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24 Mar 2005, 09:12
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#1
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Rawr rawr
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Upside down
Posts: 5,300
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What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Our minister of national management renewal (or whatever the word for it is) resigned his post after the "eerste kamer" (can eb compared with you house of lords I believe) rejected the plans for an elected mayor.
And now his party is threatening the rest of the cabinet to plunge the whole government into a crisis if they don't implement one of their other major agenda items.
I can't believe people can have their heads so far up their own arse. I've never seen something as childish as Dutch politics.
Do things like this happen in the UK too? That ministers resign when their plans get rejected?
The worst part of this is that when the government falls (again) I will have to vote again and figure out what every party has to offer.
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"Yay"
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24 Mar 2005, 09:17
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#2
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Banned
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: ******
Posts: 2,326
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Democracy sucks
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24 Mar 2005, 11:21
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#3
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Idle Git
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wandering
Posts: 1,550
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
In the UK, when their plans fail, they try to make it sound like it actually succeeded, just in a different form (they can't stand the idea of being seen to be defeated in something), or, in the case of the Labour government, they bully MP's into voting for it (through the use of MP's called Whips), and then when it gets to the House of Lords, if it fails, they send it back and forth til it gets accepted (although more recently they brought in an act that means they can force it through the House of Lords, i.e. bypass it completely - which, when considered next to other parts of the UK governments setup, means that the government can do whatever the hell it wants really).
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24 Mar 2005, 11:35
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#4
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Born Sinful
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Loughborough, UK
Posts: 4,059
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Actually the Parliament Act (the legislation allowing the Commons to bypass the Lords) has been around for nearly 100 years, but it's never been so flagrantly abused by anyone before Labour came along.
Quote:
Originally Posted by http://www.parliament.uk
Until the early years of the 20th century, the House of Lords had the power to prevent legislation, as bills had to be passed by both Houses of Parliament.
David Lloyd-George's so-called 'people's budget' of 1909 brought this arrangement under strain, when the House of Lords originally refused to pass it. Eventually, the budget was passed after a general election in 1910; a second election was then fought on the issue of reform of the House of Lords. The result was the Parliament Act of 1911, which removed from the House of Lords the power to veto a bill, except one to prolong the lifetime of a parliament. Instead, the Lords could delay a bill by up to two years. The Act also reduced the maximum lifespan of a Parliament from seven years to its present five years. The Parliament Act 1949 further reduced the Lords' delaying powers to one year.
Since 1949 four acts have been passed into law without the consent of the House of Lords:
The War Crimes Act 1991
The European Parliamentary Elections Act 1999
The Sexual Offences (Amendment) Act 2000
The Hunting Act 2004
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__________________
Worth dying for. Worth killing for. Worth going to hell for. Amen.
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24 Mar 2005, 12:05
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#5
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Lucky
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: -
Posts: 3,830
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
i don't think this will cause another crisis in the parliament. think it'll end with a 'generaal pardon' for the D66 rebels. :P
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24 Mar 2005, 12:07
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#6
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Choice of Whacker sir?
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Ireland
Posts: 679
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
its election time.
lets open the gates on issues deemed sensitive but will curry favour with the mass voters who read the like of the Daily Telegraph.
blah blah blah
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* thanos sets mode: -brain The_Shadow_Man
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24 Mar 2005, 13:20
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#7
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Sub
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: University of Bath
Posts: 444
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
I like the House of Lords. They are probably the only part of the political system that is remotely interested in civil liberties.
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24 Mar 2005, 13:29
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#8
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Idle Git
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wandering
Posts: 1,550
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
I like the house of Lords, they are not elected which means that they can go with their feelings rather than make decisions based on trying to get as many votes as possible.
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24 Mar 2005, 13:36
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#9
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Mr. Blobby
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,271
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
My city has had an elected mayor for years
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24 Mar 2005, 13:37
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#10
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Bored
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Nottm ->Shef ->Croydon ->Manc ->Durham ->Sheffield
Posts: 6,506
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
I thought the parliament act could only be used if the bill has been rejected by the lords in two seperate terms? there are a few other things needed as well i think...
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24 Mar 2005, 13:43
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#11
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Idle Git
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wandering
Posts: 1,550
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Certainly it has to be rejected twice, and the reason they didn't use it for the recent "anti-terrorism" bullshit was because there wasn't enough time before the old legislation ran out for them to use it. But it does mean that, given time, the government can force through pretty much anything if they have a sufficient majority in the commons.
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24 Mar 2005, 14:06
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#12
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Love's Sweet Exile
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Living on a Stair (Now Sword-less)
Posts: 2,371
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
How terrible, that having an elected majority is enough for the government to make decisions, and that an unelected body merely plays an advisory role, with the Royal Assent being a mere formality.
I blame asylum seekers.
__________________
--SYMM--
Ba Ba Ti Ki Di Do
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24 Mar 2005, 14:26
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#13
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NEWSBOT
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: The enby cave!
Posts: 4,872
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leshy
My city has had an elected mayor for years
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so has my old one, and he's an utter cock.
__________________
[20:27:47] <nodrog-aawy> **** i think my housemate just caught me masturbating
[11:25:32] <idimmu> you are a little piggy arent you
[13:17:00] <KaneED> i'm so closet i'm like narnia
__________________
Pretty parks and funky scrap metal things here
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24 Mar 2005, 14:41
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#14
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Idle Git
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wandering
Posts: 1,550
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by SYMM
How terrible, that having an elected majority is enough for the government to make decisions, and that an unelected body merely plays an advisory role, with the Royal Assent being a mere formality.
I blame asylum seekers.
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One problem with democracy is that it generally leads to short-term policies. You need more permanent people to think about long-term policies. After all, all that politicians do is represent the mood of the day, and that can change very quickly (although, it is effectively an elected dictatorship anyway).
Also, a unicameral democracy tends to be less 'kind'.
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24 Mar 2005, 15:01
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#15
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Mr. Blobby
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,271
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by NEWSBOT3
so has my old one, and he's an utter cock.
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I didn't vote for ours either, I voted for the other candidate
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24 Mar 2005, 18:43
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#16
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Lucky
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: -
Posts: 3,830
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
YOURI MULDER FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!
yessss
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24 Mar 2005, 18:47
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#17
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Evil inside
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,631
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Structural Integrity
Our minister of national management renewal (or whatever the word for it is) resigned his post after the "eerste kamer" (can eb compared with you house of lords I believe) rejected the plans for an elected mayor.
And now his party is threatening the rest of the cabinet to plunge the whole government into a crisis if they don't implement one of their other major agenda items.
I can't believe people can have their heads so far up their own arse. I've never seen something as childish as Dutch politics.
Do things like this happen in the UK too? That ministers resign when their plans get rejected?
The worst part of this is that when the government falls (again) I will have to vote again and figure out what every party has to offer.
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Have you ever considered the world to be bigger than Holland and the UK?
__________________
<Germania>but you called Fury a bully, and that is terribly unfair
<Hicks>Occassionally individuals do things without Executive consent
<Dreadnought>You cant whois on Eclipse server without a registered nic, which mr ****stirrer doesnt have.
<Almeida> well i like to grow fat myself too, and when i have enough ships then i can engage in big battles
<Nantoz> Zhukov for Lord Protector!
<Jakiri> (Windows)XP was fine on release
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24 Mar 2005, 19:10
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#18
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Dum Di Dum Di
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 858
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
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Like it was any different *ever*.
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24 Mar 2005, 19:15
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#19
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Rawr rawr
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Upside down
Posts: 5,300
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
Have you ever considered the world to be bigger than Holland and the UK?
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Hows things in Russia?
__________________
"Yay"
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24 Mar 2005, 19:28
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#20
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Born Sinful
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Loughborough, UK
Posts: 4,059
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Cold and impoverished, comrade.
__________________
Worth dying for. Worth killing for. Worth going to hell for. Amen.
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24 Mar 2005, 21:21
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#21
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Idle Git
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wandering
Posts: 1,550
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toccata & Fugue
I think it has to be in the manifesto as well.
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If that's true (I'll have to check sometime), then it won't get used. When was the last time a manifesto was stuck to?
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25 Mar 2005, 00:16
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#22
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Evil inside
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,631
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Structural Integrity
Hows things in Russia?
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Im not there, ask Putin to get the official version
__________________
<Germania>but you called Fury a bully, and that is terribly unfair
<Hicks>Occassionally individuals do things without Executive consent
<Dreadnought>You cant whois on Eclipse server without a registered nic, which mr ****stirrer doesnt have.
<Almeida> well i like to grow fat myself too, and when i have enough ships then i can engage in big battles
<Nantoz> Zhukov for Lord Protector!
<Jakiri> (Windows)XP was fine on release
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25 Mar 2005, 00:19
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#23
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Aardvark is a funny word
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
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Re: What's wrong with these politicians nowadays?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toccata & Fugue
I think it has to be in the manifesto as well.
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don't think so, i thought the lords couldn't oppose it at all if it was the manifesto
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
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