Planetarion Forums - Round 9, Stagnation and a possible solution.

14 Apr 2003, 05:02

I will not start this over again...let it be a lesson for those who absolutely had to make these powerblocks from the start. Let the ticks roll for now. I paid for this game, not for it to end and restart again, then I'll rather have my money back.

Baco · 14 Apr 2003, 05:39

Quote:

Originally posted by Stylez1877
not really
im in NoS, im not weet, but that doesnt mean I didnt work hard to get where I am this round. I've defended my planet just as much as you im sure..but I did it WELL, and i managed to KEEP my roids, which is why I wouldnt want that to be for naught.

u r NAR so that means.....
/me is lost

Lanber · 14 Apr 2003, 06:45

Kloopy.

It`s nice to see some action & initative.
But I`m afraid it`s a bit of too little too late here.

Unless there is a change in the fundamental aspect of some chicken alliances napping 80% of the universe we will just see a repeat of what quite simply ruined the round.

I was Ely back in R3-R4, then we had the Fury/Legion dominance. Never was that so bad as we see it now. I remember curseing them then for bashing and being so organized etc etc.

Truth of the matter is that the dominance today is more a question of sheer numbers and not too much of 1337`ness.

Thanks for a game that`s been 95% fun. Now it isnt, so I find something else to do.

Lanber

SSC · 14 Apr 2003, 06:49

I think this would only work if you set up limitations.

What i mean is this round has been sorta ruined by power-blocking so why dont you make a change to the situations. What i mean is say there are 50 parallels, why dont you set parallell 1-10 into a war against each other, 11-20 etc...

Then the targets are less available, forcing NAP's to be broken, thus making the game more exciting!
Also you could have a bonus saying the top gal in each cluster goes through to a playoff untill only one gal is over XX million above the 2nd place gal.

Im just reeling things off but my point is if you do this, you have to change something than just shuffle the gals or the NAP's will remain and the same senario will happen again.

Urkki · 14 Apr 2003, 06:52

Yes. Just give WEET a bit of time to sort themselves out (you know, discover who truly is the winner). Then reset.

Just keep the res&con, or at least most of it. And give 7 roids of all 4 types. Perhaps give a bit extra to those who now have more iniroids (in logaritmic scale, something like 100 iniroids gives you 1 extra unini roid at start, 200 gives 2, 400 gives 3, 800 gives 4, 1600 gives 5, 3200 gives 6, 6400 gives 7, 12800 gives 8 etc) so this all will not have been in vain.

Because atm the game is basically unplayable for all but WEET, because doing anything that gets roids will be basically suicide, or at least leave you with less roids than you had before, after all the hostiles are gone.

Those who whine that they'll stop playing... I bet there are 10 players who will *start* playing again for every one who quits because of the shuffle

This should have been a possibility in R5&R7 as well. Let's set a precedent here, that if round stagnates, a shuffle can happen. Might make alliances work differently...

Miccksey · 14 Apr 2003, 07:02

this has gone on long enough

Ramses · 14 Apr 2003, 07:15

I guess the idea would be great if we could have something like: Everyone starts with 200 roids and all cons/ res done, and a 72 hours protection, so that people can start creating their fleets before the fun begins. Randon rounds can be boring, but this will prolly be better than this round as it is now. But PLEASE, DONT MAKE US GO IN THAT ROID INITIATING THING AGAIN. That part if the rounds SUCK

furssie · 14 Apr 2003, 07:20

This encourages players to form powerblocks even bigger in the rounds to come.

Spoonman · 14 Apr 2003, 07:28

reset

look on it as a bonus round
dont play if you dont want to

wd creators

Soron · 14 Apr 2003, 07:33

Now you're gonna spoil the round and all have to start from beginning. I am not member of a powerblock but lately goes as it should and we attack and fight back...

those who wants speed rounds let them join those and leave other with normal one.

tamsu · 14 Apr 2003, 08:13

Reset-Reshuffle-Random !!!

Darkwolf · 14 Apr 2003, 08:15

heh restart that round?
ok why not its my best round so far but hell i also go for a random universe ....

but i would say you can count all of that yes, yes, yes ,yes, begging since they are all from players who dint have a good round and as every1 know when you got a bad round you beg for an reset about 24/7

you will never be able to get all alliances to agree not to ally with any other alliances. PA is not only fighting its also ment to for diplomacy and i would say NAPs or allys belong to diplomacy.

btw round7 was a bad round for meh and it hadnt been reset why now?

r4:n00b
r5:n00b (insomnia)
r6:freebie (vVv)
r7:n00b (vVv)
r8: (Flash/Madcows)
r9: hell its hard but i luv it

:e_chick:

Darkwolf

14 Apr 2003, 09:00

yes yes yes - this is good. changing names would, however, make it better

i'm in : )

Copie · 14 Apr 2003, 09:05

Whilst I agree with the idea that this game has become no longer fun for 80% of the players (I think that even the veterans would agree that PA is no longer fun really, it's something that we do out of habit) I don’t think that resetting the game every time it comes to a point where one side has an overwhelming advantage is the answer. Because history repeats itself every round, power blocks form, take control of the majority of the universe and then stagnation sets in.

The solution (which might be R10 I don’t know) is to make the game more fun for all players. Somehow make it easier/faster for players who have been bashed to rebuild. It shouldn't take 2 weeks for me to get back to a point where i was before being bashed in return for another players 3 ticks of victory. It's simply not balanced IMO.

Other similar games *cough*LH*cough* are more fun IMO simply because if i get bashed I DONT CARE because I can rebuild in no time at all. Admittedly fast ticks are not necessarily the answer, just one solution to the "I’ve been bashed and need to rebuild so I can have some fun" problem.

I think most players would agree that there’s something fundamentally wrong with the setup. It may have worked for 10k players but not for 4k. I hold out hope that spinner and the other creators know what they’re doing and that I might actually enjoy round 10.

I've played every single round of PA and i can count on one hand the number of rounds i can honestly say that i've enjoyed. The others i've played out of habit and because of the community that goes hand in hand with PA.

Anyway after my ramblings i've voted to accept the reset. Not because i feel that it's a long term solution but because i feel that it's the easiest short term solution to allow people to actually feel like they may enjoy the game for a few weeks at least. And thats what it boils down to, it's a game and games are sposed to be fun, if there not people wont play. More than anything this game, and any other, needs more players to make it more fun, and the power blocks dont make it easy to introduce new players to this game. n00bs are not welcomed into power blocks because they are not good enough players, they are bashed constantly because they do not have an alliance, and they get disillusioned to the game and leave quickly. We end up with inactive planets and the stagnation that we all see.

I shall wait with interest to see what the out come of the reset is, as it appears the majority of the player base want it to happen. Maybe i'll enjoy the first few weeks of r9.5. I shall await R10 even more eagerly, and see what fun and tricks are to come.

Copie

roadrunner_0 · 14 Apr 2003, 09:25

i perosnally have never had a round this bad for being attacked, without mentioning any coords, two galks in cluster have made it thier job to make sure that no other gals in cluster stand a chance, they are both WEET and have repeatedly sent not just roiding fleets, but kill fleets against us. at our best, as a independant gal we got up to 198, but now we are no where near
I am all for this idea therefore

seventh · 14 Apr 2003, 09:26

thats a very very very good idea.

seventh · 14 Apr 2003, 09:29

kloopy you are probably already inundated with ideas on ths one etc.
but perhaps take the top 500 and put them in there own universe. 50 galaxies. different conditions such as faster ticks or something. then it gives the people who want a chance to try ad get near the top a chance cos the top 500 players are probably members of powerblocks. effectively wiping the powerblock.

Waku · 14 Apr 2003, 09:36

RESET AND SHUFFLE !!!!!! YES

14 Apr 2003, 09:38

name changing should be a problem, just give a form which you give what you want your new name to be, but it doesnt get updated stright away, names would only get updated when the shuffle took place and logining in was unavilable

Hurragutten · 14 Apr 2003, 09:51

I voted yes yesterday, but after the break up of weet I would have voted no.

Embroglio · 14 Apr 2003, 09:53

I'm still against having come cons and res done for you, which sounds like its what is going to happen. It gives certain races a disadvantage, and early round roiding will be stupidly hard to do.

Lord_Thunderball · 14 Apr 2003, 10:01

Random,

that's how planetarion should be played. In a random universe power blocking is much more difficult(cause you can't hit a gal that way). Last round was fun, in a universe this small, private gals is NO option,

Kalle · 14 Apr 2003, 10:02

reset is fine... but not with fully random gals. i and maybe some others payed for private and we want private. we paid for a whole round.... 1/2 round + 1/2 round = 1 round..... but plz stay private. 3 unit roids, 0 const/res. changing planet/ruler name and race.

§pa¢e¢ook¦e · 14 Apr 2003, 10:10

i would say let them get bored to death :e_chick: , reset would be nice but i would make the powerblockers suffer a bit ;p

CrazyConrad · 14 Apr 2003, 10:22

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord_Thunderball
Random,

that's how planetarion should be played. In a random universe power blocking is much more difficult(cause you can't hit a gal that way). Last round was fun, in a universe this small, private gals is NO option,

Exactly...

vent · 14 Apr 2003, 10:30

(first off sorry i have only read the first page when i thought of this so if anyone else has said it...sorry!)
how about a shuffle like we have at the start of the round?
but with all the planets?
i have managed to get a good fleet and roid/score going even through being roided 5/7 nights
and it would be VERY depressing to have to do it again!!!
what about if round 9.5 was free and you just shuffle round 9?

hAl · 14 Apr 2003, 10:30

Quote:

Originally posted by MaTTiE
name changing should be a problem, just give a form which you give what you want your new name to be, but it doesnt get updated stright away, names would only get updated when the shuffle took place and logining in was unavilable

Taking the universe, rankings and gal pages of line would suffice as well. The new names would be invisible then.

hAl

WebAngel · 14 Apr 2003, 10:38

Quote:

Originally posted by Cochese
I say do it.

Alliance HC's should form a game-wide agreement to ALL go solo, and just have some fun in a nice random round.

We had that already for this round Cochese and you know it. Of course it wasn't written down on a paper but we have all talked about it before the round starts. But for some of us winning is more important than to have a funny round. It looks hopeless

limpmen · 14 Apr 2003, 10:42

Quote:

Originally posted by Kalle
reset is fine... but not with fully random gals. i and maybe some others payed for private and we want private. we paid for a whole round.... 1/2 round + 1/2 round = 1 round..... but plz stay private. 3 unit roids, 0 const/res. changing planet/ruler name and race.

when will it hit your head that it is NOT a half round.... if this happens you will just get a free round extra to play even tho this round has been short but winners are known (well ok new war taking place and if that's over no more big fights will happen)

14 Apr 2003, 11:01

hmmm, Why can you guys not see that you are getting a completely new round for free?

I am all for this reset, but I think restrictions need to be put on the game, there must be a way of stopping powerblocking.

Soron · 14 Apr 2003, 11:22

well..... i feel now that everytime that someone would have a bad round, we will reset...

(((

sometimes you win, sometimes you loose

Jain_Zar · 14 Apr 2003, 11:26

right firstly i havent read all the replies on here coz frankly im too narked to be bother i would just like to add my lil piece and then im goin

now correct me if im wrong but PA is ment to be a real time strategy game so can some one tell me whats real time about a strategy that goes wrong and so the ppl can request a restart dosnt sound very real tiem to me surely it would be better and more fun to work a way out of it rather then makin everyone suffer for the actions of the blocks

i myself will be leaving PA if the restart occurs as i feel it unfair and unnessacery u will never be rid of powerblocks no matter what u do the only way to get rid of them is make them realize its a flawed strategy as they can see by the stat of the universe at the moment THEY DONT WORK you cut ur self off and leave urself with nuffin to attack so let them disband dont ruin it for the rest of us and lets remeber the key pharse her REAL TIEM STRATEGY GAME nothin real time about being able to hit a restart button

Kal · 14 Apr 2003, 11:47

My suggestion:

monitor how the final war goes, once stagnation is reached, end the round. Then have a new round - round 9.5. This round would be random with free signups - that way we actaully have some players in the universe rather than the same old thing again but random.

So I want a new round when the last war is over with free signups, i don't really care if its random or private

randal · 14 Apr 2003, 11:58

i'm for it ye, not that i play much anyway tho..
but i've always been pro randoms (and it also helps against 'blocking', if people want to believe it or not).. it wouldn't be bad of course to start with a certain stage on res/con, and maybe with some k resources, or a bunch of roids..
of course some free signups later the round would help alot for round10 aswell, but i guess that's not gonna be done again anyway..

Amberielle · 14 Apr 2003, 12:06

well good going PA Crew, this will certainly remove a few players from the universe with the start of r9.5.

I for one am not in WEET or in any other powerblock or alliance, if you do the reset and start this new intermediate round, i will not be playing, you may well please the masses to start with, but not all. Any player who is not in a powerblock, large alliance or who is allianceless like me has had to work for there position in the universe, and having to start all over again and get to know a new lot of people in a random gal ... NO THANKS !!!!! ...

Spoonman · 14 Apr 2003, 12:08

isnt pleasing the masses the general idea?

Fallen · 14 Apr 2003, 12:14

Ha i dont like my name this round, Weet have owned all isnt that enough for you guys and girls or do you have to gloat some more.
Lets go random and start off 3/4 through con/res with 100/200 unin roids and a certain amount of resouces.
Get the game off to a quicker start please for god sake please.

Of course make sure name changes are not trace-able close down pa for afew hours no biggie maybe race changes might be good.

Cant we think of this as the last beta test to see if priv gals worked. Ps i think we should go random in speed rounds too.

Amberielle · 14 Apr 2003, 12:15

pleasing the masses is the idea to start of with yes, but have they honestly thought this though ?

the answer is no

in the end they will find you still have powerblocks and alliances will still rule nad then those who play the game for fun and dont have the backup of alliances or others will suffer

basically all the so called n00bies and allianceless peeps are going to suffer ... unorganised gals or split gals due to alliances

no one to help defend them cos there friends are now in a completely different parallel or cluster etc etc

14 Apr 2003, 12:36

I think free signups would be a good idea too.

seventh · 14 Apr 2003, 13:31

its pretty well thought through. they also havent just made the decision, they set it to a vote and at the moment the vote is yes.

I am not in an alliance.

Random galaxies are way more fun than private. people are willing to get to know you etc. you can form close friendships; on the net obviously no ones sad enough to take it over to real life (lo tpe)

i personally think its a very good idea and im unsure why but i think the people who whinge about random galaxies only do so because they haven't played in them. i've thought its been a bad idea to have private galaxies from the start, due to the fact people can just hook up with everyone and there aint any targets left.

the guy who said "real time strategy" you played command and conquer? since when did it take 4 minutes to build a tank...? and c&c doesnt last forever does it.

also to make it more "real" have we chosen who is in our universe? (even if we dont know who else there was, we wouldnt be able to say "no i dont want them in our galaxy" theyd just be there.

anyway. dont just quit. you'll be allowed to play free. try it. then when you dont like it, leave. it honestly wont affect us much. cos i know a lot of my mates are starting up again next round. so you will be replaced.

ZaPpeh · 14 Apr 2003, 13:33

how about a mix of the two:

You can have a galaxy for your friends, but only a maximim of 5 players, the other 5 are then random?
that should benefit the weak and the strong?

ZaPpeh · 14 Apr 2003, 13:38

By the way, i am in a galaxy that is getting hit by an alliance all day and night, its no fun at all, and theres no way i will pay for another round like this, im sure others feel the same.

Our incomings...

:2 ***** 8621/0
:3 ***** 351/0
:4 ***** (online) 3236/0
:7 ***** 1086/0
:8 ***** 647/0
:9 ***** (online) 2115/0

Ultramar · 14 Apr 2003, 13:42

Dunno if this has been mentioned already but...

If we do end up having Con/Res for a few ticks already done, do we get to choose what con/res we get? Tbh, if im terran i dont want to go for scans or pds... and as a Xan i wouldnt have thought getting new ship classes would be something i'd want at the start! Everyone starts in different ways, therefore surely we need to start back at the beginning!!

-Ultramar

anomnorway · 14 Apr 2003, 13:43

Answers to sevenths comments:

"the people who whinge about random galaxies only do so because they haven't played in them"

comment: wrong, most have - in R8 all went random cos they had to.

"the guy who said "real time strategy"..."

comment: real time stratergy means what happens, happen and in real time there is seldom any going back - no restart button.

"we wouldnt be able to say "no i dont want them in our galaxy" theyd just be there."

comment: wrong - the exile button is still there.

"anyway. dont just quit. you'll be allowed to play free.."

comment: wrong, we have already paid.

:e_bunny:

wakey · 14 Apr 2003, 14:42

tbh I cant say I like this idea. As most people here probally know I'm all in favour of PA being totally random BUT as we saw last round with so few players random doesnt really work. The powerblock situation with so few planets results in the round stagnating almost from the start. before random is a real possiability we either need the powerblock situation dealt with OR numbers raised. If you want to run an intermediate round and something isnt going to be done to stop the powerrblocking then we would be better off letting us keep our galaxies instead of being thrown in the mix with a number of differnt powerblocks all of whom have forgot what PA used to be like when you put alliance troubles behind you and worked for the ake of the galaxy instead of what happens now and they put their alliance first thus killing any fun there is in the game.

wakey · 14 Apr 2003, 14:50

Quote:

Originally posted by ZaPpeh
how about a mix of the two:

You can have a galaxy for your friends, but only a maximim of 5 players, the other 5 are then random?
that should benefit the weak and the strong?

Ive been telling spinner and co for a while that they should try the 'frienship group idea' for a while. Let us all choose a few friends (perhaps 5 as you said maybe less, certainly no more than 5) and then just mix all these up. Youve got the benifits of random yet still allow everyone to have a couple of friendly faces with whom they can get on with even if they end up with a bunch of idiots.

kpec01 · 14 Apr 2003, 14:57

Just stop planet bashing ..........

It will only happen again if you allow 10 x 5 million planets to attack a single 1 million.

Sjor · 14 Apr 2003, 15:01

i understand all ppl saying let the round go on
the big guys fought a lot to reach the spot they are atm
the non weet ppl fought hard to keep their roids

but those ppl saying pa should last are just about 24 % as the poll shows (unless Killmark voted already)

The thing is that 3/4 of the ppl are bored with the game
yes it is your right to finish this round but at what cost? loosing >50 % of the players?

Maybe its just cause im on the loosers side like every round but i think we should start R 9.5 asap

nice to see the activity comming back by just mentioning a restart

my ideas for R9.5
7 ppl priv gals 25 ppl random gals
race, planet/rulernam change
50 roids and only basic research and construction done or if possible to select the const/ress for the 1st 72 ticks which are finished automaticaly
Protection of 24 ticks to make the allies sort their arbiter and not block

Finally its up to alliances not to block and really show which ally is the best/luckiest one

i hope my ally will have enough backbone to stay alone

Ronin · 14 Apr 2003, 15:19

The round is a bore, but a restard wont make anything better for anyone. Leave it.

masochist · 14 Apr 2003, 15:24

a stagnation? where? i've been killed today. dunno who was attacking me, perhaps some 'friends' again...