Watch your Marshmellows...

[Androme]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050526/...shmallow_death

CHICAGO - Six years after a sixth-grader choked to death while stuffing her mouth with marshmallows as part of a classroom game, a lawsuit blaming her suburban school district went to trial Thursday.
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Francis Patrick Murphy, a lawyer for the girl's family, argued that a lack of supervision led to the death of 12-year-old Catherine "Casey" Fish. But an attorney for the Glenview School District contended the youngsters were never out of the teachers' sight.

The lawsuit seeks unspecified damages.

Murphy told the jury that the teacher had walked out of the room to talk to a janitor when Casey and her friends started playing "chubby bunny" — a race to stuff as many marshmallows in their mouths as they could and still say the words "chubby bunny" three times.

Casey choked on four marshmallows and collapsed. She died at a hospital a few hours later.

"You have to make sure that when children are doing something that might be dangerous you are there to protect them," Murphy told the jury in opening statements. "Effective supervision timely acted upon would have saved Casey. Casey's parents would be sitting at her high school graduation next week."

Thomas DiCianni, an attorney for the school system, said the children were in a room in the middle of a group of open classrooms with sliding doors and a low wall between the rooms and the hall. Two teachers had a view into that room, so at no time were the children unsupervised, he said.

DiCianni also raised questions about the medical examiner's ruling that Casey choked to death, saying unknown health problems could have been involved and were missed in the autopsy.

I wonder how big they were if she choked on a miniscule "mouthful". Sympathy goes out nonetheless.

[Phalon]

I could say something extremely cruel about 'Natural Selection' etc but i shall refrain.

I don't see how they can blame the teachers, if not this she would likely have drowned in her school dinner or at the water fountain tbh.

[Cannon_Fodder]

If there was 'Effective supervision' surely they would have put her out of her misery and shot her.

[roadrunner_0]

if i were the school board, i would point out that if she were stupid enough to do that then the consequences were her own fault.

[midge5]

Originally Posted by Androme2

"You have to make sure that when children are doing something that might be dangerous you are there to protect them,".

I've never heard of a task involving marshmallows be described as dangerous before heh.

[acropolis]

i rocked at chubby bunnies.

i really don't think the school can be sued on this one. that would require that somehow the person in charge should have known that marshmallows can cause death upon ingestion, which is a little much to expect.

the target for my lawsuit would be the doctors. seriously, if after a few hours of work, you lose a patient to a marshmallow-related injury, it's time you were ushered into a different field.

[Phalon]

Originally Posted by acropolis

i really don't think the school can be sued on this one. that would require that somehow the person in charge should have known that marshmallows can cause death upon ingestion, which is a little much to expect.

She didn't ingest them, hence why she died.

the target for my lawsuit would be the doctors. seriously, if after a few hours of work, you lose a patient to a marshmallow-related injury, it's time you were ushered into a different field.

Let's review what happened.

She choked on marshmellows (this means they were blocking her airway; she couldn't inhale)

She collapsed likely due to a combination of lack of oxygen and panic.

She died because her brain was starved of oxygen for a significant amount of time. Something ~ of 4-5 mins would be sufficient to do this. They obviously kept her breathing, but her brain refused to perform this function on it''s own or later gave up in hospital due to the trauma suffered.

So, unless the obstruction was cleared within the few minute timeframe and her brain's oxygen supply restored, there's really **** all any doctor could have done to save her.

[wu_trax]

they should rather sue the company which produced the marshmallows. they should have put a warning on the package and none of this would have happened !

[acropolis]

Originally Posted by Phalon

She didn't ingest them, hence why she died.

my working definition of ingest has always been to put 'food' or what have you into your mouth, with the implied eventual intention of digestion but w/o the actual requirement.

i, however, detest debate over definitions, as words mean for all practical purposes whatever you think they mean.

on point, i agree if she was braindead on arrival then it was not the fault of the physicians'. my guess is that the arriving emts couldn't figure out how to get a trache tube past a marshmallow blockage, a problem that persisted upon arrival at the ER.

[Marilyn Manson]

This is why my nan always told me to chew my food well.

Obviously she had an inferor nan to mine.

[Nantoz]

Originally Posted by wu_trax

they should rather sue the company which produced the marshmallows. they should have put a warning on the package and none of this would have happened !

They probably do have a "warning". American products are filled with it.
Remember The Hot Coffee Incident, Where a woman was awared the mind-numbing sum of $2,9 million for spilling some McDonald's coffee on her. She claimed she didn't know it would be hot...
It's pathetic, it truly is.

Read this for a well-written cry for help and sanity.

[Ärketrollmannen]

Didn't she lose on apeal?

[Tactitus]

Originally Posted by Ärketrollmannen

Didn't she lose on apeal?

Actually, the case never even made it that far. The judge reduced the punative damages to $480K and fearing that it would be reduced even further on appeal, she settled for an 'undisclosed amount' (probably substantially less).

[Kurashima]

Something goes wrong , you sue someone.

You trip and fall on the pavement, you sue the council
You eat too many burgers and get Idi-fat, you sue McDonalds
You dont get the job you want because your CV is shit, you sue for discrimination because the person who got the job is White/Black/Male/Female/Catholic/Protestant.
Your do something that is UNBELIVABLY ****ING STUPID, and when you get injured, you look for someone to blame.

I REALLY ****ing hate blame culture. The concept of taking responsibility for your own actions no longer exists.

The Lawyers HAVE inherited the earth. Nobody did a ****ing thing to stop them because they were scared of getting sued.

Not particularly relevant in this case, more a generalisation on why Ambulance Chasers have single handedly made Lawyers the most hated professionals on the planet, ahead of even Traffic Wardens, and weak "judges" have been handed too much power to make decisions that have made lawyers rich and very little else.

"My lawyer got me a payout of £3,500 when i had a fall at work".

Well whoop dee ****ing doo, thats enough to cover the 3 months wages you lost whilst pretending to be badly hurt for the courtoom, but your lawyer got £10k in fees and the court costs were covered by your employers, who have now either fired you or made sure you have no career prospects".

Yahwe, there MUST be a grouping withing your profession that daily shakes its head at the actions of individuals like this, and surely, someday, theyll recognise that if this continues, there wont be anyone left to sue but other lawyers.

[Rinoa]

"she choked, collapsed and died a few hours later"

-- WFT was going on in those few hours? people frantically trying to remove marshmallows from her mouth as she continued choking?

[Proteus]

Why would you want to ruin utterly a lovely name like "Catherine" by making it "Casey"?

[Kurashima]

Originally Posted by Rinoa

"she choked, collapsed and died a few hours later"

-- WFT was going on in those few hours? people frantically trying to remove marshmallows from her mouth as she continued choking?

Im guessing the kids around here just stood there thinking "Cool" as she choked to death, as is the norm with American Schoolkids.

[Phalon]

Originally Posted by Rinoa

WFT was going on in those few hours? people frantically trying to remove marshmallows from her mouth as she continued choking?

On a serious note, i already explained the likely reason she died.

'God works in mysterious ways'

'Everything happens for a reason'

Wonder what they'll put on her headstone?

'Here lies Catherine "Casey" Fish whom, though our beloved daughter, was too ****ing stupid to chew a marshmellow'

[furball]

Every time there's a wacko legal case, people seem to bring up the McDonalds Coffee case. But no-one seems to actually know what happened, except that she won for being burnt by McDonalds coffee. I've shamelessly copied this off a website for you all.


The Truth About the McDonalds Coffee Case

Perhaps the most well-known "frivolous lawsuit" is the story of Stella Liebeck - the woman who was burned by hot coffee from McDonalds. Here are the facts about the McDonald's lawsuit; decide for yourself if the suit was frivolous:

1: Stella Liebeck was a 79-year-old grandmother who was the passenger in her grandson's car.

2: McDonalds served the coffee at roughly 190 degrees. 190 Degree liquid will cause third-degree burns within 2-7 seconds of contact with the skin.

3: Stella was wearing cotton jogging pants, and the 190 degree liquid soaked into the pants. She received third-degree burns to her thighs and genitals. This is what a third-degree burn looks like

4: McDonalds admitted that the coffee was not fit for human consumption at the temperature they served it.

5: Over 700 men, women, and children had been burned prior to Stella's lawsuit.

6: Stella offered to settle with McDonalds just for her medical bills. They refused.

Hopefully, this clears up some of the misconceptions that Stella was a careless woman who spilled some hot coffee on herself and just needed some aloe vera. She was docked $20 000 for her own negligence, so don't try to claim that it was all her own fault. That was taken into consideration when reaching the decision.

[Yahwe]

shame on you furball.

shame.

nothing spoils a good story like the facts.

[Vaio]

Originally Posted by furball

Every time there's a wacko legal case, people seem to bring up the McDonalds Coffee case. But no-one seems to actually know what happened, except that she won for being burnt by McDonalds coffee. I've shamelessly copied this off a website for you all.


The Truth About the McDonalds Coffee Case

Perhaps the most well-known "frivolous lawsuit" is the story of Stella Liebeck - the woman who was burned by hot coffee from McDonalds. Here are the facts about the McDonald's lawsuit; decide for yourself if the suit was frivolous:

1: Stella Liebeck was a 79-year-old grandmother who was the passenger in her grandson's car.

2: McDonalds served the coffee at roughly 190 degrees. 190 Degree liquid will cause third-degree burns within 2-7 seconds of contact with the skin.

3: Stella was wearing cotton jogging pants, and the 190 degree liquid soaked into the pants. She received third-degree burns to her thighs and genitals. This is what a third-degree burn looks like

4: McDonalds admitted that the coffee was not fit for human consumption at the temperature they served it.

5: Over 700 men, women, and children had been burned prior to Stella's lawsuit.

6: Stella offered to settle with McDonalds just for her medical bills. They refused.

Hopefully, this clears up some of the misconceptions that Stella was a careless woman who spilled some hot coffee on herself and just needed some aloe vera. She was docked $20 000 for her own negligence, so don't try to claim that it was all her own fault. That was taken into consideration when reaching the decision.

So now the only half decent thing you can get at McDonalds is lukewarm and just as fit for human consumption as the 'too hot' one.

[SYMM]

I was walking down London Road/Piccadilly/Market Street (they kind of follow on as one long road) in Manchester last week, and was asked 7 times 'Had an accident mate?' by the scruffiest and least personable people you could possibly imagine. Some of them were wearing 'uniforms' bearing the names of their companies, but first guy wasn't, and I thought (as you do) that he was asking for a light, so my reply of 'Sorry, don't smoke' probably left him somewhat confused (it only occured to me afterwards what he probably did in fact say).
By the time I got to the last guy, a reply of 'no, but if I get asked again, I'll point him in your direction' was very tempting, but I refrained like the coward I am, and just ignored him.

[djbass]

I don't get it... is there some secret meaning to what they were saying????

[Madina]

Originally Posted by SYMM

loadsa stuff

I always feel like walking into the stall/stand they have and pretending to be badly injured. Im sure they would be very helpful in helping me sue themselves.

[roadrunner_0]

well, she was stupid enough to drink hot coffee in a car, which i assume was moving...

[Nantoz]

Originally Posted by furball

Every time there's a wacko legal case, people seem to bring up the McDonalds Coffee case. But no-one seems to actually know what happened, except that she won for being burnt by McDonalds coffee. I've shamelessly copied this off a website for you all.


The Truth About the McDonalds Coffee Case

Perhaps the most well-known "frivolous lawsuit" is the story of Stella Liebeck - the woman who was burned by hot coffee from McDonalds. Here are the facts about the McDonald's lawsuit; decide for yourself if the suit was frivolous:

1: Stella Liebeck was a 79-year-old grandmother who was the passenger in her grandson's car.

2: McDonalds served the coffee at roughly 190 degrees. 190 Degree liquid will cause third-degree burns within 2-7 seconds of contact with the skin.

3: Stella was wearing cotton jogging pants, and the 190 degree liquid soaked into the pants. She received third-degree burns to her thighs and genitals. This is what a third-degree burn looks like

4: McDonalds admitted that the coffee was not fit for human consumption at the temperature they served it.

5: Over 700 men, women, and children had been burned prior to Stella's lawsuit.

6: Stella offered to settle with McDonalds just for her medical bills. They refused.

Hopefully, this clears up some of the misconceptions that Stella was a careless woman who spilled some hot coffee on herself and just needed some aloe vera. She was docked $20 000 for her own negligence, so don't try to claim that it was all her own fault. That was taken into consideration when reaching the decision.

It doesn't matter at all.
She was still the one who managed to spill the coffee onto herself, beacuse she placed the cup on the dashboard of a moving car.

I hate McD as much as the next man, but I fail to see how that in any way could be their fault.
If I drop a bowling ball out of a window and kill a man, should I then sue the firm producing the bowling ball because it didn't have a warning label saying "Potentiallly deadly when dropped upon someone's head".
By using common sence we avoid most of these blindingly stupid things. Coffee is supposed to be hot, that is probably why Stupid Stelle bought it.

I have no sympathy for that woman whatsoever.

[Phang]

Originally Posted by Nantoz

Coffee is supposed to be hot

it is not however supposed to cause horrific injuries. If the woman had been inside the restaurant and sustained the burns to her mouth would your opinion be different?

[Ärketrollmannen]

Originally Posted by furball

Every time there's a wacko legal case, people seem to bring up the McDonalds Coffee case. But no-one seems to actually know what happened, except that she won for being burnt by McDonalds coffee. I've shamelessly copied this off a website for you all.


The Truth About the McDonalds Coffee Case

Perhaps the most well-known "frivolous lawsuit" is the story of Stella Liebeck - the woman who was burned by hot coffee from McDonalds. Here are the facts about the McDonald's lawsuit; decide for yourself if the suit was frivolous:

1: Stella Liebeck was a 79-year-old grandmother who was the passenger in her grandson's car.

2: McDonalds served the coffee at roughly 190 degrees. 190 Degree liquid will cause third-degree burns within 2-7 seconds of contact with the skin.

3: Stella was wearing cotton jogging pants, and the 190 degree liquid soaked into the pants. She received third-degree burns to her thighs and genitals. This is what a third-degree burn looks like

4: McDonalds admitted that the coffee was not fit for human consumption at the temperature they served it.

5: Over 700 men, women, and children had been burned prior to Stella's lawsuit.

6: Stella offered to settle with McDonalds just for her medical bills. They refused.

Hopefully, this clears up some of the misconceptions that Stella was a careless woman who spilled some hot coffee on herself and just needed some aloe vera. She was docked $20 000 for her own negligence, so don't try to claim that it was all her own fault. That was taken into consideration when reaching the decision.

Wouldn't the water be boiling if it was 190 degrees when she received it?

[Phalon]

I assumed it was in fahrenheit, which would make it ~88 degrees celsius.

Though i wouldn't have thought that would've caused third degree burns.

So i'm now unsure again.

Still, i too have little sympathy for a woman who doesn't hold on to her hot coffee whilst the car is in motion.

[Ärketrollmannen]

88 degress? Surely that can't cause any injuries worth mentioning unless she got the WHOLE cup over her. Wich I really can't see anyone predicting.

However, if the coffe was 190 degrees celsius, it should have been bubbling. Wich means you don't even drink it. Wich makes it her fault.

I still feel sorry for her tough.

[Phalon]

She didn't drink it though, hence the fried burst-rugby-ball.

And polystyrene is an immensely good insulator so she would've had little reason to suspect it being so hot.

Kudos to McD's for boiling their Coffee up to 190 degrees celsius though.

The thing to take home about this and the marshmellow incident is that stupid people will inevitably do stupid things.

No matter their age.

Common sense is clearly not something that can be learnt.

[LHC]

Just because somebody comes in and says "here are the facts" doesn't mean he didn't make it up.

[Marilyn Manson]

Clearly, 80 year olds should be expected to be absolutely mentally alert at all times, and if they are served molten lava by McDonalds and then manage to suffer spotaneous combustion over 100% of their body through a simple act of carelessness, then they've got no one to blame other than themselves. In fact, McDonalds should be given an award and a generous cash donation for their exemplary conduct.

[queball]

Originally Posted by Ärketrollmannen

88 degress? Surely that can't cause any injuries worth mentioning unless she got the WHOLE cup over her. Wich I really can't see anyone predicting.

However, if the coffe was 190 degrees celsius, it should have been bubbling. Wich means you don't even drink it. Wich makes it her fault.

I still feel sorry for her tough.

Do you mean Fahrenheit? Water can't go above 100 degrees Calcius without turning into gas (at standard temperate and pressure, and impure water can often go higher, but I doubt coffee is special).

190F is indeed near boiling, and the temperature at which the coffee was served. Water only bubbles vigorously when you're adding heat to it - try boiling some water in a kettle, pour it into a cup and watch the lack of bubbles. Now pour it on your genitals.

[Alki]

maybe she thought it was that giant marshmellow dude from ghostbusters and had a major fetish for him, but he was to much for her to take and she died:/

[Marilyn Manson]

I don't know if it's positive or negative, because you've only just registered, thus your opinion counts for nothing. You make no difference to 'teh rep.' You get a white blob to signify your insignifigance.

[Thermodynamics]

Originally Posted by Ärketrollmannen

88 degress? Surely that can't cause any injuries worth mentioning unless she got the WHOLE cup over her. Wich I really can't see anyone predicting.

However, if the coffe was 190 degrees celsius, it should have been bubbling. Wich means you don't even drink it. Wich makes it her fault.

I still feel sorry for her tough.

Ah- I was going to point out what Queball already did! well done! Seriously I hate litigation culture- in Ireland, little kids are no longer allowed run in playgrounds[this isn't the law: but its readily adopted in many schools across the state]- for fear they will fall and parents will sue. But on the other hand- think of the family? The daughter- the apple of her parent's eye- and they must think- had a teacher/adult been there, she would probably be alive and hapy now. So, it follows on to think that all their pain and misery, and loss in caused because of negligence. But is it unreasonable for a teacher to step outside to have a word with another member of staff? I think not. Certain matters shouls not be discussed in front og the pupils. full-stop. Who would run to get a supervisor o supervise for the 5 minutes you spend talking to your colleague?

Either way, I cannot say what should be done. I sympathise with both parties.

Moral Dilemma I think.