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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:17   #1
Radical Edward
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bad spelling

Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a total mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe.

I think this is really
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:19   #2
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Re: bad spelling

thats old research.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:22   #3
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
thats old research.

so. it is still and that was the point of this thread, to highlight the coolness of the research.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:25   #4
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Re: bad spelling

but surely everyone knows that we recognise words by shapes and not letters?

thats why you make mistakes when you skim read.

get someone to write a word then traceround the outside and see if you can guess what the word is.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:34   #5
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
but surely everyone knows that we recognise words by shapes and not letters?

thats why you make mistakes when you skim read.

get someone to write a word then traceround the outside and see if you can guess what the word is.
aRe yOU SUre youR thEory sTanDs uP to ClOSer scRUtiny?
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:37   #6
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Re: bad spelling

yes, i think it does, unless your a 13 year old girl who likes to type like that?

are you a 13 year old girl?
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:38   #7
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
but surely everyone knows that we recognise words by shapes and not letters?

thats why you make mistakes when you skim read.

get someone to write a word then traceround the outside and see if you can guess what the word is.
I would suggest that the problem then is that you are converting from letters to an "image" (since much of the letter information is lost, it is no longer recognised as a language). different areas of the brain operate on different image types.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:40   #8
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
unless your a 13 year old girl
quoted for irony
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:42   #9
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Re: bad spelling

did you try it?

The cambridge theory only has basis if the words are in context. Out of context, a lot of words could be anything.

Such as:

rlelay
dlinag


edit: for syntax error in second sentence
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:44   #10
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
did you try it?
If people recognise words 'by shape', how do you explain the fact that they can easily recognise words written in a mixture of upper/lower case letters, and non-standard fonts, which both involve giving words radically different shapes than the ones they normally have.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:46   #11
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Re: bad spelling

its more difficult to, that is why newspapers use serif fonts for their body type, because it makes word shapes easier to define.

Im a journalist, i had to study this crap
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:47   #12
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
did you try it?

The cambridge theory only has basis if the words are in context. Out of context, a lot of words could be anything.

Such as:

rlelay
dlinag


edit: for syntax error in second sentence
good shot.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:49   #13
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
its more difficult to, that is why newspapers use serif fonts for their body type, because it makes word shapes easier to define.

Im a journalist, i had to study this crap
link plz
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:54   #14
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
link plz
someone did a study on it in my first year. From what I recall, he is correct in that some fonts are easier to read than others (not entirely suprising). On the issue of "word shape" I am not so sure though. Shapes and images are analysed in the left hemisphere of the brain, wheras the language center is on the right. If Nofutcha was correct then a stroke in either side of the brain in the relevant areas would impact on the ability to read, wheras so far as I know, it does not (in phonetic or sound based written languages)

I could however be entirely wrong in this, it is just extrapolation from what bits I know.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 08:55   #15
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radical Edward
someone did a study on it in my first year. From what I recall, he is correct in that some fonts are easier to read than others (not entirely suprising).
That could simply because of letter shapes - it certainly doesnt lend evidence to support a theory that words are partially conceptualised in terms of their shape.

edit: why dont people notice typoes more often then?
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 09:06   #16
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
That could simply because of letter shapes - it certainly doesnt lend evidence to support a theory that words are partially conceptualised in terms of their shape.

edit: why dont people notice typoes more often then?
yeap, hence I presented a counter argument in terms of brain damage. typoes would also be another counter argument, as would the whole of the opening paragraph (since the total word shape is entirely different to what it would be if the words were spelled correctly)
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 09:10   #17
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Re: bad spelling

well im not saying my theories are rock solid and they are the only reasons behind why we read like we do.

But pick up any newspaper and you will see that the body type is serif, headlines are sans-serif or serif, depending on the paper, because headlines are usually so big that it doesnt matter.

I cant offer a link because i wouldnt know where to find one, i did it at journalism school. I also cant quote any names/theorists cause all my notes are still in transit to me. (i just moved towns)
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 09:21   #18
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Re: bad spelling

yeah, but that is just letter identification, not word identification. the two are quite separate concepts, as is sentence identification, grammar and the rest....
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 09:25   #19
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Re: bad spelling

surely letter identification is tied in to word identification, and surely word identification is tied in to sentence identification and grammar.

I made my 'in context' point before. If things are in context then they are muc easier to read. Anyone who has learnt shorthand will know this concept well.

Anyways i made all my points i think, anything else i say will be hastily made theories full of holes. Take what you like from them, and disregard what you dont.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 09:29   #20
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nofutcha
surely letter identification is tied in to word identification, and surely word identification is tied in to sentence identification and grammar.

I made my 'in context' point before. If things are in context then they are muc easier to read. Anyone who has learnt shorthand will know this concept well.

Anyways i made all my points i think, anything else i say will be hastily made theories full of holes. Take what you like from them, and disregard what you dont.

well word identification is necessary in order to identify a sentence, and letter identification is necessary in order to identify a word. this doesn't mean that you can take the principles of letter identification and apply them to all the rest however, otherwise you end up (to take a hyperbole) recognising an entire novel from it's shape.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 09:34   #21
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Re: bad spelling

yeah, thats an area i know nothing about, so i'd rather not comment.

Maybe i will look into the sides of our brains and stuff and research this properly.
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 19:19   #22
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radical Edward
Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a total mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe.

I think this is really
it's been in my signature since 1978
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Unread 13 Nov 2003, 19:32   #23
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Re: bad spelling

This thread is a deju vu zone
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Unread 14 Nov 2003, 14:44   #24
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Re: bad spelling

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Originally Posted by the dying puppy
it's been in my signature since 1978
well signiatures in my account have been turned off since 1977.
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Unread 15 Nov 2003, 14:15   #25
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Re: bad spelling

wlel, if tihs is ture tehn due to rsercaeh stietaud form the hpisehytos of tohse iilleetnngt sttiisencs at Cgdbriame Uiitvernsy you sohuld not hvae any pomerlbs apemtttnig to depehcir tihs.good lcuk poplee of Gaeernl Dosssuciin.

hhaa get taht you scagbums.
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Unread 15 Nov 2003, 16:12   #26
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superpig #1
wlel, if tihs is ture tehn due to rsercaeh stietaud form the hpisehytos of tohse iilleetnngt sttiisencs at Cgdbriame Uiitvernsy you sohuld not hvae any pomerlbs apemtttnig to depehcir tihs.good lcuk poplee of Gaeernl Dosssuciin.

hhaa get taht you scagbums.
Read it at normal reading speed.
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Unread 15 Nov 2003, 16:19   #27
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Re: bad spelling

I kinda agree with mr Superpig here. When you start using words that aren't used on a daily basis you might not recognise the pattern. I'm not a native English speaker, so a few occurences in that sentence make no sense to me whatsoever, although I can read most of it quite normally.
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Unread 15 Nov 2003, 16:24   #28
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Re: bad spelling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Structural Integrity
I kinda agree with mr Superpig here. When you start using words that aren't used on a daily basis you might not recognise the pattern. I'm not a native English speaker, so a few occurences in that sentence make no sense to me whatsoever, although I can read most of it quite normally.
I actually DO use words like hypothesis regularly though.
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