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Unread 10 Dec 2010, 21:57   #1
DrunkenViking
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Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Well played all 3!

Lets hope for different politics next round and a more open race. Maybe without so much salvage from steals and attacking fleet?

Edit: Don't let anyone marginalize your achievement, you earned it!
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Last edited by DrunkenViking; 10 Dec 2010 at 22:16.
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Unread 10 Dec 2010, 22:10   #2
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weprw__WvWs
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Unread 10 Dec 2010, 22:11   #3
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

thx!
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Unread 10 Dec 2010, 22:28   #4
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post

Edit: Don't let anyone marginalize your achievement, you earned it!

actually: no.
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Unread 10 Dec 2010, 22:42   #5
DrunkenViking
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Theam, remember that just because the competition(read YOU AND ME) suck, that doesnt mean they suck..
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Unread 10 Dec 2010, 23:03   #6
Knight Theamion
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Hey Imperia, do you want to attack Apprime with us tonight, together with CT and ND?
Nah, we rather no do anything and cruise to second place and suck some more cock. Make the round boring for everyone, including us while gaining absolutely nothing.
Okay!
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Unread 10 Dec 2010, 23:36   #7
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Congratulations, i guess.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 00:06   #8
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Well done guys. In a bit of shock that App didn't get the treble!
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 00:07   #9
Knight Theamion
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Yeah, that's the consolation I have, that at least I have ruined some things by suiciding my fleet on HaSu.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 02:13   #10
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Problem is Theam with the above statement never were ct/nd willing to work with imp but we have been over this 100 times.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 05:24   #11
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

The end of the round is always the best part!
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 07:08   #12
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knight Theamion View Post
Hey Imperia, do you want to attack Apprime with us tonight, together with CT and ND?
Nah, we rather no do anything and cruise to second place and suck some more cock. Make the round boring for everyone, including us while gaining absolutely nothing.
Okay!
Ill just quote that as bs
i agree politics was shit, but thats a collective effort of asc nd ct imperia.
if you think otherwise feel free to pm me for proof/reasons


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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 07:15   #13
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

fail round... glad its over

and for everyone else...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1G0aemJnlyU

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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 09:52   #14
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

I guess this means the round is over?
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 10:38   #15
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by Buddah View Post
Ill just quote that as bs
i agree politics was shit, but thats a collective effort of asc nd ct imperia.
if you think otherwise feel free to pm me for proof/reasons


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I do well remember the logs that include the offer of ND to hit App with Asc/Imp, and Titos refusing to go along with it.

Please come again..

Edit: Also, yea, grats App, grats HaSu. App did nothing wrong (except maybe ruining their triple ), so yes, they earned the win.

Last edited by rUl3r; 11 Dec 2010 at 10:43.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 11:15   #16
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Fun how Asc/ND/CT were free to hit App all round, but chose to focus on Imp instead. Imp even stated they wanted to maintain neutrality You chose how you played your round Theam. Imp didnt even hit back till after a week, to show that we ment the stuff about staying neutral. But you were so bitter over the fact that we werent gonna hand you the roundwin right there that you had to keep attacking imp and let app run away with it. The round was boring as hell, but watching you fail like this compensated hugely.

Bottom line is; you have nothing to complain about, you created the political/military situation as much as everyone else.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 11:56   #17
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

lol
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 11:58   #18
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
Fun how Asc/ND/CT were free to hit App all round, but chose to focus on Imp instead. Imp even stated they wanted to maintain neutrality You chose how you played your round Theam. Imp didnt even hit back till after a week, to show that we ment the stuff about staying neutral. But you were so bitter over the fact that we werent gonna hand you the roundwin right there that you had to keep attacking imp and let app run away with it. The round was boring as hell, but watching you fail like this compensated hugely.

Bottom line is; you have nothing to complain about, you created the political/military situation as much as everyone else.
I find it amusing how you think we wanted you to "hand us the roundwin" despite the fact we probably weren't anywhere near getting it at any time, simply because our standards aren't as high as they used to be.
You on the other hand obviously had the potential to go for #1, but gave it away by refusing to hit Apprime. You know, we chuckled about the fact you decided to play for #2. We didn't create the situation as much as you did, your HC refused to hit App in the first place. It's not like we could change anything about that, the round was over that very moment.

And to be honest, your statement about "watching us fail" amuses me even more. It's a well known excuse for being shit while not wanting to admit it.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 12:43   #19
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
Fun how Asc/ND/CT were free to hit App all round, but chose to focus on Imp instead. Imp even stated they wanted to maintain neutrality You chose how you played your round Theam. Imp didnt even hit back till after a week, to show that we ment the stuff about staying neutral. But you were so bitter over the fact that we werent gonna hand you the roundwin right there that you had to keep attacking imp and let app run away with it. The round was boring as hell, but watching you fail like this compensated hugely.

Bottom line is; you have nothing to complain about, you created the political/military situation as much as everyone else.
afaik this is a war game.. and if i read correctly u wanted to remain neutral??
hahahah... so why do you play?
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 12:53   #20
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

vamp mate, yea its a war game, but i guess one has a choice who to hit and who not.. so guess that was the choice of imp this time (actually i got no clue what happened as i didnt play last month of the round or sth )

neways, grats to HaSu and Apprime, win is a win !
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 14:28   #21
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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lol
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 15:45   #22
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

lol
Some things can never change

Congrats.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 15:47   #23
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by rUl3r View Post
I find it amusing how you think we wanted you to "hand us the roundwin" despite the fact we probably weren't anywhere near getting it at any time, simply because our standards aren't as high as they used to be.
You on the other hand obviously had the potential to go for #1, but gave it away by refusing to hit Apprime. You know, we chuckled about the fact you decided to play for #2. We didn't create the situation as much as you did, your HC refused to hit App in the first place. It's not like we could change anything about that, the round was over that very moment.

And to be honest, your statement about "watching us fail" amuses me even more. It's a well known excuse for being shit while not wanting to admit it.
Since you asc guys like to point out hypotetical scenarios: If Asc had kept hitting App instead of swtiching to Imp at the time in question while imp had wrapped up their war with ND/CT(killing them off so they're not a threat further into the round), Imp would very likely have hit App at a later stage for #1. Hitting App down with Asc/CT/ND right behing imp on the other hand would have ended in an imp-massacre the last third of the round(my subjective point of view, and you wont really convince me anything else), since both ND and CT maintained their objective to kill imp. Imp didnt want 5 allies with the same value, with 3 of them very hostile and asc as the odd ally out able to run away with it. The round wasnt over at this point, at all(YOUR ability to get to #1 may have been)After being hit by asc/nd/ct for over a week, it was clear that we werent gonna be able to hit app, so we had to hit asc back instead(imagine that). This is the point the round was over in sense of who were winning.

Asc had the option to halt app while imp killed off nd/ct, and then asc and imp could have cooporated on app leaving it a 3 ally race the last half of the round, but you chose to have imp as enemies.

Point is, Imp chose to go one way politicly(temporoary neutrality), Asc chose not to allow it and in effect helped GIVE the round to App. App still deserved it, they outwarred you early on, outroided everyone and influenced the political environment in a favourable fashion.

As for your last statement there, read my second post again; i clearly state that the competition sucked, including myself with capitol letters. Stop sinking your teeth into lemon after lemon.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 15:51   #24
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Quote:
Originally Posted by VampiriA View Post
afaik this is a war game.. and if i read correctly u wanted to remain neutral??
hahahah... so why do you play?
We were fighting nd/ct(whom claimed to keep hitting us 5 days later again) at the time, even if it's a wargame; fighting the #1 ally(with a decent valuelead) and fighting 2 other t5 allies at the same time isnt wise. Especially when we were by far the fattest ally behing app(guess where app would have focused their attacks). Look what happened to Hitlers Germany when he fought on western, eastern and african fronts at the same time.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 15:58   #25
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Look what happened to Hitlers Germany when he fought on western, eastern and african fronts at the same time.
It's probably worth thinking about that statement a little bit more if you're actually interested in trying to work out why the round ended up going the way it did.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 16:00   #26
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
Point is, Imp chose to go one way politicly(temporoary neutrality), Asc chose not to allow it and in effect helped GIVE the round to App. App still deserved it, they outwarred you early on, outroided everyone and influenced the political environment in a favourable fashion.
Now read that again. You state App outwarred us (rather easily imo, I might add), yet you pretend Asc hitting App while Imp wastes CT/ND would have led to a 3 ally race. You're contradicting yourself here. The more likely outcome would have been a smashed Ascendancy that had kept Apprime busy for a while to keep Imp in the race for #1. Obviously, Ascendancy preferred not to do the dirty work for you. Ask yourself why...
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 16:04   #27
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
It's probably worth thinking about that statement a little bit more if you're actually interested in trying to work out why the round ended up going the way it did.
I'm not interested in trying to work out why the round ended up going the way it did. I just want the lemoneaters to have a look in the mirror and be done with this round already. Just because politics didnt go the way some people wanted at pt500, didnt mean they have to sabotage the rest of the round for themself to prove a point. Not being able to congratulate the winners after the ticker has stopped because of what they feel some none-winners has done is just disrespectful to those on the top of the rankings. There are enough threads to take the discussion of hypotetical and actual political moves midround further in, no need to make this thread a lemonparty.

ruler; i state app outwarred you because of asc-members own statement midround, asc were still #3 with full control on the allies behind and had several top planets(including shazna). Even if you were outwarred, you were far from beaten.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 16:24   #28
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
I'm not interested in trying to work out why the round ended up going the way it did. I just want the lemoneaters to have a look in the mirror and be done with this round already. Just because politics didnt go the way some people wanted at pt500, didnt mean they have to sabotage the rest of the round for themself to prove a point. Not being able to congratulate the winners after the ticker has stopped because of what they feel some none-winners has done is just disrespectful to those on the top of the rankings. There are enough threads to take the discussion of hypotetical and actual political moves midround further in, no need to make this thread a lemonparty.
Let's be honest here, this was a very poor round. I have no respect for anyone who did anything this round with the exception of apprime, and yes that includes hasu and 7.6. I mean, I assume respect has to mean something above and beyond "you managed to finish at the top of the rankings", which is self-evident after all.

If we go back to where this emerges from, in terms of this thread, we have theam disagreeing that one, some or all of the three you mentioned "earned" their victories. Now, as far as I'm aware hasu finished ahead of henrik due to massive salvage donations. I have no idea how he "earned" those. Sure he logged in and attacked enough to be in the position for these to get him to #1 but if that's all you were trying to say why bother saying it? If you look at 7.6 I'm not sure if that galaxy has been attacked at all this round. Again they were obviously active enough to get to and stay at #1 but y'know 'duh'. Even for apprime I imagine a round like this feels a lot less satisfying than round 32 or 34. I know that the different rounds I've won always meant more or less to me because of what we'd done during those rounds, and indeed in some cases meant basically nothing.

This is not about not winning in any sense. I do not care about winning solely for the sake of it. The fact is that this was a dire round with so little worth remembering in it disgusts me. My opinion is that this is not how this game should be played. If you disagree you have my pity. The first line of your post really sums things up though. You're an idiot. However all men are redeemable. I hope your post is just angry bluster and not an actual tacit acceptance that there's nothing worth learning from that happened this round.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 16:37   #29
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
Asc had the option to halt app
No. We had the option to get massacred by Apprime. This is entirely in line with your own post, in which you correctly state they outwarred and outroided us. Arguable, the failure to realise how close Ascendancy were to giving up is what blew your chances.

Seeing no other way to really make the round interesting, some of us hit Imperia and some of us just stopped playing, with more and more people from the former group moving into the second group as the round progressed. The "war" against the horde was a direct result of this quitting, along with the shitness of certain members of Ascendancy.

If your war against ND/CT ever finished (I'm not sure if it did, enlighten me), all other alliances worth mentioning would've been reduced to rubble (us by Apprime, CT/ND by you), leaving just you and Apprime. Apprime would then have had the option to nap you and win, or fight you and win.


The alternative suggested by Ascendancy was coordinated targetting of Apprime, which would knock them down to managable levels (as mass incomings always do). This would've been good for everyone except Apprime:
* It would have kept Ascendancy at least interested in the round.
* While it would by no means guarantee Imperia's round win, it at least kept you in the running. This is true even if you believe it also kept Ascendancy in the running, which I would contest but is irrelevant to the point.
* Cooperation against a shared enemy would also have lowered tensions between Imperia and CT/ND, even without the explicit promise by ND/CT that they would not resume hitting you, which Titos unreasonably and unrealistically insisted on.


As for Apprime, napping Imperia was a masterstroke. I'm not sure if the it was really necessary, but it did reduce the risk of facing a unified universe by an order of magnitude.

I don't know if Cardinal intentionally planted Firebird in Imperia, but even if he didn't, Firebird's presence there certainly didn't hurt Apprime's interests. Furthermore, Cardinal's refusal to break the nap with Imperia, even when the risk to their #1 finish was next to nothing, testifies of an interest in more than a single round win.

I don't think it compares to some of the political play we've seen in previous rounds, but it's certainly a massive improvement over Apprime's usual (i.e. absent) political strategy. If they can keep that up, I expect good things from them in the future. A win well earned.


[edit] I see that some of my points have been made by rUl3r as well.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 16:37   #30
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
Let's be honest here, this was a very poor round. I have no respect for anyone who did anything this round with the exception of apprime, and yes that includes hasu and 7.6. I mean, I assume respect has to mean something above and beyond "you managed to finish at the top of the rankings", which is self-evident after all.
Fair enough, but this is a congratulations thread.
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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
If we go back to where this emerges from, in terms of this thread, we have theam disagreeing that one, some or all of the three you mentioned "earned" their victories. Now, as far as I'm aware hasu finished ahead of henrik due to massive salvage donations. I have no idea how he "earned" those. Sure he logged in and attacked enough to be in the position for these to get him to #1 but if that's all you were trying to say why bother saying it? If you look at 7.6 I'm not sure if that galaxy has been attacked at all this round. Again they were obviously active enough to get to and stay at #1 but y'know 'duh'. Even for apprime I imagine a round like this feels a lot less satisfying than round 32 or 34. I know that the different rounds I've won always meant more or less to me because of what we'd done during those rounds, and indeed in some cases meant basically nothing.
Theam's post was a pure flame and he showed little interest in parttaking in either this threads purpouse or discuss it. HaSu were #1 before asc-fleets started suiciding on him, henrik's salvage came from mostly planets that spent most of the round in app-tag. HaSu, being in a weak'ish gal, had to fight to keep ahead all round. It was in no way an easy ride. You can ask dlr/xvx if they gave HaSu anything for free aswell. As for App taking more pride in previous wins; i'm most definatly certain they do. I dunno what kind of incs 7:6 had, so not gonna comment on them as a gal.
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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
This is not about not winning in any sense. I do not care about winning solely for the sake of it. The fact is that this was a dire round with so little worth remembering in it disgusts me. My opinion is that this is not how this game should be played. If you disagree you have my pity. The first line of your post really sums things up though. You're an idiot. However all men are redeemable. I hope your post is just angry bluster and not an actual tacit acceptance that there's nothing worth learning from that happened this round.
I have never claimed this round to be interesting or fun, at all. I've been bored to hell myself. I'm just pointing out that there are more factors in play than imp's desicion not to hit app at the time in question.

As for me being an idiot; since when have i claimed to be anything else?

And yes, marginalization of people undeserving of it(App/7:6/HaSu) angers me.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 16:48   #31
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
No. We had the option to get massacred by Apprime. This is entirely in line with your own post, in which you correctly state they outwarred and outroided us. Arguable, the failure to realise how close Ascendancy were to giving up is what blew your chances.
You were in no means massacred by apprime(well, after you stopped targetting them maybe). And no, i didnt know asc were in such a weak state.
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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
If your war against ND/CT ever finished (I'm not sure if it did, enlighten me), all other alliances worth mentioning would've been reduced to rubble (us by Apprime, CT/ND by you), leaving just you and Apprime. Apprime would then have had the option to nap you and win, or fight you and win.
We targetted them for 7-10 days after you started hitting us, then they gave up more or less. I doubt anyone didnt think asc were able to last 10 more days against app(except those in asc).
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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
The alternative suggested by Ascendancy was coordinated targetting of Apprime, which would knock them down to managable levels (as mass incomings always do). This would've been good for everyone except Apprime:
* It would have kept Ascendancy at least interested in the round.
* While it would by no means guarantee Imperia's round win, it at least kept you in the running. This is true even if you believe it also kept Ascendancy in the running, which I would contest but is irrelevant to the point.
* Cooperation against a shared enemy would also have lowered tensions between Imperia and CT/ND, even without the explicit promise by ND/CT that they would not resume hitting you, which Titos unreasonably and unrealistically insisted on.
From what i were told CT said they definatly WOULD keep hitting us after 5 days on app. It's not daft to believe ND would stick with CT in that. It's worth pointing out that imp at this point had an infrastructure that was falling apart, officers not doing anything, inactive hc's etc. The score at this point mostly reflected individual abilities with each member.
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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
As for Apprime, napping Imperia was a masterstroke. I don't know if Cardinal intentionally planted Firebird in Imperia, but even if he didn't, Firebird's presence there certainly didn't hurt Apprime's interests. Furthermore, Cardinal's refusal to break the nap with Imperia, even when the risk to their #1 finish was next to nothing, testifies of an interest in more than a single round win.
Very true.
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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
I'm not sure if the nap was really necessary, but it did reduce the risk of facing a unified universe by an order of magnitude.

I don't think it compares to some of the political play we've seen in previous rounds, but it's certainly a massive improvement over Apprime's usual (i.e. absent) political strategy. If they can keep that up, I expect good things from them in the future. A win well earned.
I think the NAP prevented rougue elements in both allies from ****ing up the friendly terms, cause about half of both app and imp wanted to attack eachother most of the round. Well shown by the resoning behind the situation where the nap were dropped.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 16:55   #32
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
Fair enough, but this is a congratulations thread.
That isn't really a thing. If we're not going to at least question whether or not people deserve to be congratulated then it's not really a "discussion". We might as well just have one guy "congratulations" and people could quote it repeatedly.

Quote:
Theam's post was a pure flame and he showed little interest in parttaking in either this threads purpouse or discuss it.
I meant the post where he disagreed with you that they deserved to be congratulated. That was not a flame. And although his second post was a flame the point in it is not instantly dismissable. Even if everyone sucked to the level whereby it was officially pronounced a game against mankind someone would still have to finish #1.

Quote:
HaSu were #1 before asc-fleets started suiciding on him, henrik's salvage came from mostly planets that spent most of the round in app-tag. HaSu, being in a weak'ish gal, had to fight to keep ahead all round. It was in no way an easy ride. You can ask dlr/xvx if they gave HaSu anything for free aswell.
First off, no. Prior to timpayne et al suiciding he was 350k behind, res might have brought him closer but he wasn't first. And if you're trying to prove your point by referring to his galaxy which flagshipped him and the fact his main enemies were a pair of non top 10 sub-30 man tags. Well, you can see why I don't think it's a particularly awe-inspiring victory. I wouldn't worry about it too much though. The list of #1 planet winners isn't exactly one I view as particularly worthy of respect.

Quote:
I have never claimed this round to be interesting or fun, at all. I've been bored to hell myself. I'm just pointing out that there are more factors in play than imp's desicion not to hit app at the time in question.
Actually you said the round wasn't worth thinking about it. Which was what I pointed out was a daft thing to say.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:07   #33
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
From what i were told CT said they definatly WOULD keep hitting us after 5 days on app. It's not daft to believe ND would stick with CT in that. It's worth pointing out that imp at this point had an infrastructure that was falling apart, officers not doing anything, inactive hc's etc. The score at this point mostly reflected individual abilities with each member.
Why is it more daft to believe that ND would stick with CT than Ascendancy? There was no particular reason for the conflict between you two, clearly they didn't really care that much considering they stopped hitting you anyways even after what would be considered by them as the added shitness of refusing to get involved, we'd been closer to ND than CT had been for the past few rounds and they're agreed to at least stop their attacks for the minute. There's basically no reason to believe that at all. Honest to god it's the fact you have unbelievable imbeciles like titos running alliances that ruins rounds like this.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:08   #34
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
That isn't really a thing. If we're not going to at least question whether or not people deserve to be congratulated then it's not really a "discussion". We might as well just have one guy "congratulations" and people could quote it repeatedly.

I meant the post where he disagreed with you that they deserved to be congratulated. That was not a flame. And although his second post was a flame the point in it is not instantly dismissable. Even if everyone sucked to the level whereby it was officially pronounced a game against mankind someone would still have to finish #1.
Simply stating "Actually: No" without arguing anything is in my mind trolling/flaming. Even tho i should be getting used to it on AD
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First off, no. Prior to timpayne et al suiciding he was 350k behind, res might have brought him closer but he wasn't first. And if you're trying to prove your point by referring to his galaxy which flagshipped him and the fact his main enemies were a pair of non top 10 sub-30 man tags. Well, you can see why I don't think it's a particularly awe-inspiring victory. I wouldn't worry about it too much though. The list of #1 planet winners isn't exactly one I view as particularly worthy of respect.
I dont have access to tools like sandmans, so my factual statements in regards to score, pt and such are only from the top of my head and are naturally a bit off. Let me rephrase to saying HaSu was "in it" before the crashes took place. Still, crashes happened largely on BOTH planets in question. I'd still say 2:2 was a weaker gal than 7:6(and the other t5 gals for that matter). In respect to dlr and xvx: Single waves of 15 million DE are a ****ing bitch to cover, those two alliances created a hell of a lot more trouble than any other alliance throughout the round. Including when app hit us.
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Actually you said the round wasn't worth thinking about it. Which was what I pointed out was a daft thing to say.
I believe i said something along the lines of "the lemoneaters should be done with this round already". Prepare for the next round and save us the whine(?).
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:13   #35
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
You were in no means massacred by apprime(well, after you stopped targetting them maybe). And no, i didnt know asc were in such a weak state.
We weren't dead at the very point of the conversation about hitting Apprime, but it was clear to us, at least, that we would not last another week (especially not without some confidence that the round would improve down the road). None of our (few) attacks on Apprime landed, at least half their waves landed on us, due to largely absent night defence (except when shaz was due to receive incs).

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Yrom what i were told CT said they definatly WOULD keep hitting us after 5 days on app. It's not daft to believe ND would stick with CT in that.
I would contest that the continued targetting of Imperia by ND/CT was a set-in-stone certainty, unchangable until the end of time. The fact that they were willing to hit Apprime with you is evidence of the misconception that they were implacably hostile to you.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:19   #36
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
Why is it more daft to believe that ND would stick with CT than Ascendancy? There was no particular reason for the conflict between you two, clearly they didn't really care that much considering they stopped hitting you anyways even after what would be considered by them as the added shitness of refusing to get involved, we'd been closer to ND than CT had been for the past few rounds and they're agreed to at least stop their attacks for the minute. There's basically no reason to believe that at all. Honest to god it's the fact you have unbelievable imbeciles like titos running alliances that ruins rounds like this.
I didnt say it's more daft to believe ND would stick with asc. I do believe all 4 allies would be hitting imp simultaneously as soon as app had been brought down to our level tho(Just ct first, and most likely nd). I think imp hc dealt with ct saying "we're gonna hit you after 5 days nomatterwhat because you tried to poach our head dc prior to the round", nd saying "we wont guarantee we wont be hitting you full on next week" and asc saying "we just want to get app back down so the playingfield is leveled again". I can understand any hc in such a situation thinking "as soon as app is not the clearest candidate for #1 anymore, we'll be gangbanged by all 4". Afaik there were only 1 person that were willing to give his word that he werent gonna smash imp 1 week down the road, and that was cardi(most likely because of his and firebird's close relations and the prospect of future cooporation AND ofc the roundwin implied).
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:20   #37
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
Simply stating "Actually: No" without arguing anything is in my mind trolling/flaming.
Possibly, in certain circumstances. Considering you offered nothing more than a simple assertion an equally simple denial is a perfectly valid response though.

Quote:
In respect to dlr and xvx: Single waves of 15 million DE are a ****ing bitch to cover, those two alliances created a hell of a lot more trouble than any other alliance throughout the round. Including when app hit us.
Fair enough. Did they actually ever get through as a matter of interest? On a subsidiary note did hasu dc for himself or did others?

Quote:
I believe i said something along the lines of "the lemoneaters should be done with this round already". Prepare for the next round and save us the whine(?).
Well, done in what sense? Obviously it's over but a very important part of preparing for the next round is reflecting on what happened in the previous one.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:27   #38
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
Possibly, in certain circumstances. Considering you offered nothing more than a simple assertion an equally simple denial is a perfectly valid response though.

Fair enough. Did they actually ever get through as a matter of interest? On a subsidiary note did hasu dc for himself or did others?
They did land one i think, and they pulled a wave that was a win for them(they'd kill hasu if they'd landed). Messy calc on the last one tho. HaSu was on calcing and fixing his own defence on most occations, with the help of others calling/texting etc. He also set up retals and kept people interested in seing the round out for him.
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Well, done in what sense? Obviously it's over but a very important part of preparing for the next round is reflecting on what happened in the previous one.
One thing is to see errors and take them into consideration to prevent a repeat, another is to use the errors made to marginalize someones achievements.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:32   #39
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
I didnt say it's more daft to believe ND would stick with asc. I do believe all 4 allies would be hitting imp simultaneously as soon as app had been brought down to our level tho(Just ct first, and most likely nd). I think imp hc dealt with ct saying "we're gonna hit you after 5 days nomatterwhat because you tried to poach our head dc prior to the round", nd saying "we wont guarantee we wont be hitting you full on next week" and asc saying "we just want to get app back down so the playingfield is leveled again". I can understand any hc in such a situation thinking "as soon as app is not the clearest candidate for #1 anymore, we'll be gangbanged by all 4". Afaik there were only 1 person that were willing to give his word that he werent gonna smash imp 1 week down the road, and that was cardi(most likely because of his and firebird's close relations and the prospect of future cooporation).
Parts of this are true, parts are guesses and parts are just way off. In terms of ascendancy we offered more than just "yeah, we want the playing field levelled". I can remember actually asking titos what more we could offer them. We just couldn't guarantee the actions of other alliances. So that's just way off.

The CT bit is true as far as I know and this was one of the things we couldn't change. But I think we can all recognise that in 5 days time apprime would not be dead and would probably still have been #1 or very close to it. There is no way we'd have turned away from a still very much alive apprime to beat up imperia (unsurprisingly we viewed them as considerably better than you) thereby completely alienating you at a midway point in the round.

The ND bit is just a guess on your part and, in my opinion, a poor one. ND didn't really have much against you guys, they'd more just stumbled into a war with you than anything else. They were willing to work with you and us to hit apprime. They weren't willing to 100% guarantee you that they weren't going to hit you for the rest of the round but for ****s sake ****ing work with what you can get.

What happened was that the option whereby firebird got to work with his friend, titos got to continue to be an idiot and buddah got to continue to do what he does best (nothing) got picked. This meant that you guys were pretty much guaranteed #2 because, as much we threatened and such, we'd obviously lose interest after a few days of just hitting someone to "punish" them. Clearly there was more risk involved in working with us to hit apprime but there was also far more to gain.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:35   #40
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
They did land one i think, and they pulled a wave that was a win for them(they'd kill hasu if they'd landed).
DLR always do that

Quote:
One thing is to see errors and take them into consideration to prevent a repeat, another is to use the errors made to marginalize someones achievements.
But if the errors are significant and the round wasn't challenging surely their achievements deserve to be marginalized? I mean, have there been any winners of any of the rankings in any round that you think didn't deserve to be congratulated?
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 17:37   #41
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Dlr's 2nd attack was Dc'd by myself which = a land the 1st crash from dlr was done by me/hasu and a few others calling. As to carDi planting me in imp that was never the case as i very nearly went to vgn, I just knew in the long run i could trust carDi rather than the others ct/nd were never willing to leave us alone ct more so Santa/Titos and i believe in asc tried to get them to leave us alone. You can full heartedly thank Golan for my utter refusal to work with ASC kicking me from a convo good move on top of his mouthing off last rnd about me. Now to the NAP being dropped this was done by vamp and Cronix who were running app however with carDi being the one the agreement was made with carDi came on and held them to there words. I will say gratz to all winners this rnd. There were obvious donations on both sides which i had reported if MH fail to take action it will only encourage this to happen over and over again.
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Unread 11 Dec 2010, 18:03   #42
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by Firebird View Post
You can full heartedly thank Golan for my utter refusal to work with ASC kicking me from a convo good move on top of his mouthing off last rnd about me.
I don't know why he did that. Although he was right, you were pasting everything to cardi pretty much, it was irrelevant, as the others would obviously not refuse to tell you what was being said. I don't remember any mouthing off about you last round though. What was that about?

Quote:
I just knew in the long run i could trust carDi rather than the others
Although it's not your fault it's a certainly a large part of the problem with why the round turned out the way it does. It's easier to go with what you know and it's hard to break with the past.
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 02:31   #43
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
DLR always do that


But if the errors are significant and the round wasn't challenging surely their achievements deserve to be marginalized? I mean, have there been any winners of any of the rankings in any round that you think didn't deserve to be congratulated?
Everyone deserves a "congratulations" in that respect imo. As for the previous post; fair enough(drunk as hell atm but still).
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 02:37   #44
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Worth adding: imperia had the best group of players i've played with since r3, just not a structure worth the memberbase.
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 08:16   #45
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

I guess that says a lot about the quality of the players you encountered so far.

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Afaik there were only 1 person that were willing to give his word that he werent gonna smash imp 1 week down the road, and that was cardi(most likely because of his and firebird's close relations and the prospect of future cooporation AND ofc the roundwin implied).
At no point during our talks, did Buddah/Titos express their concern about this. And at no point did I tell Buddah/Titos that Ascendancy would break the nap after we were done with Apprime. Also, Golan has been trying a lot, prior to Imperia's nap breaking, to get ND/CT off Imp's back so we can actually do something interesting with the round.

From my point of view, the round went in the lines of this:
-Apprime hit Ascendancy, we get face raped and look for help;
-We establish an avoidance with Imperia, which is broken the second day;
-We drop the avoidance and continue to be raped by Apprime, with the help of some small flak alliances and certain Imperia members;
-After some talks, we NAP Imperia and try to get ND/CT along to hit Apprime and leave Imperia alone;
-Imperia isn't willing to setup a clear attack on Apprime and just grounds fleets fearing ND/CT attacks probably;
-Few days later, Imperia gets hit one night by Apprime and decides to drop the NAP with us and start a new one with Apprime to secure player ranks.

That's my perception of the round and I'm fairly certain it is the same as most other people's. If Imperia manages to be trusted again at some point in the following rounds, it'll be a surprise for me.
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 09:20   #46
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Worth adding: imperia had the best group of players i've played with since r3, just not a structure worth the memberbase.
then you prolly only played in fail alliances upto now...
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 10:18   #47
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

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Ill just quote that as bs
i agree politics was shit, but thats a collective effort of asc nd ct imperia.
if you think otherwise feel free to pm me for proof/reasons


hugz and kissez
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 11:23   #48
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Quote:
Worth adding: imperia had the best group of players i've played with
That was the good thing about allot of the people in imp 98% were not jumped up ego's

As to this
Quote:
If Imperia manages to be trusted again at some point in the following rounds, it'll be a surprise for me.
Trusted please eablorate on what we actually did that was untrustworthy?? Broke a NAP with ASC and told them that we wanted to stay neutral towards them which we would have so that we could fight our war with ND/CT so please tell me what did we do that was so untrustworthy ?

JBG ref Golan i will get bk to you with that when i get to my pc not gonna paste incorrect info.
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 11:46   #49
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

For what it's worth, I don't consider Imperia's actions this round to have been untrustworthy as much as I think they were dumb.
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Unread 12 Dec 2010, 12:14   #50
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Re: Congratulations Apprime, HaSu and 7:6

Well Pot kettle black springs to mind with all the other allies as well other than the one that finished on top.
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