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Structural Integrity · 20 Aug 2003, 11:37

Wakey, I agree with the variable declaration of PHP, but the thing is that a beginning hobbyist programmer wants to see visible results, not some cryptic text on the screen.
I remember the first time I went to my current school and heard I was going to learn to program. I was dreaming of the amazing first person shooters and multiplayer games I was going to make. Or the great special effects I was going to make on my computer screen. Things the world had never seen before.

heh... I was quite disappointed when I drew my first "Hello world" on the screen with a Java applet and after three years didn't get much further than our latest project: a simple chat-application.

For motivational reasons I would always recommend a graphical language. A language that is meant to put things on the screen, rather than do things invisible. But it's up to what you want to do really.

PHP would do fine in my opinion. The beginner doesn't have to worry about types or variable declaration and can concentrate on the structure of his programming rather than on syntax.

Java is also a possibility as it's easy to put simple shapes (squares, ovals, etc) on the screen, but I personally don't really like it because of the vagueness of the ObjectOriented and reference part. (Give me C++ anyday)

If you want to actually SEE your results then C or C++ is a big "nono", but I agree that these languages do encourage to uphold the correct syntaxes.
You can create graphical fancy things with C/C++ but to learn it it takes time. Lots of time. Time that a beginner doesn't want to put into it.

I never worked with Pascal or Python so I cannot comment on that.

It's up to you what language you choose, but think of what you actually want to create with your programming. Fancy stuff on your screen or things that are done under the surface? Things in your browser, or things on a users computer?
From there on you have to choose your language.
There's no best language to learn programming from... there's only the best language that suits the job you want to do.

20 Aug 2003, 11:37	#28
Structural Integrity Rawr rawr Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Upside down Posts: 5,300	Wakey, I agree with the variable declaration of PHP, but the thing is that a beginning hobbyist programmer wants to see visible results, not some cryptic text on the screen. I remember the first time I went to my current school and heard I was going to learn to program. I was dreaming of the amazing first person shooters and multiplayer games I was going to make. Or the great special effects I was going to make on my computer screen. Things the world had never seen before. heh... I was quite disappointed when I drew my first "Hello world" on the screen with a Java applet and after three years didn't get much further than our latest project: a simple chat-application. For motivational reasons I would always recommend a graphical language. A language that is meant to put things on the screen, rather than do things invisible. But it's up to what you want to do really. PHP would do fine in my opinion. The beginner doesn't have to worry about types or variable declaration and can concentrate on the structure of his programming rather than on syntax. Java is also a possibility as it's easy to put simple shapes (squares, ovals, etc) on the screen, but I personally don't really like it because of the vagueness of the ObjectOriented and reference part. (Give me C++ anyday) If you want to actually SEE your results then C or C++ is a big "nono", but I agree that these languages do encourage to uphold the correct syntaxes. You can create graphical fancy things with C/C++ but to learn it it takes time. Lots of time. Time that a beginner doesn't want to put into it. I never worked with Pascal or Python so I cannot comment on that. It's up to you what language you choose, but think of what you actually want to create with your programming. Fancy stuff on your screen or things that are done under the surface? Things in your browser, or things on a users computer? From there on you have to choose your language. There's no best language to learn programming from... there's only the best language that suits the job you want to do. __________________ "Yay"