non IE (free) web browsers

[vampire_lestat]

can someone give me a link to get rid of the advert at the top plz.

[Vaio]

Originally Posted by MrL_JaKiri

I use opera, and I haven't paid for it.

Well done, would you like a biscuit ?

~Vaio~

[Flayer]

IE, and therefore 'Avant' too, is integrated within the windows OS, which is the reason why it is totally insecure.
Opera and firefox ARE secure.

[Vaio]

Odd that, I quite happily use IE on my Mandrake box without me having to install Windows first

~Vaio~

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by Vaio

Well done, would you like a biscuit ?

~Vaio~

It's not very hard, I downloaded it and here it is!

Saying you have to pay for opera is, at best, a hideous falsehood.

[Vaio]

Out of all the falsehood perpetrated in this thread, it's probably the most truthful

~Vaio~

[Flayer]

Originally Posted by Vaio

Odd that, I quite happily use IE on my Mandrake box without me having to install Windows first

~Vaio~

It is a FACT that IE is integrated within windows. And it's a FACT that it causes serious security problems. Ever tried entering a URL in windows explorer? It transforms into IE, because it's the same freakin application

edit: and I dont care what fancy trick you use to get IE working on mandrake, it's the stupidest act I have ever heard about

[vampire_lestat]

wow, streaming is much cooler with opera .

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by Vaio

Out of all the falsehood perpetrated in this thread, it's probably the most truthful

~Vaio~

Being false is a digital state.

[KoeN]

to view internetsites i use IE. it works.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by KoeN

to view internetsites i use IE. it works.

I hop to get to work. It works.

[Leshy]

Originally Posted by Vaio

I doubt any browser could be said to be totally secure unless...

That's hardly an excuse to justify the use of the most insecure browser available, which has even prompted the USA government to advise against using it. Both the Mozilla and Opera suites do not suffer from weekly discoveries of new vulnerabilities which compromise your Operating System. Although in all fairness, Mozilla/Firefox recently had a critical security flaw, but that was fixed in a day or so.

Also, tt does reopen pages on improper shutdown

Not with their respective history.

previously closed windows

Really? Where? I can't find any option to reopen a window I just closed.

I can disablebackground sounds, GIF animations, Flash, Scripts, Active X or JavaScript at a single keypress and mouseclick.

Fair enough, the last time I tried AvantBrowser (a long while ago), it didn't have (m)any of these options. Although Opera still allows you to configure what you want to allow JavaScript to do, and what not.

And I hate the lack of inline find, or find-as-you-type, mouse gestures, and the interface which almost contains more buttons than Opera's default. In effect, AvantBrowser is a shell running on a highly insecure and outdated browser, which poorly mimics Opera's features. But hey, if you want to settle for less, that's your choice and loss

[Vaio]

Originally Posted by Flayer

It is a FACT that IE is integrated within windows. And it's a FACT that it causes serious security problems. Ever tried entering a URL in windows explorer? It transforms into IE, because it's the same freakin application

edit: and I dont care what fancy trick you use to get IE working on mandrake, it's the stupidest act I have ever heard about

It's a Microsoft fact that IE is integrated within Windows so it isnt necessarily the truth. Use Google and find out the truth (or a truth, it's all subjective)

You don't need fancy tricks to get IE working on Mandrake, it's just an interesting challenge and is remarkable easy and painless

~Vaio~

[Quazi Starbucks]

Originally Posted by Flayer

No but you could be a little idealistic and think about the poor web designers who have to go through a LOT of shit to get their pages to work in IE too, a browser that is 3 years old (a lifetime in internet development, so it doesn't support standards any more).

Is margins a total of width or isnt it, MAKE UP YOUR MIND!

if you code it well the differences are very, very slight

[Leshy]

Originally Posted by Quazi Starbucks

Is margins a total of width or isnt it, MAKE UP YOUR MIND!

The W3C is doing that with CSS3, which will allow you to set the box-model the browser should use.

if you code it well the differences are very, very slight

Indeed. The annoyance is mostly in completely non-supported stuff such as :hover on attributes and position: fixed.

[Sandsnake]

I have no problem with hover and positioning...however, IE not supporting the min and max height attributes is ****ing annoying.

Coding for IE is actually quite simple. Coding for IE, Firefox, Netscape, Safari, and Opera is where it gets awfully tricky..

[Leshy]

Originally Posted by Sandsnake

Coding for IE is actually quite simple. Coding for IE, Firefox, Netscape, Safari, and Opera is where it gets awfully tricky..

In reverse, coding for Firefox, Netscape, Safari and Opera is fairly simple. Getting it to work in MSIE as well is where the tricky part begins

[Sandsnake]

Originally Posted by Leshy

In reverse, coding for Firefox, Netscape, Safari and Opera is fairly simple. Getting it to work in MSIE as well is where the tricky part begins

not necessarilly true....Opera and firefox are far from perfect themselves.

That said, as a professional web designer, I don't have the luxury of not supporting a browser...Hell, I even have to code for NN4 in some cases.

[Leshy]

Originally Posted by Sandsnake

Opera and firefox are far from perfect themselves.

They're pretty strict when it comes to standards, though

That said, as a professional web designer, I don't have the luxury of not supporting a browser...Hell, I even have to code for NN4 in some cases.

You should shoot people in the head who request you to do NN4 compatibility. The world will be a better place for it.

[Obliterate]

Does IE support things like a[href^="mailto:"] { in CSS yet?

</random question>

p.s I prefer Firefox, because I'm used to it now - although Opera's pretty good aswell.

[Sandsnake]

Originally Posted by Leshy

They're pretty strict when it comes to standards, though
You should shoot people in the head who request you to do NN4 compatibility. The world will be a better place for it.

I agree wholeheartedly, but I've worked with lots of B2B stuff, so you get a higher percentage of NN4 users than normal. It's really quite scary that people will refuse to upgrade from that pile of shit. I've been quite vocal about stopping supporting it, but they pay the bills so....

That said, we've stopped supporting NN4 for normal commerce and publishing sites. Only for the ones still show decent NN4 usage in the stats.

Fortunately, I'm shifting more into the SEM/SEO side of things, so I worry about it less and less these days. I just get ulcers from clients wanting the holy grail of search engine marketing and not understanding that it's not as easy as it appears...

[Sandsnake]

Originally Posted by Obliterate

Does IE support things like a[href^="mailto:"] { in CSS yet?

Not that I know of...IE's biggest problem is CSS...

FORTUNATELY, MS has reconstituted the IE development team, so we might see some serious upgrades coming in the coming months. MS needs to stop the trickle before it becomes a landslide.

They lost an entire percent of market share for IE in 3 weeks. Doesn't sound like much but that could turn to avalanche fairly quickly.

[Nodrog]

"I don't drink Coke, I don't shop in K-mart, I don't **** ugly women and I sure as hell don't use inferior internet web browsers"

[Dante Hicks]

I buy (some of) my clothes in Primark and even I wouldn't choose IE.