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Unread 1 Aug 2017, 17:27   #1
BloodyButcher
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R73 whine thread.

So who winning?
Heard Apprime showing up with 150 cousins this round, so im supporting CarDi to #1 this round.
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Unread 1 Aug 2017, 17:38   #2
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Re: R73 whine thread.

ultra defensive round and already blocks and naps set up.. shamefull repeat of r70
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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 10:29   #3
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Unfortunately I agree. Was busy all summer so didn't have time to come with any input, so can't really complain. But this looks like one of the most boring stats sets in a long long time
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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 16:09   #4
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Re: R73 whine thread.

is there any new/returning alliances playing next round apart from forests?
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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 17:01   #5
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Norseless
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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 17:45   #6
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 18:14   #7
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Re: R73 whine thread.

forest isn't playing, getting married in Jamaica
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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 19:33   #8
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by [DDK]gm View Post
forest isn't playing, getting married in Jamaica
i didn't think he would follow through with it
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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 20:05   #9
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by [DDK]gm View Post
ultra defensive round and already blocks and naps set up.. shamefull repeat of r70
only the new quests make me play tbh

good move implementing those!

stats are way too defensive sadly and politics, ya well....same as usual
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Unread 3 Aug 2017, 20:39   #10
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Re: R73 whine thread.

p3nguins won't be playing for the win. But happy to ruin others rounds. If you wish for us to be on your side and helping you to achieve a win yourself we are happy to support.

Troll all you want. The statement has been made Our contact details are in my sig.
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 12:55   #11
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Gl all, p3n, escort me!
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 15:17   #12
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Ill escort you to Jamaica Forest
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 15:32   #13
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Re: R73 whine thread.

lol
think im already escorted there
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 22:51   #14
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Re: R73 whine thread.

congrats demort, 2 tags, 100 players, and you dont hoard players??? ;p
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 23:07   #15
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by [DDK]gm View Post
congrats demort, 2 tags, 100 players, and you dont hoard players??? ;p
Yeah this whole 2 tag thing is getting out of hand, how can you be proud of winning a round if you have double the players the alliance behind you has, its not cheating but its close enough to it.
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 23:13   #16
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Re: R73 whine thread.

you would of thought that kittenz would of drew the line at 80 players, but no ;p
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 23:14   #17
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Little bit late to complain about dual tags.
Ult been doing it for a while. App also got two tags.
Should give em credit for aggressive recruitment policy.
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 23:15   #18
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Re: R73 whine thread.

been complaining for a while but its out of hand now, there is a difference between small support tags of 10-15 players and a hole other allaince tag
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Unread 4 Aug 2017, 23:23   #19
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by [DDK]gm View Post
been complaining for a while but its out of hand now, there is a difference between small support tags of 10-15 players and a hole other allaince tag
Ultores has been 80-90 planets for several rounds.
The tag limits been too low for years, wich has leaded to this situation.
There is nothing stopping smaller allies from commiting to work together to make the odds more even, but usualy its stopped by noone willing to commit to working with another small tag.
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 11:51   #20
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by [DDK]gm View Post
congrats demort, 2 tags, 100 players, and you dont hoard players??? ;p
What is 'hoarding players'? Are these not people who are free to make their own choices? Demort is not some kind of slave master, trapping players in alliances they don't want to be in.

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The tag limits been too low for years, wich has leaded to this situation.
Low tag limits have resulted in alliances recruiting enough people for 2 tags? How does that even work?
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 12:40   #21
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
Low tag limits have resulted in alliances recruiting enough people for 2 tags? How does that even work?
No room for inactives, no room for expanding the memberbase, whatever.
If one tag has a 2nd tag, the rest has to have it to compete.
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 13:10   #22
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
If one tag has a 2nd tag, the rest has to have it to compete.
I'm not sure if I'm reading you correctly. Are you saying that 'low' tag limits result in alliances recruiting more than if the tag limits higher than they are now?
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"And THEN," Mary was yelling and stomping up and down, "I'm going to take all the tiny little pieces of your body left over from the explosions and I'm going to put them in a bag and then I will throw it in the ocean so SHARKS will eat them! And then do you know what I'll be doing?" he screamed. "I... will... be... LAUGHING." He giggled. "AT YOU!" he added.
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 13:16   #23
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
I'm not sure if I'm reading you correctly. Are you saying that 'low' tag limits result in alliances recruiting more than if the tag limits higher than they are now?
Yes
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 14:07   #24
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Yes
You heard it here first folks. Alliances recruit more if tags are smaller!
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"And THEN," Mary was yelling and stomping up and down, "I'm going to take all the tiny little pieces of your body left over from the explosions and I'm going to put them in a bag and then I will throw it in the ocean so SHARKS will eat them! And then do you know what I'll be doing?" he screamed. "I... will... be... LAUGHING." He giggled. "AT YOU!" he added.
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 15:00   #25
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Re: R73 whine thread.

To be fair to BB, he has long being saying we need larger tags, and it is appearing now his lone voice was correct.

You just sound a bit bullying there Mzy
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 16:21   #26
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest View Post
To be fair to BB, he has long being saying we need larger tags, and it is appearing now his lone voice was correct.

You just sound a bit bullying there Mzy
Actually no, Bitcher said that small tags didn't work because no enough people could run them. Yet we are getting more recruitment and overspill tags forming and lots of people running them and new people trying stuff and old people returning to run stuff.

Using Kittenz and it's overspill as an example, it's a very two tiered system. The calibre of players in the overspill is lower and needs different politics and naps/allies accordingly. Although Katz will always aid Kittenz it may be possible to lock out the picture if as Kittenz rival you get your naps right. If it was 1 giant 120 person tag you couldn't do this and politics would be stale AF.
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 17:30   #27
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Little bit late to complain about dual tags.
Ult been doing it for a while. App also got two tags.
Should give em credit for aggressive recruitment policy.
Ultores doesn't have two full tags. Ast is like 30 members. This round it's barely even 10.
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 18:10   #28
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest View Post
To be fair to BB, he has long being saying we need larger tags, and it is appearing now his lone voice was correct.
Really? This series of posts was started by a complaints that all these large support tags are a problem because they make it harder and harder for standard 60-man alliances to win. You're saying Butcher is correct when he says tags should be even bigger than they are now. Could you explain how the situation is improved when we allow Ultores to merge with Astatores and KittenZ with CatZ and Apprime with whatever their support tag is?

Because at this point, and I want to stress I'm not being sarcastic for effect, but I genuinely can't see how that would work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest View Post
You just sound a bit bullying there Mzy
I was honestly a little surprised Butcher took a statement that I had specifically crafted to be contradictory in order to point out the flaw in his argument, and then went ahead and agreed with it. I ran out of ideas what to do with that other than highlighting it as something to read twice.
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"And THEN," Mary was yelling and stomping up and down, "I'm going to take all the tiny little pieces of your body left over from the explosions and I'm going to put them in a bag and then I will throw it in the ocean so SHARKS will eat them! And then do you know what I'll be doing?" he screamed. "I... will... be... LAUGHING." He giggled. "AT YOU!" he added.
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Unread 5 Aug 2017, 18:31   #29
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
Really? This series of posts was started by a complaints that all these large support tags are a problem because they make it harder and harder for standard 60-man alliances to win. You're saying Butcher is correct when he says tags should be even bigger than they are now. Could you explain how the situation is improved when we allow Ultores to merge with Astatores and KittenZ with CatZ and Apprime with whatever their support tag is?

Because at this point, and I want to stress I'm not being sarcastic for effect, but I genuinely can't see how that would work.
The arguments thats been given by Ultores in the past is that they have too many "core players" to fit in tag, and instead of having em go "spy on other" tags etc, theyve decided to create a 2nd tag wich allows their players to play with the community.
Looking at past rounds, before the tag limit cut, Ultores were around 50-70 players, so i dont think the argument that Ultores will just fill up their tag and create a new support tag is valid(even though it could happend).

Many tags thats been "high caliber" on paper has usualy eaten themself up from the inside because of clashing personalties, and this is more likely to happend for bigger tags than smaller tags as the chance of having more CBA`s, or Joseph`s, or whatever in those tags.



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I was honestly a little surprised Butcher took a statement that I had specifically crafted to be contradictory in order to point out the flaw in his argument, and then went ahead and agreed with it. I ran out of ideas what to do with that other than highlighting it as something to read twice.
Quite honestly i did not read your post throughly, i thought you asked if i belived the new meta of "2nd tags" has increased the recruitment activity in tags like Ult/App/KittenZ.
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Unread 6 Aug 2017, 09:52   #30
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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p3nguins won't be playing for the win. But happy to ruin others rounds. If you wish for us to be on your side and helping you to achieve a win yourself we are happy to support.

Troll all you want. The statement has been made Our contact details are in my sig.
Same as other rounds then?
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Unread 8 Aug 2017, 06:03   #31
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Re: R73 whine thread.

So I hoard players when we actively recruit outside of pa as I've always said feel free to ask them to join you
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Unread 8 Aug 2017, 07:25   #32
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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So I hoard players when we actively recruit outside of pa as I've always said feel free to ask them to join you
Guess some will get pissed if you approached their players to join what is your support tag/main tag/whatever.
I wouldnt, its just natural that players switch alliances these days, and its not like Ultores/ND/CT/etc isnt trying to recruit players from other tags aswell.
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Unread 9 Aug 2017, 01:57   #33
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Guess some will get pissed if you approached their players to join what is your support tag/main tag/whatever.
I wouldnt, its just natural that players switch alliances these days, and its not like Ultores/ND/CT/etc isnt trying to recruit players from other tags aswell.
What support tag?
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Unread 9 Aug 2017, 17:21   #34
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Ave View Post
What support tag?
KittenZ support tag, LionZ, Ultores support tag, do i need to go on or are you just acting stupid?
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 04:15   #35
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Re: R73 whine thread.

I am obviously acting stupid and we have no support tag.
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 11:54   #36
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Re: R73 whine thread.

no they just have 2 tags so they can force politics
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 12:09   #37
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by [DDK]gm View Post
no they just have 2 tags so they can force politics
Well this is a question on how you define a support tag.
Well over 50% of all fleets CatZ sent last round was sent to KittenZ, more than CatZ sent to their own planets.
Meanwhile, under 10% of the fleets KittenZ sent last round was sent to CatZ planets.

So they happend to have 2 tags, where one is much better at defending the "sister tag" than the other.

Not that i got anything specificly against this way of playing, as its what the game is enforcing upon the community with having the tag limits as low as they are today.
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 12:44   #38
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Oh please, tag limit is higher than your IQ already.
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 13:37   #39
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Oh please, tag limit is higher than your IQ already.
Guess ur one of those thats "pro support tags" or "pro sister tags" then.
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 14:22   #40
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Guess ur one of those thats "pro support tags" or "pro sister tags" then.
What's the difference 60 man Kittenz1 and 50 man Kittenz2 vs 60 man Ultores1 and 50 man Ultores2 and 120 Kittenz vs 120 Ultores?

You complain about support tags when in reality the lower tag limits are the only thing keeping the game alive. Do you really think allowing agar3s access to 360 ally ETA def fleets in an active ult round would be good for the game? The +1 support tag defence keeps in check the usefulness of such a plan and if the likes of Ult or App were given access to 60 more ally spots each then they would gather up every active player going in 2-3 rounds and then just nap and chill.
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 15:00   #41
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Kaiba View Post
What's the difference 60 man Kittenz1 and 50 man Kittenz2 vs 60 man Ultores1 and 50 man Ultores2 and 120 Kittenz vs 120 Ultores?

You complain about support tags when in reality the lower tag limits are the only thing keeping the game alive. Do you really think allowing agar3s access to 360 ally ETA def fleets in an active ult round would be good for the game? The +1 support tag defence keeps in check the usefulness of such a plan and if the likes of Ult or App were given access to 60 more ally spots each then they would gather up every active player going in 2-3 rounds and then just nap and chill.
Well there is a lot difference.
Its called the "bandwagon" effect, cba to explain it to you, as im sure its been dicussed xxxxx times allready.
Also, having 40/60 planets scoring means that even with 10-20 planets in a support tag you will have MORE planets that has a crazy "1 ship build" and that dont care about crashing their fleet as long as lose some aswell.
The other round i had 5 or 6 waves of incs from "Astatores", all of em "covered" wich meant the attacker to big losses, way more than defence, still they all landed cus they dont give a damn.
The moronic changes to the tag limits over the 30 rounds is changing how the game is played, and its not changing it in a direction wich i think is positive.
Historicly, Ultores never had a lot of players, theyve always been around the same member count they are right now, a little less actualy.
And who is talking about making tag limits 120+ anyway?
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 16:11   #42
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Ave View Post
I am obviously acting stupid and we have no support tag.
* Now talking in #KittenZ
* Topic is 'KittenZ / LionZ Public Channel
Set by Avenger on Mon Aug 07 20:16:00 2017

2 tags, 1 main tag, 1 support tag
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 17:09   #43
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Well there is a lot difference.
Its called the "bandwagon" effect, cba to explain it to you, as im sure its been dicussed xxxxx times allready.
Also, having 40/60 planets scoring means that even with 10-20 planets in a support tag you will have MORE planets that has a crazy "1 ship build" and that dont care about crashing their fleet as long as lose some aswell.
The other round i had 5 or 6 waves of incs from "Astatores", all of em "covered" wich meant the attacker to big losses, way more than defence, still they all landed cus they dont give a damn.
The moronic changes to the tag limits over the 30 rounds is changing how the game is played, and its not changing it in a direction wich i think is positive.
Historicly, Ultores never had a lot of players, theyve always been around the same member count they are right now, a little less actualy.
And who is talking about making tag limits 120+ anyway?
So you can't be bothered to explain the core reason of your argument?

Nothing was said about counting/uncounting, that's a completely different kettle of fish.

So all this is based on an element which has moved by 10-20 members in 30+ rounds? (Kittenz would still have Lionz with round 40 limits)

Astaores style of play is no different to any other uncompeting alliance around tick 800, just because they are affiliated with Ultores does not make them different to any of the plethora of tags that have done the same since rd1.

You have no clue of Ulrores memberbase, you never played there and no one in there would talk to you on a personal enough level to give that info away.

If we have two tags with 60 + 50 you would alreast need a tag limit of 100-120 to stop support tags otherwise nothing would change
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 20:32   #44
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by BloodyButcher View Post
Well this is a question on how you define a support tag.
Well over 50% of all fleets CatZ sent last round was sent to KittenZ, more than CatZ sent to their own planets.
Meanwhile, under 10% of the fleets KittenZ sent last round was sent to CatZ planets.

So they happend to have 2 tags, where one is much better at defending the "sister tag" than the other.

Not that i got anything specificly against this way of playing, as its what the game is enforcing upon the community with having the tag limits as low as they are today.
I wonder where do you get those numbers from...

To be quite honest, we played separated most of the last round due to fang politics, which stopped us acting as a one. Until we had to leave for that particular reason. Without the obvious KittenZ relation, the merger would have been pretty nice with fangs def oriented thinking and our attack hungry people. Sadly the politics messed it up.

We only deffed KittenZ the last (couple) hundred ticks, when they had a clear shot for the win, while our 20 man tag obviously didn't. Still there were a solid few finishing top 100. Prolly would have been closer to t50 without changing priorities.

I don't know what supportive formation you do find from a tag full of solid teamplayers and some main figures of the alliance.

We don't have minions to do dirty work for us, so I rather create our own luck.
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 20:40   #45
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Adapt View Post
* Now talking in #KittenZ
* Topic is 'KittenZ / LionZ Public Channel
Set by Avenger on Mon Aug 07 20:16:00 2017

2 tags, 1 main tag, 1 support tag
If I typed them in different order, would it be other way around then?
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 21:03   #46
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Re: R73 whine thread.

Code:
Rank	Name
2	KittenZ
7	LionZ
Ave, are you being intentionally dense?
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 21:39   #47
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk View Post
Code:
Rank	Name
2	KittenZ
7	LionZ
Ave, are you being intentionally dense?
8 FAnG 14,720 60 5,745 377,983 15,119,357
9 Apprime 14,285 60 4,561 343,975 13,759,009

Apprime a support tag too?

e. and ofc its intentional.
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Unread 10 Aug 2017, 23:12   #48
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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Originally Posted by Ave View Post
8 FAnG 14,720 60 5,745 377,983 15,119,357
9 Apprime 14,285 60 4,561 343,975 13,759,009

Apprime a support tag too?

e. and ofc its intentional.
No, there is only 2 alliances with support tags, your alliance and ultores, no others.
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Unread 11 Aug 2017, 00:16   #49
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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No, there is only 2 alliances with support tags, your alliance and ultores, no others.
I thought CT was commonly accepted as NDs support tag?

Illuminati works for App and FanG is full of Bows now so it will support VGN or p3n

Everyone has support tag.
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Unread 11 Aug 2017, 01:16   #50
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Re: R73 whine thread.

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I thought CT was commonly accepted as NDs support tag?

Illuminati works for App and FanG is full of Bows now so it will support VGN or p3n

Everyone has support tag.

Maybe Illuminati are close with Apprime but Illuminati are there own tag and have no intention of supporting Apprime as Apprime are playing a chilled round

And as for FAnG between 9 and 12 of the players are former bows and im not to sure that the whole 9 - 12 of them would have the influence politically to make decisions regarding relations.

Anyway were not talking about alliances that are napped/allied or have been friendly in the past were talking about an alliance having a 2nd tag controlled by the main tag
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