Discuss my terran fleet

[isildurx]

So ive been thinking on my terran fleet for a while and im too lazy to continue it in an old thread.

I reckon my terran fleet will look pretty much like this:


10% Harpy
40% Pegas
15% Syren
25% Wyvern
10% Pods and chims.


I will use the wyvs and pegs 4 attacking, syrens for ingal/cluster def, and harps 4 ally def.

Depending how my gal/cluster situation is i might make more make more syrens if worse para and more wyvs if my gal gets in a good para/cluster.

[EDIT] Will make more Pegas if the number of xans in theuni causes me big probs [/EDIT]

[Waku]

I think you will have more Harpies cause with 40% pegs and a 2:1 ratio(<-Example) you will get alot more Metal to spend on harpies

[Chax]

Odd fleet there, 10% pods and chims on one line suggest an FR roiding fleet, yet you're attacking with wyv and peg.

May I suggest including demeters in your build?

[Sun Pin]

Originally posted by Chax
Odd fleet there, 10% pods and chims on one line suggest an FR roiding fleet, yet you're attacking with wyv and peg.

May I suggest including demeters in your build?

i think that with pods he ment both a-pod and the demeter

[[GAP]Obiwan]

Originally posted by Sun Pin
i think that with pods he ment both a-pod and the demeter

WINNAR!

by the way IsildurX is a pretty good player, fleet looks lovely to me

/me arse licks islildur

[Prince]

what about later in game?
The Guardian is a formiable ship with its power bonus

[SYMM]

Terrans have nothing effective against either CR or BS.
Gryphons are *reasonable*, but are CO, and so not to be built.
Drakes are just abysmal, nothing more to be said.
Chimera's are a nice compromise. Able to stop the odd oppurtunistic CR/BS attack, but without putting resources into a ship that will lie dormant the rest of the time.
The main defence for a terran against CR/BS is, unfortunatley some may say, a Cathaar gal-mate

[Prince]

Dragons?
or don't you rate them as a ship?

[hyfe]

Originally posted by Prince
what about later in game?
The Guardian is a formiable ship with its power bonus

Take the losses or avoid the those targets. Killing everything seldom is an option anyways, and the number of people who are Guardian heavy enough for it to be really scary isn't that big.

you can't customize your fleet into cathering for everything

My personal opinion on the fleet though:
I'm not a great fan of building ships exclusevly for in-gal/cluster/para defence. This means either tying up a fleet slot exclusevly for these left-overs you produce, or have them rotting at home. Neither options are very attractive imo. So ships like Syrens are nice if you need to entrench yourself in a loosing war/bad cluster; but planning for it seems ineffiecent imo.

So...I'd skip the Syrens, produce less wyverns, and pump more into both harpies (for your friends) and pegasi (for you).

[SYMM]

Dragons are only very slightly less effective than Chimeras vs. CR and BS. I don't think the additional eta, with such a single-purpose ship, is worth any resources being spent on them.
Admittedly the Chimeras are firing vs. all, but a Cath CR/BS fleet (the main worry) is unlikely to contain anything else, and anything extra it does will either mean lower CR/BS numbers, or reduced cap.

[hyfe]

Originally posted by Prince
Dragons?
or don't you rate them as a ship?

arg. i'm posting too slow!

Building slow ships just to have them rot at home just in case isn't cost-effective. Attacking with them even more frustrating..

[black-eyed boy]

Originally posted by isildurx
I reckon my terran fleet will look pretty much like this:

10% Harpy
40% Pegas
15% Syren
25% Wyvern
10% Pods and chims.

Imho only 10% of your fleet to defend your alliancemates and friends is just a bit too few.

However I suspect you're a really good (read: top 100) player, so this isn't something for you to worry about

[Prince]

so thats a Terran fleet, anyone here care to suggest/debate the ideal Cath Zik and Xan Fleets?

[isildurx]

Indeed i ment mostly DE pods.


Im not too worried about CR attacks.

1. Not many caths build a big CR fleet.
2. My alliance|gal|friends will b able to arrive in my aid for most cruiser attacks.
3. Even with only a few % chims ill hopefully b able to take down quite a number of CRs (if the rnd og as i hope :P)

Also rmbr to take notice to the part about the % of wyvs and syrens, much depends on what kind of cluster/para situation u land in.

[mens]

here's my fleet from last round which I thought worked out pretty well (I haven't bothered with the %-wise cost thing so here's only the numbers in ships)

harpy 65k
gry 2k (dunno why)
pegs 12k
dem 500
wyvern 2500
dragon 500

If I go terran this round I'll build some chims aswell. They can come in handy as shield on attacks. Maybe I'll drop the dragons. They're powerful and great and never die and all, but maybe I'll be better off with more chimeras and pegs instead.

[Ants]

My terran fleet may look something like this

50% pegs
20% harpy
20% wyverns
10% dems

I aint thought about ratios at all, this is just off the top of my head but I'll trade m/c or add more harpy if needed. I may think about buying chims, but not till a point in the round when I dont need my fleet optimal to get roids.

[K-W]

Originally posted by hyfe
arg. i'm posting too slow!

Building slow ships just to have them rot at home just in case isn't cost-effective. Attacking with them even more frustrating..

Dragons are basically pds, and when looked at in that sense they are most definately worth building in a limited fashion. It makes you slightly less of a nice target for cr and bs fleets and makes it easier for you to be defended against them.

[K-W]

Originally posted by isildurx


10% Harpy
40% Pegas
15% Syren
25% Wyvern
10% Pods and chims.


I will use the wyvs and pegs 4 attacking, syrens for ingal/cluster def, and harps 4 ally def.

Dont build Syren. When your gal/cluster get attacked they will be happy taking your pegs and wyvern or your harpy def fleet. Unless you plan on leaving fleet spots open all the time very rarely are you going to be in situations where you can shuffle off your otherwise useless cr into the cluster to help out. I suppose if you are a very charitable player, and this is what you like then fine, but most players dont keep a cluster def fleet. Syrens are a nice ship on paper, but they are not useful for much of anything in the game. Im not number headed enough to look at the percentages, but take out the syren and youve got the right ships.

[Prince]

I'm going to say a ship name now and your all going to laugh

Centaur?

its fast quiet cheap and is effective vs co craft

no one likes them anymore? (i had a nice bunch last round for targeting vultures)

[K-W]

Youve already got a ton of pegasus, so no one is really thinking of trying to sneak co by you. Thats the main reason, terrans do not need another fi/co targetting ship. Nor do they need another frigate.

[Sun_Tzu]

call me an idiot but where are the hydras? cr-class thus flanked by both wyverns from the bs-cr-(de) targeting ships and by pegs from de-cs-(bs) targeting, and even if not flanked it's actually got a better armor than either of those. A decent kill rate, shoots at fr-first(atm you need to plow through de to get to them with the wyv) and I'd say it's an all-around nice thing to have...

[Ultimate Newbie]

Originally posted by Sun_Tzu
call me an idiot but where are the hydras? cr-class thus flanked by both wyverns from the bs-cr-(de) targeting ships and by pegs from de-cs-(bs) targeting, and even if not flanked it's actually got a better armor than either of those. A decent kill rate, shoots at fr-first(atm you need to plow through de to get to them with the wyv) and I'd say it's an all-around nice thing to have...

Syrens are ALOT better at killing the FR than the Hydra (or the Wyvern for that matter), and my experience with Hydra i have felt that they are actually a bit too weak to survive for long. in addition, they simply dont kill enough to make it worth having an extra class, especially one that is also targeted by your #2 ship (the Wyvern).

The hydra has a good ETA, however iirc.

[spectrum]

my experience (and i have never played terra!): biggest pro for centaurs is: their eta.
on defending against massive incomes against the gal, a terran (whos attacker did withdraw) can send them in at co-class-speed ingal. and they are effective vulture-stoppers (at least for killing the co-incoming on another planet ingal).
there where several times when i whished we had 1k of them ingal. (the 1tick faster than pegs can be VERY much in such hammering incoming waves)

[Sun_Tzu]

Originally posted by Ultimate Newbie
Syrens are ALOT better at killing the FR than the Hydra (or the Wyvern for that matter), and my experience with Hydra i have felt that they are actually a bit too weak to survive for long. in addition, they simply dont kill enough to make it worth having an extra class, especially one that is also targeted by your #2 ship (the Wyvern).

The hydra has a good ETA, however iirc.

The syrens isn't a valid choice for your attack-fleet since it's eta9, and now what do you do if you run into de+fr? with hydras(who have better armor than both pegs and wyvs and the vast majority of all ships in the game, especially of high-classes) you can target those fr and limit your losses. Besides, I've done very nicely leaving those wyvs at bay and attacking with pegs, dems and hydras, it's just a more compact formation...

[K-W]

Hydras are not useless, but wyverns are more durable and handle frigs too. There is just no need to pop the cr class in there. They can flak for De on some occasions, but it isnt worth the resource investment to build up a hydra fleet.

[Sun_Tzu]

Originally posted by K-W
Hydras are not useless, but wyverns are more durable and handle frigs too. There is just no need to pop the cr class in there. They can flak for De on some occasions, but it isnt worth the resource investment to build up a hydra fleet.

I'll disagree, I've allready said why but either way, I know I've gotten pretty nice roids with that sort of fleet in rnd7, managed to be in top3 roiders 3-4nights/week for 2weeks after de had come in to play seriously(then the war was over :-/)

[-QS-]

Originally posted by Sun_Tzu
call me an idiot but where are the hydras? cr-class thus flanked by both wyverns from the bs-cr-(de) targeting ships and by pegs from de-cs-(bs) targeting, and even if not flanked it's actually got a better armor than either of those. A decent kill rate, shoots at fr-first(atm you need to plow through de to get to them with the wyv) and I'd say it's an all-around nice thing to have...

I like Hydras too, but as they target ships your pegs and wyvern also target, they are not that useful. But ofc, they are CR and have eta 8 universe... maybe I`d build some, but wouldn`t concentrate on it!

Originally posted by Prince
I'm going to say a ship name now and your all going to laugh

Centaur?

its fast quiet cheap and is effective vs co craft

no one likes them anymore? (i had a nice bunch last round for targeting vultures)

I do not laugh, i used them in R6 in masses. I like the centaur, it is fast and not too bad against FI/ CO, BUT u have masses of peds + they die very fast!
And as I think, a mix of all is worse than concentrating on your strength i wouldnt build em

Well i have thought about it long and here it is,

Main roding fleet, early stages 80%

FR Pods 15%
Centaurs 70%
Chimeras 15%

add Harpies at target request



Defence fleet, early stages 20%

Harpies 100%
add free centaurs you don´t need in the roiding fleet



Roiding fleet, mid/late round 80%

FR roiding fleet 30%

DE/BS roiding fleet 70%
Pegs 50%
DE Pods 15%
Wyvern 35%

The percentages for Pegs and Wyvern can differ about 10% depends liking Xan targets or not. But the more Wyvern you have the better you can attack Zik, Cathaar or Terran



Defence, mid/late round 20%

Harpies
Pegs
Wyvern

Gryphons
Dragons


Result is you are weak against CR/BS as your only ships targetting this class are Gryphons/Dragons forget the T3 of Chimera it won´t have any use.
You have to fear only Cathaar who build up their CR pod fleet. And of course all other ppl who are much bigger then you

[Colt]

Originally posted by Jori.X.McKie

Defence, mid/late round 20%

Harpies
Pegs
Wyvern

Gryphons
Dragons


Result is you are weak against CR/BS as your only ships targetting this class are Gryphons/Dragons forget the T3 of Chimera it won´t have any use.
You have to fear only Cathaar who build up their CR pod fleet. And of course all other ppl who are much bigger then you

Why waste resources on gryphons when you can just trade in gal def?? Dragons wont be made in mass bulk neway imo, as they r just moveable pds

Only #1 can not be 'fearful' of the peeps above him/her, as there are none

[Ultimate Newbie]

Originally posted by Colt
Only #1 can not be 'fearful' of the peeps above him/her, as there are none

Instead s/he must fear the thousands of people below....


thoguh Colt does have a point - as a Terran ignore tryign to defend against Cruisers (beyond CHimera T3) - the ETA is long enough to get roaches, bombers, broadswords, clippers, ermm.. .sentinels, COrsairs, Buccaneers, what else targets CR/BA? peacekeepers (rofl) etc.

[Sun_Tzu]

Originally posted by Jori.X.McKie
Well i have thought about it long and here it is,

Main roding fleet, early stages 80%

FR Pods 15%
Centaurs 70%
Chimeras 15%

add Harpies at target request



Defence fleet, early stages 20%

Harpies 100%
add free centaurs you don´t need in the roiding fleet



Roiding fleet, mid/late round 80%

FR roiding fleet 30%

DE/BS roiding fleet 70%
Pegs 50%
DE Pods 15%
Wyvern 35%

The percentages for Pegs and Wyvern can differ about 10% depends liking Xan targets or not. But the more Wyvern you have the better you can attack Zik, Cathaar or Terran



Defence, mid/late round 20%

Harpies
Pegs
Wyvern

Gryphons
Dragons


Result is you are weak against CR/BS as your only ships targetting this class are Gryphons/Dragons forget the T3 of Chimera it won´t have any use.
You have to fear only Cathaar who build up their CR pod fleet. And of course all other ppl who are much bigger then you

scrap centaurs, use chims+harpys, scrap gryphons and the "fr fleet" shouldn't be needed much alone after de comes into play, just keep some chims for pegs-flak.

[Colt]

Originally posted by Ultimate Newbie
Instead s/he must fear the thousands of people below....

hehe, idd

I agree that a Terran has problems in targetting CR/BS and i won´t build many of those Gryphons and Dragons but the Gryphons may come handy in allliance defence.

However i can´t agree on those Chim/Cents issue. Chim are crappy in killing any ship. Their only use is to flak Pegs... hell, why using such an expansive flak ??
Cents die a bit easier ...yes, but they kill some Co/Fi (not against Pulsar of course)
before and you can spend your resources on wyvern to "flak" your Pegs as both have the same targetclasses only vice versa. (Chims/Wyvern)
So instead of using Chims to flak use Cents and buy Wyvern.

I think it depends on your C income, with less C i won´t waste it on Cents neither on Chims later on....

Concentrating on pure DE roiding fleet is limiting your possible targets so a FR roiding fleet has it´s use.

[Colt]

Originally posted by Jori.X.McKie
However i can´t agree on those Chim/Cents issue. Chim are crappy in killing any ship. Their only use is to flak Pegs... hell, why using such an expansive flak ??
Cents die a bit easier ...yes, but they kill some Co/Fi (not against Pulsar of course)

Wots the point of buyin cents, they target co/fi as u said, but hen u got such a good ship as the pegasus, then why not use the resources on better things, such as more pegs??

Concentrating on pure DE roiding fleet is limiting your possible targets so a FR roiding fleet has it´s use.

But maximising your strengths

[K-W]

I think a responsible alliance/gal member will build some gryphons at first and in the end have a pds of dragons just to lower what your allaince has to send you in a cr attack.

Originally posted by Colt
Wots the point of buyin cents, they target co/fi as u said, but hen u got such a good ship as the pegasus, then why not use the resources on better things, such as more pegs??

Yes the Peg are the better ship and from only looking at the stats the Cents have no use later on. If you going to have a pure DE roiding fleet Cents get more useless.
But if you want to have a Fr roiding fleet Cents are the better choice as Chims additional Cents are a nice defence ship due to its eta. And yes you will/should have less Pegs if you buy Cents.

Pro: 2nd roiding fleet, additional alliance Defence.

Con: You open another Ship Class to shoot at but the defenders need to cover a 2nd ship class too

Maximising your strengths in one Ship Class, many pros and cons.

[MAdnRisKy]

Originally posted by K-W
I think a responsible alliance/gal member will build some gryphons at first and in the end have a pds of dragons just to lower what your allaince has to send you in a cr attack.

we've had this debate before haven't we.....

Originally posted by MAdnRisKy
we've had this debate before haven't we.....

Tell me your point or tell me where i have to look, please.

[MAdnRisKy]

Originally posted by Jori.X.McKie
Tell me your point or tell me where i have to look, please.

try here

[Teh_Necro]

40% Pegs/Dem i presume?

Persnally, i'd have a larger FR fleet, especially earlier on.

-Necro

[Sun_Tzu]

Originally posted by Jori.X.McKie
I agree that a Terran has problems in targetting CR/BS and i won´t build many of those Gryphons and Dragons but the Gryphons may come handy in allliance defence.

However i can´t agree on those Chim/Cents issue. Chim are crappy in killing any ship. Their only use is to flak Pegs... hell, why using such an expansive flak ??
Cents die a bit easier ...yes, but they kill some Co/Fi (not against Pulsar of course)
before and you can spend your resources on wyvern to "flak" your Pegs as both have the same targetclasses only vice versa. (Chims/Wyvern)
So instead of using Chims to flak use Cents and buy Wyvern.

I think it depends on your C income, with less C i won´t waste it on Cents neither on Chims later on....

Concentrating on pure DE roiding fleet is limiting your possible targets so a FR roiding fleet has it´s use.

I cba to look but I'm sure you can give me the price of the centaur armor compared to the price of the chimera armor and the pegasus... I'm pretty sure Drakes had the best armor of terran fr, chims coming only some 10res/1armor behind and centaurs finishing last by a good margin. Now tell me why you wanna flak with the worst flak available?

Using Chims or Cents as flak is not a good idea.
But if you want to have a fr roiding fleet what would you include a useless flak which doesn´t kill anything or a useless flak which kill Co/Fi and can be used for defence.

However against cathaar a pure Chim/pod fleet early on is nice so you have to think about hitting cathaar only for the first days what isn´t a really bad idea.
I will do so but for later FR fleet Cents are essential in my eyes.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Jori.X.McKie
Using Chims or Cents as flak is not a good idea.
But if you want to have a fr roiding fleet what would you include a useless flak which doesn´t kill anything or a useless flak which kill Co/Fi and can be used for defence.

However against cathaar a pure Chim/pod fleet early on is nice so you have to think about hitting cathaar only for the first days what isn´t a really bad idea.
I will do so but for later FR fleet Cents are essential in my eyes.

Actually it is a good idea. Youve got to get roids, and if that means eating some losses it means eating losses. Your probably better off with armor than fi/co targetting.

[Chax]

Originally posted by Jori.X.McKie
Using Chims or Cents as flak is not a good idea.
But if you want to have a fr roiding fleet what would you include a useless flak which doesn´t kill anything or a useless flak which kill Co/Fi and can be used for defence.

However against cathaar a pure Chim/pod fleet early on is nice so you have to think about hitting cathaar only for the first days what isn´t a really bad idea.
I will do so but for later FR fleet Cents are essential in my eyes.

If I was to send a terran FR fleet against cathaar I wouldn't send chimera or centaur. I'd use the Drake with its 85% emp res.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Chax
If I was to send a terran FR fleet against cathaar I wouldn't send chimera or centaur. I'd use the Drake with its 85% emp res.

The thing about the Chim, is that you are going to want to build them anyway for defence. Buiding a drake roiding fleet is a waste of resources because the extra armor and emp isnt worth the fact that youve invested in a ship with no other use in the game.