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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:15   #1
Karmulian
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Exclamation Round 11 - What's going on

Well that's the big question.
I would first like to apologise for the lack of information regarding rnd11. Unfortunately we have been very busy getting things sorted and just haven't had the opportunity to release something concise

Right..
This announcement will NOT contain details of the new features being put into Rnd11, we want to keep these well under our hat so that our competitors cannot steal them.
However we do read the suggestions forum and have taken many of them on board, we hope that when Rnd11 is released you will appreciate why we have kept secrecy paramount.

I can however give a quick summary of what's coming back. We have tried as best as possible to keep the best features of old and new pa.

BACK
Multiple Tick Attacks/Defences
Dynamic Combat ETA's
Fleet Missions
A combination of Rnd9/10 construction/research systems
PDS - but with some new features
Multiple Ship Targeting
More Ship Classes

Development for the Rnd11 project is progressing well, and includes a lot more than just a new game.
It will see the release of the new passport system which includes.
a new manual (which for the first time in pa history will actually pull stats and and tech tree from the game)
a new credit tracking/trading system.
alliance hosting
hire planetarion - an option for you to hire pa, with settings of your choice.
user database linked into game,forums and all pa systems.
This will enable you to have one account and signup to a planetarion game in but a few clicks. no more entering your address every single time.

I know this is not too much detail, but we are trying to keep a certain element of surprise.
A lot of work has gone into the rnd11 project and we appreciate any suggestions you have - so please continue to post them on the forums.

Expect further details soon

Many Thanks

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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:26   #2
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Smile Re: Round 11 - What's going on

That sounds great to me.

What does Dynamic combat ETA's mean? Different eta's for different classes, overburn, different ETA's to different targets?
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:31   #3
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Different ETA's per Class/Type of Ships
dependent on research, and engineers ofc
And Cluster/Parallel ETA's are being added back in (though they can be turned on and off ofc)
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:39   #4
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

E.g. "classic" style
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:43   #5
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmulian
BACK
Multiple Tick Attacks/Defences
Dynamic Combat ETA's
Oh great just what the game needed, a better ability to bash and less of a reason for alliances to use in game alliance function hence making it harder to control them.

Both of these features were on the shortlist of what the finsihed PAX product got right and go back to a more traditional system for both is taking the game backwards. Unless your going to reduce the damage each ship does then multiple tick attacks means only one outcome for small players, that being 3 times the bashing as for Dynamic etas they gave some control over alliances, this wasnt really taken in either pax or 10.5 as the limit was way too high for the number of players but the ability was there. Now the alliance eta bonus is alot less important and it certainly doesnt stop the big alliance players with their larger contact base (due to the blocks they form) regaining the advantage of having so much defence to call upon and no matter how low you now set alliance limits it wont make a difference as getting defence will still be possible from allies (basically alliances can split into 2 and still act like one alliance as they will still all be able to easierly defend each other or even stay out of the ingame alliances altogether after all theres a point where additional members outweighs any eta advantage)

Quite a few alliances this round have shown theres a good deal of small players still in this game who want to play it yet once again it seems as if development is being done simply based on the view that there is only big players left. Just because the big players are more vocal doenst make their numbers greater and you should by now realise that without small players the big players cant survive either so continuously victimising the small players like this in favour of the big big isnt going to save the game
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:46   #6
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Sounds like sum gud ideas to me
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:48   #7
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Well it was on "your" shortlist, alot of people wanted them back
anyways that aside
who said alliances will get a eta bonus?

also dynamic ETA's will be in-- doesn't mean we have to use them. they can be turned on and off the final decision on that will be upto you
same applies to the number of ticks for an attack
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:51   #8
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmulian
I know this is not too much detail, but we are trying to keep a certain element of surprise.
A lot of work has gone into the rnd11 project and we appreciate any suggestions you have - so please continue to post them on the forums.

Expect further details soon

Many Thanks

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This is more than enough. I know ill do my very best to play that round, unless it crasges with some RL issues like military...

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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:52   #9
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

in my opinion most of what karmulian has said is evry good for the future of pa, however i do share wakeys concerns. I am a firm believer that alliances should be fully integrated into the game where they can be controleld to an extent through game dynamics - however unlike wakey i do not think that they have to be controlle din the same way as they were in pax - there are other possibilites - http://pirate.planetarion.com/showthread.php?t=176291
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:52   #10
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

btw...will it be private gals??

And what about cov ops?(which id not like to see :P)
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 15:58   #11
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Cov ops will be in - but there will be more options
Private Galaxies will be in - but again can be turned on an off.. or you will be able to have X priv X rand in a galaxy
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 16:02   #12
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

what about private packs e.g. groups of 2 sets of 3 privates and 4 randoms in a gal
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 16:06   #13
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

can be done
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 16:27   #14
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

everything really sounds gud. that private pack thing sounds kind of bogus to me tho'. If you wanna be private, go private. If you wanna go random, go random. Don't try to force others to go random with you.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 16:48   #15
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmulian
Well it was on "your" shortlist, alot of people wanted them back
anyways that aside
who said alliances will get a eta bonus?

also dynamic ETA's will be in-- doesn't mean we have to use them. they can be turned on and off the final decision on that will be upto you
same applies to the number of ticks for an attack
ofc alot of people here want them back, most of the vocal people on these boards are big players and either simply dont know or have forgotten what its like at the lower end. All these people generally know or care about is whats best for them and not whats best for the game. And you remove alliance eta bonus and you may as well scrap the whole Alliance aspects of the game, the big alliances have their own systems which are just as good if not better and any smaller alliance who might need it isnt going to be around with a game that allows the big alliances to get relativly bigger and due to the game being so much in favour of the big alliances and the bashers the small alliances get smaller and smaller as more and more of their members quit because a game like this just isnt fun when your being bashed day in day out.

To comepete this round while the membership levels for the big alliances were still too high many smaller alliances have had to combine just to stand a chance and thats not an ideal situation for anyone as the game gets less competative but you remove the only way you have to control alliances and allow alliances to go back to their attack and defence capable blocks and its no longer going to force us to group in blocks of 2,3,4 just to stand a chance to survive but instead into groupd of 6,7,8+. You may as well assign it so that the top 10 alliances are allied and cant attack each other and everyone else is allied and can only attack the top 10 alliances as this is the situation your going to see the game being forced towards


As for " final decision on that will be upto you" please tell me your kidding right, after all i guess this will be done on the opionons expressed on the forums which isnt really fair is it. One half of this forum community we have the big players who have one belief, then we have a large group of ex players who seem to want to see PA fail, then a small number of smaller players and ex and current players who understand the game and arent just going on whats good for them. Its not really going to produce particlarry good results now is it and neither would polls because people vote on a whim going on gut feelings without thinking things over listening to the cases from each side.

Not to mention its not a very good game design process, your not supposed to design a game on what the customers want simply because they normally arent fully informed. Take one of PA's biggest mistakes, the private galaxy in r4. This was something the players (and Zeus) wanted and was implemented because they wanted it, the idea itself wasnt bad and could have worked but it was the lack of forthinking about how the idea fitted in with the way the game was. What seemed like a trival change totally unbalanced the game as it simply wasnt something that could just be 'plugged' into the code, it needed other changes to counterbalance it.
By putting decisions into our hands your just asking for trouble, one small feature turned on or off changes the game in so many ways that it unbalances it, as everything has knock on effects which need decided right at the start of design and not at the end because the players say thats something they want. The players need to be used as places to test ideas to see if any problems ect you havent thought of are present or for getting inspriation from, not for giving creative control to
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 16:49   #16
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

the idea is that u get to be in a gal with a coupl of friends but that blocks can;t dominate gals
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 17:02   #17
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by KalVirtus
what about private packs e.g. groups of 2 sets of 3 privates and 4 randoms in a gal
I still believe it need to be more like 5 packs of 3 making up a galaxy for the diversity and to reduce the chances of one group having a majority (randoms put into packs with other randoms and then assigned like all other packs or one pack spot in all galaxies left for a pack of randoms)

With the balance it is (and especially with the fact it seems top alliances seem like they are going to be given back the ability to block freely and grow to any size they wish) with too few packs in a galaxy you make the chances of having whats pretty much a private galaxy greater. You need more packs in a galaxy or smaller packs else we may as well stay at private as thats what most of the top alliances will effectivly get. 3 packs of 3 might work but only 1 random seems too few so we need a bigger galaxy again and 15 seems a good number (or 12 might do 3 packs of 3 and a pack of randoms)

Private packs is an idea ive been floating since private galaxies were first mentioned in r3 and the real key to them being successful is enough mixing so that you get the benifit of random universe without having too many 'fortress galaxies' that private produces and the friendly faces element of private. Otherwise we are just getting close to having the same situation that the old 10/5 galxies gave which had all the problems of private galaxies, all the probelms of random galaxies and a linited number of the good bits from either
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 17:24   #18
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

I agree with everything u r saying wakey, but i think there are ways all of this can be addressed - possibly via pateam consultation with alliances of all sizes.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 17:30   #19
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by KalVirtus
I agree with everything u r saying wakey, but i think there are ways all of this can be addressed - possibly via pateam consultation with alliances of all sizes.
You think that ever had any impact on the formation of blocks?
I must have missed something then.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 17:41   #20
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

What do you mean by "hire" PA?
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 18:37   #21
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerbie
You think that ever had any impact on the formation of blocks?
I must have missed something then.
i didnt mean pateam ask allainces not to block....

i meant pateam discussing things with alliances.... this is allready starting to happen - but its hard to track down the smaller alliances on irc.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 19:02   #22
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by KalVirtus
i didnt mean pateam ask allainces not to block....

i meant pateam discussing things with alliances.... this is allready starting to happen - but its hard to track down the smaller alliances on irc.
It's hard to track people that don't use IRC. Same as ~50% of PA players. It's those people that need to be contacted. Not the big alliances. They are the people we need if PA is ever to grow. Spinner understood that when he decided to ignore the alliances and make radical changes to PA despite their objections. Not all changes worked out brilliantly, but if you leave it to alliances, nothing is going to happen.

(I'm expecting a long Wakey post...)
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 19:30   #23
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerbie
It's hard to track people that don't use IRC. Same as ~50% of PA players. It's those people that need to be contacted. Not the big alliances. They are the people we need if PA is ever to grow. Spinner understood that when he decided to ignore the alliances and make radical changes to PA despite their objections. Not all changes worked out brilliantly, but if you leave it to alliances, nothing is going to happen.

(I'm expecting a long Wakey post...)

would it shock u that the things being discussed on a secret alliance forum are actually designed to limit alliance power. Also we hope very much that we can coax the smaller alliances onto irc so we can find out what they want - the magical powers of pa team can be used to pamail them and get them onto itc.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 20:03   #24
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerbie
It's hard to track people that don't use IRC. Same as ~50% of PA players. It's those people that need to be contacted. Not the big alliances. They are the people we need if PA is ever to grow. Spinner understood that when he decided to ignore the alliances and make radical changes to PA despite their objections. Not all changes worked out brilliantly, but if you leave it to alliances, nothing is going to happen.

(I'm expecting a long Wakey post...)
So how come PaX wasnt a bloody sucess story then?
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 20:20   #25
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

In short: time is money and he didn't have the budget to test his ideas thoroughly.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 20:46   #26
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

@Gerbie: your not getting a long post in reply from me as i totally agree with what your saying
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
So how come PaX wasnt a bloody sucess story then?
I'd put a fair amount of that down to the beta plus an over optimistic estimation of playing numbers on Spinners part. The initial beta imho had alot of things write about it when it came to rebalancing the game but people started to complain about things because it 'wasnt' PA or it didnt allow them to play the way they always played so didnt allow them to use their significant number advantages to guarentee success. Things such as the scoring system which was alot more fairer than the "who has the most ships" method and other such aspects were degraded every time the beta was reset till we got the mess we have now which still has ships and roids as most important with 'acheivments' making up a very small amount of your score and various other aspects which were watered down so much they didnt really acheive what they were intended to. On the over optimistic front it seems clear spinner was expecting many more players than the 2k we got, why else would he have set the alliance limit which was supposed to control alliances so that alliances could have as much as 7.5% of the playerbase each. As it was alliances didnt have to get anywhere near that and were still too big for the number of players with most of the big ones having around 5% of players so where was the limiting factor, all it limited was defencesive blocks as defending was next to impossible from outside your alliance and they couldnt join under a single tag in most cases.

Theres also the problem of the cost of PAX the very people in mind when the changes were made were the people most liklly to decide not to play with the price hike of PAX. They are the players who have spent rounds being bashed over and over again and having no fund as the balance had move further towards the big alliances and whom if they hadnt quit at that point were close to it and the price tipped many over the edge, i know in fcrew he had to pretty much force many of our players and pay for them just to get them to continue.

@Kal : the problem with alliances is they quite often say one thing as it looks good but they then they do the something that goes against what they are saying publically. Its been the same for much of PA's life, pretty much since private galaxies saw the death of the wider community and replaced it with the many smaller alliance based communities we have now. I guess that probally because most of their members no longer have any real connection with the wider community and its then kind of hard to really care about anyone but your own little group. And when your members dont care about anyone else then you cant really take a stance of caring for anyone else especially if its bad for your members.

Just look at the end of r9 when the PAX beta started. Alliances were saying things like "We wont block we care about the game and want it to thrieve" and took praise for it. Then the top alliances saw what was in the beta and got together in a senate where they refused to let any smaller alliance take part, in fact their responce to me was along the lines of "go and setup your own of small alliances and put your view across". They then proceded to use this power to try and get things changed, some of them even made hints that they would walk out if things werent changed. So on one hand they were being all responsable and on the other they were abusing the power that they had due to their status which they knew even if they small alliance could have been organised the lack of well know 'personalities' meant they couldnt counter (Myself, Aryn and Leshy were about the only well known people on the small alliance side of things, the big alliances had all the big name leaders, the big named players and even some PATean members all on their side)

So while they might be willing to discuse certain things they would undoubtedly never use their power to get anything limiting put into the game but wouldnt hesitate to get something in their favour done, hey how can they as their members simply wouldnt stand for it
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 21:29   #27
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
@Gerbie: your not getting a long post in reply from me as i totally agree with what your saying
...
I meant that I expected you to write a long post about the discussions with the alliances...
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 21:45   #28
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

lets just give things a chance shall we
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 22:14   #29
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Wakey, I'm wondering if there's any feature in the game that you can't attack for being biased towards bigger players.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 22:19   #30
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leshy
Wakey, I'm wondering if there's any feature in the game that you can't attack for being biased towards bigger players.
*applauds*

I wanted to say something like this earlier, but you've done it far better than I possibly could have.
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Unread 3 Apr 2004, 23:38   #31
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nonentity
*applauds*

I wanted to say something like this earlier, but you've done it far better than I possibly could have.
At least he is voicing his concerns while you haven't said crap. And so it goes with useless replies like yours. If you don't have anything constructive to advance the game then shut up and let people who have an interest in it surviving say thier piece. Wakey is making a lot of very valid points. These things need to be addressed if the game is to survive. 1 tick attacks are an improvement to the game, as are many of the other things. However the alliances need to be reigned in so that a solo player has a shot at the game. Game skill not blocking and bashing still need to be a criteria for Planetarions ultimate survival.
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 00:02   #32
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by merlin1955
Wakey is making a lot of very valid points.
Wakey has a tendency to complain about every change, as they're all taken in the interest of big alliance players. Random rounds? Smaller players can't play with each other and organise themselves. Private rounds? Fortress galaxies are impregnable to smaller players. Single tick combat? Smaller players don't have the coordination and activity to cover incomings for a specific tick. Multiple tick combat? Smaller players get bashed.

In that regard, it's not very surprising that there are some comments upon that, regardless of whether Wakey raises valid points or not. Occasionally I agree with them, occasionally I don't.
Quote:
However the alliances need to be reigned in so that a solo player has a shot at the game.
The only possible way anyone could play solo in any way, is by removing defense altogether.
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 00:27   #33
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

I think PAX is the best Planetarion I have played.
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 07:09   #34
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Hm the ETAs were a good feature, same as different production times, PDS can be put back in, but actually PDS is crap if a bash-fleet (they were there, and they will ever be there) is incoming... (btw. PA has the BEST bash-protection of ALL browser-games I know, so don't change a thing there!) I like the idea of spending more than one tick in defense again, but for the offence I think it should stay like now... same goes for target classes... I just need to say FRIGATES to remind everyone what PA was in the past.... you needed just LOOOOOOOOOOTS of one ship that targetted the main enemy ships to succeed. Very boring actually. I like the new system which - togehter with the races - gets you an immense potential about tactics, especially if you play the game togehter with some friends and everyone chooses a different race...

just my 2 cents as a player that never was "a big one" but always one of the active small-mid-range players who wants a game you need skill and tactis for, nothing else...
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 10:14   #35
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmulian
Cluster/Parallel ETA's are being added back in
Wooohooo... Cluster ally malarky here I come.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmulian
also dynamic ETA's will be in-- doesn't mean we have to use them. they can be turned on and off
You better not turn em off! Wakey's talking a load of rubbish. A low ETA is one of the most important things for succesful attack/defence. If you can lower it using engineering, I predict any sensible player will be using their "first priority" for that most of the round. And alliances will use any ingame ETA advantage they can get their hands on, they'd be crazy not to.

Wakey, you seem to have a very distorted view of what it's really like in the bigger alliances. People don't sit around all day long making friends with all the other vaguely threatening alliances, laughing at the occasional stray hostile incoming, and scouring the universe for noobies to bash, (not since the middle of round 5 or so). We are locked into constant bitter wars with opposing block(s). We don't have an infinite supply of defence to call upon, and I've rarely seen allies willing or able to share defence with each other. As for the ingame alliance member limits, I see very few alliances hindered by them (one of these being NOD Heads - not exactly an alliance which falls in with your views of top alliances). As I'm sure you've noticed, the diminishing PA playerbase provides a perfectly adequate limit on alliance size. Most of the bigger alliances are at (or way past) the critical point where they have enough players to continue to function and a lower artificial limit which actually meant anything would probably destroy them.

Infact your ideas about small players getting bashed are fairly far off the mark too. Small players with a lot of roids get bashed. Small players in really tiny galaxies get bashed. But I've seen enough skilled Elysium players wind up in crappy galaxies to know this isn't a product of the player's 'smallness' (by that I mean skill/activity - they become small after a while of course) or of their alliancelessness. Fact is, because nice targets in small galaxies are so drastically outnumbered by active players nowadays, they are bound to get constant incoming (until they're no longer nice targets). A small player can get along fine if they want to, it's only when they try to initiate roids that they get bashed.

Perhaps getting rid of galaxies altogether is the answer... (it surely solves the random/private dilemna that plagues so many threads on these forums!), and I'd welcome a move like that once clusters come back.
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 10:21   #36
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
Oh great just what the game needed, a better ability to bash and less of a reason for alliances to use in game alliance function hence making it harder to control them. (...)
ok here comes the whining front again

i bet he's never gotten over 1 mil for some reason and gets his butt handed to him all the time...
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 11:59   #37
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leshy
Wakey has a tendency to complain about every change, as they're all taken in the interest of big alliance players. Random rounds? Smaller players can't play with each other and organise themselves. Private rounds? Fortress galaxies are impregnable to smaller players. Single tick combat? Smaller players don't have the coordination and activity to cover incomings for a specific tick. Multiple tick combat? Smaller players get bashed.

In that regard, it's not very surprising that there are some comments upon that, regardless of whether Wakey raises valid points or not. Occasionally I agree with them, occasionally I don't.
The only possible way anyone could play solo in any way, is by removing defense altogether.
Strange that Leshy cos if you had bothered to ever take notice of anytthing I've ever posted you would know I much perfer a random universe, theres problems with them yes and there are aspects of random universe I complain about (although most arent things that make the game worse for small players but all players, things like the inactive problems caused by the poor way they are dealt with ect) and I have certainly not complained about single tick attacking because its alot harder for you to lose all your ships when you get bashed which with the current scoring system thats so reliant on ships to do well.
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 16:43   #38
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by [BaD]Knoddy
ok here comes the whining front again

i bet he's never gotten over 1 mil for some reason and gets his butt handed to him all the time...
And here comes the arrogant big alliance players who think the universe revolves around them.
How does a persons score suddenly make them and their views any less important than the big players. Small players also play the game and hence their view point is just as important . Its actually people like you who are to blame for the reluctance smaller players show when it comes to putting their views over here, why post what you think when bigger players will simply slag you off or dismiss you because your not one of them. The structure of this community simply has to be built upon a pyramid structure of fewer at the top and more at the bottom rather than wthe inverted pyramide structure we have now which see it being top heavy due to the fact for every bigger player who leaves theres 2,4,5 smaller players who either quit or move up to take the place of a bigger player whos quit and unless things change the base will get so weak that the whole game will come tumbling down. This is why smaller players concerns have to be listened to and you bigger players have to give them the respect they deserve rather than dismissing them and insulting them, otherwise its not just them that wont be playing the game anymore but also the bigger players


[
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 16:51   #39
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
Strange that Leshy cos if you had bothered to ever take notice of anytthing I've ever posted you would know I much perfer a random universe
I wasn't naming any specific examples - it's just that I've very rarely if ever seen you reply positively to any changes being introduced
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 18:32   #40
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

i think the last time i saw wakey happy about ideas was when he was the mod of the old (ie very active, compared to now) suggestions forum of rounds 2-4(ish, not sure exactly...)

all those changes for round 11 sound good to me!! i suppose wakey has a point about the single tick defense, so why not just go like old style principle, and have defense possible for twice as long as offense (ie 1 tick attack, 2 tick defense)? i think this is the solution wakey prefers...
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 18:43   #41
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on


noob from IC need help?
(srry didn't know where else to post this)
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 19:43   #42
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leshy
I wasn't naming any specific examples - it's just that I've very rarely if ever seen you reply positively to any changes being introduced
Thats probally because i dont see the point in posting things like "I like it" or other such mindless throwaway one line comments on ideas I really like. They just detract from any real discussions that are going on and if i'm totally honest if I start writing something I like to do it right hence why most of my replies are pretty long and if I was to do a proper reply to everything good id require more hours in the day.

Also its hard to be totally positive on an idea because its rarely completly good, most have flaws and its simply a case that these flaws require more said about them than the good parts because good parts simply stand on their own merits. The one time good ideas require a reply is when a discussions starts on them (and as with most discussions these start from critism) which is when theres a need to respond and justify why you think things are good.
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 20:35   #43
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
And here comes the arrogant big alliance players who think the universe revolves around them.
How does a persons score suddenly make them and their views any less important than the big players. Small players also play the game and hence their view point is just as important . Its actually people like you who are to blame for the reluctance smaller players show when it comes to putting their views over here, why post what you think when bigger players will simply slag you off or dismiss you because your not one of them. The structure of this community simply has to be built upon a pyramid structure of fewer at the top and more at the bottom rather than wthe inverted pyramide structure we have now which see it being top heavy due to the fact for every bigger player who leaves theres 2,4,5 smaller players who either quit or move up to take the place of a bigger player whos quit and unless things change the base will get so weak that the whole game will come tumbling down. This is why smaller players concerns have to be listened to and you bigger players have to give them the respect they deserve rather than dismissing them and insulting them, otherwise its not just them that wont be playing the game anymore but also the bigger players


[
Afaik Knoddy is ROCK Maybe you should ask around before making nonsence posts ;-)

And no I havne't read all your posts, and I doubt very much people have. That's a 24/7 job...
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R1: ??:?? | R2: 51:6 | R3: 37:12 | R4: 186:13 | R5: 13:17 | R6: 1:25
R7: 15:14 | R8: 34:4 / 52:10 ¤ | R9: 16:2 | R9.5: 34:6 / 41:6 ¤
R10: 2:2 | R10.5: 15:4 | R11: 28:8 | R12: 22:9

Damn, outdated and too lazy to edit, retired now
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 20:43   #44
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by General Martok
Afaik Knoddy is ROCK Maybe you should ask around before making nonsence posts ;-)

And no I havne't read all your posts, and I doubt very much people have. That's a 24/7 job...
i'm not a big player anyway, but i'm glad multiple attack ticks are coming back anyway

if you suck at the game, poo on you but don't bring down any changes as 'encourages bashing' or 'here come the big ones' or some other bs
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Last edited by [BaD]Knoddy; 4 Apr 2004 at 21:17.
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 21:19   #45
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by General Martok
Afaik Knoddy is ROCK Maybe you should ask around before making nonsence posts ;-)

And no I havne't read all your posts, and I doubt very much people have. That's a 24/7 job...
tbh his alliance doesnt really change things a great deal, he still has that arrogant attitude that that is normally associated with the bigger alliance players, that being your importance is proportional to your planets size.

And come on lets be honest ROCK arent really an alliance youd consider small, ok they maybe arent right at the top but they are probally at a level where you would consider them at the lower end of the top alliances so its not like I'm that far off am I
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 21:21   #46
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
tbh his alliance doesnt really change things a great deal, he still has that arrogant attitude that that is normally associated with the bigger alliance players, that being your importance is proportional to your planets size.

And come on lets be honest ROCK arent really an alliance youd consider small, ok they maybe arent right at the top but they are probally at a level where you would consider them at the lower end of the top alliances so its not like I'm that far off am I
11 out of 14/15 decent alliances is the lower top?
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R1: ??:?? | R2: 51:6 | R3: 37:12 | R4: 186:13 | R5: 13:17 | R6: 1:25
R7: 15:14 | R8: 34:4 / 52:10 ¤ | R9: 16:2 | R9.5: 34:6 / 41:6 ¤
R10: 2:2 | R10.5: 15:4 | R11: 28:8 | R12: 22:9

Damn, outdated and too lazy to edit, retired now
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 21:48   #47
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Quote:
Originally Posted by General Martok
11 out of 14/15 decent alliances is the lower top?
Again your discounting over half the PA community, ROCK are not a small alliance, admittedly you seem alot smaller with the way that most of those below you ahve fallen away to a stage where they dont offer much but your still very much at the top end of things
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Unread 4 Apr 2004, 21:57   #48
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Hmm looking good. Back to the old days. Can we get back to topic plz?
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round 9 rank 941 23:1:9 - TFD HC
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Unread 5 Apr 2004, 00:28   #49
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Your wrong wakey.
Why? Becouse this is a war game. Not only that, but those who put in the most effort, should win.
The solo player should always loose. If a not, why should people use irc, form alliances and so on?

so wakey, Ive said it before, and I will say it again untill you stop complaining about the non-existing n00bs who hang around here, go play sims.
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Unread 5 Apr 2004, 00:53   #50
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Re: Round 11 - What's going on

Good luck with r11 guys. If you put in the work hopefully you'll get the reward of the players who lamented the loss of the aforementioned features returning. Make it good enough and I'll even consider paying for an account this time.
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