r9.5 race

[isildurx]

What will be the race to go ?

seeing as we now start with a complete tech tree!!

will cath be chosen because of their CR??


or will we see massive Terran overflow??

or maybe 60% of the uni is'dumb' enough to go xan


waddya think???


and how will people init???, how many roids should one init too?

[Embroglio]

Xan will do alright, in random galaxies defense is less organised making the low eta even more of an asset.

[storeslem]

Cathaars will be very powerful indeed if they go cr/bs only

[SpazMonster]

none of the above

[Colt]

Hmm, well if Terran is the majority in the universe, then obviously zik would be a good choice to be, but for me their init sucks n so does the graphics, but thats just my opinion. I will be going xan for quick roiding and id like to have another go at them after doing so ****e with them in rd8

[gzambo]

to be honest i dont think the xan wil have any speed advantage with full tech trees for each race so more than likely the race that most will choose will be terran for the killing power of the larger ships, however i think as this will be a quick fun round i myself will probably pick zik as its the only race that i have not played yet

[MAdnRisKy]

Mil scans from word go says xan would get ****ED.

and WHEN will people stop it with the zik init thing? it's a stupid arguement since init is worked out mainly by class.

(Pegs still fire after pulsars just like cutters do etc).

There are not many same ship class to same ship class battles inter race except with respects to FI and when do you see FI attacking against FI?

(if someone says Xan I'll shoot them, primary anti xan def is beetles anyway so the point is mute.

I don't care if brigs fire last, the only ship this would concern is Syrens... and you should be using buccs anyway, which if someone then says wyverns fire first falls into the second mis conception about the zik init. Zik have more armour and firepower than any other race on a ship by ship comparison so the point evens out.


People just don't think when they talk about zik init being bad.

[Aknot]

Terran will be the best choice

build chimera pegs and wyverns and noone will attack you (certainly not a zik..)

5chims (20%)
5pegs (40%) (and as many demeters you need)
1wyvern(40%)

I had a fleet like this in the speedround and owned both in defence and attacks.

[MAdnRisKy]

That would be you booted from my ally then. not a single ship to offer for defence??

[black-eyed boy]

Originally posted by MAdnRisKy
That would be you booted from my ally then. not a single ship to offer for defence??

Ditto.

Also ditto about people saying that zik init is bad

Yes, there will be plenty of terrans in r9.5 and some of them will do well. But there will also be ****loads of clever Bs/Cr based caths who will be owning those terrans. (No, your chims arent any good against it - they inflict **** all damage themselves and die as soon as guardians fire).

[Psi_K]

Originally posted by Aknot
Terran will be the best choice

build chimera pegs and wyverns and noone will attack you (certainly not a zik..)

5chims (20%)
5pegs (40%) (and as many demeters you need)
1wyvern(40%)

I had a fleet like this in the speedround and owned both in defence and attacks.

Chims pegs and wyvs vs my Cath Cr/Bs fleet.
GL.

[Ultimate Newbie]

I think a Cath CR fleet (with Beetles or as Symm suggested Spiders) will do well.

1) it will mostly come up against random fire
2) Fewer ziks will build Corsairs as they have a whole tech tree to pick from (corsairs being the #1 enemy of a CR fleet)
3) Alliance defence in the form of anti-Xan FI
4) Guardians :P
5) Tarants will do quite well against Clippers/buccs etc

need i go on?

[black-eyed boy]

Originally posted by Ultimate Newbie
5) Tarants will do quite well against Clippers/buccs etc

need i go on?

The main disadvantage I see in cath Bs/Cr fleet is it's vulnerability to De attacks.

"Quite well" = still no way enough to stop / scare off De attacks on you. Actually you'll be able to block max 50% of incoming De. That is if you spend a LOT of your score on tarants.

Another big disadvantage is vulnerability to xans - you think your guardians hurt them a lot but usually they dont hurt enough AND sentinels cause massive losses on your side even if attacker doesnt send a killfleet.


Still, for those who will find themselves in really active gals where defence swapping wont be a problem cath Bs/Cr is awesome. You can usually defend most of attacks on your galmates with your guardians only and your tarants rock against other Bs/Cr caths.

But I feel pity for caths in inactive gals as usually.

[MAdnRisKy]

A cath CR fleet you say?

Right I'm now going to insult you all so appologies in advance.

HOW THE HECK DO YOU PLAN ON BUILDING MORE THAN ABOUT 5 PODS WITH THE RESOURCES YOU WILL HAVE WHEN YOU PREPARE TO START ROIDING?

I'm sorry I had to shout that but its so blindingly obvious i'm amazed that the collective pool of inteligence I have come to admire from the regulars on this board have not spotted this.

You will be initing roids with your M. This means if you want a fast start you have 1 option sadly. Pegs.

(which is fine, I'll just churn out clippers and laugh at you, yes all 3 of my clippers yes all 3 you heard me, they will EAT YOU ALIVE!!!!!)


oh yes, and about those inactive random filled with free multi farm gals which you'll be relying on for defence for those meager few roids your top heavy pitifully small and not very scary fleet will have scrounged..... yes that's right THAT gal you will be begging to save you, which doesn't log in.

What are you going to do about that?


Cath CR, pfffffffffffffffffffft

a pox on your house!

[hyfe]

wether you build 10 astropod or 3 mantis isn't really the point is it?

Biggest problem with using cath CR/BS is normally thats its really difficult to get a significant amount of resources in them, since you start building them so late.

While you may still not like them, you have to agree they will be a better and more viable alternative now that the main obstruction from using them has disappeared?

[MAdnRisKy]

Originally posted by hyfe
wether you build 10 astropod or 3 mantis isn't really the point is it?

Biggest problem with using cath CR/BS is normally thats its really difficult to get a significant amount of resources in them, since you start building them so late.

While you may still not like them, you have to agree they will be a better and more viable alternative now that the main obstruction from using them has disappeared?

the cat pods are horribly expensive in terms of roid guns to cost ratio fyi. the flak is equally expensive, and just a meager few roaches (read every mo fo will go terran) is all it would take to stop you VERY cheaply. PLus the pods ain't the issue really yes, it's the pods plus flak, and the "i won't take losses" cathaar mentality which will mean that just a few lost cr would mean an instant recal on the part of the cat player. Come say tick 100 or so the cat can barely afford enough pods to get the roids for a full cap, never mind a decent proportion of flak for those pods PLUS the neccesasary guardians.

you see now?

(you smug pretencious crazy assed norge)

[SpazMonster]

Originally posted by hyfe
wether you build 10 astropod or 3 mantis isn't really the point is it?

Biggest problem with using cath CR/BS is normally thats its really difficult to get a significant amount of resources in them, since you start building them so late.

While you may still not like them, you have to agree they will be a better and more viable alternative now that the main obstruction from using them has disappeared?

while you have a major disadvantage to the cr roiding fleet removed, another (disadvantage) is introduced at the same time. In normal rounds, the lack of cr/bs targeting is to your advantage, however with the res/constr finished for everyone, and with just about everyone pushing for the larger ships, cr/bs targeters will be much more prevelant, negating the 'early' cr advantage.

[Iceaxe]

I'm going zik for 9.5 for because:

A. I've been cath, xan, terran

and

B. I really wanna get my hands on a cutter/clipper fleet

[-QS-]

Cutter/ Clipper only for me

[MAdnRisKy]

Originally posted by -QS-
Cutter/ Clipper only for me

by george I think they're learning!

anyone would think my speed game recommendations were rubbing off on people after Oly's litte demonstration

[at0mic.c0w]

Originally posted by MAdnRisKy
by george I think they're learning!

now that u have convinced 95% of the universe to go zik... what do u suggest to counter them

[General Martok]

Originally posted by MAdnRisKy
by george I think they're learning!

anyone would think my speed game recommendations were rubbing off on people after Oly's litte demonstration

Well my 3k cutters and 700 clipper 300 buccas got dried up by a tarant/quardian fleet in speedround Blocked totally and 300 guardians killed tons of frigs lost 2,5M of 5,5M then (before milscan that was)

[HRS]

and even worse, i lost 100s of cutters defending him:P

anyway, i "hated" the cr/bs fleets in the speedround, especially when they ran from my pirates(only bs i stole were wyverns) think i give it a try in this round

or maybe terran, have to play it some time i guess

[MAdnRisKy]

Originally posted by at0mic.c0w
now that u have convinced 95% of the universe to go zik... what do u suggest to counter them

(cat cr bs :/ but I wasn't going to say, damn you for spoiling my next cunning plan)

ps is this known as "doing a Nodrog"?

[Mi5]

if a lot of people go zik it will still be easy to own it, just have to choose what you build carefully.

"If" i play rnd9.5 i would def go zik

[Nat]

Originally posted by MAdnRisKy

ps is this known as "doing a Nodrog"?

LOL..

Zik's arnt that good.... everyone go Terran, i highly reccomend it

[MAdnRisKy]

Originally posted by Nat
LOL..

Zik's arnt that good.... everyone go Terran, i highly reccomend it

*chuckles

[Mi5]

yay go go terran ) you will own zik!!!!111

[Aknot]

Originally posted by Psi_K
Chims pegs and wyvs vs my Cath Cr/Bs fleet.
GL.

some pulsecannons or dragons should solve that problem easily, and btw, those chims might hurt you more then you think.

[General Martok]

Originally posted by Aknot
some pulsecannons or dragons should solve that problem easily, and btw, those chims might hurt you more then you think.

pds

That's why a cahtaar plyer should ahve friends, to defend him and to kill pds for him

BTW the lower pds classes are nicely killed by the widowmaker and quardian

[Sun Pin]

Originally posted by General Martok
BTW the lower pds classes are nicely killed by the widowmaker and quardian

but the lower pds classes doesnt target your BS/CR....so why you would even consider sending in widowmaker to kill a pds that dont target the ships you are sending?
(and yes, they were discussing cathaar CR/BS)

[Aknot]

its rubbish... cathar cruiser fleet is the easiest to defend against...some pulse cannons and you are ****ed... so if you want to go for it, build some avengers too.... they are better then their reputation...

[CrazyConrad]

Originally posted by storeslem
Cathaars will be very powerful indeed if they go cr/bs only

No spids/beets/roach to deff your allies with ??

[CrazyConrad]

Originally posted by MAdnRisKy
by george I think they're learning!

anyone would think my speed game recommendations were rubbing off on people after Oly's litte demonstration

Yaaayyy, Zik owned speed game \o/

Me and Desse attacked only with fr/de fleet and hardly anything could stop us.

I am xan now and it is truly ****

/me looks forward to play zik in rnd 9.5

[isildurx]

Ye i played ziks in the speedgame and it was pretty successfull.

The noly thing was that i didnt need much clippers, since 75% of all the players went xan :|

[CrazyConrad]

Originally posted by isildurx
Ye i played ziks in the speedgame and it was pretty successfull.

The noly thing was that i didnt need much clippers, since 75% of all the players went xan :|

True, but since majority of the universe will prolly go terran in rnd 9.5 the clippers will be quite useful

[dlpsycho]

You will find that no matter what race you are, you will have to start off building alot of small ships, but also build some big ships, because if you just build big ships to start with, you will be flooded by "numbers", likewise if you only build small ships, you'll be roided by the big Caths and Demeter ships.

Or you could just pour all you resources into reflectors!!!

[Lan]

my experience from this round with cath cr/bs fleet was that they always got def. the high eta was a huge disadvantage.

i wanna try a fleet with beetels/roch/bw/tulas/pods in r9,5.

a problem there is enemy BS, cause defenders aint very good vs them, (therefor i aint building them)

[Lan]

my experience from this round with cath cr/bs fleet was that they always got def. the high eta was a huge disadvantage.

i wanna try a fleet with beetels/roch/bw/tulas/pods.

a problem there is enemy BS, cause defenders aint very good vs them

[hyfe]

any combo with beetles/tulas is toss.... tulas shoot before beetles, so your tulas will spend their time mainly freezing FI.. quite a waste...

[Sun_Tzu]

for me it's ziko, I expect quite a few terrans and I like eating terrans(and zikos aren't very popular so less people to share your food with)

[MadeMan]

by the looks here, it will be impossibel to get def from allies, as u all wanna build fr/de/cr/bs fleets everyone off you.

i will atleast ahve some beetle & roach to def my allies with.

pluss tara mantis and scorps..

[MadeMan]

Originally posted by hyfe
any combo with beetles/tulas is toss.... tulas shoot before beetles, so your tulas will spend their time mainly freezing FI.. quite a waste...

well taras dont target fi's before T3, so they are left back(most off them atelast)

But who uses beetle in attack??

[MAdnRisKy]

anyone who also attacks with roach and bw.....

[black-eyed boy]

Considering there are 72 ticks of protection...

Everyone starts with 24 roids, mines producing 4.5k of each resources and most of the quests completed. This is a set up for a mad initiation race which will last until protection ends.. People will have a lot of roids then, 100-200 or more if they just want to initiate more.

But. Caths that want to attack straight out of protection and want to use their ace Bs/Cr fleet must order ships 24hrs before protection end which is tick 48. + people have to save for a while before ordering ships. Nasty for caths unless they start off attacking with Fr fleet.
16 hrs to build pegs / dems isnt too few time either. My guess is first terran attacks will be with pegs/dems only which will lead to defending them ingal with clippers.
12 hrs for ziks to build a roiding fleet is pretty quickly, but indeed it's xans who will have the advantage of very early roiding, they only need 8 hours to build the roiding fleet and flack.

I know you might think those differences aren't very important, but clever people know the price of 16/8/4 extra ticks in the first 100 ticks or so

[MegaNova]

Ill go xan just becouse almost all of you will be building anti fr/de/cr/bs defence when i see all of you talking.
atm i havent heared many ppl say that they will go xan.
so if there aint many xans there wont be many pegs or annoying beetle/spid fleets to def against you.
and xans have the advantage that they are eta7. and thats pretty annoying for a random gal becouse not all the ppl will tell their alliances to the galaxy mates.

[isildurx]

yep m8


im sorta toying with that idea atm too

its not fun to stop xans right after the stat, seeing as they can grow a pretty decent army fairly quick.

and most ppl will go for DE\CR fleets, making em too slow to def agaisnt xans


and one can fake to :P

[aza1]

so i take it your retracting your "dumb enough to go xan" comment?

[MegaNova]

Originally posted by aza1
so i take it your retracting your "dumb enough to go xan" comment?

one of the reasons for me going xan would be to show isil its possible to be a "dumb" player and outclass him

[isildurx]

Originally posted by aza1
so i take it your retracting your "dumb enough to go xan" comment?

weeeell

theoretically speaking xan shud be in somewhat deep **** imo

but IF, people start building mostly DEand CR killers, xans can be effective.

thats a big IF thou, so to an extent i'may' have been wrong P