Depression

[JammyJim]

To any of you who have had / know people whove had / have depression.

Does depression make you lose complete sight of what you care about and those around you?

Does it mean that you just stop caring about anyone or anything that previously meant something to you....e.g.

Loved ones (bf/gf's/family members etc etc)


and why does it do this?


Ta for any info....

[skiddy]

Have you been listening to Jeremy Vine today?

[JammyJim]

no i havnt.

[JammyJim]

it was about misdiagnosis. this is if you actually have it as opposed to just being told you have it......just to get the thread back on track.

[SilverSmoke]

My father was chronical depressed, resulting in an early death.

Even in his darkest days I can say he still cared about his beloved ones although the negative moods where more on the foreground.

[Embroglio]

Originally Posted by JammyJim

Does depression make you lose complete sight of what you care about and those around you?

Yes.

Originally Posted by JammyJim

Does it mean that you just stop caring about anyone or anything that previously meant something to you

Yes, well it does at times for me.

Originally Posted by JammyJim

and why does it do this?

Because it's a physical and mental illness and something you shouldn't have to deal with alone.

[JammyJim]

so basically its capable of disorting how you feel about people you love

meaning your not sure if you actually love them anymore because you dont seem to care if you see/hear from them....

[Thermodynamics]

First, read my footnote.
Hope is nothing but the prelude and procascination of dissapointment.
The only solace I derive from my darkest moments is that I *can* end it. *I* Don't have to put up with it.
Apathy coupled with disillusionment- in the contetx of my life; it defines it
Since I had cancer and had a rough time with several girlfriends I have lost my drive and motivation for everything, my mind has succumbed to contemplating how millions of years of painstaking evolution, millions of years of "improvement" have led to what we term "society".
Walk down the street, they are all already dead, they have no purpose beyond what their petty minds can contemplate.
Do they care about you? Do they care about those suffering? No.

And the worse part is: I am one of them, so are you.

[Dead_Meat]

I think I'll just go and buy a farm after reading that post.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Thermodynamics

First, read my footnote.
Hope is nothing but the prelude and procascination of dissapointment.
The only solace I derive from my darkest moments is that I *can* end it. *I* Don't have to put up with it.
Apathy coupled with disillusionment- in the contetx of my life; it defines it
Since I had cancer and had a rough time with several girlfriend's I have lost my drive and motivation for everything, my mind has succumbed to contemplating how millions of years of painstaking evolution, millions of years of "improvement" have lead to what we call "society".
Walk down the street, they are all already dead, they have no purpose beyond what their petty minds can contemplate.
Do they care about you? Do they care about those suffering? No.

And the worse part is: I am one of them, so are you.

Terminal cancer?

[JammyJim]

well that was bloody happy clappy stuff wasnt it?

and btw

i am not suffering from depression.

[Thermodynamics]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

Terminal cancer?

Still suffering.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Thermodynamics

Still suffering.

Do you go to chemotherapy? What exactly is it (if you don't mind me asking)? I am curious as I have never met anyone your age (I'm presuming you're fairly young here) suffering from cancer in Ireland.

[Thermodynamics]

When I was 13, I had a tumour growing on the main facial nerve of my face.
My operation was going to be after Christmas [public hospital etc., no enough staff] but my parents borrowed money to get it done asap. It was a very dangerous operation as if the tumour had affected my facila nerve, the nerve would have had to be cut- and i would have lost all control of the left side of my face, as it is i merely have no feeling in my left ear and cheek.
The tumour was then sent to Belfast for tests, it was malignant- i was very lucky, it could easily have affected my skull, and hence, possibly my brain.
Two years later, I had a tumour in the same place. Thankfully, quick diagnosis and my facial nerve wasn't touched.
Turns out it has affect the bone marrow just below my left ear, encouraging the growth of cancerous cells,
It can't be removed because that section of marrow is essential to supporting my brain. And i can't take chemo because the risk to my brain is too great.
Luckily i have been told that is is regressing and is unlikely to re-accur, so those of you who know, know i am a health freak with good reason.
I am 18, so yes I am fairly young.

[JammyJim]

:-(

[JonnyBGood]

I'm unsure whether you're lucky or unlucky but I'd probably go with the latter. Does the fact you're a "health freak" help prevent the recurrence of the cancer?

As a complete aside where do/did you go to school?

[Thermodynamics]

I don't know. Nobody does. But a healthy lifestyle is well.... healthy... But it hopefully will stop any other ailments. St. Andrews College, Dublin, you?

[JonnyBGood]

I went to Blackrock, currently studying mathematical science (ps not gay) in UCD. You seem very depressed for an eighteen year old, speaking from my grand old vantage point of score years and none. Do you have your leaving cert this year?

[Thermodynamics]

Indeed i do. I am often told I think too much. I am very emotionally insecure and dependant- i've had 17 girlfriends and been dumped 16 times. Been sober for two years- guess what? i'm a depressive drunk!

Mathematical science? I love maths, physics and computers
Potential courses in college- Theoretical Physics, Experimental Physics or Computational Mathematics,
private message me with your pnick and channels you hang out, i'd like to chat ta ya on IRC! If you don't mind!

[JonnyBGood]

17 girlfriends? And you're eighteen? Is that 17 actual girlfriends or do you consider every shag an offer of marriage or something?

You can find me as JBG in #forums and I don't mind at all.


PS Haha JJ hijacked your thread you useless admin.

[Thermodynamics]

Yes as in *actual* girlfriends, whom i have gone out with. I have only slept with one girl, and was deeply in love with her at the time. Very few would consider me promiscuous, I need an emotional connection before i can start to derive any sort of strong physical attraction.

I need the emotional security, intimacy and shared feelings that are intrinsic to a romantic relationship to pursue any semblance of happiness that i might have

As previously said, i am very emotionally insecure and dependant.
I will pm ya 2mrw ;-p

[JonnyBGood]

Jesus but you sound like you're forty and married with three children. Surely we're all at the stage where all we want is our bit on the weekends? Anyhow I may not be on tomorrow or the next day (college is ending and that means alcohol in quantities large enough to necessitate my liver transplant being moved up a decade or so) but if I am I will be on irc!

[skiddy]

I think he's in love with you Jonny.

[JonnyBGood]

Never fear skiddy nothing can replace the emotional security and loving support you provide when you tenderly gather me in your strong arms.

[Dace]

Depression is "not fun"

[Marilyn Manson]

My Mother was on medication for depression, and she was emotionally unstable and not very pleasant to be around most of the time she was suffering from it.

[queball]

Every single night the same arrangement
I go out and fight the fight.
Still I always feel the strangest strangement
Nothing here is real, nothing here is right.
I've been making shows of trading blows
just hoping no one knows
That i've been going through the motions
walking through the part.
Nothing seems to penetrate my heart.

[SilverSmoke]

Let me serve you guys a proportion of Linkin Park mixed with a tad of Papa Roach.

[Dead_Meat]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

My Mother was on medication for depression, and she was emotionally unstable and not very pleasant to be around most of the time she was suffering from it.

It's a good thing your Dad wasn't around much, I doubt he'd have liked that much either...

[IncubusGod]

Oh well depression is just so much fun! Personally it never really affected my opinons of those I love. Just myself. Though at the time it was only my family around.
Since I've gotten back on track and actually had some gf's too then things seem fine but certain characteristics have popped back into my actions lately that are getting me worried. I don't feel depressed but I just don't feel much anymore*. *shrug*

Means problems for me as I have a gf who appears to love me now and I'm stuck not feelin much about anyone.

So I suppose it can JJ. Depends on the person.




*this may be the condition known as "being male"

[KaneED]

Stop being a miserable bastard James, buck up!

[pyirt]

Originally Posted by JammyJim

To any of you who have had / know people whove had / have depression.

Does depression make you lose complete sight of what you care about and those around you?

Does it mean that you just stop caring about anyone or anything that previously meant something to you....e.g.

Loved ones (bf/gf's/family members etc etc)


and why does it do this?


Ta for any info....

My doctor diagnosed me with depression about a year ago. I did n`t even realise I was suffering from depression at the time. It was then I knew I had suffered like this before. I did n`t stop caring about people, it was the physical symptoms, aggrophobia and nervousness that where pretty unpleasant. Got prescribed some Dothiopen.

[AliasX]

Isn't "Bi-Polar" a similar condition to depression?

[MAdnRisKy]

JJ, gimmie some time to get home and read the thread, and I'll write something on it for you, or if it's a burning issue, find me on IRC. I'll drop by #forums tonight

[Event_Horizon]

Depression is not my expertise as I am generally a happy person and have not studied it at the university. So my question: Is depression a chemical imbalance in your body or is it more like insanity by being something wrong with your brain?

[SilverSmoke]

The main point is, to answer your question, as far I know science doesn't know yet if the entire human soul is being powered by chemical/physical reactions or by something else like a ghostlike ego.

[roadrunner_0]

depression takes so many different forms that it is impossible to come up with a single set of symptoms, yes, what you have described at the start of the thread could well be a form of depression, but i wouldnt take as read anything that you read here, your best recourse is actually a doctor. Sorry, i dont know of any really good online resources about it otherwise i would just recomend them to you

[JammyJim]

there are no decent online resources actually.

[Sarina_Joy]

I know several people who have been diagnosed with depression, though never suffered from it myself.

One girl was diagnosed as clinically depressed, yet she was seen as a 'happy' person to most - she was outgoing, enjoyed socialising etc. On the surface she didn't stop caring about others or about things which had previously been important to her. She was constantly feeling paranoid that people didn't care about her. To be honest I always thought she was attention seeking - she was very self absorbed, and while she seemed to be interested in her friends she always wanted to talk about herself and her own problems - she wanted the world to revolve around her.

Currently my Mother is suffering from depression. This largely stems from my fathers death and the fact that she feels in some way guilty and thinks that she didn't care for him properly when he had cancer. Unfortunately the effect of this is that neither my brother or myself can mention my father to her for fear of not saying the 'right thing'. One time we were discussing something dad had done which had quite amused us and my mother basically went off on one at us, saying that we were 'disrespecting' our fathers memory (personally I prefer to remember him as he was and not as some kind of perfect being that bears no relation to him). Essentially what my mother is doing is pushing us away, and at the same time complaining that we don't spend enough time with her. It hasn't made her stop caring about others around her but again she is starting to become paranoid that nobody cares about her.

[Event_Horizon]

Originally Posted by JammyJim

there are no decent online resources actually.

Try webmd.com

[MAdnRisKy]

hmmmm ok where to start.

In case anyone didn't know, what i type here comes from working in mental health, but that said it's still only one side of situation, and everyone is different, so *really* don't add too much weight to anything I say on the subject. JJ it depends on the level of "depression". and for the record I don't like the word, because it doesn't describe anything anymore. If you talk to one person who is "depressed" they may tell you that they have trouble getting to sleep or wake up early in a morning, that they're lethargic, maybe they've stopped going to work, they probably spend less time socialising and most will say they have a very low mood, or feel 'down' a lot of the time. That said, you can find others, who actively make themselves go to work, and some find it very easy to go to sleep at night, and don't wake up in a morning, some have regular eating paterns, and other people will lose appitiet and stop eating, whilst others will have an appitiete but lack the motivation to make anything to eat.

Yet all these people if they go to see their GP will be diagnosed (hopefully, if their GP is someone who will acknowledge mental health problems, some don't because of the increased and difficult workload such patients represent, they frequently don't show to appointments, and muck up targets and nearly all mental health problems, are very difficult to discet properly to provide any direct treatment other than medication in a 7 - 10 minute consultation) with "depression". Now these days there are 'levels' of depression (well there's always been levels but they're much more happily expressed as such over the last 10 years or so) mild, moderate and severe. it's only really in the more severe cases that you begin to see anything like psychotic symptoms where a persons actual perception of reality is radically altered, but that said, a large proportion of depression is recently being seen as a cognitive diysfunction. That is to say a miss attribution of events in terms of their impacts and responsibilities. Typically a depressed person, if something fortutitous happens to them, will say that their actions had no effect on the outcome that is happening to them, but if something negative happens then it is all their fault. They feel a failure, and they feel unworthy or worthless. Again these are only some accounts, not a hard and fast rule.

Now you may have read recently (I caught an article in the times on the way to work this morning) to do with GPs over prescribing SSRIs or rather prescribing them in situations which they may be better not to. SSRIs (or selective seratonin reuptake inhibitors) are a type of anti depressant, a catgegory in which drugs like seroxat and prozac lie (peroxetine and fluoxetine if you want the generic names). This is interesting because what the regulatory bodies and advisory commities like the National Institute for Clinical Excelence (or NICE - heh) are recommending is more therapy based approaches being used instead of drugs, largely due to the unstable effects of such antidepressants being prescribed for mild to moderate depressives.


But enough waffle cos I;m not answering your point JJ. No depression doesn't make you lose sight of those who care about you, often, and some of the people I've seen have said this, they withdraw from social interaction because they don't want those around them to see them being moody or a "kill joy" as one person put it today to me. and so no you don't stpop caring, but sometimes you do think (wrongly) that your family or friends stop caring about you, and this is difficult, because anyone who asks a mate out, and is declined lots will eventually stop asking, something which reinforces their opinions. but then the more someone asks and the more they keeps saying no, the more the patient feels guilty for 'letting their mates down'. and often cognitions feed back onto behaviour like stpopping going out with "well you wouldn't have had fun anyway" so you go oput less, which feeds back onto the thoughts, and then you have the physical feelings too, creating a loop or cycle which can be very hard to break.

here's a couple of websites for you to look at anyway, and like I said, I'll be lurking on IRC if you want to catch me


http://www.scmh.org.uk/ <---- sainsbury centre for mental health (I know, same family as the supermarket lot it's actually a charity based group, but is also quite a definative authority in the area)
http://www.nimhe.org.uk/ <----- national institute for mental health in england
http://www.dipex.org/ <----- site filled with patient testimonies about problems they've had and treatment they've recieved.

[Weeks]

Originally Posted by Thermodynamics

First, read my footnote.
Hope is nothing but the prelude and procascination of dissapointment.
The only solace I derive from my darkest moments is that I *can* end it. *I* Don't have to put up with it.
Apathy coupled with disillusionment- in the contetx of my life; it defines it
Since I had cancer and had a rough time with several girlfriends I have lost my drive and motivation for everything, my mind has succumbed to contemplating how millions of years of painstaking evolution, millions of years of "improvement" have led to what we term "society".
Walk down the street, they are all already dead, they have no purpose beyond what their petty minds can contemplate.
Do they care about you? Do they care about those suffering? No.

And the worse part is: I am one of them, so are you.

POTW!

When i think of depression I always think of that quote I read on radiohead.com

"Man's mind was made for short-time problems like running away from a Lion etc, todays problems that society puts upon its members is slow and gradual and the human mind invariably can't take it"

Which I agree with. Basically that society evoluted faster than the human brain has. That's not the exact quote but it's near enough (radiohead.com have archives of their old sites if you wish to waste some hours away and loose all hope). Although to me radiohead's songs offer help sometimes, like Nothing to Fear for example. Comfort in depression possibly. Comfort in sound.

[Thermodynamics]

Oh, where to start. For those of you who haven't noticed- I am very open- I feel the need to express myself on a regular basis- this has been called "needy", "self-centered" etc. I wouldn't argue the point.

1) "Surely we're all at the stage where all we want is our bit on the weekends?"- for me, any sort of sexual interaction is an intensely emotional experience, a turmoilt of ectasy and mutual love and affection- an expression of your deepest and most intimate feelings for each other. As such, I cannot "hook-up" with a girl, I need the relationship. I need the emotional support and intimacy only a girlfriend can provide- the tender love and affection, I need to know that i am accpeted and wanted on a regular basis- and physical expression (cuddling, holding hands etc.) is the best manifestation of this, I long for it at ever conscious point in my life.

2) "Is depression a chemical imbalance in your body or is it more like insanity by being something wrong with your brain?" Well, all emotions can be viewed as a chemical imbalance influenced by external stimuli that you have been conditioned to believe are positive or negative.
I get down, miserable and depressed, my seratonin levels drop (seratonin being the chemical which is most commonly associated with happiness). Long-term depression has been shown to shrink the size of th gland just beneath your hippocampus which produces seratonin- a vicous circle.

3) I have been diagnosed with "severe manic- depression". This is merely a label slapped on me to best describe my mental health- a label derived from taking a demograph of 18 year old western males and seeing how far off it I am. I have been on anti- depressants, those close to me press me to take them again. But as arrogant as this may sound, the one thing I value is my intellect- my capacity to reason, think, process etv.- I feel this is only impeded by anit-depressants. They do not solve any problems- they merely affect the delicate chemical balances in your brain. You get a severe laceration- inject some morphine, the pain may be gone, but the problem is still there. I am also very neurotic- on the rare occasions I am happy, it is wonderfully so.

4) When I read about the depths of human depravity, I am convined the problem doesn't lie with me, but those who rape, kill and abuse- and the society which has raised them. In these moments my only comfort is take i may absent myself from the said society at any point i wish. In these moments, the only strong feelings i feel are for those I love. I distance myself from them in an effort to isolate my pain,I wish not to burden them with it. Any disregard I show for them stems form my certainity that they will be OK, if I didn't believe it I couldn't do it, I couldn't hurt them so in my efforts to contain my pain.

Hmmm... all done for now i think....

[Sarina_Joy]

Originally Posted by Thermodynamics

Oh, where to start. For those of you who haven't noticed- I am very open- I feel the need to express myself on a regular basis- this has been called "needy", "self-centered" etc. I wouldn't argue the point.
....

Practically everyone I know feels the need to express themself on a regular basis. This does not make you self centred. To me self centred is when you talk about yourself a lot but never listen to others when they want to talk about themselves.

[Thermodynamics]

Thank you.

[Tomkat]

You're a bit angsty aren't you?

[KaneED]

I think I'm in a state of depression having read soem of this stuff, I thought it before anyway. Fortunately, I'm not depressed to the state where i want to cut myself although I do on depraved anger fits at myself which i admit hurt, but its not attention seeking and its frustration and anger with myself mainly for not dealing with it.

Not much I can do except ride the wave, and in the meantime, I'm relatively nice, JJ can confess to that.

I went to his flat, and he lives with 4 boys who he does not know or speak, can anyone say repressed?

[Thermodynamics]

Angsty?? I am not familiar with the term...

I understand about the self-harm everyone seems to go through at some stage. And very few who I have known to do it, do it for "attention", their motivations generally lay within themselves.

I am truly sorry if I have brought some of you guys down with me by posting here- it was not my intention.
I am also sorry for any of you who have had unpleasant memories of loved oned dragged up by this too, I can understand your pain. In fact, I really don't know why I did this in the first place.

When i self-harmed, it was beatings, bruisings, scalding, and cutting- I found if i could reach a pinnacle of physical endurance, whereby my emotional pain matched and counteracted my physcological pain, they seemed to be the antithesis of each other- I would enter a heightened state of ectasy, of bliss whereby I felt no pain, a state of physcoligical, physical and spiritual contentment. I cannot even begin to compare it to any other experience, I have not encountered anything even remotely akin to it.

[Event_Horizon]

Originally Posted by Thermodynamics

Oh, where to start. For those of you who haven't noticed- I am very open- I feel the need to express myself on a regular basis- this has been called "needy", "self-centered" etc. I wouldn't argue the point.

1) "Surely we're all at the stage where all we want is our bit on the weekends?"- for me, any sort of sexual interaction is an intensely emotional experience, a turmoilt of ectasy and mutual love and affection- an expression of your deepest and most intimate feelings for each other. As such, I cannot "hook-up" with a girl, I need the relationship. I need the emotional support and intimacy only a girlfriend can provide- the tender love and affection, I need to know that i am accpeted and wanted on a regular basis- and physical expression (cuddling, holding hands etc.) is the best manifestation of this, I long for it at ever conscious point in my life.

2) "Is depression a chemical imbalance in your body or is it more like insanity by being something wrong with your brain?" Well, all emotions can be viewed as a chemical imbalance influenced by external stimuli that you have been conditioned to believe are positive or negative.
I get down, miserable and depressed, my seratonin levels drop (seratonin being the chemical which is most commonly associated with happiness). Long-term depression has been shown to shrink the size of th gland just beneath your hippocampus which produces seratonin- a vicous circle.

3) I have been diagnosed with "severe manic- depression". This is merely a label slapped on me to best describe my mental health- a label derived from taking a demograph of 18 year old western males and seeing how far off it I am. I have been on anti- depressants, those close to me press me to take them again. But as arrogant as this may sound, the one thing I value is my intellect- my capacity to reason, think, process etv.- I feel this is only impeded by anit-depressants. They do not solve any problems- they merely affect the delicate chemical balances in your brain. You get a severe laceration- inject some morphine, the pain may be gone, but the problem is still there. I am also very neurotic- on the rare occasions I am happy, it is wonderfully so.

4) When I read about the depths of human depravity, I am convined the problem doesn't lie with me, but those who rape, kill and abuse- and the society which has raised them. In these moments my only comfort is take i may absent myself from the said society at any point i wish. In these moments, the only strong feelings i feel are for those I love. I distance myself from them in an effort to isolate my pain,I wish not to burden them with it. Any disregard I show for them stems form my certainity that they will be OK, if I didn't believe it I couldn't do it, I couldn't hurt them so in my efforts to contain my pain.

Hmmm... all done for now i think....

I always have a hard time trying to understand why people are continually depressed. Sure I get down on myself if i make a bad grade on a test, or I get sad if a family member dies or if a relationship goes sour, but I just move on and keep heading towards my goals in life. What are your goals in life? Do you have any ambition to achieve them?
I think that looking at society and noting the raping and pillaging and getting depressed over it is a bit ridiculous. The world has always been like this and will always be like that, it is nature. But for all the bad i think there is an equal amount of good if not more. I am not trying to put you down or anything or even argue with you, but I guess my point is don't you find happiness going through life and moving towards goals that you set for yourself?

[Thermodynamics]

Goals, ambitions? For what? Sure i want my material comforts... but when i wlk down the stairs every day, my brain makes many, many complicated calculations: my weight, air resistance, the resistive forces of the stairs, the friction the carpet will provide etc.

A single miscalculation and my ankle could slip, i could easily fall. Snap my neck, fracture my skull. My life could end at any point, being constantly aware of this..... hmmm..... creates a general approach to life known as apathy. My most depressed times are spent hiding under my desk or on my floor in the dark, I simply do not have any drive nor do I derive any pleasure out of the accomplishment of my goals, perhaps the rest of society can't see past tomorrow- but i can't see out of the cruel cage of depression of depression that I have enforced upon my mind and being- and why i do not know.