IE 7 (hey leshy)
hey guys. i don't know much about browsers etc, but i just downloaded it and i think it's supercool (it has tabs and all that). what's your opinion?
(i'm interested in your opinion in particular leshy, please comment). :) |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
itt, koen demonstrates insanity :P
Personally, i think its a heap of junk |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
yes but why phil?
why ITT you have to give reasons. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
It looks and feels terrible
Its sluggish It STILL isnt standards compliant Its incapable of only displaying the tab bar when there is actually more then one tab It still has activex in it Its being forced on users as a 'security update' to Windows etc etc etc |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
The only reason I ever used to use IE was to connect to my works systems (via Citrix). At the moment, it doesn't seem to work. :(
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
Horrible user-interface, slow, and the search box in the top right uses the hideous MSN search rather than google (I've no idea if its possilbe to change this).
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
I wouldn't mind if every time I started using the damn thing my CPU load didn't go up to 100% for several minutes, then go back there after a page refresh.
Nod: The default Search is Google. You must have chosen MSN, you HEATHEN. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
no, the default search engine is whatever you had set to default before in ie6 - or msn depending on what mood the installer was in
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
Erf, I hate threads involving MS products... you get so much uneducated "blah blah is crap" because people (sup Phil^) seem to think it's either cool to bash MS, or have used an unreliable product from them 400 years ago, and so now everything is crap.
In responses to above : * In terms of performance, it seems OK to me. * Looks are subjective. I would concede it looks out of place currently, but its designed to mimic the look and feel of Vista. Within a Vista environment it will probably seem nicer, but by all means, that isn't a justification for it. * Standards compliance ... yup it is not 100% complient.... but then I don't think any browser is. The popular FireFox 2 by no means passes the Acid2 standards test (though I believe the development 3 version does). * The search bar can be configured for most search pages. * What is wrong with a product having ActiveX in it? Are all products capable of being an ActiveX container rubbish by the same definition? Word, Excel, PowerPoint... even good old WordPad? * As for the comment on how it is being deployed.. Err? Whether or not your point is valid ... I hardly think its deployment policy has any relation to how well the application performs its intended operation once deployed. However, as with most products ... it is certainly not perfect. My main problems with it are as follows: * You can't shorten the address bar. I like all my icons on one line, up there with the address bar. You seem to have no control over this. (Leading me right on too...) * You have very limited control over the position of the predefined buttons. I can't for example stick the home button next to my forward button. * The "back history" (the list of pages you have visited recently) is accessed via the forward button. I find this very counter intuitive. I have a sneaky suspicion this is to reflect how it is in Vista.... but I'm going to hate it there as well if that is the case. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
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I was asked for my opinion - that is it. Its somewhat patronising of you to assume that i dont like it because i want to bash microsoft or hold a grudge for some reason. With standards compliance i was more referring to css2 but yes, it doesnt pass acid2 either and as you rightly pointed out neither does firefox atm. I think opera and safari are the only ones which do currently Activex is a terrible terrible technology that has a deeply flawed implementation. It is a significant reason why there are so many exploits for things out there. yes its been patched again and again in order to try and make it better; but the best solution would have been to get rid of it entirely. Regarding deployment, i resent how its being forced as a windows update in order to try and 'win the browser wars' again a-la-netscape. A products success should be entirely dependant on how good it is, not how easily it can be rammed down the average user's throat. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
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Its a windows update becuase IE is part of windows, IE7 is in essence a more feature-full version of IE6 but with better security - why not have it as a critcal update (you can choose not to install it)? Firefox also has an update feature. The other advanatge of a critical update is that it will force web sites to fix their systems to work properly with the new security archiecture so that for thoose of us that rely on IE for certain sites will have the minimum possible period of time with lost functionality. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
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IE is not something which should have been part of the operating system in the first place. it was tied together for political, not technical reasons and we all have to suffer the consequences of these actions today. I have no problem with updates for the sake of security, i do have a problem with bundling and claiming it as part of an operating system when it is quite clearly a seperate application. As a seperate application - it would have to rely on its own merits as to how successful it is and not the success of the operating system it was tied into. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
Here's what Richard Brodie, had to say about IE 7 in a recent blog entry.
FYI Richard was the author of MS Word 1.0 (and Microsoft Employee #77)...so is definitely not anti-MS. Quote:
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
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Or he could just start the browser delivered with the OS and download the browser of his choice... oh wait... Computer systems and software are already complicated enough, don't make it even more difficult for the average user. |
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
I was backing you up!
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
I thought ActiveX was a "bad thing" because it's possible to manipulate ActiveX controls to implant viruses on your machine.
I doubt I'll move over to IE7. The only real gripe I have with firefox is its memory utilisation, but even that doesn't seem as bad as people claim. I never run out of memory anyway. Besides, firefox has its javascript console, which I find vital for debugging javascript, and the various plugins I have installed. As far as visual appeal goes, I hated the new firefox theme at first. But now I'm used to it, and even like it. I'm sure the same thing will happen with IE's theme. The only reason I'm "pro-firefox" and "anti-IE" is because IE seems to flaunt standards to a far greater extent than firefox does. That important to me because I hate it when I have a website that's standard compliant in firefox but as soon as I test it in IE it's all ****ed up. I'm thinking the advanced selectors in CSS2 here. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
I've used IE7 in the labs, but put off using it on my machine at home til it's a bit more mature. Here is my opinion:
I like the UI. I have always hate hate hated that Firefox hides the tab bar by default until you have 2 or more tabs open, without providing a button to open a new tab easily. Sure, there's a keyboard shortcut and you can rightclick links and open them in a new tab etc, but most of Microsoft's customers won't know how or want to have to do that, hence it's a good design choice. Regarding the aesthetics, they're clearly designed to fit in with Vista not XP. Tough shit. You can't really expect a company not to design a new product to look its best on the latest systems. The big "tiled thumbnails" view of all open tabs is nifty. I like it. I like that the menubar can hide to save space. I like that the search can be altered (the ones in the labs are all set to google anyway). I like that the browser reset really does reset and is extremely effective at removing spyware toolbars etc. I don't like that it crashed within 30 minutes of me using it for the first time. However, as with most new software I assume there are bugs to be worked out. Firefox is far from innocent on this front, before you all start. I've not come across the "back history on the forward button" thing because I've not tried to access it yet, but I'll definately have a look when I'm next in the labs. If that's true it really is a stupid piece of HCI design. If Vista works that way too I'll be concerned to say the least. Overall it's an improvement over IE6, and quite a substantial one at that. |
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Mouse gestures mean that I don't use it anyway (they are the absolute nuts). Quote:
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
In all honesty, I've not really had a reason to try out IE7 yet, since between Opera and Firefox I never even fire up IE anymore; Firefox only occasionally if there's a site with one of those "if it isn't IE or Netscape, do nothing" scripts.
So, as much as I enjoy the name-dropping, I'm afraid I can't really give any valuable input on it right now. From what I've heard, it definitely incorporates some of the good features of browsers like Opera and Firefox, but it's still a long way from being an equal to either. I may download it later and see if I can install it without it giving me hassle about a non-official WinXP installation on this machine. |
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Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
I like the button that gives an overview of all the tabs. Other than that firefox beats it in all aspects I know/care about.
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You don't design general purpose software for the educated minority, you design it assuming the user has no prior knowledge of computing terminology. Stop and ask yourself if your mother or your uncle would think it was obvious to right click on a section of the screen that doesn't look like a button (assuming they know what a right click is) and then drag an icon to an area of the screen which, again, doesn't immediately look like something you can interact with. Stop and ask yourself how frequently Microsoft support are going to have to deal with questions about how to make this magical tabbed browsing thing work. Offset that against adding a simple "new tab" button by default. No contest really, is it. The fact that I never had the patience to find out how to make Firefox work that way pretty much demonstrates what I'm talking about, seeing as I'll often go out of my way to change software to work the way I want it to. |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
I like the way in Firefox 2.0 you don't have to type 'www.' which is making me lazy but I'm I'll be damned if I'm gonna stop doing it.
I don't know if you could do this before so it might be 'old' but I really couldn't care less. |
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Jesus H Christ he's right! |
Re: IE 7 (hey leshy)
Hasn't that been in IE for years?
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As with most open-source software, it gets easier to use as it matures - just look at the difference between Firefox 0.9 and Firefox 2.0. Quote:
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