you set Construction as Pri 1 and spam Jammers, or do you set Research as Pri 1 and rush as fast as possible to BA?

Plz outline your tickplan (roughly) so we can compare.

Yes, i am interested. Yes, i am a curious person. Yes, i have got into trouble due to that in the past .
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 12:53   #12
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by noah02
but yeah I agree with flying monkey on getting out the BS as soon as possible as it did wonders for me last round just walking over everyones defence and fake attacks where very very easy
Going by this I reckon he has research as first priority
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 12:58   #13
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supersander
Going by this I reckon he has research as first priority
Yeah, i had figured that - and i presume that noah has Research as P1 initially, then maybe swapping to Construction P1 so he can build jammers, the result of which being:

Quote:
Originally Posted by noah02
as it did wonders for me last round just walking over everyones defence and fake attacks where very very easy
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 13:37   #14
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guran
I disagree. If we are talking of early stages, and take as an example a research which takes 24 ticks to finnish. With first engineering priority set as research, you will research 15% faster and priority as second, you will research 10% faster.

Basic 24 ticks
2nd 21 ticks
1st 20 ticks

With researches that take less than 36 ticks, you are always gonna win only 1 tick. If research takes 36 ticks or longer, you will win 2 ticks or more per research. Granted, Xandathrii being 10% slower by default, every bit you can make it faster might be of value to you.
Really? I would have sworn at 30 ticks it's already 30*0.9 = 27 at 2nd prio, and 30*0.85=25.5 -> 25 at 1st, so it's already 2 ticks ahead.

btw the relative gain is even larger if you take research centers into account, as then it is 0.65 against 0.7 (as opposed to 0.85 against 0.9), which means on average you win 1 tick every 14 ticks (without rounding)

Last edited by Envious; 18 Jul 2005 at 13:42.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 13:42   #15
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supersander
I think the main point for choosing RH over Core Extraction is the fact that even tho CE might seem a better choice the first few tick your gonna need the support for more roids.
You're bound to go over the 200 roids early on so you need the support for that. With CE research instead of RH you're gonna miss out on more and more resources as the game advances (assuming you keep growing the first ticks out of protection).
Well, you can do both. Going up the Core Resources tree as fast as you can while making sure that you have researched enough of the HCT tree as you need to be able to mine all your roids.
My point though was that other trees are much more important than Core Resources; ie ships, ETA and scans.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 14:25   #16
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Yeah, that was my point as well. Fact is that there hasnt been a round where I havent seen at least one person choose CE the first few tick instead of RH and ending up in a bit of a mess with his RH research.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 15:15   #17
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Right to satisfy ultimate newbie coz he helps everyone a lot and does a lot for us all:
I actually choose Construction as first priority and research as 2nd priority and first thing I construct is a metal refinery (as a res lab will take 4 ticks then i have another 6 ticks till it actually get to use the research lab so I always go for metal first then res lab then metal mines which in turn gets me more metal roids a lot quicker (which us terrans need badly).
And also to mine to 100 roids takes the same time wether its first or 2nd priority and as long as you have 1 in 5 res labs you will be ok.
As for jammers never will and never have ever wasted my money on them because there will always be someone able to scan you or cov op you and the only race a see it an advantge to is ziks tbh coz fleet scans on them is a must.
Last round i got of to a flying start having a BS fleet and small destroyer fleet which just about gave me an excellent start in XP usually attacking the biggest players in A target list and getting away with it (BS defence was rare or just not hard enough)

This is how I always start my research and construction so that i have 10 cons 8 which are metal and 2 res labs asap and it works well for me and gets me off to a good start with a good amount of metal to buy ships with.
(looks rough lineout sorry ultimitate but hope it helps your curiosity)
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 15:34   #18
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

p.s tick 48 engineering research-production-construction or research construction production depending how my research goes aka i dont miss ticks
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Written by Kloopy Wed Mar 16 22:06:43 2005

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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 15:49   #19
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by noah02
p.s tick 48 engineering research-production-construction or research construction production depending how my research goes aka i dont miss ticks
why tick 48?
you won't need to start building ships before tick 60 or even later, so you could as well enjoy the mining bonus for 12 more ticks.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 15:53   #20
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Because you already have your 10 structures by then and you want your research to be faster.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 16:00   #21
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

ah ok i thought he just put production in for mining, didn't notice he pushed research up.
but doesn't it actually mean construction on prio 1 is a waste in the first place?

i usually only build 10 constructions and don't bother about researching infrastructure until i have some eta and ships, so the only construction that really matters is the first research lab, which must be finished by the time the first research is done.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 16:02   #22
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

The advantage is that you can build alot of mines fast thus boosting your income early on.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 16:48   #23
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Envious
why tick 48?
you won't need to start building ships before tick 60 or even later, so you could as well enjoy the mining bonus for 12 more ticks.
Well it all depends on research tbh cant remember excactly but I am sure I change it stright away or 1 or 2 ticks depending on research etc...but usually I try and get engineering on the go asap coz the sooner it is started the sooner I can change it again to something else.(48 ticks + 48 ticks = 96 ticks remember so you need ships asap before that tick for sure) like I said I can't remember fully how I do things but its always same non the less as long as I dont miss a tick which I didnt last round and it went wonderfull .
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 16:55   #24
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Envious
Really? I would have sworn at 30 ticks it's already 30*0.9 = 27 at 2nd prio, and 30*0.85=25.5 -> 25 at 1st, so it's already 2 ticks ahead.

btw the relative gain is even larger if you take research centers into account, as then it is 0.65 against 0.7 (as opposed to 0.85 against 0.9), which means on average you win 1 tick every 14 ticks (without rounding)
I was basing this on the fact that there are no researches that take 30 ticks to finnish and I thought there was only 24 ticks and 36 ticks in that area but as I re-checked now, there actually are a few researches that take 32 ticks to finnish (eta-2, constructions 50 and 4th cov-op) which although are not usually researched very early. My plan don't have many 36+ tick researches either during protection so I'm gonna loose 4 ticks myself by going with mining first before research which I find more useful than finnishing a few ticks earlier. Naturally all this varies with what you research and research labs have ofc their impact. As the discussion was about research during first 72 ticks and this being general guide I'm not taking into account those who will rush for CR/BS cause you are a minority and you know what you are doing. You are also forced to do some longer researches and will benefit more timewise from having research as first priority.
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Unread 18 Jul 2005, 17:03   #25
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

I hesitate to put my Construction priority higher than 3 because it would mean that I would have to concentrate a lot of Research time on Infrastructure upgrade. What I might do this round is change my priorities from Research 2 and Construction 3 to Construction 2 and Research 3 once I have researched 50 Constructions. Last round I was a Terran and this round I will be Zik so the Construction time will actually be the same (8 ticks).
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Unread 27 Oct 2005, 23:39   #26
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guran
As the discussion was about research during first 72 ticks and this being general guide I'm not taking into account those who will rush for CR/BS cause you are a minority and you know what you are doing. You are also forced to do some longer researches and will benefit more timewise from having research as first priority.
These people can do both, surely you wont get to CR/BS before 48 ticks, so why not go MINE RES CON for first 48 then RES MINE CON after that. Unless you wanna rush in your CR/BS and switch later to mining 1st pri
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Unread 28 Oct 2005, 12:04   #27
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

If you go xan and expect to be roid heavy I would suggest to go with research as pri 1 and stick to it for a looong time. And dont stop doing resource handeling even if you are low on roids, because when you get going you will be able to get roids much faster then you can upgrade your res handeling.
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Unread 28 Oct 2005, 12:51   #28
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

I feel that you get so little gain from resources in the start that im goin res\con\mining, but tbh it doesnt matter THAT much what you choose aslong as you have those three choices picked.
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Unread 28 Oct 2005, 13:09   #29
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Tick-plans are overrated.

When it comes to it, it doesn't matter what you do in the start. You can start a week late and get a good rank (someone got a top10 some rounds ago by starting week or two late, cant remember who it was though). As long as you play your cards right throughout the whole round you'll do fine.
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Unread 28 Oct 2005, 14:16   #30
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

I always find that getting the bigger ships early can help out a lot.

If i was playing competativly i would aim for cutlass for coming outta protections (im not so i dont have a tick plan ) But getting a resonable amount of cutlass will do wonders for you early in the game as theirs gonna be a fair bit of excess xan fi floating about that you should be able to pick up before jump scans come on the scene to any big degree.

This tactic will be a lot more defencive based ive not looked into it a lot but i would think its easy enough to get your eta down and core done before your out of protection. The sacrafice has to be made in the roids department but if you have a nice FR fleet then on the whole you can pick up a roiding fleet by tick 83 that can be out roidning by tick 93 This gives you time to get you eta down once more and to get your RH up. By this time it should be possible to have an FI roiding fleet and an FR defencive fleet. The FR fleet will feed the FI fleet and the FI fleet can pick up roids.

Im not sure if that will be much help to anyone but i just felt i had to put in my 2cents if someone wants to make a tick plan for this

RH 1
Core 1
Ship 1
Ship 2
Eta 1

Thats roughly what i would aim for as a zik player. This makes the most out of your stealing early in the game when it counts and means you should be able to have 2 fairly effective roiding fleets one of which is contantly being fed by the other
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Unread 25 Nov 2005, 12:47   #31
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

i avnt played PA since the very beginning, thanks a lot for this quick guide on getting started. Looking forward to the new revamp in the next round
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Unread 22 Jan 2006, 20:22   #32
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Well each round is difference but I would think speed for races with Fi/Co pods might be important early in the round. Mines/refineries are helpful at the beggining especially for ter, cat, and zik.
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Unread 1 Mar 2006, 19:14   #33
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Thanks for the info, I'll keep this in mind on my way to tick 72.

As a Xan I followed the quick start guide with research, mining, and construction, but the buildings are nearly the same.
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Unread 6 Oct 2006, 02:19   #34
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

As a Xan, I don't try to be ready to attack at tick 72. I found attacking at that early stage brings little reward. Xans are set to concentrate on a few ship type and go for high XP roids.
That's why i find it more interesting to go for FR. By the time I'm ready there are enough juicy targets to attack. The mistake is to try absolutely to be in the top 10 during the first week. If you're at the top too early you collect low XP roids (your roids bring you only value, which you'll lose when you're attacked and if you can keep them you're entering a race to try and mine them all) and you become a good target... for me :P
So far i have used Res-Min-Cons for my engineers.
The first 2 research are about cargo transfer, the first construction is Research lab.
The most important I have found in the early stage is to make sure you got light and medium factories built within your first 10 constructions.
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Unread 6 Oct 2006, 12:40   #35
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

omfg! you made me read half this thread before I realised it's old as hell.
bumping is bad ok?
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Unread 6 Oct 2006, 12:42   #36
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

well, did you learn anything?

If so, then it was worth it, right?
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Unread 17 Jun 2007, 13:49   #37
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

so... what's changed since the first post here in 2005? we now have population instead of engineers, does that mean the whole priority 1,2,3 thing is outdated and the game works with percentage of population assigned to x now?

and are there any tickplans around, just so i can get an idea of what to do

i don't think i've allready found all the changes since my last round (r8) :P
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Unread 17 Jun 2007, 13:53   #38
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MiereNeuker
so... what's changed since the first post here in 2005? we now have population instead of engineers, does that mean the whole priority 1,2,3 thing is outdated and the game works with percentage of population assigned to x now?

and are there any tickplans around, just so i can get an idea of what to do

i don't think i've allready found all the changes since my last round (r8) :P
Umm, alot has changed in the last two rounds, so this thread is kinda outdated. What i will do is (once i've worked it out myself) is to post a replacement guide with the new population and production system and unsticky this thread.

This page on the manual details the changes from R13 or so, and except for some major changes in ship stats and the removal of PDS, i cant remember any major differences between R8 and R13.
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Unread 17 Jun 2007, 13:55   #39
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

I've read that manual page, but it's too much change upon change upon change to keep up with
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Unread 17 Jun 2007, 14:03   #40
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Re: Generic Startup Guide(s)

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Originally Posted by MiereNeuker
I've read that manual page, but it's too much change upon change upon change to keep up with
heh, it might be best to just re-learn from scratch tbh .


Oh, there was a major change from R8 to R13 - it was "PAX" - a fundamental recode of the whole engine for R10 which simplified everything (many said, too far), but by R13 enough complexity had returned to make the game fun again.

My planet actually did quite well too - i was fond of that round .
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