Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Well, Asc is now pretty much tied with DLR, and Apprime keeps on closing in, so the interesting question at this point has become, how badly will DLR crumble? There's a 9mil value lead over p3ng, but p3ng have the roidlead, and if DLR keeps hemorrhaging roids as they have been, there may yet be time for p3ng to catch up.

So, how badly will DLR snatch defeat from the jaws of victory?

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Hey Sun Tzu, preparing your EORC speech yet?






Oh right, there is no speech for napping to 2nd!

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

o no he didnt!

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

its classics like this that show just why you are my friend VdM :) <3



i guess its too much nowadays to expect the number 2 alliance to attack the #1 alliance :) VisioN must be sat in their private channel having hernia after hernia due to all the side splitting decisions made (or rather not made) by ND this round.

So much promise, and just as usual, never delivered......ND will always be the bridesmaid, never the bride.

ofcourse, i don't have much respect for VisioN who appear unable to engage in one on one fighting with DLR :)

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Since you are so bright and allknowing, can u please tell me wich alliance(s) my alliance apparantly hitting you with ?
We have engaged you alone most of the time, except for a few days with eXcessum.

DLR this round is just a shadow of what it has been the other rounds, with a smaller tag imo.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Note to DLR: ND offered to take on Vision if you'd have joined us. It was you who chose to NAP Apprime and basically force a stalemate for the rest of the round, one that Apprime subsequently abused to kill you guys off. Oh, and fingers crossed, I hope you enjoy your 6th place finish!

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

RE: Newdawn

I strongly doubt that a bunch of forum flames is gonna change their politics.

And besides, anyone who doesn't think that NewDawn wont have a go at Vision if they get within striking distance is a fool.

If Vision have any more crashers, and should we drop to 6 or 7m in front, NewDawn would be nuts not to have a go at us.

Meanwhile, Vision are pretty much stuck politically. Napping our #1 threat has let us focus on other targets, such as everyone that isn't NewDawn.

If NewDawn did decide to start on Vision now (or next week) - who do you think would get the support?

^ That isn't as rhetorrical as it sounds btw, answers on a postcard etc.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

at the time you were the number one alliance and already had a NAP with VisioN, you really think that the best move for the game was for DLR to NAP ND also thus giving you a massively unneeded block which would further stagnate the game?

i also know, that your command has given assurances on a number of occasions that they would drop the NAP with VisioN.....a quick scan to the 'NAPs' part of the universe screen shows that this NAP between ND and VisioN is actually still in place....

when are ND going to man up and actually do something with a round other than sitting on their arse and trying to roid race....something your alliance is incapable of doing....

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

gareth read my post please.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

ND didn't 'have a go' at you when you guys passed them by a couple mill....what makes you think that is going to change at any point soon? :P

I am quite aware that this is just a way of you underplaying your hand and trying to make out like this NAP with ND, and the subsequent refusal of them to fight you, isn't an issue kenny :)



you think that after the 'few days' of hitting us with excessum they would just go back to gal raiding? they have been hitting us fairly readily and add in the gal raids on our non fortress planets by ND, it all adds up and thus gives the lovely -% of roids you have been seeing for the last 4 days

and with regards to us being a 'shadow' of our former selves....tell me with your infinite wisdom, how any alliance doesn't lose roids to the tune that we have when we are receiving 200-250 fleets of inc a night constantly? ;)

could an admin please combine these all into one post please :P

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Its just just one alliance which made stupid decisions this round. It was the earlier wars which forced this political situation, New Dawn are just getting the flak for it all now.. as they're comfortable in 2nd.

At the time when most of the decisions were made which shaped this round, there was 3 alliances more than capable of winning the round (DLR, Vision and ND) and 2 alliances which had the potential to win it but were outsiders (Asc and Apprime). DLR have played the worst politics this round.

NewDawn thought that it couldnt take on Vision by itself, especially as Vision was capable of finding allys if need be (or so, it seemed that). Before the Nap was in place, did any other alliance offer to help NewDawn take Vision down? or was everyone else too busy fighting amongst themselves.

As far as im aware, Vision has been hitting DLR the majority of the time by itself. Only a couple of raids were co-ordinated with exi, which isnt exactly a huge alliance.

As things stand, it looks like DLR will struggle to even finish top 4 this round.. Why would you have respect for what they have done? Instead of pointing the fingers at other alliances, have a look what decisions DLR made this round :)

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

are you for real Light?

so you are saying that DLR played the worst politics of the round because they did not nap either ND or vision as other contenders for the round? and instead NAP'd an alliance that you state is a 'rank outsider' and thus by your logic not a contender for the round.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

I must of mis-read the alliance page.. I thought DLR was struggling to hold onto its 3rd place? and was likely to go down to 5th by the end of the round?

Im not saying what DLR should of done, or that DLR should of nap'd ND or Vision. Im simply saying that DLR's politics completly failed them and they went from a #1 contender to fighting to hold onto 3rd/4th. DLR's politics obviously werent good, I cant believe you're arguing that they made the right decisions.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Well, actually I'm not trying to underplay anything mate.

The way I see it is that at the time when NewDawn napped Vision they were, as you said, getting pummled by everyone. They napped the biggest threat to concentrate on the numerous other threats they were facing. The logic, I assume, being that by eliminating the biggest threat they'd be in a better position to stabilize their alliance and stop the points freefall they were in.

It doesn't make sense for somebody to hit the #1 alliance all the while they're being hit left, right and centre by everybody else. Yes, Vision were only in the lead marginally at the time of the NAP and now the gap between them is greater.

But who knows, maybe all they needed was a time-out to get back into a position whereby they can challenge.

All I'm saying is behaving like a knob on the forums and crying because they're not already hitting Vision is kinda a waste of time.

Besides, it's Friday night. Go out you muppet, and report back on your adventures tomorrow mate.

/out

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

everybody knows, 1st is the only alliance anyone remembers so it doesn't matter what rank we finish tbh :)

you are saying that though light...you are saying that by napping App we made a bad choice in comparison to you and ND who napped each other...both of you being, by your own description, contenders for the round win..

grats on the round win though :)

anyway, i have had chance to vent my feelings on the issue group therapy style.....so im going away from the boards for now :)

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Times DLR were asked to take part in hitting a major alliance (of which I am aware), but declined to do so:
-Going for either Apprime or Asc after they'd ended their first waring period. Before this they had also been asked to co-ordinate efforts on some issues, but nothing major.
-Pummeling Apprime/Vision after ND/Asc relations stabilized.

[At this point, Apprime hit DLR, and then DLR NAP'd Apprime, because, you know, let's protect the roids they just stole from us, right?]

-Multiple times trying to get DLR to drop the NAP with Apprime and join ND/Asc in hitting Apprime/Vision.

[ND NAP Vision as we were simply not able to keep up with the endless fruitless wars.]

-Still after this attempts have been made to try and convince DLR to drop NAP with Apprime and join in on hitting Apprime. DLR would however rather just sit around and get roided by Apprimes friends, while cardi assures them he's a pure little angel.

So umm...DLR the great war alliance, right?



Your memory is a bit hazy, we didn't NAP Vision until they had passed us, and by then DLR had already been NAP'd to Apprime for a substantial period of time.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

we hit u a grand total of _2_ days
the rest of the incomings u get from us is retals or randomattacks, i like hitting shitgals with semifat ppl, dlr/nd/vsn got alot of those...

if u guys had not gone for easy roids(us) for most of the round, we would never have teamed up on u in the first pace. maybe fight wars and actively seek the #1 rank next round, instead of hitting top80 gals and masswaving big players from smaller/weaker alliances:salute:

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

You're such a meanie Halvor :(

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

DLR didn't want to get involved in a war and instead wanted to sit on the outside?

WELL THAT IS A SURPRISE!!

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

NO, YOUR FACE IS A SURPRISE!

Been a while :P

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

wrote a 5 paragraph reply, then decided it isn't worth of it.

Simply said, this is what you get when newbie BC's or oldies without the drive/skill to win running PA alliances these days. Can't see further than few days.. if you would have to be farmed 2 months at worst like in old pa due to failure they might actually learn more.. as they sure as hell haven't learned anything in 20+ rounds since pax started.

tick1 we knew ND won't rank higher than 4 or 5.
tick1 we knew DLR is gonna get buttraped as they builded fr/de as anti-bs against advice. Not to mention that NAP and fortress building so they never where a contender for top2 spots.
tick240 we knew apprime is going to be unstoppable in a week when we took a closer look if we can hurt them anywhere else than 10:8 without major effort what requires multiple alliances.(what weren't willing or like vsn had all major planets in apprime galaxies)
tick440 At this point the round was already over alliance vice competition for win due to galaxy compositions only personal ranks/galaxy ranks are still undecided.

Anyways was awesome round. Easy mode pa still it is.. Can't even understand the quality of players these days.. it was bad at r9.5.. now it's way worse.. like 100 times worse, and the scoring system what makes numbers matter more than quality of player.. nice glass ceiling.

Personally might try PA at some time in future, if I can be bothered to get some 10 man crew of players whom even I could respect and join some alliance as a internal BG as clearly there isn't any hardcore alliance or BG in pa atm.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

That signature makes me chuckle every time

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

The topics question has been answered.

No.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

We'll take credit for being the sole people who ruined the round; that makes all the self-proclaimed ruiners around these parts nothing more than wannabes SO SUCK IT! Also thanks for the congrats Sun_Tzu, it'll be our highest finish ever if we can manage to hold it.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

stupid ruiners ruin everything.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Ruin ruiners ruin everything.



Wow....you're actually right...I mean I knew you were always sh*t, but that's a whole other level of sh*t...

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

People need to stop perceiving non-aggression pacts as political decisions with the intent of gaining something in the ranking ladder. Most of the pacts people form are either because jolly good friends nice and fun, or because they simply want to avoid conflict and continue raiding galaxies for the hell of it.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

This is stupid. It is not the task of a lower ranked alliance to approach a potential (still) round winner to help them take down the top alliance.



That's just bad politics on their behalf. If you're #2 and are getting hit by everyone, you're doing something horribly wrong.



And then you wrote another 5 paragraph reply? :D

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Well, that's not quite true. Some alliances have a mutual long-lasting past, in which case they usually enter the round and go through it more or less working together.

However, any political decision made during the round is made with a expectancy that it will be beneficial to the alliance in some way. Usually, this implies furthering their hopes of accomplishing their round goals.

Based on the statements of DLR members, it seems quite obvious that at least the members do not feel they've accomplished their round goals, which frankly is quite understandable, since before the NAP they had a very real shot at a top2 finish, and now they're having to settle for rank6. In fact, I've heard plenty of opinions to the effect that people are not willing to play with DLR again after this round, which might indicate a quite deep discontent with the way the alliance has been run.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

I do believe the point was that there was no will to take on Vision and Apprime, not to squabble over who approached whom. Really Mz, try a bit harder.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

She specifically said "offer to help Newdawn". If that is not what she meant, she should not have written it.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Could you enlighten me what my goals as a DLR member are? Or how rank 2 and rank 6 differ in any meaningful way?

Great -- I'll thank each leaver personally for helping with spring cleaning. What's the point of this thread anyways Sun_Tzu? Surely you aren't bitter after getting rejected from playing with DLR this round? This thread might hurt my pride a little if it were vsn members calling us out, but coming from you it just makes me shake my head and wonder if it isn't just your time of the month.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

The point of this thread was to make fun of DLR, what else? Also, to entertain me since I am quite bored.

Believe me, getting rejected from DLR really doesn't change my opinion of myself much, more so my opinion of DLR, not that it was all that high to begin with.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

I was never contesting that, mz!



Now now, there's no need to play the bitter card!

I think Grog's decision to reject you was never a question of your ability. You had vouches from just about everyone in the alliance, who were all attesting to your ability.

Basically it came down to the way you approached Grog and told him that his strategy was wrong. Yes, you and I and hopefully now Grog too can see that it was a poor strategy... but Grog has spent most of his PA career playing dictator to a small minority who are all perfectly happy to place their trust in somebody else and play as a collective.

Just by the by, the 'dictator' comment was not meant as derogatory - I'm paraphrasing Grog himself when I describe him as such.

Anyway, the bottom line is that Grog has never had to listen to anybody else's opinion because he's used to people placing their trust in him to do the right thing. Unfortuantely, DLR isn't a small BG playing inside a tag, nor is it a small tag playing for the good of each other with no real objective outside doing well and annoying people.

The bottom line is that Grog does not have the experience to lead a full alliance in the pursuit of success. He's not used to having to deal with the casual gamers who don't play in a tag in order to be part of a team, nor is he used to having to try and use and manipulate political situations to advance his own standing.

Bottom line: you told him he was wrong, Tzu, and he didn't like that. You didn't represent the kind of player he was capable of dealing with and were rejected on account of being a non-conformist.

None of the above makes him bad per ce, nor should it be reason to dislike the guy. He's a very good leader and usually gets tactics spot on. He's even laughed at some of my jokes, so he can't be all bad.

All I'm saying is there's no need to hold the guy's head under whilst he's already out of his depth, tis all.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm sure Grog has HCed NewDawn in the past.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

He has, however not with perfect impunity, as he does in DLR.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

You might be right, he may well have had an HC spot whilst his BG played within NewDawn. I'm sure it was more an authority thing than a policy-making position though. Can somebody from NewDawn please comment?

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Almost a threepeat even (lol). The bottom line is that Grog has far too much experience dealing "with the casual gamers who don't play in a tag in order to be part of a team," which is a major reason why he/we decided to leave that behind in ND.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

zebra you know more than most that I love a load of the folk in DLR, and I also get on well with some of the folk who joined this round from the likes of Euphoria and so forth.

The fact remains though that DLR isn't a small, tight-knit group of players who are playing for the good of each other, anymore. It has become the very thing that Grog sought to leave behind in NewDawn.

Sure, there's certainly more team-spirit than in the likes of CT or Vision, but to imply that DLR isn't becoming a refuge for the casual shows a level of naivety that I don't think you're capable of mate.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Protip: it would be more rewarding to troll asc from an objective standpoint (they have 10x the AD posters that DLR has), but nice job getting mek wound up nonetheless ;p

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

And even then he's easily wound up!

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Atleast DLR is fighting a war, and hopefully use this new experience to learn from mistakes. Fighting outnumbered requires real leadership, and in order to fight successfully you need a bunch of leaders. Whoever steps up when needed and get the job done for your alliance is a leader. If everything relies on Grog, then you will never be able to compete with Apprime/Asc/vision who has several people pulling the wagon in the right direction.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

This pretty much sums it up. Personally, I don't think the tag should ever be more than ~30 or so. It also shouldn't be overlooked that our strategy revisions are based largely on inactivity management now, and that it's a rather beautiful spring.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Again, correct me if I'm wrong but I seem to remember Grog doing politics in R15 at least.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

It is a rather beautiful spring!

And HaNzI does touch on a good point - although some would argue that JDD is as 'in-charge' as Grog and therefore it's not entirely on one man's shoulders. I think the closest they've come to expanding their command team was in R35 when they asked Savior to step up, which he did. Unfortunately, they then had RL shit to deal with and their own activity dropped accordingly and it all got left on one man again, which is - I think - why Savior left and joined Vision.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

A round in which ND flew to top spot by avoiding any and all conflict, only to get beaten the minute anyone actually attacked them?

And for the record - I don't know who was doing ND's politics that round.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

The problem with DLR's politics is that instead of taking a risk, they chose the certainty of not being hit by Apprime, without giving any consideration to the consequences.

They would have been better off taking a bit of a hit, marauding against the very people in fence galaxies that were a problem for them. Later in the round they might have had a situation where they could have a chance to strike for the win, but instead they been bled quite comprehensively and eventually imploded. Ascendancy have **** all roids, far less activity yet are going to have a respectable finish.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

I must admit that I enjoy seing DLR fail. Because they have been hitting us more than any other alliance all round. Which is why I said yes to both asc and vsn when they asked if I wanted to hit DLR with them. Hell, I even asked asc if I could join that one night!

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

I don't care how well/badly ND did that round, you claimed that he hasn't had experience in a policy-making role, I showed you that you were wrong. He has had experience and hasn't seemed to learn from it. Refusing to take advice and being a dick about it the way he appears to have been is pretty gay.

Re: Will DLR manage to stay top5?
 

Actually all you did was ask a question which I was unable to answer due to insufficient information. You may take that as a victory, if you wish.