The Circumstances that that lead to the closing of my account ...

[SilverSmoke]

Originally posted by laputa
I just checked it out for ya

You cannot leave the field blank. You must fill in some digits otherwise the form won't get submitted.

For further questions I'd contact MrBrick who is very helpful in #support.

ah well, then I probably did fill it in, as I can't remember filling in some random numbers.

[Supernova9]

Originally posted by laputa
So Spinner/MrBrick have chosen the hardest punishment possible for what is in my eyes a minor offense.
Additionally, I just read the User Agreement (very quickly) and I could not find a passage saying that the user is obliged to provide 'correct' information regarding herself.

I have read and accepted the User Agreement above, made sure all information submitted is correct, and understand that my account can be closed or deleted with no warning should it contain invalid or false information.


^^ Written in bright red letters on the sign up screen.

All the personal info must be correct for the account to be valid. Incorrect info can lead to closing or deleting of the planet.

^^ Written to the right hand side of the sign up boxes.

Then there's the paragraph that says:

14. You shall comply with all applicable laws regarding your access to
your Account and your playing of the Game.

That's where it is, in black and white. (and red).

[rUl3r]

Plz note that it says "CAN LEAD" not "DOES LEAD" to closing.

So basically, it was not MUST to close Frucht, they could have punished him with temporarily ban and give him the chance to correct the info provided.

Now PA Team plz go and close some real cheaters before i get angry again on a bright sunday morning after a good saturday afternoon/evening festival with a really cool gig.

Oh, and re-open Frucht, he has been closed long enough as punishment, keeping in mind he has not ruined the game for anyone by any cheating.

[edit] typo corrected [/edit]

[inf]

Why Frucht is technically in the wrong, his account should be reopened.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by rUl3r
Plz note that it says "CAN LEAD" not "DOES LEAD" to closing.

Eating food laden with cyanide 'can lead' to my death.

When we're talking about rules, it's better to err on the side of caution, is it not?

[hAl]

Originally posted by rUl3r
Plz note that it says "CAN LEAD" not "DOES LEAD" to closing.
[/edit]

I see that as meaning basically if you make a slight typo they can make an exception. If you give fake info you get deleted. And I'm pretty sure Frucht admitted to giving fake info 'to protect his privacy' or whatever his 'real' motive might be.

hAl

Originally posted by hAl
I see that as meaning basically if you make a slight typo they can make an exception. If you give fake info you get deleted. And I'm pretty sure Frucht admitted to giving fake info 'to protest* his privacy' or whatever his 'real' motive might be.

hAl

*protect

[merle]

... i dont have words for this. its just unbelievable.
only reason to give out REAL info about who u r (who knows what u do with our rl names and who can monitor what u do however) is the prizes. so i think his punishment should be absolutely enough if he finished the round top 1 player to not get any prizes.
this is a free and bonus round, for me its the funniest and best since like 4 rounds. be glad so many good ppl stil stick to the game instead of being so RUDE and unfriendly, have fun with ur tactics in scaring good ppl away willing to pay for ur game. i for myself am shoked about this attitude, show a little more respect for the community. and i am sure if u check phonenumbers like 70% of them dont exist or are numbers of ppl not playing pa.
regards, merle

[hAl]

Originally posted by merle
... i dont have words for this. its just unbelievable.
only reason to give out REAL info about who u r (who knows what u do with our rl names and who can monitor what u do however) is the prizes.

Off course not !!! That is really stupid and ignorant if you had read this thread at all !!! The main reason for giving your real info is to counter cheating and payment fraud. The prizes is just laughable argument.

Off course Frucht is saying he has only one account but frankly I would not be surprised if he made a few and choose the one he found to be in the best gal. This is now impossible to check for because he gave false info. If he would have his real info you could be reasanobly assured that he created only one account and stayed with that. Him giving false info on signup has virtually ensured that he can't be caught on several cheating offences like making multiple accounts or accountswapping.

Since his actions are at the least on the same level with evading detection of cheating (if it not really was evading it) it is completly logical that he was closed.

hAl

[Quetzovercoatl]

It does look like Frucht was treated harshly, the maximum penalty for a minor offence when he pleaded guilty etc

but reading between the lines, (and speculating about something that I don't have a clue about ), I wonder if maybe PATeam are really sure he is guilty of something bigger but have no proof, and so use this loophole as a way to get rid of him.

I noticed in his log with spinner, the first thing spinner asked about was related to if he had cheated in any other ways.

It could be like Al Capone, the authorities knew he was a murderer but didn't have the evidence so they got him for tax evasion instead.

[Monkehpimp]

I have never used my real details in case Spinner comes to my house at night and looks in my window.*















*if anything along these lines has already been said, please note I read the first 2+last 2 posts.

[Fifth_teletubbie]

Amazing.

Noone with half a brain leaves their real data around the internet if they can help it, and certainly not with an outfit with a trackrecord like PA has with regard to competence and reliability.

If they've got your CC details, they can extract payment for services rendered which is all that is needed.
I really don't see why they would need my actual address and telephone number in addition to this. They dont ask me for them in the shop where I do my groceries, so why should PA? It's simply none of their f*cking business.

[ParraCida]

Originally posted by Fifth_teletubbie
Amazing.

Noone with half a brain leaves their real data around the internet if they can help it, and certainly not with an outfit with a trackrecord like PA has with regard to competence and reliability.

If they've got your CC details, they can extract payment for services rendered which is all that is needed.
I really don't see why they would need my actual address and telephone number in addition to this. They dont ask me for them in the shop where I do my groceries, so why should PA? It's simply none of their f*cking business.

Then don't sign up?

Taken from the portal:

False sign up information

Signing up with false information in your Planetarion account can be a cause for closure.
If you have signed up with false information we will assume that you are either guilty of creating multiple planets and used this as a means to avoid detection, or that you in the past have switched planets and therefore the information could not have been correct

[Fifth_teletubbie]

Originally posted by ParraCida
Then don't sign up?

Taken from the portal:

I didnt.

However if you carefully read what I wrote down you'll find that I am questioning their NEED to have this information.
Answering that with a typical braindead 'then dont signup' is a bit sad really.

[ParraCida]

Originally posted by Fifth_teletubbie
I didnt.

However if you carefully read what I wrote down you'll find that I am questioning their NEED to have this information.
Answering that with a typical braindead 'then dont signup' is a bit sad really.

No it isnt, you don't feel they need that information, you ignore every other arguement because you feel a certain way.
There is no sense in telling you why certain things would be a certain way if you are not open to it at all, so the simple conclusion is:

If you don't agree with it, don't sign up, and preferably don't spend your time whining about it on PD, especially if you haven't signed up.

[Al_zz]

Originally posted by Fifth_teletubbie
I really don't see why they would need my actual address and telephone number in addition to this.

Then read the whole thread.

[whoop]

While on the surface it appears that Frucht did in fact break the EULA I find it disturbing that an account like this can be closed for what appears to be a trivial reason, and one which more importantly seems to be consistent with general common sense on the internet.

I for one, never use my real information on the internet wherever possible. The only reason I put my real name into PA was because I thought it would be necessary for the Credit Card check. Had this been a free game, I can assure you that I would not have used my real name either.

I find it bizarre that he/she has been closed for something as trivial as this, while there are still rampant podless escort planets and defence whores all over the universe. Surely the multihunting efforts could be prioritized.

There is also one question that remains unanswered, which I find extremely disturbing.

How did PA find out his real name?

-whoop

[Supernova9]

Originally posted by whoop


How did PA find out his real name?

-whoop

It was said somewhere else, I think in the thread MrBrick was a major part of (not this one) that it came from people who knew Frucht (one of whom I believe to be PATeam).

And ever thought that maybe people closing him wanted to get him for cheating, just couldn't find enough evidence to get it to stick, and thus lumped for this option? Might be idle speculation, but hey, could be true.

[hAl]

Originally posted by whoop
While on the surface it appears that Frucht did in fact break the EULA I find it disturbing that an account like this can be closed for what appears to be a trivial reason

I wonder why you think this is trivial. It is now impossible to tell how many accounts Frucht has been making to get a good place in this game. That is not trivial. It is impossbile to tell wheather Frucht actually was the original owner of this planet or that he swapped into it early in round. These are not trivial things.

hAl

[Hicks]

Originally posted by SilverSmoke
A serious question.


Can I get closed for not having filled in my phonenumber?

A member of my galaxy was deleted at the end of Round 7 for giving a fake phone number so I imagine you can be deleted as well. Though I doubt you will be, consistency has never been a PA Crew strong point.

[Quetzovercoatl]

Jolt owns PA, Jolt is a UK company so Jolt surely has to comply with the data protection act.

My memory of the details of this is sketchy but I seem to remember that one of the conditions was that the data they store about us had to be relevant

It could be argued that name, address and telephone number aren't relevant in a free round of an online game, as credit card details etc aren't an issue.

Oh, and if they aren't registered at all, it's a criminal offence punishable by an unlimited fine.

Just a thought.... and can I reiterate that I don't know what I'm talking about, but I expect one of the know-it-all's out there will clarify

[whoop]

Originally posted by hAl
I wonder why you think this is trivial. It is now impossible to tell how many accounts Frucht has been making to get a good place in this game. That is not trivial.

Agreed, not trivial - but a name won't help this.

Originally posted by hAl
It is impossbile to tell wheather Frucht actually was the original owner of this planet or that he swapped into it early in round.

Absolutely trivial.

My point was that with so much farming, escorting, multiying, you would think that this would be pretty low on the priority list. That's all.

-whoop

[Zeus]

Great to see some things havent changed in the universe of PA

To make it clear and to the point.

If ANY of the User Agreement rules are broken, then the admins MUST (weither they want too or not) close the account FOR deletition.

It is not the communities decision of weither the action was justified or even purely right or wrong. In individual cases, its between Simtech & the individual player who have made the agreement, or in this case no agreement was made due to the individual not even giving his correct information. Therfore the user agreement doesnt EVEN excist with him. Namely he has no rights what so ever, so dont even bother going down the law route

I agree, proceudres need to be improved to catch people using false information, and Im sure he creators are doing there very best, but to rationalise your distaste of this decision against an individual because they catch the one/few and not them all is rather silly.

After reading the logs of MrBrick & spinners discussion, I have to say Frucht was treated with politeness and shown respect, just by discussing it with him in those logs. He admitted to signing up with false information. (how he was found out is not important at all) The simple question the admin must ask himself is are this fake details? YES = Close/Deletion No= move onto next case. Its as clear cut as that and no personal opinons of the admin can come into it, weither they agree with the rules or not.

If your going to debate about this case, I recommend making if a debate about is real info needed when signing up accounts or not, rather than debating weither its fair the few who get caught are closed when some others dont.

You break the rules, you have decided its worth the risk, in this case and I must say, sadly you where wrong to do so. But Frucht, you have no rights or agreement with Simtech BECAUSE you used fake information. This is one of the reasons why its important you use the real information, cause if you do YOU HAVE RIGHTS! and an agreement.

Signing up multiple accounts to get into a good galaxy is also deletion immediately if found out. To use the excuse "but others do it" is like saying after you got caught stealing sweets from the shops "but others do it, Mr! Its not fair you caught me! BOOHOO" THen your frineds come running over saying "Come on MR, others do it all the time, let him go this time please, he wont do it again" When the friends are the ones that told the person caught, to do it

[Zeus]

Originally posted by inf
Why Frucht is technically in the wrong, his account should be reopened.

You see here, this off course is your opinion. However if we go by your opinion, we would have to apply your opinion to every rule broken and closed planet. In your wisedom, you know it is inevidible your biase will come into it, i.e your galaxy memebers, your alliances, old frineds, real life frineds, etc.. etc.. You would find yourself overlooking your "friends" action in breaking the rules.

People will have no faith in your decisions as you have allowed the human factor enter the rule of law, which decides if law has been broken. As to the punishment, there is only one u can give and that is closure/deletion.....you see where you will end up?

I sound like a harse B****rd, but like the admins, hate to see anyone closed/deleted, I hate to see anyone breaking the rules. I hate to see anyone leave this community because they thought they could get away with breaking the rules. But like any community we need rules to give a happy medium

[Zeus]

Originally posted by Quetzovercoatl
It does look like Frucht was treated harshly, the maximum penalty for a minor offence when he pleaded guilty etc

but reading between the lines, (and speculating about something that I don't have a clue about ), I wonder if maybe PATeam are really sure he is guilty of something bigger but have no proof, and so use this loophole as a way to get rid of him.

I noticed in his log with spinner, the first thing spinner asked about was related to if he had cheated in any other ways.

It could be like Al Capone, the authorities knew he was a murderer but didn't have the evidence so they got him for tax evasion instead.

This imho is also very possible. The admins have strict rules which tell them if they can/cant close/delte a planet. Many times I have known someone cheating, but couldnt gather enough evidence from admin tools, etc.. Even when 99% sure cheating occured, I couldnt close as not 100%, as is the way the admins currently run I would guess.

Therfore, I would close/delete if fake details used in signup as that also equals deletion and I would use that reason enough for the deletion to go ahead. Weither 1 planet or 10,000 ranked planet, the same rules apply,, but with #1 planet you have to be 100% sure of at least 1 rule broken

[Iceaxe]

Originally posted by Zeus
You see here, this off course is your opinion. However if we go by your opinion, we would have to apply your opinion to every rule broken and closed planet. In your wisedom, you know it is inevidible your biase will come into it, i.e your galaxy memebers, your alliances, old frineds, real life frineds, etc.. etc.. You would find yourself overlooking your "friends" action in breaking the rules.

I am pretty sure he was saying why should he be reopened if he was technically in the wrong. If he did mean this then he would be agreeing with you.

[hAl]

Originally posted by Zeus
Weither 1 planet or 10,000 ranked planet, the same rules apply,, but with #1 planet you have to be 100% sure of at least 1 rule broken

Same rules different standards. I see the most obvious of multies attack our gals but none of the bigger planets involved ever gets closed. Only some of those small planets attacking with them.

hAl

[Knight Theamion]

Originally posted by Hicks
A member of my galaxy was deleted at the end of Round 7 for giving a fake phone number so I imagine you can be deleted as well. Though I doubt you will be, consistency has never been a PA Crew strong point.

I reported him, for fun, see what happens.

[Zeus]

Originally posted by hAl
Same rules different standards. I see the most obvious of multies attack our gals but none of the bigger planets involved ever gets closed. Only some of those small planets attacking with them.

hAl

Perhaps, the multi is a lot more careful with his big planet? The multi can do many things to keep his main planet seperate from the rest of the farms etc...

I totaly understand how you can certainly percieve what you say above, but there can also be rational explanations for it to appear that way, even if all planets treated equally.

[Rappie]

btw about that al capone thingie
he got the worst punishment possible for tax evasion

so indeed it might be true in this case aswell

[Al_zz]

Originally posted by Zeus
Perhaps, the multi is a lot more careful with his big planet? The multi can do many things to keep his main planet seperate from the rest of the farms etc...

I totaly understand how you can certainly percieve what you say above, but there can also be rational explanations for it to appear that way, even if all planets treated equally.

If some top 100 planet attacks with 4 extremly obvious multies freebieplanets without pods and then gets closed and comes on IRC with a 'friend' who claims to control the freebie planets and only those 4 planets stay closed but the main planet is reopened I find that a disgrace. If it happenned only once is is already extremly anoying but if you then get hit again, look at your news first a big planet at :56 and every minute after that a freebie of much much smaller size and off course those freebies recall in time not to get a roid but nothing is done against the bigger planet it gets very frustrating indeed. I see cheating and in each case it is blatantly obvious to see who is the culprit so why not close him !!!????!

There might not be directly linking evidence in the multihunter tools but that kind of detection is even for some ignorant person like me easy enough to avoid. You do not always need that evidence. If you see a single planet gaining a huge advantage from using numerous cheating planets on his attacks that itself is already really powerfull evidence of cheating and warrents closure.

hAl

[SoliD]

ive never given out my real details in all the rounds ive been playing,i dont want people i have never met knowing my tel number and where i live.

Wtf do you want the real details anyway?!? if someone doesnt want to give their details out then they shouldnt be forced to to play a online game fs

and 3 days ago my account got closed then reopened a day later with no reason as to why,i just had 2 emails waiting for me when i got home,telling me this and this stupid bit of acting has made me decide to quit pa after this round,

another account you lost for next rd pa crew

[Supernova9]

Originally posted by SoliD
Wtf do you want the real details anyway?!? if someone doesnt want to give their details out then they shouldnt be forced to to play a online game fs

You aren't forced to do anything. If you don't want to sign up using your real information, you don't have to. Just don't sign up. Problem solved.

[hAl]

Originally posted by Supernova9
You aren't forced to do anything. If you don't want to sign up using your real information, you don't have to. Just don't sign up. Problem solved.

[Desse]

Originally posted by rUl3r
Just for your info: I tried to show MrL_JaKiri how stupid his "they won´t do it cuz it´s forbidden" argument is (we know noone in pa farms cuz it´s illegal, yes we know...).

[enter nitpicking mode]

Actually farming is not illegal. It is against the rules of this game though.

However selling the information in question to a third party is illegal, and could result in a very nasty case against the owners of that data

[leave Nitpicking mode]

[DarkAngel]

frucht pwnz :/ and that was indeed harsh, tho .. they were in their right, i guess .. still sucks.

[Carlyy]

He signed up, knowing full well he was breaking the rules, then whines like a baby when he's caught and deleted. Tough titty. Take it like a man.

[Chax]

You have showed an amazing consistency here.
Well done, close all the cheaters.

[Unf_Slasher]

Originally posted by Carlyy
He signed up, knowing full well he was breaking the rules, then whines like a baby when he's caught and deleted. Tough titty. Take it like a man.

go read his post again....
i dont see him either whining or behaving like a baby...

[mockingbird]

I'm really surprised u started this thread, cos im sure u KNOW it wont help and will only annoy ppl...

I already told u that the most logical explanation is , that the pa-team uses this reason (the fals acc. information), because its the only way to get rid of ppl who cheat/have unfair advantages (not saying u did or didnt cheat).

You see, if the creators would say: "Frucht, u are account sharing" , you can always say that u wernt followed by a good excuse like: it's a mate who lives with me/stays at my house, i use dial up connection so i have a changing ip-adress, i login at school like others of my school.

NO MATTER HOW OBVIOUSLY THE CHEATING IS, IT CAN NEVER BE PROOVEN 100% , and thus deleting players is VERY hard for the pa-team.

cos every time pa-team closes someone for multying, farming etc. there's bound to be some thread like this in wich those ppl whine, some alliance that whines spinners head of and a bunch of players that threathen to quit the game due to unfairness.

This reason of closing u is simply non-discussiable, and as clear as can be: u agreed to the rules on sign up, u put in false info.

TA.



Just dont whine about this, it only makes it sad. Go make a new account , dont cheat/use unfair advantages (not saying u already did, not saying u didnt) and use real info (then spinner might even phone u about a date )


PS: didnt u tell me something like : "i wont whine" on irc?.. but that prolly was after u told me u wernt in an alliance

[QazokRouge5]

You got HOSED .

[Illegal]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
Hasn't worked so far.

People ALWAYS complain.

well the forums is full of bitter people who all hate the game (sub consious or not)

I want to complain about you, but to whom? Ill make sure I do if I get the chance. There, made you feel better?

[Illegal]

In the new anti cheat post by Spinner he says that they will strike down on things that gives an unfair advantage to people.

Farming will cost you some roids as a penalty

While signing up with the wrong name will have your sorry cheater ass deleted from the game (scum)

I cant see how signing up under another name will give you a bigger profit then farming, still it gives you a more strict penalty.

http://main.planetarion.com/portal/news.php?id=218 <- Spinners post (no I cant be arsed making it look seksi)

[Illegal]

Originally posted by mockingbird
I'm really surprised u started this thread, cos im sure u KNOW it wont help and will only annoy ppl...

Err ehum.. I have no idea.. hmm.. Perhaps to let people know what was going on? As alot of people were wondering?

[Fred of Bedrock]

I havent been playing PA much lately as its a sad pathetic game with sad pathetic crew. I am only posting on Fruchts closure as I think its as big a load of cr#p as the closure of the best player in rnd7 ... yes TU. Closing TU on that technicality was as stupid as closing Frucht and its a shame to hear the game is run by the same lunatics as it always has been.

Shame crew is so stupid as PA could be the best game but I am already playing a game that is much better and know of another to play after it.

The lure has gone from PA for me and the crew and its stupid closures for "rule-breaking" are hopeless. I once offered my services for multi-hunting to spinner but the twat didnt listen. Yeh is right, it doesnt take anything more than a monkey to see the real cheats but unfortunatley we have baboons running the game and they arent as smart as a monkey.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Fred of Bedrock
I havent been playing PA much lately as its a sad pathetic game with sad pathetic crew. I am only posting on Fruchts closure as I think its as big a load of cr#p as the closure of the best player in rnd7 ... yes TU. Closing TU on that technicality was as stupid as closing Frucht and its a shame to hear the game is run by the same lunatics as it always has been.

Just on one small point I believe TU later admitted he should have been closed during r7 (I'm trying to remember where I read that and will post it if I do).

[Illegal]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
Just on one small point I believe TU later admitted he should have been closed during r7 (I'm trying to remember where I read that and will post it if I do).

Nice work Sherlock.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Illegal
Nice work Sherlock.

Thanks holmes, judging by the phrasing used I assumed it had all been forgotten.

[HobbieRogue4]

I can only agree with Jonny. Sorry Fred, but that particular "technicality" was more clear-cut cheating than Frucht's is.

I wonder if certain people recall Round 4 and the whole Lantador & 20:9 situation?

P.S. I forgave Moridin. :/

Edit:

At this point, once I read the initial post, and now see this thread, which is quite "whaa-whaa" anyway, as being four pages long now, I can only leave but one and O B V I O U S bit of advice when playing Planetarion:

The Creators are the Judge, Jury, and Executioners when it comes to this game. I don't care if you're the most honest or dishonest player to have played Planetarion, we all know that nothing is fair about closures, so ultimately, it I S your fault for playing this game in the first place. Risk is involved, no matter what, and that risk is closure. Think about it, recognize it, and then accept it.

Especially if you plan on actually competing for the top spots.*

*Something everyone and their right testicle seems to forget, each, and every round of Planetarion.

[hAl]

Originally posted by Illegal
I cant see how signing up under another name will give you a bigger profit then farming, still it gives you a more strict penalty.

Since in a random round the location your planets ends up is the biggest single bit of luck you need making multiple accounts and then using the one that suits you the best is vitually the ultimate random round cheat !!

In a random free round this possible form of cheating ranks up there with farming end using multi escorts planets. But believe me you need a good gal more than any roids farmed !!!

And obviously vitually the only tell tail signs of this cheat is the use of fake signup info. Cause if you signed up with the same name twice you'd be caught as a multi fairly quickly (I'd hope).

Not saying Frucht did do that. But obviously he might have done that as this is undetectable when the round has started except for the fake info.

hAl