[Tietäjä]

Right, round two.

Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk

I don't think that's much different from the system we currently have, in which the West collectively believes it deserves the ridiculous wealth it has accumulated while paying little to no need to the plight of the truly poor in the world. Here, the right is only a little more blatant in its disregard to suffering than the left is.

Things like aid to Africa are bits and pieces used to sooth the conscience due to the fact that nobody genuinely cares. "Time jesum transeuntum et non riverentum", as per the Dirty Three, there are very very few altruists around, and those that appear altruistic are probably also masochistic.

I think it's interesting that a right wing coalition party would be interested in discussing a citizen's wage at all. It's not on the mainstream political agenda here, not even for the left, let alone for the right.

They're in it for practical reasons. And uncanny knives. The system currently is fairly complicated and somewhat not very fair (between people receiving subsidies; there can be a thin red line between getting one and not getting). Their main incentive to it is to cut the costs of a heavy complex system.

So how do they afford it now? I think the mistake (not yours, but theirs) here is one of degree. A citizen's wage cannot support our desired standard of living (and probably never will be able to), it can merely support a required standard of living, plus a little extra. If you want 3 children, or go on holidays twice a year, or want to live in an expensive Helsinki appartment, you're going to have to make it happen yourself, just like you do now.

You can afford a lot of things by raising earnings income tax rate. For me, a 1000+ adds level would mean an earnings income tax increase of 15-20% (on their progressions, depending on the adds levels).

We're not 'better as humans', but we are better at using those gadgets, not to mention that our civilization (again, focusing on the West) has a degree of stability that, for example, allows us to set up systems that will provide us with a pension in 40-70 years from now.

However, those reasons are themselves probably also caused by the same technological advances that have driven the rest of human progress.

Interwoven, dramatically. The education-technology -drive.

It makes me wonder though: if the current phase of exponential growth is due to technology, how long can that continue?

For the sake of all the poor in Africa and China, let's pray it can last long and accelerate. We've got little alternatives.

The other is more subjective: we in the West have been in a unique position of privilege in that a succession of global economic, political and scientific events put us far ahead of the rest of the world, in a way that we never had been before. Now that balance seems to be shifting back into the direction of Asia (as it's historically been), which brings up the question: how much longer we'll continued to be the preferred place for investment? I don't feel qualified to answer that question, so I won't (but I'm interested in yours).

I don't think it's a question of nationalism anymore. I believe it's a question of a direction towards a "corporatocracy". But it's another massive a subject.

I don't think that the average xenophobe welcomes immigrants that work, as the prototypical "they're taking our jobs!" illustrates. Interestingly, that sentiment, though distasteful to me, is not actually wrong: an increase of the size of the work force will tend to cause a reduction in wages (though other factors may hold that back or even prevent it altogether). Here too, inequality is largely to blame: a world in which a large portion of the population lives at or below subsistence levels, while a minority lives in abundance is simply not stable.

They're not all xenophobes - the xenophobes are probably a tiny minority of True Finns (they certainly exist). Most are probably around the call "if they're long term unemployed or criminals, exile, otherwise, okay".

The left has traditionally marshalled support support for the notion of solidarity between workers of any creed, nationality or skin colour, which has served them well for over a century.

My grief with this is that the left has forgotten it's roots - work. And paid work. And supporting that. And the system we have is built on it.

feeling of entitlement: not only do I want more, I deserve more.

This is a curious phenomenom. I think it's something that generally plagues the west.

"I deserve this, and that means no one else does; therefore, this is the right thing to do".

It's remniscent of monarchies. Self-righteous decision to allow oneself something with the cost of it to others.