Fence sitters

[Domin]

what will alliance do with the mixed nar/weet gals?

We know there are some. what sides will incase they take if they have to choose?

[Psi_K]

What I want to know is:
Why would Nar or Weet offer members protection from the people they're going to war with.
ALL Nar players should be fair game to Weet, and vice versa.
Anything other then this ... would be far to annoying, and no 'real' war would take place.

[Treveler]

Originally posted by Psi_K
What I want to know is:
Why would Nar or Weet offer members protection from the people they're going to war with.
ALL Nar players should be fair game to Weet, and vice versa.
Anything other then this ... would be far to annoying, and no 'real' war would take place.

I guess it will be our job to take down the big, fat, fence-sitting gals.

[Domin]

i agree psi but i still remember that in r6 there were lots of people who suddenly had been loyal to theyr alliance all the time suddenly was loyal more loyal to theyr own galaxy.

what i do not understand is why the alliances allowed it or why the people in the gal did it as it was an oportunity for it that it would happen...

[InTGuRu]

Originally posted by Domin
what i do not understand is why the alliances allowed it or why the people in the gal did it as it was an oportunity for it that it would happen...

Yeah, a mystery.

[Domin]

Originally posted by InTGuRu
Yeah, a mystery.

Well i expected em to learn

[Sauron]

Death to mixed gals , now is the time to separate the boys from the men...

[whoop]

Originally posted by Sauron
"A Ring to controll all , and in darkness bind them all"

You know thats like, completely wrong right ?

-whoop

[Treveler]

Originally posted by Domin
what will alliance do with the mixed nar/weet gals?

We know there are some. what sides will incase they take if they have to choose?

One of the problems is that it is not only weet/nar peons that share gals. Its also members of the command team in both blocks. They would never let their gal get destroyed, and the result will be fence sitting.

[The_Fish]

well in my gal now, the weet are hitting nar, and the nar are hitting weet. As for attacks on us, who knows, maybe it'll be vvomm attacking him, because weet would struggle.

[K-W]

If your gal is mainly one alliance, and your alliances ends up in war with them, you have 3 choices:

*fight with your alliance
*leave your alliance
*fencesit

That is why the policy exists to not auto target all enemy alliance members. Some of them are more loyal to thier galaxy than to thier alliance. As far as fencesitters, its thier alliances fault if they allow them to be members and not participate.

[Aaranaf]

now you see why vvomm made pure vvomm galaxies ?

[K-W]

Originally posted by Aaranaf
now you see why vvomm made pure vvomm galaxies ?

Cause they like having to defend 10 planets in a galaxy for every galaxy that gets attacked?

Pure galaxies has been considered many times in the past. Pure 1 group galaxies have advantages. And they have disadvantages. So far most groups in this game have decided that the greater advantage is in mixed galaxies. Perhaps you will prove us wrong.

[cypher]

Originally posted by Treveler
One of the problems is that it is not only weet/nar peons that share gals. Its also members of the command team in both blocks. They would never let their gal get destroyed, and the result will be fence sitting.

most likely they will both just attack the other block... and make sure they don't get targeted by their alliances... quite simple really..

[Sad]

HI EVERYONE!!!

[kyrealean]

this new war is going to be just like the 2nd war of Rd7 was. allied gal hitting allied gal, planetary naps and general anyone hitting anyone else, as trying to track who is who will be ridiculously chaotic.

In other words, a pure ****e war imho.

[K-W]

Originally posted by kyrealean
this new war is going to be just like the 2nd war of Rd7 was. allied gal hitting allied gal, planetary naps and general anyone hitting anyone else, as trying to track who is who will be ridiculously chaotic.

In other words, a pure ****e war imho.

Nar and Weet cant be as bound together as FLTV were. Lets hope it doesnt come to that.

[Scouse]

It's not the first time it's happened and it's not really a big deal either.

[sigrid]

Originally posted by cyphie
most likely they will both just attack the other block... and make sure they don't get targeted by their alliances... quite simple really..

wich results in retals from the other galmembers alliance...wich they cannot defend, wich then kills the gal....BAD option therefor.

[Teh_Necro]

My gal is facing a v difficult situation 1/2 being wp and the other 1/2 being nos.

We'll no doubt be labbled "Fencesitters", and to some degree i would agree, however its difficult to asksome1 to choose their alliance over galaxy or vise versa, this is why i was always dreading the inveitable war between Nar and Weet.

However, i hope the situation is not here for long, as i intend to get into the action at some point.

-Necro

[Axis_WLF]

easy think of what allowed you so much protection and free gain up to this point <outside farming>

your alliance, your galaxy is probably getting to a point that some BG's get to in later stages of PA and thats the feeling of "we did it all on our own and our alliance should be happy to have us".

All rounds the fence sitters were the people in mixed galaxies who did not wanna get into a war for fear of getting attacked but not so much worried about their alliance getting hit.

Example: the members that mysteriously do not have defence for the alliance <mainly due to fear that news scans will show your galaxy defending thus welcoming incoming>

Your galaxy is very important no doubts there but very rarely will one be able to have their galaxy achieve top galaxy position without being in an alliance that kind of achievment comes from being a part of alliance/block where even the lowest member can help save a large members planet from destruction.

Never put your galaxy into a position in a round where politically the naps you have will definatly cease later. <speaking of definate known temporary block naps>

[dabult]

This is all very ghey.



edit; point being, have one block in your gal, or suit yourself for any fuss that might occur later.

[kyrealean]

Originally posted by Axis_WLF
easy think of what allowed you so much protection and free gain up to this point <outside farming>

your alliance, your galaxy is probably getting to a point that some BG's get to in later stages of PA and thats the feeling of "we did it all on our own and our alliance should be happy to have us".

All rounds the fence sitters were the people in mixed galaxies who did not wanna get into a war for fear of getting attacked but not so much worried about their alliance getting hit.

Example: the members that mysteriously do not have defence for the alliance <mainly due to fear that news scans will show your galaxy defending thus welcoming incoming>

Your galaxy is very important no doubts there but very rarely will one be able to have their galaxy achieve top galaxy position without being in an alliance that kind of achievment comes from being a part of alliance/block where even the lowest member can help save a large members planet from destruction.

Never put your galaxy into a position in a round where politically the naps you have will definatly cease later. <speaking of definate known temporary block naps>

i will never make a galaxy based on political agendas. they will ALWAYS be based on my friendships etc. In my case it was Eclipse and RaH people that are closest to me. Hence i have a near 50/50 split between the 2.

A gal that can work together will survive together, i hardly know anyone in Ely or WP or ToT so it was obvious that i wouldnt be having any of their members in my gal.

fencesitting has been a part of the game throughout its history. in a war such as this 1, alliances should be looking at the major mixing of their respective gals and make some groundrules about defending against 1 another and etc.

Imo, defending should be fine regardless of where it came from, unless its from someone of EXACTLY the same alliance as the person. (ie Ecl defending against Ecl) if a RaH defends a RaH from WP from a mixed gal, tough cookies, no retal allowed.

Attacking.... if the members avoid hitting anyone of their same alliance then it should be fine to hit whoever without risk of retals.


But the problem will reside when retals are granted, and will be wholesale across the board, which will destroy many mixed gals that will actively support this new war.


p.s.

the bottom line is that the universe is SMALL enough now, that no alliance should have to ally up with ANY other alliance. its not like theres 100k planets out there that can team up and squash you.

If anyone plays Rd10 i would highly suggest that alliance just TRY ONE TIME to go it alone. the amount of planets dictates that any blocking, or allying up with anyone else is just stagnation suicide.

[Morden]

Originally posted by kyrealean
the bottom line is that the universe is SMALL enough now, that no alliance should have to ally up with ANY other alliance. its not like theres 100k planets out there that can team up and squash you.

If anyone plays Rd10 i would highly suggest that alliance just TRY ONE TIME to go it alone. the amount of planets dictates that any blocking, or allying up with anyone else is just stagnation suicide.

would be interresting to see, but however not likely.

although tbh i dont see a problem with friends making a galaxy, as long as they keep to there alliance requirements to defend the alliance they belong to, and attack anyone who is at war with there alliance,
if they got retalled, well thats what they have an alliance for, at the end of the day if you help your alliance, your alliance will help you(if its one worth being in), if they dont then what good are they for the alliance?

[kyrealean]

Originally posted by Morden
would be interresting to see, but however not likely.

although tbh i dont see a problem with friends making a galaxy, as long as they keep to there alliance requirements to defend the alliance they belong to, and attack anyone who is at war with there alliance,
if they got retalled, well thats what they have an alliance for, at the end of the day if you help your alliance, your alliance will help you(if its one worth being in), if they dont then what good are they for the alliance?

perhaps so, but noone wants to see their galaxy being torn apart at the seams due to their alliance loyalties.

the fact remains, granted retals make getting defense just a tad harder than before. and noone in a gal wants to stand by while their gal mate gets attacked.

sigh its wars like this 1 that really annoy me. it could have been avoided but now its going to just become a big mess

[Saitam]

War is by defenition a mess...

[K-W]

Originally posted by kyrealean
perhaps so, but noone wants to see their galaxy being torn apart at the seams due to their alliance loyalties.

the fact remains, granted retals make getting defense just a tad harder than before. and noone in a gal wants to stand by while their gal mate gets attacked.

sigh its wars like this 1 that really annoy me. it could have been avoided but now its going to just become a big mess

There was no way to avoid a war that would split someones galaxy. Without doing what you refuse to do and making galaxies based on politics.

[Axis_WLF]

<lets germania do the talking as he and I have had enough exp in that department that I dont have anything to add>

[kyrealean]

Originally posted by K-W
There was no way to avoid a war that would split someones galaxy. Without doing what you refuse to do and making galaxies based on politics.

agreed, just another fundamental flaw in how the players play PA unfortunately.

maybe come the new round, alliances will be brave enough to go it alone and that way u avoid all these lame political situations.

the universe is small enough now to not warrant any allying etc.

but its up to the players themselves if they have the guts to try it and be honest to each other not to go allying behind their backs.

[AlbinoSquirrel]

Originally posted by kyrealean
agreed, just another fundamental flaw in how the players play PA unfortunately.

Yeah, people don't like being in the same alliance as their friends because of X or Y being a dick or a bitch or whatever.

So we get a lot of friends who find themselves forced to fight each other because of their HC.

The saddest part is that these players tend to either fencesit or obey their HC instead of growing balls and striking out.

[Chax]

If alliance X HC allow their members to share galaxies with members of alliance Y then that same HC can't complain when their members don't want to attack or defend against alliance Y.

[Axis_WLF]

pretty good point made by Alby.

I like to play with friends also but I would not create my galaxy full of friends from various alliances that will definatly become hostile or end naps for later. It becomes to much of a mess and most of the time the people that are in those types of galaxies are not in it for the alliance or the war but just personal gain. <knows of the backdoor deals a certain agricultural galaxy has to play possum to keep incoming off them>

My advice is for alliances not to put up with it kick them out roid the galaxy down before the people pitch a fit and leave for another group thats either allied to you and such. The problem some see is that kicking them out weakens you well only on paper cause those people are not doing you any good at the moment anyway its all cosmetic.

Sure alliances can go at it alone BUT I dont mind 2 alliances working close together and filling their galaxies up with those 2 alliance. Filling your galaxies of people that will only be napped for a certain period of time becomes a burden for your galaxy and alliance.

I hate the three main fence sitting stages

1: The need for the alliances those people are in to watch their arse why they grow <which is ok but the people always say "sorry dont have ships or something like this". Contributing slightly to the war by only picking targets that the galaxy wants and not what alliance needs.

2: where they begin to grow their own mind and start to do things their own way but enjoying the fruits of having the naps their alliances have to keep incoming off them and defence for them when they need it. Still helping ever so slightly but starting to slowly make back door deals or work on ways to keep them safe during their leech the lessers or piggy campaign.

3: The part where the galaxy is in a top position but feel they did it all on their own with no help and that their alliance owes them somehow for something even though they did not contribut hardly anything. The stage where they contribute 0 but pretend to contribute 100% their large size is an illusion to the alliance their in as they are not really thinking of alliance or care but rather thinking of self gain etc.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Chax
If alliance X HC allow their members to share galaxies with members of alliance Y then that same HC can't complain when their members don't want to attack or defend against alliance Y.

No, not really.

Alliance X HC can expect thier members to attack or defend against anyone they want. And the member can then chose to obey his/her HC or to leave the alliance. This goes for all orders and policies. Not completely dictating every action of your members does not mean you cant make any policies at all.

[Chax]

Originally posted by K-W
No, not really.

Alliance X HC can expect thier members to attack or defend against anyone they want. And the member can then chose to obey his/her HC or to leave the alliance. This goes for all orders and policies. Not completely dictating every action of your members does not mean you cant make any policies at all.

Well then alliance X HC isn't really looking out for it's members best interests is it.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Chax
Well then alliance X HC isn't really looking out for it's members best interests is it.

Thats a rather gross generalization.

An alliance would of course be most effective if it hand picked all its galaxies, and controlled every aspect of its members play, but suprisingly enough not many members would want to join. An alliance, to properly serve its members, must find compromises of members various desires.

I wasnt around when the politics of this round formed, but I can imagine there being very good political reasons not to exclude nar from weet gals well.



I think the big problem this round is the lack of middle tier alliances. Alliances that members could get gal m8s in that wouldnt get involved in the block wars, so werent an issue. Another buildup over time has been the lack of non alliance players. There used to be alot of them, but alliances are almost absolutely neccessary now. The end result is that you end up having to choose between very severelly limiting your gals and concentrating your members, or taking big chances that you end up with mixed gals in a war. There are pros and cons on both sides.

[BetrayerOfHope]

bah only winners

its realy not that hard my galaxy also mixed weet nar works fine on.

the weet attack and defend with weet.
the nar attack and defend with nar.

whats so hard with that? only 2 main rulez we have.
not giving out info about targets (galaxy status).
not defending against a galaxy mate.

all who say its impossible to play on in a mixed galaxy should be ashamed in fact the only difference to before is that we do no longer galaxy raids.

and comeing to vomm pure 1 block galaxys were the reason u got bashed this round but seems u should have suffered a bit more to learn it.

[K-W]

Originally posted by BetrayerOfHope
bah only winners

its realy not that hard my galaxy also mixed weet nar works fine on.

the weet attack and defend with weet.
the nar attack and defend with nar.

whats so hard with that? only 2 main rulez we have.
not giving out info about targets (galaxy status).
not defending against a galaxy mate.

all who say its impossible to play on in a mixed galaxy should be ashamed in fact the only difference to before is that we do no longer galaxy raids.

and comeing to vomm pure 1 block galaxys were the reason u got bashed this round but seems u should have suffered a bit more to learn it.

Out of curiosity, when weet want to attack the nar in your gal, and/or nar want to attack the weet in your gal, what do you plan to do?

[isildurx]

Originally posted by K-W
Out of curiosity, when weet want to attack the nar in your gal, and/or nar want to attack the weet in your gal, what do you plan to do?

that is pretty much what it all boils down too


are you most loyal to you gal or your alliance.

I bet that the playerbase are pretty divided on this question, wud b interesting to c a poll on it.

[ParraCida]

Originally posted by K-W
Out of curiosity, when weet want to attack the nar in your gal, and/or nar want to attack the weet in your gal, what do you plan to do?

Sadly there are enough people who can convince their alliance to drop the attack, lets take Jurgen for an example. Why were the three XeTa members in his gal never attacked?

BetrayerOfHope
whats your gal if its 50/50 make sure you dont show your cords any where should be fun attacking your gal ;]

[jornx]

Originally posted by Psi_K
What I want to know is:
Why would Nar or Weet offer members protection from the people they're going to war with.
ALL Nar players should be fair game to Weet, and vice versa.
Anything other then this ... would be far to annoying, and no 'real' war would take place.

I might be way off, but weren't u under gal protection in r7 when u were titans?
Should you have been fair game to fury aswell?

[cypher]

think he was as soon as the war started, having fun in weetnar?:P

[jornx]

Originally posted by cyphie
think he was as soon as the war started, having fun in weetnar?:P

well 'fun'. I haven't played very much since I left Oly.
Just check out my planet, inactivity ahoy.

[MadeMan]

Originally posted by Sad
HI EVERYONE!!!

Tha egyptian spammer

[Psi_K]

Originally posted by jornx
I might be way off, but weren't u under gal protection in r7 when u were titans?
Should you have been fair game to fury aswell?

I seem to recall having Fury and Legion at each other's necks because of Fury's pathetic rules.
It's not my fault if I choose to expliot them.

[cypher]

Originally posted by jornx
well 'fun'. I haven't played very much since I left Oly.
Just check out my planet, inactivity ahoy.

shouldn't have left

[K-W]

Originally posted by Psi_K
I seem to recall having Fury and Legion at each other's necks because of Fury's pathetic rules.
It's not my fault if I choose to expliot them.

It was Fury's pathetic rule to attack hostile planets? Id love to hear that explained Psi_k, how us wanting to attack you for attacking us and farming roids of other titans is pathetic. I think that sitting in a Legion galaxy, fence sitting and taking roid donations is pretty pathetic. I think that Legion protecting you, as well as its other deals with titans to get your gal to win were pretty pathetic.

Im unlcear how wanting to rightfully attack you is pathetic.

[Zh|l]

Originally posted by Psi_K
I seem to recall having Fury and Legion at each other's necks because of Fury's pathetic rules.
It's not my fault if I choose to expliot them.

Amusing. You were hostile, that was the crux of the "rules". Don't think for a second it was you that saved yourself or the 'rules'. You didnt exploit anything, dont try to assume that. It was alot more complicated than that which involved friendships that had been forged for years.

You still don't realize after all this time what my motive was.

[kyrealean]

Originally posted by BetrayerOfHope
bah only winners

its realy not that hard my galaxy also mixed weet nar works fine on.

the weet attack and defend with weet.
the nar attack and defend with nar.

whats so hard with that? only 2 main rulez we have.
not giving out info about targets (galaxy status).
not defending against a galaxy mate.

all who say its impossible to play on in a mixed galaxy should be ashamed in fact the only difference to before is that we do no longer galaxy raids.

and comeing to vomm pure 1 block galaxys were the reason u got bashed this round but seems u should have suffered a bit more to learn it.

sir, thats all well and good..... i will be curious to see when the weet alliances want your NAR players for roids a tad later this round, or vice versa. What will you and your galaxy do then? refuse the retals? Defend them in gal? interesting indeed.

Will be kinda hard to just sit back and allow people to come roid half your gal mates wont it?

[ParraCida]

Originally posted by K-W
It was Fury's pathetic rule to attack hostile planets? Id love to hear that explained Psi_k, how us wanting to attack you for attacking us and farming roids of other titans is pathetic. I think that sitting in a Legion galaxy, fence sitting and taking roid donations is pretty pathetic. I think that Legion protecting you, as well as its other deals with titans to get your gal to win were pretty pathetic.

Im unlcear how wanting to rightfully attack you is pathetic.

Actually you stated that titan planets not enganging in the war and in friendly galaxies would not be hit. We intended to get psi's gal a shot at #1 because you didnt want that gal as #1