Planetarion Forums - Either PA got hacked...or...

Twist · 22 Sep 2003, 12:42

I am a normal style player and I wont change (as terrans suck at c-op)
as that I am happy to accept you as winner if you manage it.
you stick to the rulez you did not cheat in any way. way to go.....
/me is just a bit pissed its not him who does this to spinner and his all new pax !

Spinner · 22 Sep 2003, 13:01

Most amusing to see what people can actually think of and do within the set rules and formulas. Pld to you Gerbie, very impressive, I am a bit let down that you didnt put this plan in motion in any of the betas so we'd have known about it though (:
Thats a challenge of course, if testers take part to find out how they can make the most out of loopholes etc in stead of testing and reporting.

But, in regards to this:
It is a good way to earn a good score early on, but as far as I can tell, there is little chance you will be able to keep up, having sacrificed a lot of value. It is intentional that you can play this game in more than 1 way, and your original tactic surely paid off, hard to argue with that.
But we will wait and see what happens before we make any descisions here, I think time will make sure you end up a bit lower with every passing week.

Time will show, good one though (:

Gerbie · 22 Sep 2003, 13:05

I'm currently in the lead. Pretty far even. If they let me keep this score I might still do better than I ever did. I had my moment of glory.

It would not be good to have me win with this tactic. People would quit if it were the best tactic to play as in fact it's quite a boring tactic.

I just read the post above (which wasnt there when I started this reply):
If you haven't made any changes then I'll win, unless somebody beats my on my tactic. I can afford to lose 10 ships/battle for 60k score easily. Just check my galfund. I can steal half a million resources in 1 covert operation. Do you think I'll be seriously damaged over losing 10 fighters?

SystemShock · 22 Sep 2003, 13:14

Spinner, Gerbie could collect resources till the end of the round, spend them on the last day and win. None of the big ones can hit him or covert op him.

Unless you have implemented a cap on how many resources he can keep, he wins, you loose. How about you start recognising this fact?

Afaik Gerbie did implement this in the beta but with a higher roid count. You just missed it.

Edit : I forgot that ships are worth less than resources. So if Gerbie doesn't spend and keeps donating to gal fund, he could take back the resources last day and win.

gzambo · 22 Sep 2003, 13:27

well its nice to see a "CLEAN" player at the no1 spot for a change

SystemShock · 22 Sep 2003, 13:30

Quote:

Originally posted by gzambo
well its nice to see a "CLEAN" player at the no1 spot for a change

He beat the system while staying well within the rules. Tbh, personally, I wouldn't mind it if he won the round.

cbk100 · 22 Sep 2003, 13:30

I must take my hat off here Gerbie. Nice work and I will have to say Gerbie you own spinner this time, but that you didn't inform him about this in beta is kinda lame since its what you are playing beta for.

With the current rules you will most likely win but what NONE of us know about is if Spinner has a little rule which says "that you can only donate as many res as makes you go to the limit of score which is above the avg. of the gal"

My first thought was ofc also that you could just donate the whole **** to the fund and then the last day take it all back and build ships.

Ofc. there will also be little tricks to avoid full efect of such a change in rules such as donating to you untill you can't get more. Then donate to the person who is above the avg of the gal. then donate to the new ones who are above the avg of the gal and so on and so on and so on. It would take a few hours to get those res out of the fund in that way but it will for sure boost your gal to a level where we can only look up to but wihout a posible chance to reach.

cbk

mikay · 22 Sep 2003, 13:34

Systemshock - he is winning and doesn't need resources.

Gerbie - No question you are one of the true great players and you deserve to win this round now but this needs to be changed very soon. 60k score in 1 day is unassailable and as the value difference gets more you will just grow faster.

They need to change it because this is basicaly too simple a strategy that is too easy to copycat and essentially boring. The point of PaX is that there is more than 1 way to win, no best way - and you've just proven there isnt.

Anyway until they do:

[20:57] <xxxxxxx> THIS IS UTTER CRAP!
[20:57] <xxxxxxx> 1 agents hacked into our systems and managed to get away with 30539 Metal, 21702 Crystal and 19153 Eonium. Our alertness has been raised.
[20:57] <xxxxxxx> Covert 200 1 agents hacked into our systems and managed to get away with 33932 Metal, 24114 Crystal and 21282 Eonium. Our alertness has been raised.

I laughed

Sergio · 22 Sep 2003, 13:35

Congratulations. Your feat almost gave a reason to upgrade my free account to a paid one. But then i thought that i would like to play a war game, launch ships and steal roids and kill ppl.

But i really hope you can keep this up. It's very amusing to say the least.

Gerbie · 22 Sep 2003, 13:51

Quote:

Originally posted by Spinner
I am a bit let down that you didnt put this plan in motion in any of the betas so we'd have known about it though (:
Thats a challenge of course, if testers take part to find out how they can make the most out of loopholes etc in stead of testing and reporting.

Hmmz, well you are partly right there. I used the tactic of staying small and doing co-ops during the beta. It gave me loads of resources, which brought me to the 32nd spot with 18 roids even though I was offline during the last hours of the beta. I could have made top 10 and get #1 gal if I was more active then and had been able to play till the end of that beta.

I assumed this was just another option within the game and I decided to try it in the real round, doubling as a scanplanet. I knew covert ops would be harder in a real round so I never expected to make it to the top 10, but I'd settle for a top 100 spot, just to show people there are other ways to play this game.

After a few ticks it became clear to me you (Spinner en co) changed the scoring system, much to my disadvantage. Yesterday I decided to try something new: build a few ships and try to gain score defending against big attackers. I never guessed I would make it beyond the lower ranks in the top100 this way, but again this would be more than acceptable to me.

Much to my surprise I was #1 this morning. My new tactic worked extremely well. Too well.

mikay · 22 Sep 2003, 13:51

Actually gerbie it was the defence and losing 10 ships that got the score, not all the covert ops?

That's arguably worse!

Tomkat · 22 Sep 2003, 13:58

What does your alliance think about your style of playing?

Not exactly a "team-player", are you?

Leshy · 22 Sep 2003, 13:58

Quote:

Originally posted by Tomkat
What does your alliance think about your style of playing?

Not exactly a "team-player", are you?

He said he's doubling as a scan-planet, so I presume his alliance has no qualms with it.

gzambo · 22 Sep 2003, 14:01

Quote:

Originally posted by SystemShock
He beat the system while staying well within the rules. Tbh, personally, I wouldn't mind it if he won the round.

Jay-Em · 22 Sep 2003, 14:16

Quote:

Originally posted by Tomkat
What does your alliance think about your style of playing?

Not exactly a "team-player", are you?

Scans, scans...and teasing attackers with cov ops...

furball · 22 Sep 2003, 14:16

Congrats Gerbie!

Personally, i think it's unfair to change the scoring system mid-round. Gerbie's set his lot out for how he wants to play, it's worked very well and now he's being penalised for it

well done anyway!

furball

masochist · 22 Sep 2003, 14:22

31 200:9:6 Gerbie The Free Delierians 18 470.732

that's his final beta ranking. rank 31 is not too bad. So why wasting time in attacks?

I'm building my 30 ships today, so soon i'll gain some score?...

But i can say: scanning is useless. With over 100-300 scans per day i gain around nothing.

SilverSmoke · 22 Sep 2003, 14:22

Quote:

Originally posted by Tomkat
What does your alliance think about your style of playing?

Not exactly a "team-player", are you?

seldomly in the history of PA a #1 player (or any top10etc player) has been labeled as a teamplayer and still every serious alliance is keen on having those positions..

zek132 · 22 Sep 2003, 14:42

I think he explited the system, hacked the pa database with the buffer overflow and added himself some score!

Jeltje · 22 Sep 2003, 15:00

see ur a good strategist and that u belong to the good players
never say to me again that u arent gerbie

Gerbie · 22 Sep 2003, 15:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeltje

see ur a good strategist and that u belong to the good players
never say to me again that u arent gerbie

:-)
tnx

I just remember writing a post somewhere about how the score system would suit high-valued players too much. How the one with most value would win. I might have made a fool of myself there.

Admitting mistakes is not easy, but benificial if you can learn from your mistake.

Scoot951 · 22 Sep 2003, 15:05

Now I'm glad I was able to grab a few ticks at #1 before you pulled this off.

Good for you, but if the winner gets decided within 2 weeks of tick start that's no good at all.

Kal · 22 Sep 2003, 15:38

I'm with spinner in that i think gerbies score growth will be unsustainable. As normal players get bigger they wil be able to get mroe and more score of f normal atatcks. For instance now, if you cap some rodis kill some ships u might get 5k score, give it a wekk or 2 though and that will be 50k score etc. The question is though will the amount gerbie can get from defending alos increase in that way, it all depends on the hidden formulae of pax

Gerbie · 22 Sep 2003, 15:44

What I've seen so far is linear, so it would increase with the same speed. However it should not be too difficult to set a limit to this. (Just a small hint to Spinner and co.) I think a factor 10 (in stead of the ~100 I got) would be reasonable.

JonnyBGood · 22 Sep 2003, 15:56

Quote:

Originally posted by Gerbie
What I've seen so far is linear, so it would increase with the same speed. However it should not be too difficult to set a limit to this. (Just a small hint to Spinner and co.) I think a factor 10 (in stead of the ~100 I got) would be reasonable.

Mildly confused here, did you get most of the score for defending or for the covert ops or for something else I've missed?

Gerbie · 22 Sep 2003, 15:59

Defending.

gzambo · 22 Sep 2003, 16:00

Quote:

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
Mildly confused here, did you get most of the score for defending or for the covert ops or for something else I've missed?

afaik he giot the score by killing the sdhips of someone whos value was a lot higher than his

wouldnt it be ironic if a scan planet won Pax

JonnyBGood · 22 Sep 2003, 16:09

Quote:

Originally posted by Gerbie
Defending.

If the similar semi-exploits along those lines are still in place I doubt you'll win as the winner will be whoever manages to successfully roid planets much larger than his own. Of course you could try doing this by building a fleet etc etc but then you're back into the more "classic" PA cycle. (All this is from my hazy memory of the beta heh).

Cochese · 22 Sep 2003, 16:27

Even if he doesn't finish the round #1, he still 'won' by owning everyone with original thinking. That alone deserves some recognition.

Give the man a free credit or something.

Ohm · 22 Sep 2003, 16:57

Gerbie beats the system

(I know you did a great job in beta as well.....but I never thought it could be done with 1 hour ticks)

LOL

mikay · 22 Sep 2003, 17:17

He got the score by defending with 30 fighters and 9 of them getting killed. This gave 60k score. I have no real issue with someone being able to steal massive amounts of cash or get xp from coops but if the number 1 way to win is to suicide fleets of 10 fighters on defence missions it's kinda screwed up. Even gerbie (to his immense credit) realises this is way too much.

will_japp · 22 Sep 2003, 17:17

well done gerbie.
he hasnt done anything wrong. he hasnt cheated. he has played fairly with his own tactic, even if it is a bit unorthodox. so surely he should be left to do it; no score loss for him. and to say score system should be changed mid round

...

RobTD · 22 Sep 2003, 17:28

Gerbie we love you :-D

TNX · 22 Sep 2003, 17:40

something is wrong with pa...

General Martok · 22 Sep 2003, 17:41

Quote:

Originally posted by will_japp
and to say score system should be changed mid round ...

I disagree. That would lead to a VERY boring round with 10-ship fleets everywhere....

Spanish · 22 Sep 2003, 18:07

the guy is from my galaxy and he is playing the game differently to everyone else - using covert actions to gain funds / using galaxy fund as a bank to keep his score low / allowing trading as required in the fund as MoD and releasing funds to those who need them

His explainion for the score is as follows from my galaxy politics :-

Spanish
Mon Sep 22 07:03:42 2003
Edit Delete 1 5:2:5 Max 20 characters Max 20 characters 3 65.449

wtf did you do - hack the us gold reserves?
Max 20 characters
Mon Sep 22 08:36:15 2003 hehe tnx

I defended ingal. Against someone ~100x my size. Killed ~.6k worth of ships, resulting in 100x.6k = 60 k score...

I was one of the first to question his approach - sorry mate !!

there you have it as i see it !!

Kåre Willoch · 22 Sep 2003, 18:08

Well played !!!!
To Pa-crew : How can you expect the scoring system to work, when you won't let out the secret game-mechanics behind it ?

If you now change back to a scoring system even more based on value, you have fu'ked over those like Gerbie who tried to think for themselves...

Tyroka · 22 Sep 2003, 18:09

Pld Gerbie. I kinda agree with Cochese, even if they change the scoring-system (which i think they should though it's unfair against u) you will imo be considered as one of the winners of this round.
Tbh I didn't think only cov-opping would get u near the top in the end but then I didn't really think of building a few ships and defend with those against players with much more value. Or at least I didn't think that would give that much score.
Nice to see an original tactic work sometimes, though this worked too well, as there's no way to get u "down to earth" again, we can only try to outgrow u.

Browolf · 22 Sep 2003, 18:11

i think it would be generally helpful if stockpiled resources didnt give score.

Wishmaster · 22 Sep 2003, 18:17

remove the entire score system for killing ships and **** like that..

xtothez · 22 Sep 2003, 18:20

Quote:

Originally posted by Browolf
i think it would be generally helpful if stockpiled resources didnt give score.

Veil05 · 22 Sep 2003, 19:02

hahahahah, well played

^AvengeR^ · 22 Sep 2003, 19:28

gerbie how did u figure that one out.
ship stats need 2b redesigned (init, race abilities etc.) imo coz this game sucks atm.

James · 22 Sep 2003, 20:05

What can i say Gerbie, but pld?

HobbieRogue4 · 22 Sep 2003, 20:13

Quote:

Originally posted by Gerbie
From: Spinner (1:1:2) Subject: How did you manage that score?? Sent: Mon Sep 22 08:52:00 2003
Care to tell me how you managed to get that score with that little value and 3 roids?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Lord_Thunderball · 22 Sep 2003, 20:44

Gerbie still TFD?

Would be first round they win it \0/

DukePaul · 22 Sep 2003, 21:12

his signature says VGN, and so does my memberlist ;-)

Jorinn · 22 Sep 2003, 21:13

Quote:

Originally posted by Spinner
But, in regards to this:
It is a good way to earn a good score early on, but as far as I can tell, there is little chance you will be able to keep up, having sacrificed a lot of value. It is intentional that you can play this game in more than 1 way, and your original tactic surely paid off, hard to argue with that.
But we will wait and see what happens before we make any descisions here, I think time will make sure you end up a bit lower with every passing week.

Time will show, good one though (:

Changed the formula already then? Not sure whether having such a hole in the first place or been forced to change it mid round makes you more of a chump though.

Gerbie for #1, heh.

General Martok · 22 Sep 2003, 21:20

Quote:

Originally posted by Quad
his signature says VGN, and so does my memberlist ;-)

Yeah but look where he has learned all his wisdoms in the rounds before

[offtopic]
Too bad that has been the fate of TFD for the last rounds. A lot of the best members left round after round

Good thing we have a great teching method to "grow" new 1337 dutchies

[/offtopic]

Obliterate · 22 Sep 2003, 21:41

I'll forgive you for the lost roids - it's worth it to see a galm8 get to #1 planet with 3 roids \o/

pld Gerbie