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14 Jun 2004, 10:52
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#1
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Relatively simple networking question
there are now three computers in my house. The set up is as follows.
My brothers computer, downstairs, Pentium 2 gig Win XP. Connected to NTL cable modem for internet.
My computer, upstairs. Connected by network cable through the ceiling to my brother. Win XP. uses internet connection sharing.
Now, i have just fixed my ANCIENT pentium 2 400mhz Windows 98 computer for my dad. The only reason im standing for such shite, is because he only wants it generally for word processing, and a little bit of surfing on various news sites. It may, have an ancient network card in it (one of the ones that fits in those old huge slots), this card may or may not work, either way i have no problem spending a bit of cash replacing it if neccesary.
But how do i connect this up to the network? Some sort of Network hub? Where would i get one for cheapest?
PS : Im pre-empting anyone suggesting a Router. I have no problem with having to have my Brothers computer on practically 24/7 for anyone to be able to access the internet.
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14 Jun 2004, 10:53
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#2
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cynic
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
why not get a router anyway, its still the best option if you are going to be spending a little bit of money anyway, and out router only cost £35 fs
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lazy
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14 Jun 2004, 10:55
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#3
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First Disciple of Aldur
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: The Vale of Aldur
Posts: 1,470
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
The only logical solution to this question is to purchase a Router. Not buying one is just stupidity.
PS: There is a forum for this sort of thing I should point out.
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Yeah.
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14 Jun 2004, 10:56
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#4
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
dude, im trying to connect a 7 year old computer that id be lucky to get £100 for to a network. The idea is i spend as little as possible, its a shiteheap.
Routers probably over kill, any way i can get a network hub though?
Or what about buying a second network card for my Brothers PC and cabling it to my Dads?
Edit : I know theres a forum for this, but its inactive, and slow, and the main posters are from here anyway.
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14 Jun 2004, 11:06
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#5
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First Disciple of Aldur
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: The Vale of Aldur
Posts: 1,470
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
A router is the best solution, but you I suppose you could get a switch and manually assign IP's to each computer. I recently got one from a computer fair, an 8-port one, for £18. It's plugged into my router.
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Yeah.
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14 Jun 2004, 11:13
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#6
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NEWSBOT
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: The enby cave!
Posts: 4,872
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
you don't have to manually assign just cos you have a switch.
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14 Jun 2004, 11:42
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#7
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Assuming i have to buy a ****ing router (*%£**$), where, how much, what else do i need, is there any problems with me running 98.
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14 Jun 2004, 12:05
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#8
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:alpha:
Join Date: May 2002
Location: London, UK
Posts: 7,871
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
http://www.ebuyer.com , http://www.dabs.com etc will sell you a decent one, and they're pretty cheap.
Just the router and the cat5 cables should do it, everything else will come with the router.
Ensure you have the right type of router for your modem though (if it's USB or cable etc).
It should work on Windows 98 - all you should have to do is hook your dad's computer up to the router and then just alter his browser settings...
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14 Jun 2004, 13:35
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#9
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cynic
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
our router has 98SE 200 pro and XP machines running through it with no problems
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lazy
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14 Jun 2004, 13:37
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#10
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
I really dont want to buy a ****ing Router. I have no need for one and im not spending £30 "cheap" as you may think it.
Surely theres something simple, a Network T Junction - something to join three Cat 5 network cables. I dont care about one computer always having to be on for the others to access the internet.
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14 Jun 2004, 13:44
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#11
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edited for readability
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: for something...
Posts: 1,207
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Nope, we did this 2 years ago when we went from 2 to 5 computers.. The only way to do it is to get a router. Trust me. Hubs will only connect your computers 2gether, not you internet.
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14 Jun 2004, 14:22
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#12
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Love's Sweet Exile
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Living on a Stair (Now Sword-less)
Posts: 2,371
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Thick-ethernet + vampire-taps anyone?
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14 Jun 2004, 14:40
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#13
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Old Man O Deh *****s
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: In spelelpee land
Posts: 3,516
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Qdeathstar
Nope, we did this 2 years ago when we went from 2 to 5 computers.. The only way to do it is to get a router. Trust me. Hubs will only connect your computers 2gether, not you internet.
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O rly?
So a hub won't carry DHCP requests? If the second PC can get on the network, it almost certainly follows that a thirs will, as long as the subnet they are all using is large enough.
Deffeh, you using private network addresses or DHCP assigned ones?
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Dead_Meat
You dont need to keep beating a dog to get it to stop shitting on the carpet
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14 Jun 2004, 14:47
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#14
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th0ng gimp
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: somewhere in th0ngland
Posts: 1,798
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deffeh
I really dont want to buy a ****ing Router. I have no need for one and im not spending £30 "cheap" as you may think it.
Surely theres something simple, a Network T Junction - something to join three Cat 5 network cables. I dont care about one computer always having to be on for the others to access the internet.
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A token ring?
Oh lordy lord!
I hubs are easy nough to come accross cheap. I think I have an old 10 mb hub and it cost me about a tenner around 4 years ago!
No second hand pc shops or computer fairs around by you?
Look arund and I am sure you will find something.
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14 Jun 2004, 14:57
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#15
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dead_Meat
O rly?
So a hub won't carry DHCP requests? If the second PC can get on the network, it almost certainly follows that a thirs will, as long as the subnet they are all using is large enough.
Deffeh, you using private network addresses or DHCP assigned ones?
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Honest to god i dont know. Its just a simple, home network. Cat5 wires, network cards, internet sharing etc. I havent customized any settings or anything
What if i bought a second network card for my brothers PC, and connected a second Cat 5 wire from it to my Dads network card?
Presumably My computer couldnt access my dads, but my dads would still get internet, no?
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14 Jun 2004, 15:24
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#16
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cynic
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
its still a lot easier to get a router, for not much more money (and i presume that you arent paying as this is for your dads benefit) you will save yourself a lot of hassle
what have you got against routers anyway?
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lazy
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14 Jun 2004, 15:45
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#17
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
A network cable would cost a fiver, this mysterious t junction thing presumably about the same. Thats £25 less than the "cheapest" router you suggested. I neither know what router to buy, how to work one, etc etc. Nor do i care about computers being able to access the internet independantly
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14 Jun 2004, 15:56
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#18
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cynic
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Bishop Auckland Co. Durham
Posts: 8,809
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
fair enough, but if you can route your comps through your bros, they you can setup a router
plus, as i said, i imagine that you wont be paying if its for your dads benefit...
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lazy
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14 Jun 2004, 16:30
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#19
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Old Man O Deh *****s
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: In spelelpee land
Posts: 3,516
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
If there are no additional settings to be made, it sounds like your network connection is similar to mine, so all you'll need is a switch, which'll be about £20 if that.
Just take the connection from the original PC, plug it into the switch, then run two CAT5's to your PC and your Dad's.
The main thing is that since you haven't had to 'do' anything, and know even less (lol), then this will be the simplest solution.
You don't need a router, If you needed a router you'd have needed it when you connected the second PC.
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Dead_Meat
You dont need to keep beating a dog to get it to stop shitting on the carpet
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14 Jun 2004, 17:13
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#20
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The Twilight of the Gods
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 23,481
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Qdeathstar
Nope, we did this 2 years ago when we went from 2 to 5 computers.. The only way to do it is to get a router. Trust me. Hubs will only connect your computers 2gether, not you internet.
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My network, which has one pc with a PCI ADSL Modem as the only internet connection, would like to disagree with you.
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14 Jun 2004, 19:48
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#21
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Friendly geek of GD :-/
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: On my metal roid
Posts: 923
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Buy another network card! Leave your brothers pc running (as "router", i.e. using internet connection sharing). Given the fact there is a free PCI slot to fit in the card, it should work. NICs are quite cheap (8 Euros in Germany ~ 5 quid?).
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14 Jun 2004, 19:51
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#22
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetLinus
Buy another network card! Leave your brothers pc running (as "router", i.e. using internet connection sharing). Given the fact there is a free PCI slot to fit in the card, it should work. NICs are quite cheap (8 Euros in Germany ~ 5 quid?).
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So just buying a second network card for my brothers pc, and connecting that one up to my dads pc, should work for ICS?
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14 Jun 2004, 19:51
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#23
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The Twilight of the Gods
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 23,481
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deffeh
So just buying a second network card for my brothers pc, and connecting that one up to my dads pc, should work for ICS?
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Yeah, it should do (I did something similar at college)
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14 Jun 2004, 19:53
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#24
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Well, ****ing brilliant, thatll do me. I knew i didnt have to buy a shittin router
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14 Jun 2004, 20:04
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#25
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Henry Kelly
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 7,374
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Unless money is a significant concern I'd have gone the router route (lol); you get a box with shiny lights on the front that flash and dance attractively.
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14 Jun 2004, 20:11
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#26
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
i have no money
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14 Jun 2004, 20:15
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#27
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Henry Kelly
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 7,374
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Not even for flashy lights?
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14 Jun 2004, 21:09
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#28
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ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Sept 2057
Posts: 1,813
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
I haven't seen T-junctions in networks since the days of coax cabling on a 10base2 network. This would require coaxial cables (harder to find nowadays, and no, CAT5 won't do) and network cards with BNC connections (again, not easy to pickup reliably). About five years ago I thought it would be a good idea to save money on a switch by just getting a 10base2 network with T-junctions and running a long line of coax around the house. Four and a half years ago I realised how shit this idea was a shelled out £50 on a 100mbps switch and several lengths of CAT5. I still use it, and don't plan to change it in the forseeable future.
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14 Jun 2004, 23:07
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#29
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Friendly geek of GD :-/
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: On my metal roid
Posts: 923
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Yes, a computer with 2 network cards (well, 3 if you have to connect the modem as well) works as a router. Works nice with windows ICS. I tried.
I wasn't satisfied though, as the lag for StarCraft was too high AND I couldn't configure NAT and port forwarding like I wanted. Didn't find the right windows router software (and winroute was too complicated I believe).
Well, so I bought a router, which is nice.
BUT: For websurfing, mailing, ICQing and file sharing, ICS and the network-card-solution will be ok.
[edit: I don't understand why noone came up with this idea before I did]
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14 Jun 2004, 23:14
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#30
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wild one
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: River Edge, NJ
Posts: 3,313
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Got that BartPE Linus, cheers for that.
While we're on the topic of networking - both myself and a friend across the road have networks within our houses. We want to link them via a wireless link. Now, in a software sense, it doesn't really matter if we're on the same network - we're happy to run all machines in one domain or keep them as seperate networks, but hardware wise what would I need? Would two WAP's act as an invisible cat5 cable or am I being too simple here?
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14 Jun 2004, 23:14
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#31
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Klaatu barada nikto
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 3,237
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deffeh
Well, ****ing brilliant, thatll do me. I knew i didnt have to buy a shittin router
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When is this hate-filled libel against routers going to end?
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15 Jun 2004, 02:21
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#32
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:alpha:
Join Date: May 2002
Location: London, UK
Posts: 7,871
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dead_Meat
Just take the connection from the original PC, plug it into the switch, then run two CAT5's to your PC and yours
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15 Jun 2004, 02:25
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#33
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Old Man O Deh *****s
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: In spelelpee land
Posts: 3,516
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
I just assume Deffeh assumed my reply was unhelpful and ignored it, even though I was right all along.
Oh well, my reputation going ahead of me...
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Dead_Meat
You dont need to keep beating a dog to get it to stop shitting on the carpet
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15 Jun 2004, 09:55
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#34
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Angry Young Man
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Mister Cacciatore's down on Sullivan Street
Posts: 7,518
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Re: Relatively simple networking question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dead_Meat
I just assume Deffeh assumed my reply was unhelpful and ignored it, even though I was right all along.
Oh well, my reputation going ahead of me...
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No, it was my first choice, till the simple "just buy another network card" idea. Thanks anyway
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