Donnie Darko (spoillller even though it's "old")

[Bloomers III]

I watched this yesterday and it's a very good btu very weird film, and I've got on question that maybe you can help me with. Now I think that the reason he dies at the end is becuase it's a parallel universe and the jet engine comes off the plane (that his mum and sister are in) and it goes through a wormhole to the other universe which is 28 days etc. behind and kills him in that. So in the one we were watching most of the time he's living and is saved by the rabbit (which is my question) and the one at the end is the other universe that he dies in.

But my question is about the rabbit. I am assuming the rabbit is from the future of the universe we see throughout most of the film. But I also think the rabbit has travelled back in time but in that case how come only Donnie could see him? (Which porbably means i'm wrong) I don't know how Donnie could know the future that the rabbit is telling him (which means I don't know how he could imagine it), because he hasn't seen the future. So where is this rabbit from? And also why is the rabbit the guy he kills at the end?!

apart from this integral part i "get it" i "think"


+ I've been listening to the song at the end (Mad World by Gary Jules) for about an hour and i'm feeling very "solemn" and crap

[Dante Hicks]

Wasn't the Rabbit simply part of his delusions/mental illness?

[Ragnarak]

i have to post in this thread even if i cba to comment

[LHC]

I thought Frank (the rabbit) was one of his delusions, but he was a special kid who had special powers to see the future, and this power was personified in the form of Frank.


Or something equally strange.

[Bloomers III]

maybe then he can see into the future, but i don't like that explanation because it sucks they mentioned time travel and unless it was just the jet engine that did i would like to think Frank did aswell.

[MrL_JaKiri]

It's like It's A Wonderful Life or whatever it's called. In that film, an angel shows the protagonist what things would be like if he had died, and because they're 'worse', he chooses to live.

In Donnie Darko, Donnie sees what things would be like if he had lived.

[Ragnarak]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
It's like It's A Wonderful Life or whatever it's called. In that film, an angel shows the protagonist what things would be like if he had died, and because they're 'worse', he chooses to live.

In Donnie Darko, Donnie sees what things would be like if he had lived.

You summarised in 3 lines what would take a full length essay to even begin to explain properly

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by Ragnarak
You summarised in 3 lines what would take a full length essay to even begin to explain properly

I love being me.

[Ragnarak]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
I love being me.

it wasn't a good thing

[Bloomers III]

hmmm i've cheated and read something on the internet

There is the real universe and when a jet engine comes from the future it creates a tangent universe which will end in 28 days and will also destroy the real universe. because donnie was closest to this when it happened he is chosen to send the engine back through time to close the tangent universe. Frank is a premonition of the future who leads him to this situation where this happens and so the tangent universe is closed but that means that he has to sacrifice his own life but I don't know why.

1. The Philosophy Of Time Travel
The Philosophy Of Time Travel book that is given to Donnie directly explains most of what happens in the movie. However, as we aren't told whats in the book, the events in the film are left unexplained. A copy of the book can be found on Donniedarko.com. Unfortunately, its a bit difficult to find, so click here to open a copy in a separate window.

2. So What Happened?
A jet engine from the future crashes into Donnie's house and triggers a parallel world, which will end in 28 days. Frank is sent to warn Donnie of the end of the world, and help guide him into a position where he will send the engine back through time, closing the parallel time frame, and saving the world. Frank is basically a premonition from the future, as Donnie kills Frank at the end of the film. Donnie is manipulated into situations which will eventually leave him no choice but to send the engine back through time. He meets Gretchen, which proves to him that he doesn't have to die alone (one of his fears), and makes him less scared of death. He burns down Cunnighams house, which leads events to making his mother go on the trip with his sister, thereby setting up the plane in the correct position to deposit its engine into the black hole. His shrink also admits that Donnies medication are placebos, indicating he's not as mad as he thinks (this is on the DVD as a deleted scene). As the climax begins to unfold, Donnie unwittingly gets Gretchen killed, and realises that his mother and family will also die if he doesn't close up the black hole. In closing the black hole, Donnie sacrifices himself, saves Gretchen from being killed, and because he doesn't burn down Cunninghams house, saves his mother from being on the plane (as the other mother could take the kids on the trip instead). He also doesn't kill Frank. In closing the black hole, everybody then wakes up on what would be back on the 1st of October (the start of the movie) and to the news that Donnie has died from a jet engine landing on him.

3. Events Explained By The Philosophy Of Time Travel
The book explains of the Primary Universe (real life) and a Tangent Universe (like a parallel universe). When the fourth dimension of time is broken, a Tangent Universe occurs, and is unstable. Hence the world ending in 28 days time. If the Tangent Universe ends, then the world ends, the Tangent Universe basically swallowing the world up in a black hole.

The Tangent Universe occurs when an Artifact passes into the Primary Universe. The Arifact (as explained in the book) is usually metal, and its whereabouts cannot be explained. The jet engine that crashes into Donnie's house is the artifact. Obviously the engine has come from the future, and triggers a Tangent Universe, which Donnie has to close to enable the world to return to normality.

Donnie is identified as the Living Receiver, as the person nearest to the vortex when the engine appeared. Its Donnies job to send the artifact back through time to close the Tangent Universe black hole. Apparently he has "special powers" - is this to do with his time-manipulation and visions, or just cos he's schizophrenic? It would also help explain how the axe got in the bronze statue.

Everyone around him become "The Manipulated" and are basically there to guide Donnie (as the Living Receiver) on a path to make sure he uses his powers to close the black hole. Karen (Drew Barrymore), Monotoff (Wyle) and Roberta Sparrow are manipulated living, Karen dropping some large clues for Donnie throughout (again, see Drews deleted scenes on the DVD for more stuff). Frank is The Manipulated Dead, a premonition from the future used to give Donnie guidance. His job is to put Donnie into a position where he has no choice but to save the world. The Ensurance Trap is set when not only Gretchen is killed, but when Donnie realises his mother and sister will die in the plane crash, and when he kills Frank (revealed as Elizabeths boyfriend). If he sacrifices himself, everyone else will live. Gretchen is also a Manipulated Dead, though less obvious than Frank. She too dies within the Tangent, and is there to help Donnie (see Gretchen's Comment below).

In closing the rift, and being killed by the engine, the Manipulated all awake from the parallel time frame back at the start of the movie (or 1st Oct). The appearance of the engine will never be explained.

5. The Time Line Explained
The Tangent Universe/time line in the movie works in a straight line, and not a loop. The jet engine opens the Tangent Universe on October 1st. Everything that then happens in the movie is within the Tangent Universe. Donnie has to close the universe to stop the world from being destroyed. The Tangent Universe is closed by sending the original artifact (jet engine) back through the black hole created by the Tangent. So when Donnie sends the engine back, when it finally crashes into his bedroom for the second time, the Tangent Universe is closed. The time line goes back to Oct 1st and carries on in a completely different time line. Everything that happened in the Tangent Universe is "cancelled". The engine won't crash again, people won't be killed. However, this does mean Jim Cunninghams secret may not be discovered (however, see details from the Donnie Darko site below).





6. Gretchen's Comment
Twice in the movie, Gretchen makes reference to going back in time, and placing good things in the past. The second time this happens is before Donnie drives off in the car, before placing the engine in the black hole. Possibly misconstrued as a throwaway comment on first viewing, it becomes more significant second time round, especially when you realise whats actually happening.

[MrL_JaKiri]

I prefer my explanation, as then it's good drama rather than really really bad sci fi

[isildurx]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
I prefer my explanation, as then it's good drama rather than really really bad sci fi

Yeah, twas a nice explanation.

Dunno if its right though.

Im tempted to watch the movie again, since its a wicked film.

[Zar]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
I prefer my explanation, as then it's good drama rather than really really bad sci fi

your explanation is uhm, well not very good as far as im concerned.

the way i see it, is that basically, the vortex that was created was an anomaly. that is why the plane ended up at donnies house, even though the planes flight path was no where near donnies house.

this explains why the FBI or whatever they are called in this film are all over the house, very suspicious and confused. Donnie escapes death, which in theory he shouldnt have.

You see the whole concept is about time travel and there is an element of spirituality in it.

When Donnie laughs at the end, it is probably because he realises that everything is inevtiable. He has to die, to correct the anomaly, because if donnie doesnt die, then his entire family die, because of the vortex. Thus to correct the anomaly donnie created in the parallel universe by not dying, he has to correct in the other universe. Frank leads Donnie to a series of events that will allow him to accept and understand this.

Make any sense? - this is a very cut short version of a long explanation...

Zar

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by Zar
When Donnie laughs at the end, it is probably because he realises that everything is inevtiable. He has to die, to correct the anomaly, because if donnie doesnt die, then his entire family die, because of the vortex. Thus to correct the anomaly donnie created in the parallel universe by not dying, he has to correct in the other universe. Frank leads Donnie to a series of events that will allow him to accept and understand this.

The same evidence could be used for mine, so it's not exactly a persuasive argument.

[MAdnRisKy]

Donnie is a certified paranoid schizophrenic.

pls don't forget this when you anaylse the film. He was before the jet, and he was after the jet.

incidentally the bunny is almost completely irelevant.

[Structural Integrity]

I thought I understood the movie... looks like I have to watch it again some day.

[Cmdr_Cyrax]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
It's like It's A Wonderful Life or whatever it's called. In that film, an angel shows the protagonist what things would be like if he had died, and because they're 'worse', he chooses to live.

In Donnie Darko, Donnie sees what things would be like if he had lived.

The only trouble I have with this explaination is that there is no reason why Donnie needs to know he died, unless you see him hanging around in the afterlife whinging 'its not fair,' etc.

I also have a problem with the 'official explaination'. All the talk about Donnie 'sending the jet engine back in time to close the tangent universe' seems a bit strange though: at no point does donnie interfere with the course of the plane. The only thing that changes because of his actions is that his mother is on the plane...

[MrL_JaKiri]

My one can be explained as 'It's good film making, and clever'. I've already commented on the other possibility.

[seventh]

www.donniedarko.com

big mo****er website. will teach you a lot about the tangent universe and most happenings in the film

if you havent watched the film yet, read the website first.

[Cmdr_Cyrax]

Originally posted by seventh
www.donniedarko.com

big mo****er website. will teach you a lot about the tangent universe and most happenings in the film

if you havent watched the film yet, read the website first.

Where do you go from level 3 after there's the exert from the london communication?

lost

[seventh]

sorry for bringing this back up but there is a lot more info in this thread than the other.

basically you finish level 3, watch the film and then read the book on time travel.

Frank the bunny:

Frank the bunny is Frank, the guy who runs over gretchin, the reason he exists in donnies head is because he doesnt want to be shot in the head, he is an animated dead as he dies.

basically, frank comes back from teh future (after being shot in the face) to stop donnie getting gretchin and himself killed, the reason he is able to come back to tell donnie is because he is animated dead (i think thats the right word) but he is really just an underlying thing

the reason donnie then gets crushed by the jet engine is because he believes that gretchin and franks lives are worth more than his own.

[KoeN]

timetravel?!




:eek:

[MrPeach]

Originally posted by Dante Hicks
Wasn't the Rabbit simply part of his delusions/mental illness?

Donnie wasn't actually mentally ill. The drugs prescribed to him were in fact placebos.

I'm not sure if this was in the movie or on the DVD extras bit.

[Cmdr_Cyrax]

Originally posted by MrPeach
Donnie wasn't actually mentally ill. The drugs prescribed to him were in fact placebos.

I'm not sure if this was in the movie or on the DVD extras bit.

This doesnt make sence.

Do you actually know what placebo means?

[MrPeach]

Originally posted by Cmdr_Cyrax
This doesnt make sence.

Do you actually know what placebo means?

yes, you fag.

[inf]

placeo are a band!

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by inf
placeo are a band!

Molkotastic!

[Dante Hicks]

Originally posted by MrPeach
Donnie wasn't actually mentally ill. The drugs prescribed to him were in fact placebos.

He must have had some kind of problem to be prescribed them in the first place (depression, etc).

[MrPeach]

Originally posted by Dante Hicks
He must have had some kind of problem to be prescribed them in the first place (depression, etc).

The point is...

His doctor didn't believe he was mental.

He was not mental.

That is the point.

[Cmdr_Cyrax]

Originally posted by Dante Hicks
He must have had some kind of problem to be prescribed them in the first place (depression, etc).

My point exactly,

Yer wasting your breath, mate. He's oviously too far gone to hear.

[DrNick]

Originally posted by Bloomers III
I watched this yesterday and it's a very good btu very weird film, and I've got on question that maybe you can help me with. Now I think that the reason he dies at the end is becuase it's a parallel universe and the jet engine comes off the plane (that his mum and sister are in) and it goes through a wormhole to the other universe which is 28 days etc. behind and kills him in that. So in the one we were watching most of the time he's living and is saved by the rabbit (which is my question) and the one at the end is the other universe that he dies in.

But my question is about the rabbit. I am assuming the rabbit is from the future of the universe we see throughout most of the film. But I also think the rabbit has travelled back in time but in that case how come only Donnie could see him? (Which porbably means i'm wrong) I don't know how Donnie could know the future that the rabbit is telling him (which means I don't know how he could imagine it), because he hasn't seen the future. So where is this rabbit from? And also why is the rabbit the guy he kills at the end?!

apart from this integral part i "get it" i "think"


+ I've been listening to the song at the end (Mad World by Gary Jules) for about an hour and i'm feeling very "solemn" and crap

Donnie is at the point where the engine has been sent to at the end of the film at the start. He continues on his path to exact same point as when he drops the engine on himeself because he loves the girl. On his jorney he is haunted by the image of the boy he kills near the end for killing his girlfriend. He is a person indirectly aware of his own fate.

[MrPeach]

Originally posted by Cmdr_Cyrax
My point exactly,

Yer wasting your breath, mate. He's oviously too far gone to hear.

That wasn't your point at all you idiot.

If that was a point you could have said.

And my point was clear, and it was then explained. Your point was nothing to do with what Dante asked, you said I hadn't made sense... And considering your bad spelling, don't question my knowledge of the english language.

Messages like that are unappreciated

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by MrPeach
That wasn't your point at all you idiot.

It was the point that I got from his statement.

[inf]

The point was clear and concise, Cmdr_Cyrax is a cripple!

[MrPeach]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
It was the point that I got from his statement.

He didn't qualify his statement at all. He said I didn't make sense. Fullstop.

With criticism must come justification.

And considering my statement, within itself made literal sense, he was wrong.

Within a context it may not have made sense, hence my explanation... I was only stating what was shown on the DVD, not making a particular point of my own.

Donnie was not mentally ill, but had been sent to a doctor as others thought he was, the professional believed him to be sane so gave him placebos.

It's not hard.

[Cmdr_Cyrax]

Originally posted by MrPeach
That wasn't your point at all you idiot.

If that was a point you could have said.

And my point was clear, and it was then explained. Your point was nothing to do with what Dante asked, you said I hadn't made sense... And considering your bad spelling, don't question my knowledge of the english language.

Messages like that are unappreciated

I'm sorry if my point was unclear; i was just assuming that from your previous post that you thought Donnie wasn't mentally ill because he was on placebos:

Originally posted by MrPeach
Donnie wasn't actually mentally ill. The drugs prescribed to him were in fact placebos.

Placebos being the 'control' of a drug experiment, didn't mean he wasn't mentally ill; it meant he wasn't getting treatment for his illness.

I'm actually suprised the shrink actually knew the pills Donnie was taking were placebos, usually knowledge of who is getting what, is withheld from all concerned to prevent any subconcious tampering of results...



And Inf: please **** off and die, ta.

[MrPeach]

Ok, you obviously don't know what a placebo is then.

A placebo is a drug that contains no medication.

fs.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by MrPeach
Ok, you obviously don't know what a placebo is then.

A placebo is a drug that contains no medication.

fs.

From the OED:

'A placebo is a blank samble used as a control in testing new drugs'.

It appears he was referring to that definition, and he was right when saying you didn't know what a placebo was.

It can also be a 'pill, medicine, etc, prescribed for psychological reasons but having no physiological effect', which doesn't apply if the doctor thinks Donnie isn't crazy, because there aren't any psychological effects required.

[Cmdr_Cyrax]

Originally posted by MrPeach
Ok, you obviously don't know what a placebo is then.

A placebo is a drug that contains no medication.

fs.

A drug that contains no medication?????????????????????????????

Now answer me, why would this 'drug that contains no medication' be given to someone?

[queball]

Originally posted by Cmdr_Cyrax

Placebos being the 'control' of a drug experiment, didn't mean he wasn't mentally ill; it meant he wasn't getting treatment for his illness.

That's one use of the word.
If you aren't familiar with psychology, and you haven't seen the DVD, you should really try not to be so dismissive. Like maybe look up "placebo" in a non-scientific dictionary.

[queball]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
From the OED:

'A placebo is a blank samble used as a control in testing new drugs'.

It appears he was referring to that definition, and he was right when saying you didn't know what a placebo was.

It can also be a 'pill, medicine, etc, prescribed for psychological reasons but having no physiological effect', which doesn't apply if the doctor thinks Donnie isn't crazy, because there aren't any psychological effects required.

"psychology" "psychiatry"
two different words

[Cmdr_Cyrax]

Originally posted by queball
That's one use of the word.
If you aren't familiar with psychology, and you haven't seen the DVD, you should really try not to be so dismissive. Like maybe look up "placebo" in a non-scientific dictionary.

This is true.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by queball
"psychology" "psychiatry"
two different words

Indeed.

However, any psychiatric effect will be either due to physiological or psychologial reasons.

[MrPeach]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...+darko+placebo

As I said, I was only relaying a point made in the movie.

MrL_Jakiri... considering the second definition you gave pretty much fits into the context I was refering to, what are you on about?

My point was that he wasn't mental. The placebo was given to him to reassure him, as he was clearly disturbed by what was happening to him... But the doctor did not believe him to be dillusional, and therefore not mental/insane.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by MrPeach
My point was that he wasn't mental. The placebo was given to him to reassure him, as he was clearly disturbed by what was happening to him... But the doctor did not believe him to be dillusional, and therefore not mental/insane.

That's a psychiatric rather than a psychological effect.

And I wouldn't like to go to a psychiatrist who prescribed pills, placebo or no, for noninsane people.

[MrPeach]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
That's a psychiatric rather than a psychological effect.

And I wouldn't like to go to a psychiatrist who prescribed pills, placebo or no, for noninsane people.

The main point is, common usage of the word placebo is a drug with no effect...

And that is more important than some ****ty dictionary.

Making my point valid... and your arguments against me utter pointless.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by MrPeach
The main point is, common usage of the word placebo is a drug with no effect...

No it isn't.

[MrPeach]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
No it isn't.

Well, yes it is. However, it really doesn't matter, right or wrong, that is what happens in the film.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally posted by MrPeach
Well, yes it is. However, it really doesn't matter, right or wrong, that is what happens in the film.

The more I find out about what the filmmakers meant, the less I like the film.

[inf]

précis

• MrPeach was correct and any argument against him was in vain.
• Cmdr_Cyrax has disfunctional limbs.