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Unread 4 May 2005, 17:03   #1
G.K Zhukov
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UK faking its unemployment statistics?
According to the UN statistics I found that from 1990 to 2003 there has been a decline in the unemployment rate in the UK from 6.9 to 4.9%.

However, I found that there has been as little as 1.276.000 more jobs created in that period, when at the same time there was 2.550.000 more inhabitants.
This doesnt add up.
However, I've read somewhere that becouse of the political "complications" with a unemployment (looks bad for the politicians etc) the way the UK unemployment rate has been changed 18 times the last two decades.

Can anyone please help me here?
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Unread 4 May 2005, 17:12   #2
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
I expect you're right, Zhukov.

Actually, if I remember correctly, the Blair Government changed the method of measuring the number of unemployed from the number of people out of work to the number claiming Jobseekers' Allowance.

Obviously the latter is a lower number. Handy that, when it comes to meeting targets.
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Unread 4 May 2005, 17:18   #3
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
employment targets are stupid.
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Unread 4 May 2005, 18:09   #4
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Yet again, someone on GD provides us with a new and exciting insight into the world we live in.
At your discretion, replace 'new' with 'well known' and 'exciting' with 'dull'.
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Unread 4 May 2005, 18:19   #5
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Unemployment has as such fallen due to demographic shifts; Britain has an ageing populace, and you will find that even if Britain has had 2.5 million new inhabitants to 1.5 million new jobs, as long as more people are leaving the labour market (by retiring, because they're old) than entering it (by seeking work, because they're young), the rate of unemployment is going to fall.

Labour has, however, changed the way it's measured. They switched from one system (possibly claimant count - I can't actually remember) to a system where they phone up an accurate cross-section of the populace (gender, age, class, etc) and ask them if they've been seeking work and for how long they've been doing so. Any current method of compiling unemployment figures can be seen as underestimating the true figure. While I can't remember what the previous system was, I'm fairly sure that the present system generally returns a higher figure than it did.
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Unread 4 May 2005, 18:27   #6
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
The method that the British government uses is provided by the Labour Force Survey. This is defined as people who are without a job but have actively sought work in the last four weeks and are available to start work within the next two weeks. Or those who are out of work but have found a job which they are starting within the next two weeks. An alternate method used in the UK is the claimant count method which records how many people are claiming unemployment benefits. In March 2003 the LFS said UK unemployment was 5.1%(1.5million people) while the claimant count said 3.1%(0.937 million ).

As for the unemployment % not adding up. It could just be a lot of them extra 2.5million people are not of working age therefore do not count in unemployment statistics. One example would be the incresae in early retirement which takes them people out of the unemployment lists. In areasa such as Merthyr and other south Wales valleys there has also been a huge increase in the long term sick with things like back problems or depression which are hard to diagnose. These people also get removed from the unemployed lists which helps reduce the figures.
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Unread 4 May 2005, 18:46   #7
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
why would anyone care?
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Unread 4 May 2005, 18:51   #8
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Countries have e-penises too?
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Unread 4 May 2005, 19:17   #9
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
why would anyone care?
Couse comparing UK to Germany is part of my thesis?
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Unread 4 May 2005, 19:22   #10
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
Couse comparing UK to Germany is part of my thesis?
sorry i should have made it clear.

why would anyone else care?
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Unread 4 May 2005, 19:23   #11
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
Couse comparing UK to Germany is part of my thesis?
Economically? I'm assuming you're not comparing every single facet of the UK and germany. I doubt there's a university course in that for one, although this might be some kind of night thing you do in between polar bear fights I'm unsure
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Unread 4 May 2005, 19:26   #12
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
why would anyone care?
We care a Lot.

GD - Home of People Who Care
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Unread 4 May 2005, 21:10   #13
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Also when you have been out of work for 6 months you are pushed onto the New Deal Scheme. As part of this they will try and push you to attend a 6 month training scheme. The company running the training will have you there for a couple of days to work towards qualifications and the rest of the time they find you a unpaid work placement to gain you some practical experiance to go with your qualification. Now those on this scheme are considered to now be in work even though they are still claiming benifits, as far as the figures are concerned your working for the training agency. I dont know how many people are on such schemes at one time but with each one having atleast 50 people at one time and more people apparently being sent on such things there has to be a fair amount of those unemplyed who arent on the figures
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Unread 4 May 2005, 21:30   #14
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Economically? I'm assuming you're not comparing every single facet of the UK and germany. I doubt there's a university course in that for one, although this might be some kind of night thing you do in between polar bear fights I'm unsure
Certainly not. I've chosen GDP per capita and unemployment rate as the two main things.
My thesis is named "The relative decline of the german economy 1990-2003".
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Unread 5 May 2005, 00:10   #15
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Exclamation Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
Certainly not. I've chosen GDP per capita and unemployment rate as the two main things.
My thesis is named "The relative decline of the german economy 1990-2003".
The Telegraph had an article a couple of months ago on the German decline in GDP per capita.
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Unread 5 May 2005, 13:19   #16
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tactitus
The Telegraph had an article a couple of months ago on the German decline in GDP per capita.
Every newspaper on this planet have had an article about Germany's GDP the last 3 months
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Unread 5 May 2005, 16:33   #17
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
The Lincolnshire Echo?

I think not.
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Unread 5 May 2005, 17:22   #18
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
I agree with the following 2 posts:

Quote:
Originally Posted by onetwothree
employment targets are stupid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
why would anyone care?
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Unread 5 May 2005, 17:24   #19
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
I agree with the following 2 posts:

me too.

also

"There are three kinds
of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics." Mark Twain.
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Unread 5 May 2005, 17:34   #20
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
Anyone have any links to newspaper articles or anything about this "tampering" with the UK unemployment rate?
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Unread 18 May 2005, 23:38   #21
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Re: UK faking its unemployment statistics?
I have no idea if you still need the information but

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4558191.stm

could be useful for you.
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