Planetarion Forums

Deffeh · 8 Feb 2004, 01:20

.. is probably in deep shit.

Heres the deal. He's 17, and it was someones 18th just last night. He wanted to come, so he "modified" his provisional. Changed the DOB and re-laminated the card.

As it happened, he didnt get ID'ed and everything went smooth.

But, we then wanted to go to the strathclyde union afterwards. They took a look at the ID and didnt like it. The guy took his gloves off and ran his finger over it and said "its been modified, hasnt it?". My mate denied it for a while, but then admitted it. They took the card off him, confiscated it, and first of all mentioned sending it back to him, then sending it to the police. We went on our way

(By the way, im not an idiot. You dont know how many times i told him what a ****ing stupid idea it was. You also dont realise that he was already hammered, my other mate who was going to sign us in was already hammered, and despite drinking since quarter past 4, i had developed a temporary immunity to drink. Plus we were all knackered and just wanted to go to bed.)

Now, he phoned them up and theyve supposedly sent the card off to the DVLA. What, good people of GD, is going to happen to him / the card / his license to drive / his chances of getting a successful application to Strathclyde Uni (his first choice) ?

Feel free to call him a ****ing idiot all you like, i know i have. He's even more stubborn than me - well, ok, thats not possible - but he does things against what people say ALL the time just to see if he can prove them wrong. For example, today, after i told him trying to plug a second controller into my old snes whilst i was playing would freeze my game, he said "nah it wont" and did it anyway. Of course it ****ing froze.

But if any of you know whats likely to happen, let me know

MrL_JaKiri · 8 Feb 2004, 01:24

How do you keep the natives off the booze long enough to get them through the test?

Deffeh · 8 Feb 2004, 01:27

No going off topic you fool, i want an answer.

BeeKiller · 8 Feb 2004, 01:29

I'm not sure exactly what may happen to him in terms of whether or not he can get another driving license or not, but it's possible that he might get accused of fraud or something similar, which if he does would be a criminal offence which he'd need to inform his uni that he had would he not? This is just a guess though, i'm no laywer!

MrPeach · 8 Feb 2004, 01:31

Well personally i would deny all knowledge of it.

I would tell them that I lost the card a couple of weeks ago.

They are not going to take him to court over it.

queball · 8 Feb 2004, 01:32

I don't know the law or how this sort of thing is handled, but I really doubt it's anything serious. And I'm sure there's no possibility of it affecting his right to drive or uni application.

Ebany · 8 Feb 2004, 01:33

While I can't say anything for definite, I would hope that they wouldnt really pay that much attention. Just send back an undoctored version and maybe keep a note or something that theyve done it once. I'd hope they wouldn't do anything too major to a kid for forging ID once. But I'm not exactly that knowledgable on the subject, so this is just my opinion. It seems very mean to sopil a persons chances of driving or going to uni for a fairly normal attempt at underage drinking.

deerbarn · 8 Feb 2004, 01:36

Id say that was pretty major really

KraKto$is8 · 8 Feb 2004, 01:37

Unis don't like criminals. So if he gets a criminal record, he might be screwed. It depends.

MrPeach · 8 Feb 2004, 01:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by KraKto$is8

Unis don't like criminals. So if he gets a criminal record, he might be screwed. It depends.

I can't imagine any UK uni not letting someone in based on a criminal record.

And if they did they would probably get ****ed if it was proven.

Anyway, do you have to declare it on the UCAS application?

MrL_JaKiri · 8 Feb 2004, 01:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrPeach

I can't imagine any UK uni not letting someone in based on a criminal record.

And if they did they would probably get ****ed if it was proven.

Anyway, do you have to declare it on the UCAS application?

You DO have to declare it on the UCAS form, and I don't see why they would be ****ed if it was proven that they discriminated against people who broke the law; surely someone with a clean record would be preferred in an equal case, which unless he's an exceptional candidate (and from the sound of it he's not), there is GOING TO BE an equal, because of the enormous number of apps the unis get.

Baron Morte · 8 Feb 2004, 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by KraKto$is8

Unis don't like criminals. So if he gets a criminal record, he might be screwed. It depends.

Although i might disagree its common to use penal results to inflict administrative losses.

Deffeh · 8 Feb 2004, 02:15

See, forging a drivers license would get you in deep shit. Part of the point seems to me whether they report it as a card used to drink underage, or a forged license.

KraKto$is8 · 8 Feb 2004, 02:51

And then there's the whole drinking underage thing.

Dante Hicks · 8 Feb 2004, 03:10

Oh please, it's not going to affect his University application (unless they're incredibly anal).

It's no big deal, it happens all the time. Modifying a document so you can buy a drink isn't exactly major fraud.

btw : Do you actually have any evidence the ID has been sent back? I'd guess the guy merely said that to wind your friend up / scare him, etc.

deerbarn · 8 Feb 2004, 03:16

For me Birth Cert/ passport/ DVL are all official ID. Forging a passport would get you into major major shit, so why not forging a doccument that can be used for passport application?

queball · 8 Feb 2004, 03:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerbarn

For me Birth Cert/ passport/ DVL are all official ID. Forging a passport would get you into major major shit, so why not forging a doccument that can be used for passport application?

Because the country isn't run by boolean logic? Forging a passport wouldn't get you into major major shit if you just used it in a play, or to buy alcohol.

Dante Hicks · 8 Feb 2004, 03:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerbarn

For me Birth Cert/ passport/ DVL are all official ID. Forging a passport would get you into major major shit, so why not forging a doccument that can be used for passport application?

This is silly. The level of seriousness of fraud is entirely dependent on it's scale/nature.

deerbarn · 8 Feb 2004, 07:01

yeah, but the charge fraud would still carry a minimum sentence (if they decided to press) even though it may not be custodial it would rule one out of certain jobs.

meaple · 8 Feb 2004, 07:08

lol alcohol lol

the_dastardley_chihuahua · 8 Feb 2004, 08:55

few years ago one of my mates who looked about 15 when he was 17 'modified' his passport and got it taken off him and they sent it to the police. he got a letter asking him to go to the station to pick up his pasport, but he was shitting it so much that he didnt go for ages. anyway, the anti-climax of the story is that nothing happened :/

Deffeh · 8 Feb 2004, 10:57

thats a reassurance i guess.

Not that im too bothered. I rode out being 17 - oh it sucked, but i just didnt go to town, and i think he has to learn the same lesson

madi · 8 Feb 2004, 11:36

find out if the bouncer was legally allowed to remove your property
i would not allow someone to take my driving licence if the believed it to be modified or not

JonnyBGood · 8 Feb 2004, 16:48

Aye, he should have kept it/asked for it back. I doubt he's in any trouble anyways. If they prosecuted everyone in Ireland for using fake IDs to drink while underage there'd be a five mile queue outside the Four Courts.

skiddy · 8 Feb 2004, 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by madi

find out if the bouncer was legally allowed to remove your property
i would not allow someone to take my driving licence if the believed it to be modified or not

The 'bouncers' at Students Unions tend to be students of the university employed to stop trouble and ID. As you'll notice they don't have one of the yellow badges which is the telltale sign of a registered doorman, thus other than giving them the right to remove you from university property and to some extend hold persons until law enforcement authorities arrive, they have no powers to confiscate items.

This being said, I'd recommend your friend ride it out. Likely result will be the DVLA will send out a new licence, charging your friend for the replacement, which is about £15 I believe.

If the Police had caught him, or a registered doorman then the police would likely have been informed and your friend may have spent the night in the cells but unlikely anything else would have been done.

Ste · 9 Feb 2004, 12:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by skiddy

The 'bouncers' at Students Unions tend to be students of the university employed to stop trouble and ID.

Maybe at shit student unions but at mine they are all big scary blokes (except for the big scary women).

There's a law saying something about if you're a bouncer you must have the necessary license.

I wouldn't let another student eject me from the union.

skiddy · 9 Feb 2004, 13:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ste

Maybe at shit student unions but at mine they are all big scary blokes (except for the big scary women).

Well, OK, maybe the shit ones including Newcastle, Northumbria, Durham, Liverpool, Cardiff and the few others I've been to which have had student's employed on the doors.

I actually posed this question last night to one of the lad's who drinks in the local - he used to do the doors at Newcastle Uni's Union - he confirmed that most Uni's have students on the doors to cut costs (as professional doormen cost around £10p/h and student's don't). He also confirmed that they have no power to confiscate items - nor do they have any power to hold people until police arrive (which I was wrong about) as they do not have any law enforcement powers the person being held can instantly have them charged with assault.

Apparently, but this sounds correct and he does know what he is talking about.

Evergreen · 9 Feb 2004, 15:50

DVLA can fine you upto 1000 pounds now (I don't have a pound key on these homo american keyboards.)

Given there recent attitude to just using a DB to screw you on your Road tax I wouldn't be surprised if they started cashing in on idiots who'll tamper with their licenses.

Ste · 9 Feb 2004, 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by skiddy

I actually posed this question last night to one of the lad's who drinks in the local - he used to do the doors at Newcastle Uni's Union - he confirmed that most Uni's have students on the doors to cut costs (as professional doormen cost around £10p/h and student's don't). He also confirmed that they have no power to confiscate items - nor do they have any power to hold people until police arrive (which I was wrong about) as they do not have any law enforcement powers the person being held can instantly have them charged with assault.

Apparently, but this sounds correct and he does know what he is talking about.

That sounds a bit more likely. Having no powers other than taking tickets/money on the door and generally being a lookout would probably be allowed.

More stuff probably kicks off in my union, although it is the biggest and best in the country

(according to the virgin alternative guide and every student thats ever visited!)