The Lion, The Witch & The Secret-Wars

[DrunkenViking]

Originally Posted by lokken

WHY MAKE PROMISES YOU CAN'T KEEP?

He made a statement with no intel, just tought i'd help him a bit.

[lokken]

[Nadar]

Originally Posted by lokken

Don't be sad, be happy!

[Heartless]

I wonder what everyone is brabbling about. NoS didn't win round 13 and thus they didn't achieve anything worth mentioning. Just like Angels NoS did simply ensure NOT to win round 13 with their politics.

Yes I am drunk enough to reply to such a thread

[furball]

Originally Posted by Nadar

VGN and HR eh? The last week (maybe 1,5 week) of round I put up attack on Veneratio the first day, VsN the second, VGN the third and then all 3 of you the fourth night. On the fifth night we got some 3v (vsn, veneration, vgn) incs. Wether it was co-ordinated or not I don't know. Some nights after we hit HR. The days after that we had lots of HR/VGN/VsN/Ven (hirr too I think) incs. Thought they were co-ordinated (seems only HR+VGN did), but VsN and Ven hit us just as much (might have been random for what I know). So it wasn't only HR/VGN who made us red Not that it matters anyway, attacking is what this game lives for

Nope, there wasn't any co-ordination when actually attacking whatsoever. We had an excellent relationship with HR this round, but the most we did when it came to yourselves was to swap intel to cover all the bases.

Thanks for the clarification on your incomings. I was under the impression that you were NAPed to Veneratio (wrong) and that Vision were focussing elsewhere (wrong also).

Just to re-iterate - Vengeance and Howling Rain did not co-ordinate our attacks on yourselves, we just knew that we were both hitting some of NoS. VGN was sending about 2/3rds of its fleets at another alliance anyway, so I don't know how much effect we had on yourselves compared to HR/Ven/Vsn.

[lokken]

Originally Posted by Heartless

Yes I am drunk enough to reply to such a thread

You need alcohol to read this one trust me

[Kargool]

Originally Posted by lokken

You need alcohol to read this one trust me

Im actually agreeing with you lokken again. And it scares me

[Felagund]

we got problems in attacks , For those who said that , i will suggest something go to top 100 roiders in sandsmans and try to check how many NoS planets are , is a bit hard become top100 roider when u are attacking as u said small planets of small alliances,plz check would be u get a surprise oO.

To ND i had some respect for many of u guys personally still got a few m8s there , but this whine is uppersucky , dont think u saw any NoS post last round when we did really bad about u being really SUX ALLIES , if u dont remember u were .

To 1up u like ppl being ur muppets and u got some 1uppers wannabes in ND so Go GO , zhil is not nice insult ppl and more when u dont know them, wonder where are the forum moderators when someone call other bastard *cough*

About all the rest of those 4 pages of whine posts , we love u too , and i would like NoS stay out of AD how we had been allways coz this trolling and propaganda is like .....

[Neferti]

I can't believe using comments from [NADS] as evidence against ND... you mean people take that sort of thing from [NADS] seriously??

[Spritfire]

DrunkenViking : We approached NoS , and the only HC who was there was the one we found. Do a HC really need more ppl there to have a meeting ? We got told that we would get an answer after some days when rest of the HC Team was on place to make comments on our proposal.
We never got an responce.

I did go and ask for an answer. If you can guess right. I just got shit back. If your smart you can guess who I talked to since I got so much shit back. Dingo ofc , I got told that NoS would not offer there spot for some fighting ( short version , cutted down the bullshit )

SQUIDSOAP \o/ tasts jummy

[Gate]

Originally Posted by Felagund

we got problems in attacks , For those who said that , i will suggest something go to top 100 roiders in sandsmans and try to check how many NoS planets are , is a bit hard become top100 roider when u are attacking as u said small planets of small alliances,plz check would be u get a surprise oO.

However, it's far easier to steal roids from an alliance that doesn't have the defensive capabilities of eXilition, LCH, ToT. Not to put those players down, well done to those that did, I just want to put it in perspective.

To ND i had some respect for many of u guys personally still got a few m8s there , but this whine is uppersucky , dont think u saw any NoS post last round when we did really bad about u being really SUX ALLIES , if u dont remember u were .

That's because ND fought tooth and nail for the past 3 weeks whilst Mistu, LCH and VisioN threw absolutely everything at them. NoS avoided incs the entire round, and it leads to frustration and subsequent disagreements when, for instance, a NoS member in a public channel champions the NoS rank and takes the piss out of SiNND/1up rankings despite the fact that NoS have never truly been tested this round. As I said before, it seems the judgements of quality from each side are incompatible; NoS are only rank oriented, ND for instance believe in earning a rank through tests of martial strength, and by also fighting the greatest threat to stagnation, and having some form of honour. Which ideology is best depends on your opinion...

And I'm disappointed because I wanted to see how NoS military performed with TFD etc alongside them.

[Rumad]

What a crummy thread....

people start accusing NoS of crap tactics and leaving allies to die yet they have missed some salient points. Firstly as Dingo stated 1up's agenda never really totally agreed with there own.

NoS had scores from past rounds which needed settling. Many of the command were around when those past breeches happened so naturally wanted to have some closure. 1up was aware of this when they allied/napped.

As the round progressed 1up and allies placed more pressure on NoS to target an alliance it really ha no issues with and was being forced into a war it didn't want and its members didn't really care about.

So you have an ally who has no interest in attacking another 3rd party ally with allies who are only interested in hitting that ally.

I think Dingo's decision was totally right for NoS. Decisions like this can make or break rounds. In NS's case it was the right timing and the right decision.

I was suprised at how quickly WP/HR capitulated to be honest. I fully expected them to have mre resolve than they did. NoS finished the round 3rd and fought in 2 wars.

I have t also say that frm what I hear NoS had much better working relatinships with eX than any of the block who were there so called allies. I have sene logs were ND were getting bitter towards NoS even before the nap occured. I also know that NoS were extremely unhappy of napping/allying HR/WP who were also about to join the same block.

Would you ally alliances you disliked and force your members into a war you didn't want with allies you didn't really work well with?

The politics worked well for NoS, they finished 3rd and I can guarantee most members enjoyed there round.

on a side note WP/HR were unlucky. From sethy's point of view they only needed a few more weeks to solidify and they would have finsihed the round highly. Accusing others for your own inability to finish the round effectively isn't really the right way to go about things.

All I can say is thanks Dingo for letting me in. After my WP experience it as nice to be in an alliance that worked for each other.

[Kattepis]

When are the first shows are coming on the tv? I think more people watch this then Jerry Springer in the past

[ComradeRob]

A Rumad post that I agree with. What's the world coming to?

[MAdnRisKy]

So Rumad joins NoS ey?

who would have thought it

[The_Fish]

Well Done on your rank 3 NoS.

You won't be anywhere near that rank again next round, so savour it whilst you can.

[Felagund]

dont be worried The_fish if NoS is not there ND will not be either

[DrunkenViking]

Originally Posted by The_Fish

Well Done on your rank 3 NoS.

You won't be anywhere near that rank again next round, so savour it whilst you can.

Thanks

and.....wanna bet?

[Zh|l]

Originally Posted by DrunkenViking

I said certain ppl, not you. if you where in the joint chan you'd know that there was bitching from here and there on several occotions, from many sides. Before and after politics changed. I'm sure Bashar or someone can verify that for you if you want.

I think general bitching happens in every single joint channel that has ever existed. Guess what, newsflash - even the Fury/Legion channel r5+ had bitching in. Lo #monkeybusiness, the bestest ever joint channel in PA history.

Originally Posted by DrunkenViking

You may put it however you want, WP was our enemy since xmas.

And WP weren't in a strong enough position to win. But really, lol :/

Originally Posted by DrunkenViking

It was still theirs to take. You know well that we didnt do what we did in order to give the round to anyone, we did what we did because it was in line with our objectives. It would have taken less than a week to bring down wp/hr if the whole block joined in, less if we continued after the couple of days where we hit them together. Exi winning was allways something the rest of the block could have done something about, but its not like anyone respected nos opinions. Diplomacy is a 24/7 thingy innit? think someone failed along the way.

Oh that is rich. Perhaps if NoS were less shortsighted then you might have realized we needed WP/HR at the time to take down a block that had better organization. You keep on saying Exi when really you should include all the other alliances in Exi's block also - it was them we were preventing from winning and at that stage we were doing a pretty good job considering - unfortunately it was alliances like yours that upset the balance and contributed to tipping the balance into Exilition's favour.

Originally Posted by DrunkenViking

The big picture...who's big picture? Exilition/ToT/LCH were simply better than all of us, including you guys, 1up side had a great advantage in numbers all along, and exi outplayed everyone, they deserved the win, regardless of if we chipped in making it 650 vs 250-300 planets.

Numbers mean very little when they aren't being used. But you never even tried to put a stop to their block - so nowonder they had the advantage. Do you honestly believe NoS was a better alliance than 1up and ToT this round? Because if so, you need to change those rose-tinted glasses.

[Banned]

Originally Posted by Felagund

dont be worried The_fish if NoS is not there ND will not be either

And my dad can totally beat up your dad.

[Spritfire]

Originally Posted by Felagund

dont be worried The_fish if NoS is not there ND will not be either

How can you make statments from the HC of NewDawn ?
Maybe or goals are not to be in top3 ? How can you know ?

But I would say its a bigger chance ND will be there than NoS if not something drastic happends. ( like ND quit )

[lokken]

Originally Posted by Felagund

dont be worried The_fish if NoS is not there ND will not be either

like either of you know what rank either of you are going to end up, quite honestly.

If ND's got any sense it won't give a toss about you chaps next round, as they've got things like improving their alliance to deal with rather than bother with your bunch. They're going to have work their nuts off from start to finish to get top 5, and re-establish the reputation they earned (and rightly so towards the end of it considering what they were pulling off) in r12.

if NoS has got any sense they'll stop lauding up one of the most boring strategies in PA history (don't worry lads, r5 Fury is still miles in front of you), say they're pleased with their 3rd and move on. I personally think you'll find getting NAPs from quite a few alliances a lot tougher, simply because there are going to be alot of people who'd like to see you on a spitroast (I couldn't give a monkeys myself) and think you're probably deserving of a round of abject misery.

[Felagund]

Nd have lost a lot having hcs like they have atm those who like talk in AD when should do things other ways , where are the real ND hcs , where is vader , barrow or marinho? i got the feeling that the actual ND hcs are just 1up wannabees :/ im sorry u can do ur own politics and u need be allways in the sight of a big alliance , and if the round of this Strong alliance is not "good" (looking at rank position) then u go down , is a pity, grow up and try to make ur own decisions , that is what made an alliance grow would be u have not luck a round or two but u will finish getting some succes.

True my post in answer to the_fish was a bit childish , alcohol and morning are not good things together, anyways is not the place for an hc to make an statement like this and if u wanna do it then , make an official announcement that ND will be enemy of Nos, and stop here the flaming and whining.

U feel we dont do enough for u as allie i have had the same feeling as u in r12 many times and tbh dunno why our hc allied with the same ppl that leave us apart and let us go down and down in ranks (only hc knows).
So u ask us now that we dont do enough for our block , yeah would be is true but why we should when we dont have the same objetives , my hc have told in many post that we intend to hit wp/hr , we were hitting lch block for 1k ticks just coz well we thought that is what we should be doing , then we moved to our original targets (those who we want hit since the beggining), whats wrong?

I allways liked teh ponyes but not like they are now, instead of look at themselves , just lets start the flame a whinning against NoS, u should have done something wrong when u did so bad this round as NoS did when we had bad rounds, simple as that , stop the whine and wrok in ur allie .HF

[JonnyBGood]

1up got owned by dingo :(((



This has not been my most mature post ever but giggles anyways.

[furball]

Originally Posted by Felagund

Nd have lost a lot having hcs like they have atm those who like talk in AD when should do things other ways , where are the real ND hcs , where is vader , barrow or marinho?

Like most HCs, they're probably taking a well-earned rest after what most people will agree has been the 'hardest' round for quite a long time.

Originally Posted by Felagund

True my post in answer to the_fish was a bit childish , alcohol and morning are not good things together, anyways is not the place for an hc to make an statement like this and if u wanna do it then , make an official announcement that ND will be enemy of Nos, and stop here the flaming and whining.

Unlike NoS, I expect that NewDawn will approach the new round fresh and without any long-term grudges. They'll get on with doing the very best for their members, rather than holding them back by pursing particular alliances. They will do their very best to get to the number 1 rank, and you don't get there by going to war with NoS. Instead, you fight against your main competitors.

Blocks for the next round, if there are any, are currently unknown. They can be guessed at, of course, but every alliance has decisions to make. Either way, NewDawn's priority is very unlikey to be NoS.

[lokken]

Originally Posted by Felagund

Nd have lost a lot having hcs like they have atm those who like talk in AD when should do things other ways , where are the real ND hcs , where is vader , barrow or marinho? i got the feeling that the actual ND hcs are just 1up wannabees :/ im sorry u can do ur own politics and u need be allways in the sight of a big alliance , and if the round of this Strong alliance is not "good" (looking at rank position) then u go down , is a pity, grow up and try to make ur own decisions , that is what made an alliance grow would be u have not luck a round or two but u will finish getting some succes.

True my post in answer to the_fish was a bit childish , alcohol and morning are not good things together, anyways is not the place for an hc to make an statement like this and if u wanna do it then , make an official announcement that ND will be enemy of Nos, and stop here the flaming and whining.

Fish isn't HC of newdawn. ND this round were stuck with 1up because other people didn't give them room for manoevre. I'm the one who is very much anti the hate 1up brigade because it polarises the game, and prevents an open round. I think 1up probably needed a good kicking as them winning again would be zzzzz.

Barrow, Marinho and Vader are resting because they're absolutely exhausted and have better things to do, quite frankly. Presumably ND are now preparing for round 14 and they'll be reviewing everything from top to bottom considering what happened this round.

To be honest i wouldn't take the passionate outbursts at NoS from others as anything serious. They're simply the growlings of frustrated alliances on AD who prefer to see things from the bigger picture with little relevance to their actual policy, considering they have to consider their policies for next round in the sober light of day.

[Nadar]

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

nos basically took what was built over a number of rounds and pissed all over it.

We didn't have anything built with WP/HR. But I guess what you meant were yourself. You knew what our targets would be pre-round, so the question is why did you wait untill you were actually losing before you started whining about it?

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

and f**ked the alliances IN YOUR BLOCK, a group of alliances you agreed to work with pre-round.

Again, you very well knew our objectives pre-round. And we did help you with your goals at start before we moved on to our own objectives.

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

NOS is the perfect example of the "hurray for me...f*** you " attitude

Hurray for NoS...f**k you!

Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk

You jerked your allies around, and at the end of the day, everyone knows it. You contributed nothing to the war your allies were involved in, and you napped the enemy....thats what happened, dont try to call it something else

Let me finish the line you started there: You napped our enemy and we napped your enemy. You jerked us around, we jerked you around, and at the end of the day, everyone knows it. Shall I continue? I'm truly sorry we finished our goals this round and you didn't, but PLEASE don't blame anyone else than yourself for it. When it comes down to it, you screwed yourself up, we didn't.


Edit: Where did your post go?lol

[Seth Mace]

Originally Posted by Rumad

What a crummy thread....

...that you just HAD to reply too, the darkside is a tempting place hey;D

people start accusing NoS of crap tactics and leaving allies to die yet they have missed some salient points. Firstly as Dingo stated 1up's agenda never really totally agreed with there own.

NoS had scores from past rounds which needed settling. Many of the command were around when those past breeches happened so naturally wanted to have some closure. 1up was aware of this when they allied/napped.

1up were well aware of this, even more so they were aware of the HR-ND issue & at their pre-round meeting, HR was highlighted as an instant hostile alliance and that we were because of past round issues.

The difference (as has already been said on here), is that phrase i know you are a strong supporter of rumad: Fluid politics.

I think your biased view has clouded this aspect of PA that you have crusaded for, for so long?

As the round progressed 1up and allies placed more pressure on NoS to target an alliance it really ha no issues with and was being forced into a war it didn't want and its members didn't really care about.

So you have an ally who has no interest in attacking another 3rd party ally with allies who are only interested in hitting that ally.

Nos HC only had to look at pilkara/ sandman - to see who was REALLY going to win the round and for most of the round the eX average > *.

Believe me when i say this, if we didnt hold out as long as we did, nos would have been taken out by eX just because there was no more targets around and your members would have cared about this. They would have dropped your nap as soon as they were confident their enemy was beaten and they wouldnt batter an eyelid when nos HC came crying because the compassion nos lacked for their allies, would remove any remorse eX would have for dropping your nap.

Anyway, I think Nos HC are just idiots and the replys to this thread have just confirmed this:/

I think Dingo's decision was totally right for NoS. Decisions like this can make or break rounds. In NS's case it was the right timing and the right decision.

Nos = In Denial.

I was suprised at how quickly WP/HR capitulated to be honest. I fully expected them to have mre resolve than they did. NoS finished the round 3rd and fought in 2 wars.

There were few allies this round who received as much incomings as HR did (consistantly). Even when we knew nos/angels were hitting us, we understood that eX block was still the major problem & if HR and its allies could overcome that, then the likes of nos/angels could be picked off easier. You can quiz 1up/Nd about this, man there was so many times i pmed them saying "omg nos are taking the p1ss - drop your nap & lets f#ck them" but they kept the nap.

And we kept our focus on ex/ lch with the rest and as most HCs knew pre-round, attrition killed us off. But your comment and a few previous ones that imply Nos took out hr/ wp easy is comic tbh, there are only 2 allies this round HR would struggle 1 on 1 with and Nos wasnt one of them. (yes thats such a hypothetical remark but one i believe in)

I also know that NoS were extremely unhappy of napping/allying HR/WP who were also about to join the same block.

Only because it would conflict with your eX-nap & HR/Wp targetting. You could have taken that moment to drop eX relations and stand by your allies (as thats what allies are supposed to do) but instead you sat on the fence.

Would you ally alliances you disliked and force your members into a war you didn't want with allies you didn't really work well with?

Your telling me your members didnt want to war against eX/ Lch et al? With eX being the fattest & most active roiders who had likely stolen a sh1t load of Nos roids? Anyways, check out your own ideology of fluid politics for this one.

The politics worked well for NoS, they finished 3rd and I can guarantee most members enjoyed there round.

I think most can guarantee, Nos wont enjoy their next round :P

on a side note WP/HR were unlucky. From sethy's point of view they only needed a few more weeks to solidify and they would have finsihed the round highly. Accusing others for your own inability to finish the round effectively isn't really the right way to go about things.

"a few more weeks" hehe, u make it sound so easy;D

Our own inability lol? Thats such a poor throw away comment tbh. Inability how? in what way? Explain pls:P


Looking back on this thread, whats clear for me is I wouldnt have written it if Nos finished 3rd and the 1up block won. Basically, the 1up block was being owned so much (and hr/wp could see what was gonna happen next - death by eX for the rest), that we had to step in and basically fill the spot that should have been taken by Nos.

Nos sacrificied their allies (something that is always going to get flamed here) and you seem to think thats ok because "they had planned this pre-round". Thats the crux of your backstabbing justification but "why are nos the backstabbers & not 1up/nd for supporting nos vs hr/wp war" i hear you say?

Again, for the 3rd time i write this, Nos were NOT being owned by their targets - because their targets weren't fighting back (partly because we didnt consider nos a threat & partly because eX were more dangerous).

You can bet your collection of naps that 1up/nd would have ended their ex war if their enemey was no longer a threat & Nos was being owned by hr/wp. And there was a long period of time when hr/wp were beaten by the overwhelming incomings & nos stood by and STILL let their allies get shat on.

[Seth Mace]

Oh and i could reply with a lot of what i just wrote and apply it to your most recent post Nadar:P

[DrunkenViking]

lol, look at sourgrape sethy/sally. You're just pissed because we took away your chances of a desecent rank, nice whine tho Who're you to comment NoS politics in regards to our allies tho? Isnt that an issue for the block and us? Sethy, until you started getting hit, did you believe WP/HR was gonna do a good round? You had a flying start and i believe you'd be lying if you said you didnt conscider yourself a top3 contender ansame as WP.... You sir, are very amusing and incrediby bitter, glad to see that

[Seth Mace]

Originally Posted by DrunkenViking

lol, look at sourgrape sethy/sally. You're just pissed because we took away your chances of a desecent rank, nice whine tho

Hehe, ive never been afraid to speak my mind, on this occassion i happen to be saying what pretty much everyone else in the game is also thinking.

The ironic thing about your comment here, is that (and this must be the 3rd time ive had to repeat this fact), is Nos's WHOLE R13 campaign was based around sourgrapes from previous rounds.

So you are in no position to take the high ground my friend:P

Who're you to comment NoS politics in regards to our allies tho? Isnt that an issue for the block and us?

Nos politics (as u go on to explain) had a big impact on HRs round, so that = every right to say whatever i want. I was also involved in the formation of the coop between 1up/nd and hr ect. The exact coop that Nos should of been involved in, had they been aware of the universal situation & intelligent enough to see by carrying on the hr/wp bashing, they were also bashing nails into their allies coffin.

Sethy, until you started getting hit, did you believe WP/HR was gonna do a good round? You had a flying start and i believe you'd be lying if you said you didnt conscider yourself a top3 contender ansame as WP.... You sir, are very amusing and incrediby bitter, glad to see that

Seriously, you are missing the point here. Every ally has had their own agenda throughout the round, including HR and yeah ofc we knew what we needed to do to maintain a healthy position. I personally just thought better of Nos, hence my post, as it was a genuine question to nos HC for their reasoning to betray their allies. Why post it here instead of pm? It was a subject that had a considerable effect on the whole universe (for better or worse), inc my alliance, so i suppose i asked on behalf of the PA public \o/

(Great reply btw Drunken, its often the case that when you cant argue against the points made, its just easier to slag off the individual but nice try there;P)

[Nadar]

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

(Great reply btw Drunken, its often the case that when you cant argue against the points made, its just easier to slag off the individual but nice try there;P)

lol.. You did the same with Rumad just a couple of posts ago

[DrunkenViking]

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

(Great reply btw Drunken, its often the case that when you cant argue against the points made, its just easier to slag off the individual but nice try there;P)

Hehe, tbh, Squidly is the only one that actually argued my points, everyone else(including you) had the same stuff over and over without being able to argue my previous points. With the exception of minor agruments in regards to my number-estimates and tick-estimates. This is a monkey's discussion, and atm you're tarzan.

[Seth Mace]

Hehe, tbh, Squidly is the only one that actually argued my points, everyone else(including you) had the same stuff over and over without being able to argue my previous points

Lol, i didnt even mention your points, i was discussing with Rumad not you. I did read what you wrote though, i just chose to ignore it as you clearly ignored the first 2 pages which had basically covered what your wrote.

Nadar: I DID actually argue each point he made, so i dont see how you can apply my comment to that:/

[Jonas]

Originally Posted by Felagund

dont be worried The_fish if NoS is not there ND will not be either

Im confident ND will end higher than NoS next round

Not flaming NoS, simply belive they made alot of enemies on their politics this round.

[Zo0f]

I think things are getting a little too personal now and finger pointing should stay in primary school, its only a game.

Over the past few rounds Planetarion has made a large turnaround. The politics and flow of the rounds have been changed and now offer a more competitive environment for everyone. This has been widely accepted and many people you would not of thought had the insight and foward thought to take part have impressed me and im sure many others. What is the point of all this? Planetarion is what it is today due to the fluid politics and restrained paranoia that ruined rounds before.

While all the decisions alliances make are for their own benefit, the reason the last few rounds were so successful was due to the fact that alliances concidered the game too. It is possible to play for your alliance and the game.

Now, I think it is obvious to anyone reading this thread that a lot of people have a rather negative feeling about NoS at the moment. This is due to many of them being important to the change Planetarion has gone through over the past few rounds. NoS HC have confirmed that they mainly followed their own goals this round, occasionally helping allies tactically. Compared to the alliances allied to them, this was a very selfish strategy and the opposite of what they have worked hard for over the past few rounds.

The point here is, NoS and their actions were unacceptably selfish to a large amount of players this round. Now I am in no way claiming other alliances are selfless, as the game growing and being more competative is good for everyone. The point is people take this into account, not just themselves. Should NoS change? Thats upto them. Should NoS expect other alliances to respect their playstyle? Definately not.

This was not aimed to slate NoS, just to clarify the point and outcome of this thread. Oh and to remind people that it doesnt need to all be about personal arguements and bitching.

[Rumad]

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

...that you just HAD to reply too, the darkside is a tempting place hey;D

1up were well aware of this, even more so they were aware of the HR-ND issue & at their pre-round meeting, HR was highlighted as an instant hostile alliance and that we were because of past round issues.

I replied because i felt some things needed stating without someone saying "you scum bc/hc". As I am neither, but slightly more in the know than most I think I have a perfect right to set the record straight so to speak.

1up was aware of what NoS wished to do as was the rest of the block.

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

The difference (as has already been said on here), is that phrase i know you are a strong supporter of rumad: Fluid politics.

I think your biased view has clouded this aspect of PA that you have crusaded for, for so long?

See now your trying to twist thinsg. Fluidity is more than 2 blocks. However you felt it necessary to nap with 1up/nd. You seem to point to the exilition nap being sometime before you napped 1up. Who cares who napped who when? Simply NoS napped the enemy and went on to achieve there own round goals. I would say thats more fluid than fighting in block wars. Fluidity is about independence to do what you wanna do, not what you are obliged to do.

You possibly need to think more as you and WP sat on the fence long before NoS decided it wanted to achieve its round goals.

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

Nos HC only had to look at pilkara/ sandman - to see who was REALLY going to win the round and for most of the round the eX average > *.

Believe me when i say this, if we didnt hold out as long as we did, nos would have been taken out by eX just because there was no more targets around and your members would have cared about this. They would have dropped your nap as soon as they were confident their enemy was beaten and they wouldnt batter an eyelid when nos HC came crying because the compassion nos lacked for their allies, would remove any remorse eX would have for dropping your nap.

Anyway, I think Nos HC are just idiots and the replys to this thread have just confirmed this:/

I didn't realise NoS had to be responsible for ensuring eX and ANgels didn't win the round. Thanks for opening my eyes to this.......

Our members ave had fun playing in NoS. Many wanted roids yes, but equally NoS wanted some payback and members wanted to do something useful. Attacking eX night after night was a long hard slog, but they did it, but when you are attacking someone who you know isn't your target whats the point? When NoS started attacking wp/hr morale lifted and the teamwork and selflessness was great. Sometimes a war for roids is the right one (if you am on winning the round), for NoS this was always a consolidation round and they attained the targets they set themselves,

NoS HC I am sure will be upset at you for starting a thread which has probably prompted some of the harder replies. You cast the first stone with this one sethy so saying that they are idiots just doesn't help the situation.

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

Nos = In Denial.

Why are NoS in denial? They set themselves targets and they worked towards those targets.

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

There were few allies this round who received as much incomings as HR did (consistantly). Even when we knew nos/angels were hitting us, we understood that eX block was still the major problem & if HR and its allies could overcome that, then the likes of nos/angels could be picked off easier. You can quiz 1up/Nd about this, man there was so many times i pmed them saying "omg nos are taking the p1ss - drop your nap & lets f#ck them" but they kept the nap.

And we kept our focus on ex/ lch with the rest and as most HCs knew pre-round, attrition killed us off. But your comment and a few previous ones that imply Nos took out hr/ wp easy is comic tbh, there are only 2 allies this round HR would struggle 1 on 1 with and Nos wasnt one of them. (yes thats such a hypothetical remark but one i believe in)

Most allies had lots of incommings. NoS had loads - I constantly had 250k xan whenever I got above 1k roids, but its how you handle those incomming. Yu didn't handle the incommings well. I have seen NoS members lose 1k of roids a night, but they still 3 fleet attacked every night. Thats the true strebgth f an alliance when members go "hey is only roids gimme another target please "

Thats why the top alliances stayed in the upper echelons and why Angels come back - A never say die attitude and the ability to gain roids. Its easy saying it was this and that, but at the end of the day if members give up its the bc's and hc's that take responsibility.

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

Only because it would conflict with your eX-nap & HR/Wp targetting. You could have taken that moment to drop eX relations and stand by your allies (as thats what allies are supposed to do) but instead you sat on the fence.

See you are wrong. NoS found out about the wp/hr nap and as soon as they did they started looking at alternatives. As someone that helped in the process of napping eX I say I should now who napped who first.

Our allies (ND in particulary) gave cin a very hard time around the time Dingo had to go on a trip to Melbourne. At that point it wasn't unlikely that NoS due to their reticence to attack eX would have been kicked. You talk about allis like they were so supportive and loving towards NoS - the truth is ego and a dislike of the fact that Dingo and NoS did not want to be puppets made working in the block hard and at some points untenable.

Its ok saying NoS are the bad guys, but relationships are a 2 way communication process, not one.

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

Your telling me your members didnt want to war against eX/ Lch et al? With eX being the fattest & most active roiders who had likely stolen a sh1t load of Nos roids? Anyways, check out your own ideology of fluid politics for this one.

Yes I am telling yu they were fed up of attacking that block. night after night it got harder and harder. Members wanted some fun and to attack someone mre on there level so wp/hr as a joint block were the right target for NoS. And it worked. We retained more roids after doing that then before. So go figure ;p

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

I think most can guarantee, Nos wont enjoy their next round :P

Guarantee eh? WOW! Big words in a space game ;p

At the end of the da it will take more than losing a few roids to stop NoS enjoying the game. And I am sure if you think NoS will be down there I am sure Dingo will make sure the aggressors are down there too. What goes around comes around sethy

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

"a few more weeks" hehe, u make it sound so easy;D

Our own inability lol? Thats such a poor throw away comment tbh. Inability how? in what way? Explain pls:P

It really is "that simple". People make PA sound so hard, but teh reality is when yu get enough fleet and roids that you can cover def and do attacks you have done enough to contest one of the upper alliance places. The skill is using military prowess and politics to get you into that position in the first place.

Your inability was keeping members active, your inability was bad political choices at the wrong point in the rounds. And your inability was not ensuring a 3 way battle for the winning places.

Your rol shud have been that of a third block like FOS round 6. But you realy didn't have the personnel or the political prowess to pull it off.

Originally Posted by Seth Mace

Looking back on this thread, whats clear for me is I wouldnt have written it if Nos finished 3rd and the 1up block won. Basically, the 1up block was being owned so much (and hr/wp could see what was gonna happen next - death by eX for the rest), that we had to step in and basically fill the spot that should have been taken by Nos.

Nos sacrificied their allies (something that is always going to get flamed here) and you seem to think thats ok because "they had planned this pre-round". Thats the crux of your backstabbing justification but "why are nos the backstabbers & not 1up/nd for supporting nos vs hr/wp war" i hear you say?

Again, for the 3rd time i write this, Nos were NOT being owned by their targets - because their targets weren't fighting back (partly because we didnt consider nos a threat & partly because eX were more dangerous).

You can bet your collection of naps that 1up/nd would have ended their ex war if their enemey was no longer a threat & Nos was being owned by hr/wp. And there was a long period of time when hr/wp were beaten by the overwhelming incomings & nos stood by and STILL let their allies get shat on.

NoS wanted you, and its fine tryng to say "hey we are the knights in shining armour" but what and how you did it is irrelevent. What you did was too little too late anyway. the truth is though that NoS never really left nor did it abandon its allies. NoS went on to do what it wanted to do at the start of the round.

You seem to think it as all nice and cosy with 1up and nd and that they shuld have stayed and duked ut out, but it wasn't. NoS didn't want to abandon them, but at the end of the day they wanted to make sure there pre round goal was at least partially complete.

As for NoS not being targetted thats codswallop too. e had several HR/Wp attacks every night after and before they started targetting you. get over your own denial ;p

at the end of the day its a game, a fun game. Its not life and death and its definitely not something that requires many idle threats. Its a space game which is really fun to play, but only wen you get over yur own shortfalls and stop blaming others

[Alki]

Originally Posted by peon

whine

Originally Posted by another peon

counter whine

Originally Posted by peon

counter-counter whine

Originally Posted by another peon

fu

[Kargool]

Lets face it everyone, this discussion will not get any better with the extra posts, just be a throw up of old arguments allready posted here. One thing is for certain, that is that NoS finished third this round. Angels finished second and eXilition finished first. Now, eXilition knows that if they play another round (round 14 that is) they will be hit alot from the start of the round. They choose not to do it. Angels are second, and so they also should be considered as a possible winner for round 14. Infact, if I actually betted on anything else but the FA-Cup Finals I would have betted a £5 that Angels will win next round.

Everyone has clearly stated that they think NoS sucks, NoS isnt any good in attacks, NoS isnt any good in defence, NoS isnt well organised. Why hit NoS then? Because of grudges? Well, if thats the thing, I think everyone should stop calling us grudgehunters and look what they are planning for next round. Grudges against NoS.

Now, it comes a day when a person needs to stand up for what he think is right, and what he thinks is important. I have thought alot about what I feel is important in this discussion, but all I see is alot of people hurt over decisions made, then I TBH would ask this question. Why the dissapointment? It is a wargame, in war naps are made, naps are broken etc. 1up and ND seems to be wanting EVERYONE else to adapt their style of playing, by making powerblocks. NoS made a clear statement this round that WE will NOT accept powerblocking. Yes, we may have napped both sides, but it was only to ensure that our players would have had a fun round, and ALL the present NoS members who have voiced their opinion with me has clearly stated that they are satisfied. I for once would LOVE to see PA without 1up and ND's Powerblock politics, wich is alot more disgraceful in my opinion than playing for our own members as what NoS wanted. 1up and ND's constant search for a good side and a bad side in this game comfuses me. Because it's just a GAME. The players play this because we want to have fun. Not to train in halfmilitaristic organisations talking like the other players in the game was our bitter enemies. I have had lots of fun with alot of different players especially in my own Galaxy this round (Hi Vargon and Highlander) both who were in WP and was hostile towards NoS. But we eventually lived to accept it, and I now dare to call them both my friends because we all shared the expirience of playing Planetarion together..

This round I have had people giving me orders, not the HC but MC's etc, and I said it right to their face, if people start talking about orders and duty and all that crap, im gone faster than a hookers clothing on a saturdaynight (pardon to all females reading this)

Now you may be asking yourself what i want with this, and my conclusion is this. NoS played for ourselves this round, but still we respected the naps we had. Every single one of them, I personally called NoS members (Hi Fazer) and sms'sd a bunch of them to get them to recall and pull def's etc etc. In the end that is what a Nap is about. Who we choose to target was our own buisness, and I hope, and recon we can do the same next round. If our targets for next round is the same as anohter alliance, well, then I would say Hoody HOO and lets have some fun.

(this is my last post in this discussion, to continue the discussion, or ask me about anything, please see me on mIRC)

[lokken]

I think it's pretty easy to see that politics polarisation had occurred before the first tick and that Exilition and allies would be taking on 1up and allies.

NoS merely set out to capitalise upon it. Whether it's right or wrong to do so is up to who they made agreements with - if they had done something horrific, no doubt their agreement would have been terminated. While it was good for them in the short term, whether it'll be good for NoS in future rounds will probably be found out sooner or later. Every alliance has the right to act in its own self interest, it's just whether they are too selfish to get away with it for so long that matters. Zo0f's post is one particular case in point.

I have no problem with NoS's tactics, because ultimately they finished higher than many alliances who are quite frankly a good deal better than them, which is a fantastic result for any alliance. Whether them giving us full exposure of their thoughts on the issue and the full breakdown of their strategy is wise considering what some of them have written down here while trying to divert the flak and anger away from themselves is entirely open to question however. I have an opinion on what perils were the greater in all this, but it is as good as ancient history now and I'm looking forward to a hopefully open round 14.

[lokken]

Good god Alki just won AD.

[furball]

Originally Posted by Rumad

Why are NoS in denial? They set themselves targets and they worked towards those targets.

So if 1up decided next round that its biggest problem had been APA, and successfully went out and twatted it while ignoring the rest of the universe, it would also have a successful round? After all, they would have set themselves a target, worked towards it and achieved it. Then if 1up claimed that they had fully earned their high finish, would it be right?

Originally Posted by Rumad

Most allies had lots of incommings. NoS had loads - I constantly had 250k xan whenever I got above 1k roids, but its how you handle those incomming.

My heart bleeds for you. eXilition, LCH, ToT, 1up and SiNND all had incomings far beyond those of NoS.

Originally Posted by Rumad

Yu didn't handle the incommings well. I have seen NoS members lose 1k of roids a night, but they still 3 fleet attacked every night. Thats the true strebgth f an alliance when members go "hey is only roids gimme another target please "

And NoS' defensive frailties are explained in one fell swoop. Do you seriously allow members to 3-fleet attack? free oids for us next round

Originally Posted by Rumad

Yes I am telling yu they were fed up of attacking that block. night after night it got harder and harder. Members wanted some fun and to attack someone mre on there level so wp/hr as a joint block were the right target for NoS. And it worked. We retained more roids after doing that then before. So go figure ;p

We still managed to aim for the eX block for almost all of the round, until a last couple of weeks where they had really pulled away. Funny how one of the continuous patterns throughout this thread has been that NoS don't like a challenge. You NAP half the universe, you hit smaller alliances and you avoid the alliances that do retals on your members.

You retained more roids? No shit. I'd be very worried if you hadn't. But every eX roid that Vengeance players took had far far more hard work and graft in it than your attempts to take ours.

Originally Posted by Rumad

Guarantee eh? WOW! Big words in a space game ;p

Somehow I doubt that NoS will find it with as many allies next round. Since your members 3-fleet attack and don't seem to be able to cover calls particularly well (despite NAPing the majority of big players in the universe)....you may find things a little tricky.

Originally Posted by Rumad

Your inability was keeping members active, your inability was bad political choices at the wrong point in the rounds. And your inability was not ensuring a 3 way battle for the winning places.

Your rol shud have been that of a third block like FOS round 6. But you realy didn't have the personnel or the political prowess to pull it off.

Yes, it could have turned out like that. At the beginning of the round, that was how it was going to be. But events forced our hand, and so we (HR/WP/VGN) allied with the '1up block' in order to focus all of our attacks on eXilition and friends. Since the main competition for the number 1 spot was between WP and eXilition (by the time we allied), and 1up/ND were hitting eXilition almost exclusively, the events that followed should make perfect sense.

[Alki]

Originally Posted by lokken

Good god Alki just won AD.

I aim to please;D

[Cannon_Fodder]

Originally Posted by helikopter

'1up begged' ' 1up and its muppets' 'other assorted crap'

It's these types of posts that mean I will never say congratulations to eX.





Plus what alki said.

[Rumad]

Originally Posted by furball

PILE OF POO

You see you take things out of context. 1up want to win the round and they play to win the round. There biggest threat this round was eXilition and allies. I am sure unless APA are in the opposing blck APA will not be the focus of 1up's round. Thanks for taking it out of context though

As for nos yes it did allow members to attack with 3 fleets. Mostly though (me included when i was in 3 lfeet mode) those members did not burden nos by asking for defence.

Also when you are attacked its nt profitable to sit and defend rocks. Are you seriously suggesting that is what your alliance did? Hardly the best policy this round,

As for defensive frailties I knw to not 1 alliance which has NOT struggled defensively this round. Get over your egoiste reply and realise no one is any better.

I finished the round with 300 roids and about 6 million score. I bet that was better than your memberaverage no? Who is to say that the 3 fleet principle is wrong wnen a player (in all out attacking mode) can get a higher average than most alliances.

You seema bit of a newb so i will throw you a clue. This round was about attacking. Nothing more nothing less. he who attacks most wins rodders.

[JonnyBGood]

Actually this round, as all are, was about correct fleet usage. This particular round leaned more towards the offensive than defensive aspect of fleet usage however I'd dare say that exilition defended each other. If you want to try and play as an individual go for it and do whatever you want (I did it!) but if you're playing with and for an alliance three-fleeting is not the way to go as you add very little to your alliance. Eighty odd three-fleeters would never win a round.

[Nadar]

NoSsers were allowed to attack with three fleets at end of round, not the whole round. That was simply about gaining as much score/XP as possible before round shut down. We had the 'attack and give a shit about roidloss'-thoughts at the end.

[DrunkenViking]

lol, can ppl not knowing anything about how NoS played its military stop commenting on how NoS played its military? Jezz, funny bunch.

As for 3-fleeting. At times we allowed it, at times we didnt. Depended a bit on how the incs were. 3-fleeting isnt something we send our members out to do on random ppl, but selected targets in coordinated attacks. Also using the last def-fleets for fleetcatching and counters. So it did help the alliance. And it helped the low-value none-ziks to obtain a descent score and fun through XP. Not that many 3-fleeted anyway, not many at all. Tho this is very much a none-discussion :P Rather a discussion for NoS mil-command Glad to see you all care so much for what happends inside NoS tho You must really wub us

[Cannon_Fodder]

Originally Posted by Rumad

I finished the round with 300 roids and about 6 million score. I bet that was better than your memberaverage no?

Most alliances didnt have that average. I could explain why taking one score out of a group is not a fair reflection, but you might not understand averages, so I will just reply with: i was cath, and i had more roids and score than you, and I always keep to the DP/night requirement and never 3 fleeted.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Nadar

NoSsers were allowed to attack with three fleets at end of round, not the whole round. That was simply about gaining as much score/XP as possible before round shut down. We had the 'attack and give a shit about roidloss'-thoughts at the end.

Apologies for my assumptions then but rumad's post contains no reference to any "late-round strategy", rather he seemed to be talking about the whole round.

Originally Posted by DrunkenViking

Glad to see you all care so much for what happends inside NoS tho You must really wub us

Yeah who would have thought that a forum called alliance discussions would contain discussion about alliances.